141 réponses à ce sujet

[Blood-Lord Thanatos]

My Cousin can beat the crap out of me in any videogame as well as Real-life. She is not someone to cross. never get between a redhead and a serious session of DA2/DA:O.

[Stinkface27]

I was going to post a well-thought out, lengthy response to this thread, then I read all the disgustingly ignorant and misogynist ranting and decided to just post this brief one whilst continuing to enjoy and be good at any game I wish to be.

[Silveryne]

[quote]Carfax wrote...

Whether they are a minority or not is irrelevent.  The fact is, that gay men are overrepresented in the Fashion Industry.  Many of the lead designers are gay, including designers like Tom Ford, Versace (when he was alive), Karl Lagerfeld, Dolce and Gabbana......need I go on?

Basically, you have no idea what you're talking about..  Many of the top male designers are gay or bisexual, thats a fact.[/quote]

I... really...? We're going to play this game? Okay.

For sake of your argument, I will pretend that the following fashion designers do not exist:
1) Roberto Cavalli
2) Tommy Hilfiger
3) Ralph Lauren
4)Yohji Yamamoto
and
5) Christian Lacroix


[quote]Morbidly obese women (and men) disgust me.  Unless they have a medical disorder, many of them achieved that state through sheer gluttony and laziness.  They also impose upon themselves severe health risks through their lifestyle and eating habits.[/quote]

Yes, and it is their choice, unless they have a medical disorder. Nothing is stopping them from getting up and starting a work out plan. I respect the choices of other people! People know that smoking is a bad choice, and they still do it! Because people are capable of choosing how to run their lives. 


[quote]You are completely ignorant of the fashion industry, but perhaps I'm being too hard on you..  You see, I used to model myself at one time, so I'm aware of what goes on behind the scenes so to speak.[/quote]

I used to be in school so I know all about school politics. I once went to a protest so I know all about protests. I once wrote a paper so I know all about writing papers. I once took a chemistry class so I know all about chemistry. I also once rode a horse (well, five times), so I know all about riding horses.

I am so completely ignorant that I could name five straight fashion designers. Clearly, though, they're "exceptions". 
 
[quote]You find articles like that offensive?  No wonder we're having problems..

Going to the gym is a GOOD thing.  If my loved ones were gaining excessive weight that I knew would eventually put their health at risks, then I would certainly encourage them to go to the gym and start eating healthily.

Open your eyes.  The U.S and other developed countries have health care costs which consume almost  20% of our GDP, especially due to various lifestyle diseases like Diabetes Type II, heart disease, high blood pressure etc which can be completely avoidable if you take care of yourself..

I find your nonchalant attitude over this to be alarming in and of itself..  Things like this have severe consequences for all of us when it gets out of hand, but you seem to think that it's OK if people stuff their faces to the point where they can barely even move..  You seem to even think that it's beautiful in it's own way [/quote]

Yeah, because telling your girlfriend that she's fat and slapping her on the ass isn't a problem. That's the content of those articles. I believe in treating people like humans capable of making choices, not light slabs of meat. Which is why I think those articles are a problem. Frankly, if someone is aware of the health risks and decides they don't want to work out, that's their choice. Choices are awesome.

[quote]Right, because flipping someone and lifting them are the exact same thing 

Tell her to lift two 280lbs guys at the same time if she wants to really impress..[/quote]

Personally, I think a smart application of force always trumps a brute application of force. But, hey, that's just me. If you want to put your weight against something, go for it. If you can use a lever or another tool, though, you're smart.

I think intelligence and knowing where and how to apply force is smarter than just being able to lift two 280lbs guys at the same time. Also, much more useful.
 
[quote]Gymnasts only need to be strong enough to lift their own body weight with ease, so thats a bad comparison..

Honestly, you obviously don't know much about personal fitness and strength training.  It's a Scientific fact that larger muscles are stronger than smaller ones, and that the amount of muscle mass an individual has is a major factor (not the ony one) in their overall strength.[/quote]

I know more than enough about strength training to know that being "ripped" is usually overkill. Also, that it takes more to conserve those muscles that you build. Believe it or not, I'm not a completely dumb chick.

