103 réponses à ce sujet

[Apollo Starflare]

I really don't see the comic taking up much resources, the art is outsourced isn't it? Beyond that it just designing it to set off little flags on the system...

I for one am very happy to get the chance to try the comic out, obviously it can't compare to going through the previous two games but I have already done that six times and have a seventh marathon planned for sometime after ME3 hits (like a LotR marathon, but from HELL). This only adds to my replayability options, opens up the franchise to gamers who might not give it a shot otherwise (which is getting Bioware money, the ME franchise more recognition and most importantly introducing more people to the brilliance of Mass Effect. All at barely any extra cost).

I can understand you fearing resources being mispent OP but in this case I cannot agree. It feels a bit like people will complain about anything around here sometimes!

[javierabegazo]

Not everyone are Hardcore gamers like most of us.

Not everyone knows about the wonder of RPG's.

Not everyone has played a BioWare game before.

granted both of us interested in a product would react the same way but not everyone is 'sparked' the same way. Some people run at at different paces

[Dominus]

Well, there could potentially be a compromise if they wanted history choices made without the comic - Include both the Comic, and a "slim" version as was used in DA2. If you lost your saves, but don't want to wade through a 15 minute cinematic with choices given, that would be one way to go.

Modifié par DominusVita, 08 avril 2011 - 04:48 .

[Almostfaceman]

javierabegazo wrote...

Not everyone are Hardcore gamers like most of us.

Not everyone knows about the wonder of RPG's.

Not everyone has played a BioWare game before.

granted both of us interested in a product would react the same way but not everyone is 'sparked' the same way. Some people run at at different paces

Yup yup, Bioware has to think of everyone, not just the OP.

Noob customer "So, I HAVE to buy ME1 and ME2 to get what's going on in ME3?!?"
Bioware: Nooope - here, just read this handy comic.
Noob customer "Sweet.  Hmm, this looks interesting.  Time to buy ME3... wow I wonder what it would be like to play ME1 & ME2..."

Nice sig btw - very helpful. 

[Rekkampum]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

Selfish is utterly the wrong word.

No, it isn't. Suggesting that Bioware not accomodate new players of Mass Effect just because you don't like something is selfish. Lot's of people agree with me on this, as evidenced.

I may exxagerate and I am aware of that. But for qualities sake, if people didn't bother playing the first two games, then why toss candy at them if you could use that candy to make developers more happy so they make an even better game.

This isn't some major feature that's suddenly being added at the last minute, and you have no idea what their budget is, let alone the amount of time or work needed for a purely optional feature.

It is a trilogy for [insert entity of choice here]'s sake. A trilogy consists of three parts. As I do understand it, you have to read/watch/play all three titles to understand it, not just the final one.
If I make the work to create such a piece, I expect people that are interested to read/watch/play all of it.

I don't just say: "And for all those peeps who weren't interested enough reading/watching/playing the foregoing two parts: this is what you happened!". Because obviously, ... those people aren't interested.

For people having lost savegames, happens all the time. Happened to me and will in the future happen to me. That's nothing tragic. Just play the game once more. Or would you start calling all those games that don't have such a comic are discriminating against players that lost their saves? Double standards, bigtime!

You look shallow making this argument. First of all, the Mass Effect franchise depends on continuity, whereas other trilogies - Gears of War for instance- do not. Your point is baseless and flawed. You're also forgetting that a significant portion of new Mass Effect fans can't purchase ME 1 or did you forget that it's not available for PS3 owners? Again, flawed. Saying they weren't interested in a game they couldn't even purchase for their system is moot.

There is no benefit to this comic in a final part of a series consisting of more than two pieces. It neither is necessary for those that just want to play ME3 without replaying Me1 and 2, because they already know the story and if they want their decisions to carry over they have to get their lazy butts on the chair and play the games. Simple as that. That argument is invalid. Nor does the system justice to the missed out story for those that start with ME3. Those people are always better off googling the story. Again, no need to waste ressources on a comic.

This whole comic is a waste.

