667 réponses à ce sujet

[Cybermortis]

mmu1 wrote...

Cybermortis wrote...

Can anyone provide a link that indicates, without any question, that Bioware decided to offer ME2 to registered buyers of DA2 to bolster sales? Can you prove that this idea wasn't something that they had decided to do before DA2 hit the shelves (followed it seems by the waste-basket)?

Anyone?

Nope, didn't think so.

Can you provide a link that indicates, without any question, that you're not a chimpanzee trained by Mike Laidlaw to post pro-Bioware messages?

You mean apart from every other post I've ever made on the board?

Before accusing someone of being a 'Biosheep' you should at least check to see what they have been posting before.

I'm not willing to assume that the free copy of ME2 is meant to repay people for a poor quality game for several reasons.

1; If the game had sold VERY well and drawn in players who normally avoid Bioware games. Giving them a chance to get ME2 for free would have been a wild success since it would (hopefully) get people into the Mass Effects games. This in turn would have increased the number of people buying ME3.

2; DA2 is more expensive than ME2 in the shops - who are also not advertising the offer anyway. Therefore if someone wants to get ME2 they are unlikely to know about the offer unless they have DA2. And even if they do know about the offer and don't have DA2 they can get ME2 for half the price.

[Ohiodruid]

You're just making up a story, and demanding that others falsify it. What's the point?

We have a lot of consistent indicators - sales falling faster than they did for earlier games (using the same methods), bundling a bonus game with the current one, negative user reviews on sites, and so on. If you can point to a source where they said they were going to do this anyhow, go ahead - that's valuable. Just so stories, not so much.

(By the way, I'd say "encouraging people to buy DA2 by adding an extra game" is more accurate than "apologizing for a bad effort.")

Modifié par Ohiodruid, 20 avril 2011 - 08:32 .

[BY-TOR STORMDRAGON]

At least the game is better than mass Effect and KOTOR on every level. Those games SUCK. With Origins and DA 2, BioWare entered some nice new old-school territory. I am not a BioWare fanboy, but I do like a few EA games.
I doubt if Dragon Age is dropped I will buy from the company again. The title of DA 2 was the biggest mistake. A few dragons. Oh, and one big dump of a City and a few outside duplicate places to play in?

Still better than Mass Defect.

[2Hard2C]

Well, honestly, if the sales ARE that bad then Bioware might want to do a redux to Dragon Age 2. The thing is, I thought the game was good, nothing special, just good. But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

[JaegerBane]

erynnar wrote...
Well, I didn't like DA2, but I don't think they have to scrap everything but the graphics. I found some things from DA2 I liked. And yeah, DAO, fix what was meh, or not working and don't throw it all away. And don't do what they did with DAO to DA2 and throw it all away too. Take what worked from both.

Nor I, I actually quite liked how the combat worked in DA2. Hell, it was what got me through the game - half the time I was only vaguely aware of who or what I was fighting.

My point wasn't so much that they *should* dump everything but the upgraded engine, I was really pointing out that a rethink *may* result in a lot of stuff being dropped, and blank slate restarts on computer software tend to put the shivers up the backs of the financiers. Which in turn, may lead to the series being canned if it's judged that it would cost too much to fix. Admittedly that's a pessimistic viewpoint, but I'm reasonably sure that Bioware (and, by extension, EA) aren't really used to have such a mixed critical reaction to one of their flagship releases.

[erynnar]

JaegerBane wrote...

erynnar wrote...
Well, I didn't like DA2, but I don't think they have to scrap everything but the graphics. I found some things from DA2 I liked. And yeah, DAO, fix what was meh, or not working and don't throw it all away. And don't do what they did with DAO to DA2 and throw it all away too. Take what worked from both.

Nor I, I actually quite liked how the combat worked in DA2. Hell, it was what got me through the game - half the time I was only vaguely aware of who or what I was fighting.

My point wasn't so much that they *should* dump everything but the upgraded engine, I was really pointing out that a rethink *may* result in a lot of stuff being dropped, and blank slate restarts on computer software tend to put the shivers up the backs of the financiers. Which in turn, may lead to the series being canned if it's judged that it would cost too much to fix. Admittedly that's a pessimistic viewpoint, but I'm reasonably sure that Bioware (and, by extension, EA) aren't really used to have such a mixed critical reaction to one of their flagship releases.

Ah...gotcha. Yeah they could use a new engine, or a better one. I see what you're saying now.  And I agree with you. :happy:

[neppakyo]

erynnar wrote...


Ah...gotcha. Yeah they could use a new engine, or a better one. I see what you're saying now.  And I agree with you. :happy:

They should license engines, like they did with Mass Effect using the Unreal Engine.

http://www.escapistm...gine-3-Features is the latest one, maybe they're using this one for ME3?

I still reiterate that they should license the RED engine, its designed to be a flexible RPG engine.

[erynnar]

neppakyo wrote...

erynnar wrote...