[quote]What do you mean by "ripped?"  Ripped typically means cut, or muscular in terms of definition.

It doesn't typically refer to muscle mass or bulk, at least not in the vernacular sense.[/quote]

Considering vernacular means "every day language", yes, ripped does relate to muscle mass or bulk. If you are seriously having trouble understanding what I mean, then I advise you to use Google search.

[quote]I already looked, so unless History has rewritten itself, then I'm sure nothing has changed.  Why don't you tell me of these Matriarchical civilizations and societies since you seem to know about them.

And I'm well aware that there were many historical female warriors.  Thats not the same thing as a Matriarchy however..[/quote]

I already did when I told you the Ancient Celts. Selective reading ftw. 

[quote]OK lets get one thing straight.  You don't know me, or anything about my family besides a few generalities..  As far as you're concerned, I'm just text on your screen.

Now, with that said, you must have completely missed several statements of mine where I said my daughters (and wife) are all gamers to some extent, and that I have been trying to get my wife interested in games like Mass Effect etc for years..

Apparently, in your jaded view of the World, that must mean that I'm some domineering father or husband that wants to exert control over every aspect of his family's life... 
Really, I wonder if you're even reading this thread at all, or are you making things up as you go a long? [/quote]

But you know enough about me to tell me I know nothing about bodybuilding or fashion? Also, that because I'm female and into gaming that I'm an "exception" to some rule that you have still failed to define?

Characters attacks are cute, btw. I did read your post. I am more concerned that your opinion of women being able or unable to do things or having certain roles will transfer to your children. Please read more carefully before you go trying to make me commit seppuku.

[quote[Unusual simply means something out of the ordinary, so yes, a guy playing Facebook games would probably be viewed as unusual since those kind of games are played mostly by women.[/quote]

Except they're not. Only 55% of social gamers (people that play games on facebook) are female. That might be a majority in the sense of "over half", but that wouldn't be enough to pass anything in American politics.

[quote]I'm not freaking out about anything.  If anyone's freaking out, it's you, because you're obviously offended that I think female gamers that play masculine oriented games are unusual, or exceptions to the trends.[/quote]

If it's worth this much trouble to your time and attempting to beat down several people in a forum and insist to us that we're wrong, you are freaking out about it. But thank you for finally admitting that you think it and it's not actually a de facto trend, but rather your own opinion.

[quote]Yes you definitely sound like a broken record with this.  You keep continually saying that "we're individuals" and I keep saying that individuals don't concern me, as I'm more interested in the overall trend.[/quote]

Then stop fighting me about this. If the fact that we're individuals is below your notice, then just don't formulate a reply about it.

[quote]Stop being ridiculous.  Individuality and conformity are both major factors in the lives of evey human being on this planet.  If you think conformity is irrelevent, then you need to open your eyes.[/quote]

We don't conform about all things, otherwise we'd all be similar. Oh, and hey! Apparently individuality does matter if we're talking about conformity. Who knew, right?

[quote]LOL this is funny.  You think I'm trying to impose something on you and yours, but thats all in your head. 

I don't have the power to affect your life in any way shape or form.  The fact that you seem to be irritated just from my opinions goes to show that your individualism isn't as strong as you let on.[/quote]

Why do we women get annoyed about this? Because, frankly, attitudes do help to impose things on people. The attitude that women are weaker, lesser, or not human beings imposed certain things on us for a long time. You know, like not being able to own property, not being able to join the military in a combat capacity, and until recently being excluded from some public institutions. That's why we all care about this. A change in attitude can present a significant backslide in policy and rights.

[quote]
[quote]There is no standard of normal. Normality is a pleasant illusion that does not exist. It's an ideal. It's not reality.[/quote]

If you say so [/quote]

Okay. Prove it. Show me what normal is, and that there are individuals who conform exactly to that idea of normalcy.