Opinio doesn't equal scientia. In other words, saying a comic that allows people who haven't played the game to make some decisions so that they won't completely be isolated from the immersion factor of this series is not beneficial is based on your own opinions, not what you actually know about other's opinions or the product itself. Hence, again, your point is selfish and your assumption about others is unduly biased. As to your point about resources, see earlier comment.

I should hereby say that I don't rage against the comic. I am just pointing out a major flaw in thinking.

Yes, you are. Your own thinking. A person doesn't have to "rage" to be rude and inconsiderate of others. You aren't being "forced" to play this comic. Simply import your saves.

edit:// Funny how I am suddenly called a troll for stating the obvious. And even more funny how people accuse me of wanting to impede the experience of others. Let me make this perfectly clear: People that start with a trilogy on the last chapter impede themselves. I didn't think it would have been necessary to say this, but here it is. I am merely stating my opinion on how wasteful this effort is. This comic is basically addressing a customer group whose defining chractestic is/was theat they were not interested? How am I a troll to say that we could just aswell let them stay uninterested? Tell me that.

I said your topic was trolling because this comic will probably not affect you in any way whatsoever, and you don't have any knowledge about how much is actually being put into it in the first place, if it will affect the development of the game as a whole, or even the quality of it. Not to mention the fact that you created an entire thread for this instead of discussing it at the main stickied thread. 

As for trilogies, that's understood. But you keep forgetting that plenty of people become fans of a product well after it's been around for a while. How many people are fans of popular artists and entertainers yet have never heard all their albums or seen all their material? Are they lazy for it? Certainly not. 

BTW, LOTR is not a trilogy. LOTR was designed as one book split into three parts simply because marketing a 1,000 page novel would result in a catastrophic sales flop. True fans of Tolkien know this. In this way, you can consider the Mass Effect series -while being three separate games - as being irrevocably tied together and it must be seen as a whole in order to be appreciated. Of course, however, that's where the analogy ends, as again, the first game wasn't available to PS3 players. 

You also aren't the spokesman for the company. Pretending, by voicing your dissent, to speak for others on a topic you don't have any relevant information about is selfish. Plain and simple. Bottom line: don't play on default. It's that easy.

Modifié par Rekkampum, 08 avril 2011 - 05:11 .

[javierabegazo]

I believe that's not the case because it's far more important to make sure that newcomers to the series have an enjoyable time, to let them fall in love with the franchise and want to play the previous games.

Nefarious, how exactly do you think omitting will make new players feel more welcome than keeping it?

[Akizora]

I don't see the problem, if I want replayability without having to play through all of ME1 and ME2 once more just to have a different experience in ME3 then that's great...So why not? Seriously?

[merrick97]

javierabegazo wrote...

I believe that's not the case because it's far more important to make sure that newcomers to the series have an enjoyable time, to let them fall in love with the franchise and want to play the previous games.

Nefarious, how exactly do you think omitting will make new players feel more welcome than keeping it?

Agreed there is NO crime in this and I fail to see why it is.

[charmingcharlie]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...
I have my fact. The comic drains ressources. I don't know how much, but I nontheless believe it could be used somewhere else to a better extent.
You believe, that is not the case. Okay, but why?

You do not know that it is a fact that the comic will drain resources from the Mass Effect 3 budget.  No where has it been stated officially that the comic will take resources away from Mass Effect 3 you are just assuming it will.

My own personal assumption happens to be different to your assumption.  As you know Bioware has a deal with Dark Horse comics to produce Mass Effect based comics.  It is entirely feasible that Bioware incorporated these "prologue comics" into the deal.  So Dark Horse got to do Mass Effect comics and in return they had to produce the prologue comics for the PS3 and ME 3 and give Bioware a percentage of the profits from the comic book series.  Thus leaving the ME 3 budget completely untouched by the cost of the prologue comic.

