220 réponses à ce sujet

[SilentK]

Yellow Words wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Dragon Age 2 - It was oooh so close to being the Diamond it could have been. It just really needed, and indeed deserved an extra 9 - 12 months polishing time.

The interview was a good read. I always enjoy what the good doctors have to say. Fully confident they will take the issues with DA2 that people have and get DA3 spit shined to within an inch of its life.

Also: Holy BEEGEEZUS! I've been on these forums for years now and ONLY just this very second realised I could resize the window box I'm typing in!
*facepalm

I completely agree and in the end I ended up liking DA2 more than DAO despite its faults. I don't think many would argue that it could have used a few more months of polishing time. All in all I'm excited to see what they will do with DA3. 

But I do think that personal insults against the devs and people on the forum is taking things to far. Maybe it will calm down in a few weeks. 

Well I with you on DA2 having many changes that I approve of. Voice and animation of Hawke, I love that part. Also to have the companions interacting more in quests and the story so I'm looking forward to DA3. I've read posts where people would rather have a silent Hawke and more resources put on story than a voice. I would rather keep the voice and then I'll would buy one or two reused areas. For me the Brecilian forest was always pretty tedoius to get through. The temple with the sacred ashes was so pretty but there wasn't to much more to do than go through it. If you compared it to Orzammar there was just so much more to do there. I didn't get the nothing to do feeling in DA2 but that's just me. That said I would have liked a bit more about Hawke's background and a little bit more in the ending but I guess they are keeping it open because it will continue in DA3. Was about to write what I would have liked for start-up with background for Hawke but it got a bit spoilerish and this is the no-spoiler-forum.  I have a feeling that it will be a new protagonist but I'm hoping for a return of Hawke   =)   

[Monica83]

No so disgusted that i stay here to ear fanboys continue to use teeth and nails to defend a garbage sequel!

*troll face options of course*

[SilentK]

Fangirl  if you please          here have a *hug*   you sound angry. Guess we just feel differently. Have fun on the forum.

[FedericoV]

Monica83 wrote...

No so disgusted that i stay here to ear fanboys continue to use teeth and nails to defend a garbage sequel!

*troll face options of course*

A garbage sequel that a) you have not played or you have pirated or c) you have bought but not registered for sinister reason even if you had allready decided that the game was going to suck ON ANY LEVEL long before it shipped (in case, I would question your intelligence if more evidence were needed, since you bought a game that you were going to hate no matter what).

Btw, being called a fanboy by a judgemental hater hater like you, a person who has never ever ever ever something constructive or slightly rational to add to a discussion and that just use statements as facts it's an HONOR. You are a reason to like DA2 despite all its flaws.

PS: Ear: Orecchio. Hear: Ascoltare. Listen and repeat.

Modifié par FedericoV, 15 avril 2011 - 03:32 .

[Monica83]

i played it.... oh ok we are at the point because i have not registered my game you think i have not played the game...fanboys...

I played it and also maked a rewiew a costructive one please.... stop climbing glass... is.... just... hilarious

and:haterhaterhaterhaterhater mushrooom mushrooom don't bother me

im just joking... lol

Anyways im glad you puchased the game: so you can have ME2 for free.....

Modifié par Monica83, 15 avril 2011 - 03:36 .

[FedericoV]

Monica83 wrote...

i played it.... oh ok we are at the point because i have not registered my game you think i have not played the game...fanboys...

I played it and also maked a rewiew a costructive one please.... stop climbing glass... is.... just... hilarious

and:haterhaterhaterhaterhater mushrooom mushrooom don't bother me

im just joking... lol

Anyways im glad you puchased the game: so you can have ME2 for free.....

Sometime I ask myself why Bio forums have not the "ignore" function.

That's one of those time.

Ah, have a good time hating a game that you have pirated .

Modifié par FedericoV, 15 avril 2011 - 03:45 .

[Monica83]

see? i think the same thing! we are not so different after all!
And not i have pirated nothing..... i never do that.. so what's the point?....

Sorry but you take it too seriously

Modifié par Monica83, 15 avril 2011 - 03:51 .

[Siansonea]

Why does every thread turn into a skirmish? I don't see anyone actually discussing the interview anymore. Probably needs to be locked.

[Blastback]

Volourn wrote...

"Seriously Bioware is an RPG developer"

NEWSFLASH: BIo's first game and 2 of their first 3 games weren't even RPGs.

"... It seems like Bioware is changing"

Nope. BIO's goals have remained the same.



"Including Xbox, PS2, and PC sales ME2 has only sold 2.4 million (granted digital sales are not included)"

Flat out lie. Why do you lie?

Where exactly did you get your infromation about ME2 being Bioware's highest selling game?  Cause last I saw, it was Origins.

[Cutlasskiwi]

SilentK wrote...

Yellow Words wrote...

Icinix wrote...

Dragon Age 2 - It was oooh so close to being the Diamond it could have been. It just really needed, and indeed deserved an extra 9 - 12 months polishing time.

The interview was a good read. I always enjoy what the good doctors have to say. Fully confident they will take the issues with DA2 that people have and get DA3 spit shined to within an inch of its life.