[quote]
[quote]Though sorry for hurting your feelings. I'll make it up to you by posting a box of spider-man bandaids to ya.[/quote]

Please make those Superman bandaids [/quote]

Nah. It'll be My Little Pony now.

[quote]
[quote]Here, let me put my hand in and get it wrenched off for you: I'm not sensitive. I do not take kindly to being told, in a very roundabout way, that there is something wrong or unusual with me and every other woman on this forum. None of us do. This is slowly devolving into you baiting us, though, instead of a debate filled with mutual respect.[/quote]

Nonsense, you're as prickly as a hedgehog and as sensitive as a jellyfish  [/quote]

I hope I'm not the only person amused by the fact that in your response you were positively venomous and belittling up until the end. Because it's all in good fun.

[quote]Again, let me reiterate.  I have no control or impact on your life at all Silveryne.  You can do, and think whatever you want without any care what I say.

Why you place such a premium on what I think, is perplexing to me, seeing as you repeatedly claim that you're an individual.[/quote]

I don't give a rat's behind about how you think and how it relates to me. I care only about what you think in how it relates to women as a whole. There's lots of women out there who don't speak up or engage in these debates. There are lots of women who will stop gaming if a man disapproves of it. I don't need your validation, but the fact that you seem to think I do, is very sweet. Thanks, but you can take your validation and give it to someone who needs it more. All I'd like is for you to acknowledge that the whole of women is made up of unique individuals from differing backgrounds with different likes and dislikes, none of which fit some pre-conceived definition of "normal", who deserve respect for liking what they like. Not questioning why they like gaming, not saying that they're not fitting the definition of normal female for liking it.

You seem to have missed my point completely.. There is no "typical woman gamer". There is no "typical woman". There is no base line. There's only people.

I'm starting to think you're just a troll with the way you pick and chose what you want to answer to and with your character attacks. Really, I'm not running for office here.

I really do appreciate you spending so much time trying to attack/offend me, though. Always good to have a big old pointless fight on the internet.

[Carfax]

Stinkface27 wrote...

I was going to post a well-thought out, lengthy response to this thread, then I read all the disgustingly ignorant and misogynist ranting and decided to just post this brief one whilst continuing to enjoy and be good at any game I wish to be.

If you think there are any misogynistic comments in this thread, then report them...  Of course the truth is that there aren't any misogynistic comments and that you're simply hyper sensitive.

Basically, you claiming there are misogynistic comments is merely a cover up for your dislike of any opinion that conflicts with yours..

[Silveryne]

Quick addendum:

By saying that gay fashion designers are responsible for women's body image issues you are discounting phenomena that exist such as foot binding and neck rings. You are taking a distinctive western-centric view. That stuff doesn't fly for all women. But I suppose women in the east and across the seas are eagerly picking up those fashion magazines, huh.

[Shirosaki17]

Silveryne wrote...

Quick addendum:

By saying that gay fashion designers are responsible for women's body image issues you are discounting phenomena that exist such as foot binding and neck rings. You are taking a distinctive western-centric view. That stuff doesn't fly for all women. But I suppose women in the east and across the seas are eagerly picking up those fashion magazines, huh.

Don't forget the ugly armpits women have.

[Godak]

Carfax, if you fail to see how some of your comments could be construed as misogynistic, then you are probably a misogynist.

One more thing...

Carfax wrote...

You are completely ignorant of the fashion industry, but perhaps I'm being too hard on you.

Congratulations on typing out the most condescending phrase I've read in quite some time.

[Silveryne]

Shirosaki17 wrote...
Don't forget the ugly armpits women have.

I don't know if that's a joke, but thanks for reminding me. In some cultures, the shaving of armpits is, indeed, not considered a prerequisite for beauty. Unless you mean armpits are ugly in general. If that's the case they totally are gross. Anything that is [potentially] hairy and sweaty is so gross.

