37 réponses à ce sujet

[Stardusk78]

I want to like the Shuriken, hell the Katana is my 2nd favourite shotgun after the Claymore and you start with it, so I really want to see the advantage of the Shuriken but compared to the other two, Locust and Tempest, it is just fairly useless:

The Locust does 25 damage per bullet, has a clip of 20, has a 1.25x damage bonus against armour, shields and barriers; most importantly, it is pinpoint accurate with Zero recoil.

The Tempest does 14 damage per bullet, has a massive clip of 50 and has a 1.5x damage bonus against shields and barriers; it is very inaccurate and only accurate at point blank to short range. It is great for flanking with an ammo power and a beast with barriered/shielded bosses.

The Shuriken does 20.5 damage per bullet, has a small clip of 24 and has a 1.5x damage bonus against shields and barriers; it is very inaccurate (bounces more than the Tempest), can be pulsed for rapid fire (but can't hit anything that is not short to point blank range) and does comparatively speaking very little damage, given its clip size. You can't  really hit anything with an entire clip at more than short range;at medium you will miss most shots as it bounces up and down and its clip size does not encourage mistakes (whereas with the Tempest it does not matter as much). Looking at the facts, the Shuriken as it stands is inferior to both the Locust and Tempest for different reasons. I like to have a Submachine Gun as a mid range weapon or a flanking weapon; the Shuriken is terrible at both. I have been thinking about modding it, making it more accurate at medium range. I mean lots of other starting weapons retain their use through the game but the Shuriken...does anyone else feel this way?

Modifié par Stardusk78, 12 avril 2011 - 02:15 .

[Sparrow44]

Shruiken is actually better than the Tempest IMO, the key to maximizing the Shruiken is rapidly tapping the trigger between each burst as this gives you a near full auto-fire with the weapon. You just have to get in closer with it and watch out for the recoil as it does tend to climb this way.

Also if you haven't already check out Submachine Gun Pandemonium! which details the effectiveness of the three SMG's (especially up close and personal).

Modifié par Sparroww, 12 avril 2011 - 02:20 .

[Stardusk78]

Sparroww wrote...

Shruiken is actually better than the Tempest IMO, the key to maximizing the Shruiken is rapidly tapping the trigger between each burst as this gives you a near full auto-fire with the weapon. You just have to get in closer with it and watch out for the recoil as it does tend to climb this way.

Also if you haven't already check out Submachine Gun Pandemonium! which details the effectiveness of the three SMG's (especially up close and personal).

I know the tap trick but problem with it is that at the range you can actually hit somethin with it I could just start using a shotgun. It needs more accuracy to compensate for its othe deficiences.

[Sparrow44]

That's why it has burst fire, to accommodate the high recoil between the shots. Managing recoil and the rate of fire is tricky but it can be useful.

Plus Locust is better at longer engagements anyway which renders the Shruiken a little bit underrated.

[Influ]

Well I'm kind of on the same boat. I don't see much point in using it because if I need my SMG for longer ranges, Locust is vastly superior. If I want a CQC SMG, Tempest is my weapon of choice. It doesn't even work as a compromise between the two, as I don't have a problem shooting the Tempest at longer ranges. Bursting it works just fine. And the Locust also does fine in CQC. The Shuriken is a good well-rounded weapon, but it doesn't really shine at anything.

[EffectedByTheMasses]

Tempest does pathetic DPS at the same ranges as the Shuriken. You'll find with both weapons that at short or point blank range, one clip is enough to kill most enemies, however the shuriken empties way faster, meaning you're out of cover for a shorter time. It also outperforms the Locust at short/PB range, 'nuff said. At medium to long range, it still outdoes the tempest while burst firing, as burst firing generally negates its recoil. However, the locust is obviously the best choice at medium to long range.

Overall the shuriken is the best balanced submachine gun IMO, as it is a beast at short ranges and decent at medium ranges (when, say, a pistol would universally be a better weapon choice).

[Influ]

I wouldn't say the Shuriken beasts the Locust on short range. However the Locust definitely destroys the Shuriken at long range so I would say it's much more useful overall. And your massively exaggerating the difference in DPS between the Shuriken and the Tempest. The difference is about 10%. Then there's 42% more damage potential per clip with the Tempest comparing to the Shuriken.

But as I said, it's a good weapon. It's just not my cup of tea.

[HTTP 404]

well, the shuriken and tempest match the same playstyles imo. Those that like the shuriken will use it over tempest and vice versa. My problem is that neither is distinct enough for me as choices as opposed to the Assualt rifles they are all so very different from each other.

[termokanden]

I don't see the point in the Shuriken if you have the Locust. I go for headshots mainly, and it's just easier with a steady gun. The Locust can be fired full auto and you'll still hit all the time.

[Stardusk78]

Well, I modded it to give it a similar accuracy to the Locust (almost as accurate). I just want the thing to be useful.

[Kronner]

Shuriken is useful, it is really, really good SMG. It might not be better than Locust, but then again, Locust is DLC item, Locust is more of a mini-AR, not SMG. I like weapons that are not perfect, because it is just much more fun to use.

edit:
No need to mod it, unless you want an easy way out/super powerful weapon. But then again, why not just lower the difficulty? I generally dislike all gameplay mods tbh.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 avril 2011 - 12:13 .

[termokanden]

If you mod the accuracy it might actually be better. But I play without mods.

As it is, I just find it inaccurate to a degree where it's just very annoying to use. The Tempest isn't all that accurate either, but somehow it's more fun to use.

Modifié par termokanden, 12 avril 2011 - 12:11 .