At the end of the day the cost of the prologue comic will be either negligble or nonexistent.  It will in no way impact your experience of Mass Effect 3.  You will still be at an advantage if you import a Mass Effect save rather than use the comic.  In short you are complaining about something that will not affect you in any way and you are seeking to deny those that will find this comic useful the opportunity to use it simply because you think it is "wrong" or they are "lazy".

[merrick97]

Neofelis Nebulosa,

Here is something else to consider:
If you have a person who buys ME3 and uses the comic to form their backstory and obviously does not import then they will have to start their character fresh without ANY import bonuses.

However, if you do import you get all the perks that come it (XP bonus, credits, resources, etc.)

So its not like Bioware is just throwing away all incentives to import.

Don't forget about that.

[Tazzmission]

i like the thought of a comic for me3.... it did well for dead space part 2.

[merrick97]

charmingcharlie wrote...

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...
I have my fact. The comic drains ressources. I don't know how much, but I nontheless believe it could be used somewhere else to a better extent.
You believe, that is not the case. Okay, but why?

You do not know that it is a fact that the comic will drain resources from the Mass Effect 3 budget.  No where has it been stated officially that the comic will take resources away from Mass Effect 3 you are just assuming it will.

My own personal assumption happens to be different to your assumption.  As you know Bioware has a deal with Dark Horse comics to produce Mass Effect based comics.  It is entirely feasible that Bioware incorporated these "prologue comics" into the deal.  So Dark Horse got to do Mass Effect comics and in return they had to produce the prologue comics for the PS3 and ME 3 and give Bioware a percentage of the profits from the comic book series.  Thus leaving the ME 3 budget completely untouched by the cost of the prologue comic.

At the end of the day the cost of the prologue comic will be either negligble or nonexistent.  It will in no way impact your experience of Mass Effect 3.  You will still be at an advantage if you import a Mass Effect save rather than use the comic.  In short you are complaining about something that will not affect you in any way and you are seeking to deny those that will find this comic useful the opportunity to use it simply because you think it is "wrong" or they are "lazy".

I agree completely. 

I would argue that the interactive comic in ME3 actually makes it EASIER for bioware from a story standpoint since it would effectively eliminate the need for them to create another die/resurrection scenario that would be implausible to happen a 2nd time.

[Akizora]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

charmingcharlie wrote...
You do not know that it is a fact that the comic will drain resources from the Mass Effect 3 budget.  No where has it been stated officially that the comic will take resources away from Mass Effect 3 you are just assuming it will.

It is there, right?
Because if it is there, it must have been produced. If it was produced, ressources were spent on it.

From your point, I'd say you do assume that Dark Horse or whomever programms tha comic did it for free and just gave it to BioWare as a present. If that would indeed be the case, then I am totally fine with it. But assuming it would not cost something is just as wrong.

The cost of a comic is not very high, the programming of a few buttons is not very complicated. Assigning a variable is as easy as assigning a on.click(ShepardChoiceA) ==  Set.Variable.ShepardChoseA.

Ok I suck at programming, all I've ever done is scripting for Elder Scrolls and NWN but still you get my point...It doesn't take very long and as such the resources expended are minimal.

[Nathan Redgrave]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

I can understand that one can make this for ME2, especially with the PS3 release in mind, but please, this is a trilogy. If people start playing Mass Effect with the last installment, it's their fault for not understanding the story.

It's not their fault that ME1 is full of badly-executed BS and copy/pasted three-room prefabs, nor is it their fault that ME2 may be infinitely too streamlined for their tastes.

Also, forcing us to re-play the entire goddamn trilogy every time we want to change something is freaking cruel.

[merrick97]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

charmingcharlie wrote...
You do not know that it is a fact that the comic will drain resources from the Mass Effect 3 budget.  No where has it been stated officially that the comic will take resources away from Mass Effect 3 you are just assuming it will.

It is there, right?
Because if it is there, it must have been produced. If it was produced, ressources were spent on it.

From your point, I'd say you do assume that Dark Horse or whomever programms tha comic did it for free and just gave it to BioWare as a present. If that would indeed be the case, then I am totally fine with it. But assuming it would not cost something is just as wrong.