Ah...gotcha. Yeah they could use a new engine, or a better one. I see what you're saying now.  And I agree with you. :happy:

They should license engines, like they did with Mass Effect using the Unreal Engine.

http://www.escapistm...gine-3-Features is the latest one, maybe they're using this one for ME3?

I still reiterate that they should license the RED engine, its designed to be a flexible RPG engine.

I am not familiar with the RED engine, but if it is a flexible RPG engine, then I could get behind that!

[Jaron Oberyn]

Persephone wrote...

LilyasAvalon wrote...

PoliteAssasin wrote...

I find it hilarious that they're saying it's doing so well, yet all evidence points to contrary. It's so obvious that the only reason they've attached me2 to this game was to boost sales for it. What a cheap move. They've become so desperate.

-Polite

They're either in serious denial or they're sugar coating it all.

It's sad how desperate they're getting though; asking review sites to take down bad reviews, creating accounts to vote themselves and make reviews for DA2 go up, bribing popular gamer magazines (Seriously, anyone who votes a full 10/10 for this game is either bribed or easily amused), locking every topic that has bad mentions of DA2, the addon of ME2, locking users out of the game....

Eh?

Where are they asking for reviews to be removed?

And one Bioware employee reviewing DAII doesn't mean they're doing a huge campaign to boost their own scores.

Do you have ANY proof of bribery except your own disagreement with positive reviews? No? Thought so. But hey, let's accuse Bioware of ANYTHING.

Locking every topic that "has bad mentions of DAII"? That's an outright lie.

Locking users out of the game? Happened to TWO people, not two thousand. Chill!

Egads, the hyperbole!

What rock were you under? I want to take shelter there when ME3 info starts rolling in.   It's well known that Bioware requested bad reviews to be taken down. Just as it's well known that Stanly Woo has been going on a locking spree regarding any thread that discussing the negative aspects of the game. (You can find all of the "end of line" videos on youtube. A lot of the threads he closes are obviously to keep a lid on how bad the game is).  So that's not an outright lie. And locking users out of the game, it may have affected a handful of people, but just wait a few months. According to Mr. Woo, it's standard procedure for EA's ToS to lock people out of game access in association with bans. You need to get your facts straight, because you have absolutely no idea about what you're talking about unfortunately.

-Polite

[Zeevico]

If this records store sales only is it that significant?

Online sales are a pretty big market, no?

[Dracotamer]

+1 to what Polite said.

[erynnar]

I am curious about week 6 when tallies are in.

@Polite, from their own website or others'? Sorry if that is a dumb question.

Modifié par erynnar, 22 avril 2011 - 12:25 .

[DreGregoire]

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

[BeefoTheBold]

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

[erynnar]

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

Ditto!  And ditto Beef. *HUGS*

[DreGregoire]

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

How can we help but to believe that? They keep parroting these same words, "We changed the system because of the complaints/feedback we got about the first game on the forums." I cannot believe they have the nerve to suggest that the impact of these forums made them change the way things had been done. A forum where people generally only come to complain is where they chose to obtain their feedback? I never posted anything about the likes or dislikes of DAO on the forums. I keep wondering where my customer survey is; isn't that generally how companies determine if they have done well or not? The truth as I see it is, "People at bioware want it all." We as a fan base know you can't have it all, but note how they like to throw this back in our face by telling us we just want it all. It's like they want us to believe their misdirection is just our misconception of reality. I am not fooled.

Modifié par DreGregoire, 22 avril 2011 - 01:51 .

[BeefoTheBold]

erynnar wrote...

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

Ditto!  And ditto Beef. *HUGS*

*hugs back with a wry smile*

I do have to admit that something good has come of it. I started posting here on these forums and am actually having a great deal of fun with it. There are some very intelligent posters with good insights here that I've enjoyed reading.

[BeefoTheBold]

DreGregoire wrote...

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

How can we help but to believe that? They keep parroting these same words, "We changed the system because of the complaints/feedback we got about the first game on the forums." I cannot believe they have the nerve to suggest that the impact of these forums made them change the way things had been done. A forum where people generally only come to complain is where they chose to obtain their feedback? I never posted anything about the likes or dislikes of DAO on the forums. I keep wondering where my customer survey is, isn't that generally how companies determine if they have done well or not. The truth as I see it is, "People at bioware want it all." We as a fan base know you can't have it all, but note how they like to throw this back in our face by telling us we just want it all. It's like they want us to believe their misdirection is just our misconception of reality. I am not fooled.

Don't worry. I'm not naive. Bioware is off my "preorder with no further thought needed" list of developers list. I'll be paying close attention to previews, reviews, demos, etc. for them going forward. Hopefully they'll right the ship though and the magic will be brought back.

[erynnar]

DreGregoire wrote...