[Bozorgmehr]

SMGs are "spray and pray" weapons - in that regard the Locust is more an AR than a SMG. The Shuriken is a good weapon against shields and barriers up to medium range. At close /point blank range shotties are best, so classes who can use SG don't gain much by using the Shuriken. But without shotties, both the Shuriken and the Tempest are great weapons.

The Locust is the best all round weapon in ME2; but I prefer the Shuriken and Tempest when I'm in their optimum range.

[Stardusk78]

Kronner wrote...

Shuriken is useful, it is really, really good SMG. It might not be better than Locust, but then again, Locust is DLC item, Locust is more of a mini-AR, not SMG. I like weapons that are not perfect, because it is just much more fun to use.

edit:
No need to mod it, unless you want an easy way out/super powerful weapon. But then again, why not just lower the difficulty? I generally dislike all gameplay mods tbh.

I only mod weapons that are not particularly useful. I find the Shuriken to be, well, not particularly useful as it stands. Increasing its accuracy makes it a medium range weapon, useful to use.

My current Infiltrator set ups is: Incisor(Long to medium long range), Shuriken (Medium to short range), Katana CQC range...I find this works bests best for me...

I often wondered why I never saw your Sentinel with the Claymore....guess I know why now. I am actually doing a Sentinel/Katana set up right now, works really well. I am kind of sick of the Claymore at the moment.

[Kronner]

Maybe you simply haven't figured out when would that weapon be useful. For example the Shuriken is not supposed to be super accurate mid-range weapon..there are other weapons for that. It is the very basic SMG, and it excels in that role. And once you get used to its recoil, it is actually decent for mid-range combat.

Tony's Shuriken Vanguard:



I agree about Incisor though, BioWare dropped the ball there. Vanilla Incisor is totally useless for Shepard.

Modifié par Kronner, 12 avril 2011 - 12:26 .

[Bozorgmehr]

Stardusk78 wrote...

I am kind of sick of the Claymore at the moment.

I don't feel particularly well atm, but a Claymore shot will wake me up no matter what

[Stardusk78]

Kronner wrote...

Maybe you simply haven't figured out when would that weapon be useful. For example the Shuriken is not supposed to be super accurate mid-range weapon..there are other weapons for that. It is the very basic SMG, and it excels in that role. And once you get used to its recoil, it is actually decent for mid-range combat.
I agree about Incisor though, BioWare dropped the ball there.

What weapon should be used at mid range then for a SR/SG Infiltrator?

[Stardusk78]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

Stardusk78 wrote...

I am kind of sick of the Claymore at the moment.

I don't feel particularly well atm, but a Claymore shot will wake me up no matter what

Right now I am in a Katana phase to be honest; looks cool, sounds amazing and having 5 shots plus ROF makes it perfect for shoot melee shoot...

[Kronner]

Stardusk78 wrote...

What weapon should be used at mid range then for a SR/SG Infiltrator?

SR? If you have Viper OR your modded Incisor, you should have mid to long range covered, I think.
Or Locust if you insist on using SMG (miniAR) for that..

Modifié par Kronner, 12 avril 2011 - 12:30 .

[termokanden]

My point is, I don't think the Locust is overpowered. It just gives Adepts, Engineers and Sentinels a proper weapon to use until the Collector ship. What else are you going to use? Pistols with their ridiculously low ammo count?

You need something else, and these classes are just as much mid-long range as they are short range. Why force them all into close range to use the Shuriken. No the Shuriken would be great if you had another proper weapon category of your own choice. But you don't until the Collector ship.

The good thing about the Locust is that while it's useful, it's nowhere near as overpowered as the Mattock.

[Stardusk78]

Kronner wrote...

Stardusk78 wrote...

What weapon should be used at mid range then for a SR/SG Infiltrator?

SR? If you have Viper OR your modded Incisor, you should have mid to long range covered, I think.
Or Locust if you insist on using SMG for that..

Yeah, I guess. SMG is just a back up anyway...I ususally snipe and go in to shotgun kills pretty fast so...

I think I will restore the Shuriken back to its orginal stats and try to make the best use of it.

You're always an inspiration Kronner!

[Kronner]

termokanden wrote...

My point is, I don't think the Locust is overpowered.

...

The good thing about the Locust is that while it's useful, it's nowhere near as overpowered as the Mattock.

Agreed about Locust, it has no recoil (almost), but its damage is not so great. Great all-around weapon. And I love the backstory it has.

Mattock has no recoil and deals extreme amount of damage. Overpowered all-around weapon. The power of Money  :happy:

Modifié par Kronner, 12 avril 2011 - 12:34 .

[Bozorgmehr]

termokanden wrote...

My point is, I don't think the Locust is overpowered. It just gives Adepts, Engineers and Sentinels a proper weapon to use until the Collector ship. What else are you going to use? Pistols with their ridiculously low ammo count?

You need something else, and these classes are just as much mid-long range as they are short range. Why force them all into close range to use the Shuriken. No the Shuriken would be great if you had another proper weapon category of your own choice. But you don't until the Collector ship.

The good thing about the Locust is that while it's useful, it's nowhere near as overpowered as the Mattock.

I think it's bad that casters needed a weapon like the Locust to have reasonable firepower before they get their bonus weapon. I agree the Locust is not OP, but it does take away some of the 'true' SMG's usefullness. It's a awesome backup weapon, but it doesn't have any real cons beside lesser damage output compared to some AR, SR and SG.

[termokanden]

That's the problem that will hopefully be solved in ME3 when you're not longer stuck with the "support weapons".

I was playing around with a sentinel on insanity because I haven't tried it before. It's quite funny in the beginning. Can't be killed, but is about as dangerous as a newborn kitten.