And if you were right about the Dark Horse deal, I'd like a fact. Proof that it doesn't drain ressources from BioWare. So far you are assuming just like you say I am.

And its just as wrong of you to think that the cost is significant enough to put a damper on resources for ME3.  

Nobody is saying Dark Horse did anything for free, everybody knows producing an interactive comic costs money but it is very silly of you to think that the cost was great enough to have a negative impact on ME3 because it implies that they had to make the interactive comic at the cost of making something else.  

That may or may not be the case.  

I have played PLENTY of games that has features I dont use.  Does that mean it was wasted money on the developers if I dont use it to assume that it doesnt create a better experience for other gamers?  Thats the school of thought you have and this thread is proof that your feelings are very much in the minority.  

Many people are VERY appreciative of the fact that they can change some of their decisions without having to replay ME1 or ME2.  

Modifié par merrick97, 08 avril 2011 - 05:59 .

[Iakus]

I'm not too concerned about money or resources it would take up. What I am concerned about is:

"Jakob(sic) was a good kid"

"Miranda was tough, Cerberus to the core"

"Tali was as brilliant as she was beautiful"

[javierabegazo]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

javierabegazo wrote...

I believe that's not the case because it's far more important to make sure that newcomers to the series have an enjoyable time, to let them fall in love with the franchise and want to play the previous games.

Nefarious, how exactly do you think omitting will make new players feel more welcome than keeping it?

I hope you don't mean me with that nefarious!? I may be wicked, but I am not infamous for it!

Lol, sorry, I meant to type your name, Neofelis

[merrick97]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

merrick97 wrote...

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

charmingcharlie wrote...
You do not know that it is a fact that the comic will drain resources from the Mass Effect 3 budget.  No where has it been stated officially that the comic will take resources away from Mass Effect 3 you are just assuming it will.

It is there, right?
Because if it is there, it must have been produced. If it was produced, ressources were spent on it.

From your point, I'd say you do assume that Dark Horse or whomever programms tha comic did it for free and just gave it to BioWare as a present. If that would indeed be the case, then I am totally fine with it. But assuming it would not cost something is just as wrong.

And if you were right about the Dark Horse deal, I'd like a fact. Proof that it doesn't drain ressources from BioWare. So far you are assuming just like you say I am.

And its just as wrong of you to think that the cost is significant enough to put a damper on resources for ME3.  

Nobody is saying Dark Horse did anything for free, everybody knows producing an interactive comic costs money but it is very silly of you to think that the cost was great enough to have a negative impact on ME3 because it implies that they had to make the interactive comic came at the cost of making something else.  That may or may not be the case.  I have played PLENTY of games that has features I dont use.  Does that mean it was wasted money if I dont use it to assume that it doesnt create a better experience for other gamers?

I am not saying the comic has any negative impact. I am stating the ressources from a comic used else where could have a more positive impact. See the coffee break example.


edit://
Sorry for double post.

You keep repeating this over and over and the response from everyone is still the same: You dont know what the result would be and its silly of you to assume that if they hadn't authorized the creation of the comic, ME3 would be a better game. 

[Akizora]

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

Neofelis Nebulosa wrote...

I can understand that one can make this for ME2, especially with the PS3 release in mind, but please, this is a trilogy. If people start playing Mass Effect with the last installment, it's their fault for not understanding the story.

It's not their fault that ME1 is full of badly-executed BS and copy/pasted three-room prefabs, nor is it their fault that ME2 may be infinitely too streamlined for their tastes.

Also, forcing us to re-play the entire goddamn trilogy every time we want to change something is freaking cruel.

Actually you had to play only ME2, thanks to Gibbed's Save Editor. Prerequisites halfed, no money expended.

Not everyone has ME for  PC or the possibility to transfer savedgames from the 360/PS3 to the PC...So having to use an unofficial save editor to be able to enjoy a game is ridiculous.

EDIT: Err said "a PC" when I meant to say "ME for PC"

Modifié par Akizora, 08 avril 2011 - 06:03 .