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

How can we help but to believe that? They keep parroting these same words, "We changed the system because of the complaints/feedback we got about the first game on the forums." I cannot believe they have the nerve to suggest that the impact of these forums made them change the way things had been done. A forum where people generally only come to complain is where they chose to obtain their feedback? I never posted anything about the likes or dislikes of DAO on the forums. I keep wondering where my customer survey is, isn't that generally how companies determine if they have done well or not. The truth as I see it is, "People at bioware want it all." We as a fan base know you can't have it all, but note how they like to throw this back in our face by telling us we just want it all. It's like they want us to believe their misdirection is just our misconception of reality. I am not fooled.

I am wondering that too Dre! I never posted what I liked on DAO forums. I just loved the game and enjoyed it. Where is my customer survey?

[erynnar]

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

How can we help but to believe that? They keep parroting these same words, "We changed the system because of the complaints/feedback we got about the first game on the forums." I cannot believe they have the nerve to suggest that the impact of these forums made them change the way things had been done. A forum where people generally only come to complain is where they chose to obtain their feedback? I never posted anything about the likes or dislikes of DAO on the forums. I keep wondering where my customer survey is, isn't that generally how companies determine if they have done well or not. The truth as I see it is, "People at bioware want it all." We as a fan base know you can't have it all, but note how they like to throw this back in our face by telling us we just want it all. It's like they want us to believe their misdirection is just our misconception of reality. I am not fooled.

Don't worry. I'm not naive. Bioware is off my "preorder with no further thought needed" list of developers list. I'll be paying close attention to previews, reviews, demos, etc. for them going forward. Hopefully they'll right the ship though and the magic will be brought back.

Same here! I enjoy it immensly. Wish I enjoyed the game as much. But there are some really intelligent posters and it is fun to read. You are one. Dre is another *blows kiss to Dre*  

[_Aine_]

DreGregoire wrote...

 It's like they want us to believe their misdirection is just our misconception of reality. I am not fooled.

I hear ya.  

[Ramus Quaritch]

Fans are voting with their wallets. This sends the strongest message to Bioware and EA that the customers want an rpg. They want the spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate. They don't want a rushed game with the awesome button.  If there's anything that will get them to fix the issues with DA2 and make a better DA3, this is it.

Modifié par Ramus Quaritch, 22 avril 2011 - 01:39 .

[2Hard2C]

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever.

I share your sympathies, however the main reason I started to actively follow these forums, is not because there is dissatisfaction, but people making baseless claims that slander a over-hyped, sky-high expectation, game. {I thought DA2 was good, but that I could have saved my money by pre-ordering and should have waited for the price to come down.}  The real shame of it is that I no longer have the complete trust and/or faith of Bioware any more and will probably not preorder Mass Effect 3.

I just want the mistakes Bioware made, to actually reach them in a non-troll-like way, so that way they understand them, and learn from it.

[Shatterkiss]

erynnar wrote...

I am curious about week 6 when tallies are in.

I've only seen estimates for Euro sales, but there does seem to be a small bump from last week.  That might be because of the ME2 giveaway, but that's just a guess.  Sales are still well below DAO sales for week 6, though.

[erynnar]

2Hard2C wrote...

BeefoTheBold wrote...

DreGregoire wrote...

2Hard2C wrote...

But
if they learned anything from this endeavor is that maybe a niche
more-old school game will sell better. However, I do believe they
should fix up the problems with Origins, rather than fix up the problems
with DA2.

That's what I would like to see happen; however, I have no faith that the company will do that.

Call it denial of reality if you wish, but I go back and forth on this.

Part
of why I have started posting here is that I'm under the (perhaps
naive) assumption that it may make a difference if enough
dissatisfaction is expressed in the right way here.

I don't want the Bioware that I knew and loved to be gone forever. [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/crying.png[/smilie]

I
share your sympathies, however the main reason I started to actively
follow these forums, is not because there is dissatisfaction, but people
making baseless claims that slander a over-hyped, sky-high expectation,
game. {I thought DA2 was good, but that I could have saved my money by
pre-ordering and should have waited for the price to come down.}  The
real shame of it is that I no longer have the complete trust and/or
faith of Bioware any more and will probably not preorder Mass Effect 3.[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/unsure.png[/smilie]

I
just want the mistakes Bioware made, to actually reach them in a
non-troll-like way, so that way they understand them, and learn from it.

Same here, I have truly tried to not be a troll. I know I have erred or someone took what I said badly because I said it poorly.  But I have tried to be a non troll and have them get real feedback from me. I like DA2 much better as a mage...so YAY BioWare, you made me play a mage finally!  And I like it...still all my crit applies.  This game had so much potential, please, please take it to heart.

Shatterkiss wrote...

erynnar wrote...

I am curious about week 6 when tallies are in.

I've only seen estimates for Euro sales, but there does seem to be a small bump from last week.  That might be because of the ME2 giveaway, but that's just a guess.  Sales are still well below DAO sales for week 6, though.