Also: Holy BEEGEEZUS! I've been on these forums for years now and ONLY just this very second realised I could resize the window box I'm typing in!
*facepalm

I completely agree and in the end I ended up liking DA2 more than DAO despite its faults. I don't think many would argue that it could have used a few more months of polishing time. All in all I'm excited to see what they will do with DA3. 

But I do think that personal insults against the devs and people on the forum is taking things to far. Maybe it will calm down in a few weeks. 

Well I with you on DA2 having many changes that I approve of. Voice and animation of Hawke, I love that part. Also to have the companions interacting more in quests and the story so I'm looking forward to DA3. I've read posts where people would rather have a silent Hawke and more resources put on story than a voice. I would rather keep the voice and then I'll would buy one or two reused areas. For me the Brecilian forest was always pretty tedoius to get through. The temple with the sacred ashes was so pretty but there wasn't to much more to do than go through it. If you compared it to Orzammar there was just so much more to do there. I didn't get the nothing to do feeling in DA2 but that's just me. That said I would have liked a bit more about Hawke's background and a little bit more in the ending but I guess they are keeping it open because it will continue in DA3. Was about to write what I would have liked for start-up with background for Hawke but it got a bit spoilerish and this is the no-spoiler-forum.  I have a feeling that it will be a new protagonist but I'm hoping for a return of Hawke   =)   

Heh, I agree with everything you just wrote. I would have loved to start of the game in Lothering just to see how they lived and what they did before the blight. 

I think there will be a new protagonist for DA3 so I'm hoping for an longer expansion pack for Hawke too since I'm not ready to let go of my Hawke just yet. 

[John Epler]

And now we're completely off-topic and deep in the middens of personal attacks and vitriol.

Bring it back to discussing the interview, please, and cut it out the with the hostility or this will get locked.

[TheMadCat]

AlanC9 wrote...

Data is tracked by individual installation, and reaching Ostagar gives you a specific achievement for each origin, so players who played all the origins to completion would be quite obvious.

Sure, it's conceivable that Bio's people were idiots and didn't actually associate the data with individual installations when analyzing it. Do we have a reason to assume this?

Or the possibility that they simply could have lied to us in order try and give the community justification to their decision, or the fact it could be very skewed because there is an option to block your information or play completely offline as well, maybe they've only got data on 20% of the sales which would make it a fairly small sample . It's impossible to really know what data is facutal and what is stretched when it's closed off to all but a very select few and corporations and their representatives are one of the last things whose word I'll blindly take as truthful. It'd be nice if BioWare would share some of this information they've collected as it'd be interesting to see, but for whatever reason the gaming industry loves being as closed off as posible to the public which is contrary to every other entertainment industry.

[Sad Dragon]

[quote]SilentK wrote...

I've read posts where people would rather have a silent Hawke and more resources put on story than a voice. I would rather keep the voice and then I'll would buy one or two reused areas  [/quote]
[/quote]

The problem here is that its not only about reusing areas vs voiced protagonis. With a silent protagonist the 'only' cost is the writers who are writing the dialogue, now compare that to a voiced protagonist which not only has the writers getting payed but also the voice actor. It also adds more time to the production as after the lines are done you have to have someone read them.

I think most people who want a silent protagonist are after is more dialogue -- though I am sure some people out there find it increadably immersion breaking to have you character being voiced by a voice you dont like or doesn't fit with the character you envisioned.

There is some truth to the former as you can get more for the same production cost and time. That being said, you didn't get much more in terms of dialogue when we had silent protagonists then we do now -- at times we do, but it's not necesserally due to the voice acting. Of cource, one could argue that there wasn't enough dialogue options for the character back in the silent days either, and things are not bound to get better now that we have a voiced protagonist -- doesn't mean things will get worse either though.

As for the latter, it is simply how they feel and noone alive or dead -- or to be born -- can say that they are wrong.

Personally I don't mind the voice acting -- though I would still love to see more dialogue options. To be perfectly honest I would like to see the none-combat areas of the game mechanics get more fleshed out and make them just as engaging as the combat -- but I am also a realist.

- The Sad Dragon

[AkiKishi]

[quote]Sad Dragon wrote...

[quote]SilentK wrote...

I've read posts where people would rather have a silent Hawke and more resources put on story than a voice. I would rather keep the voice and then I'll would buy one or two reused areas  [/quote]
[/quote]

The problem here is that its not only about reusing areas vs voiced protagonis. With a silent protagonist the 'only' cost is the writers who are writing the dialogue, now compare that to a voiced protagonist which not only has the writers getting payed but also the voice actor. It also adds more time to the production as after the lines are done you have to have someone read them.

I think most people who want a silent protagonist are after is more dialogue -- though I am sure some people out there find it increadably immersion breaking to have you character being voiced by a voice you dont like or doesn't fit with the character you envisioned.