Also, shaving in general: it was acceptable for women to have hairy legs until a very aggressive campaign to sell women razors (that were unsuitable for men shaving their faces) in the 1920s.

[Shirosaki17]

Silveryne wrote...

Shirosaki17 wrote...
Don't forget the ugly armpits women have.

I don't know if that's a joke, but thanks for reminding me. In some cultures, the shaving of armpits is, indeed, not considered a prerequisite for beauty. Unless you mean armpits are ugly in general. If that's the case they totally are gross. Anything that is [potentially] hairy and sweaty is so gross.

Also, shaving in general: it was acceptable for women to have hairy legs until a very aggressive campaign to sell women razors (that were unsuitable for men shaving their faces) in the 1920s.

It's just a reference to tonight's Colbert Report. It's suppose to be a joke.

Basically, Dove which is owned by Unilever came out with this new sleeveless deoderant that is suppose to make your armpits sexier after 5 days. There was also a study released that showed 93% of women consider their armpits unattractive. The company that did the survey, Unilever. Colbert was making fun of them by saying they are making up things for women to be self-conscious about so they can spend money on their products "fixing" it.

Modifié par Shirosaki17, 14 avril 2011 - 06:18 .

[jellobell]

Carfax wrote...

Anyway, the point is that womens' body image issues doesn't stem from heterosexual men.  Most heterosexual men find curvy bodies much more attractive than skinny ones.  It's in our genes!

Multiple studies have shown this, so stop blaming us for your body image problems! 

Uh-huh. And I suppose we're all slaves to our genes, right? Cultural conditioning is oftentimes a much more powerful force than biology. Blaming gay fashion designers for women's body image issues seems nonsensical because it is complete nonsense. The standards of beauty that are upheld in modern western society are perpetuated, in part, by heterosexual men. Who are women trying to impress? Their husbands and boyfriends, who are most likely not gay. I'm not blaming heterosexual men for their preferences, I'm just saying that it's part of their cultural baggage. It's a view that is reinforced from many angles. From the fashion industry, from the media, and from men and women themselves. Blaming it all on a single group of people is ludicrous. 

[Silveryne]

Shirosaki17 wrote...
Basically, Dove which is owned by Unilever came out with this new sleeveless deoderant that is suppose to make your armpits sexier after 5 days. There was also a study released that showed 93% of women consider their armpits unattractive. The company that did the survey, Unilever. Colbert was making fun of them by saying they are making up things for women to be self-conscious about so they can spend money on their products "fixing" it.

Because that study isn't biased.  I love Colbert. Wish I could catch him more than I do.

[Azjurai]

Pretty much ever other female I know is also a gamer of some kind. Most don't play RPGs, this is true, but they're scary when they play an FPS >.>

Heck, the people who work at the local gamestores and actually know about games here are females. All the men here just talk about racing games or halo. Ugh, saying something like STALKER gets a confused stare at best. She does get hit on by most people who don't realize she knows gaming well though

[Godak]

Silveryne wrote...

Because that study isn't biased. 

Excuse you, miss, but they are exaggerated for marketing effect!

Silvernye wrote...

I love Colbert. Wish I could catch him more than I do.

I wish Colbert and Stewart would just come together and do an entire hour. That way my DVR wouldn't attempt suicide so often.

[Carfax]

Godak wrote...

Carfax, if you fail to see how some of your comments could be construed as misogynistic, then you are probably a misogynist.

Stop being a coward and point out some of my "misogynistic" comments..  This I'd like to see..

[Pacifien]

Somewhere along the way I think this debate has gotten a little personal and I'm pretty sure it's not about why women like BioWare games anymore. So if that particular topic has been said and done, I'll close the thread.

[Carfax]

Isn't this an off topic forum? Why would you consider locking this thread just because the conversation deviates a tad?

Thats normal for practically all threads..

[Pacifien]

When debates get personal, yes, there isn't much preventing me from locking a thread. Deviating topics should go in new threads.