There is some truth to the former as you can get more for the same production cost and time. That being said, you didn't get much more in terms of dialogue when we had silent protagonists then we do now -- at times we do, but it's not necesserally due to the voice acting. Of cource, one could argue that there wasn't enough dialogue options for the character back in the silent days either, and things are not bound to get better now that we have a voiced protagonist -- doesn't mean things will get worse either though.

As for the latter, it is simply how they feel and noone alive or dead -- or to be born -- can say that they are wrong.

Personally I don't mind the voice acting -- though I would still love to see more dialogue options. To be perfectly honest I would like to see the none-combat areas of the game mechanics get more fleshed out and make them just as engaging as the combat -- but I am also a realist.

- The Sad Dragon

[/quote]

The ammount of waste lines for a voiced protagonist is staggering. I'd want cutscenes voiced but conversations don't really bother me.

Numbers for voicing break down something like this.

In one play 50% of lines are redundant due to gender.
66% of those are redundant in any one conversation node (average of 3 lines)

Out of 2500 cinematics only around 800 will be seen in any one playthrough of the game.

Biowares design model when voiced is incredibly wasteful given that most people do not replay games anyway.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 15 avril 2011 - 05:47 .

[Aermord]

Hmm.. I spend some time on commenting the interview this thread points to.. didnt knew it though.. and the stuff I wrote got locked only minutes after I'd written it.

Is it just me or is threads locked rather quickly these days?

In any case, this is what I wrote

[SoR82]

FedericoV wrote...

Monica83 wrote...

No so disgusted that i stay here to ear fanboys continue to use teeth and nails to defend a garbage sequel!

*troll face options of course*

A garbage sequel that a) you have not played or you have pirated or c) you have bought but not registered for sinister reason even if you had allready decided that the game was going to suck ON ANY LEVEL long before it shipped (in case, I would question your intelligence if more evidence were needed, since you bought a game that you were going to hate no matter what).

Lets play nicely shall we?

a) I have played it i have not pirated it but i refuse to register it and have that sullying my name thank you. c) I freely admit I had fears long before release all the "insert awesome wordage" interviews from developrs did not reasure me much. I Bought a game because 1: I love the world that Dragon Age is set in. 2: Bioware have traditionally for me given me games that have provided me long lasting enjoyment. 3 Bioware used to stand for quality games. I have many other reasons

I wanted this to be the sequel i dreamed off I really did I wanted to love it as i loved origins.... im afraid it was so apathetic lazy and half arsed that I struggled to find motivation to finish it let alone replay it. Long before release I seem to recall making a post along the lines of "IF I wanted a god of war clone Id jsut play god of war" I was then set upon by people who i assume think that my opinion is of less value than theirs because i have  adifferent opinion. Im afraid post release all my worst fears for this franchise were reliased. Stil im sure there will be oh at least half a dozen half arsed dlcs which people will immediatly leap to the defence of no matter what evidence is presented... for more info look into the history of Witch Hunt unbelievably people defended this even when it was unable to read what choices you made in origins ..

[Firky]

Whoa. After reading the OP, I followed the link with trepidation. Thank goodness the Drs also recognise those of us who loved the game. "There’s been a lot of people that have been really delighted about what we’ve provided in Dragon Age II." That's me.

I don't have a problem with constructively expressed criticisms at all, but I do worry, from time to time, that the sheer loudness of the negativity lends these opinions an element of conclusiveness - like "we've all decided the game sucks." (Because I don't think it does at all.)

[SoR82]

Firky wrote...

Whoa. After reading the OP, I followed the link with trepidation. Thank goodness the Drs also recognise those of us who loved the game. "There’s been a lot of people that have been really delighted about what we’ve provided in Dragon Age II." That's me.

I don't have a problem with constructively expressed criticisms at all, but I do worry, from time to time, that the sheer loudness of the negativity lends these opinions an element of conclusiveness - like "we've all decided the game sucks." (Because I don't think it does at all.)

Ah well you see it often sets off constructive then you get for want of a better word "fanboys" hurling abuse at them for not loving what they do. Then you get the "haters" screaming back at them and you get a few people in the middle keeping their heads down as insults fly back and forth. It also works the other way round I do not mean to imply that all arguments are begun by said fanboys. Im sure i sparked a couple myself XD.

I dont pretend there arent aspects of DA 2 i like its jsut.... it could have been so much more i believe that is the source of most peopels frustrations. These interviews they throw the same canned answers out over and over again and then you get the genius laidlaw making comments that imply "Its my game Ill do what I want so tough.... manure". We all know this is what he has said so lets not argue about this aswell.

[Jerrybnsn]

FedericoV wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Volourn wrote...

"I doubt the validity of that, seeing as how neither ME game sold as much as DA:O. "

Ignorance isn bliss.

Including Xbox, PS2, and PC sales  ME2 has only sold 2.4 million (granted digital sales are not included)

Bull-s-h-i-t. ME2 had allready sold 5+ million copies in April of 2010.

I did a search for "Mass Effect 2 lifetime sales" and came up with this site http://gamrreview.vg.../mass-effect-2/  It seems pretty up to date since it shows the PS3 sales of the tenth week.

I tried to find the numbers you were talking about, for surely if Mass Effect ever surpassed the coveted 5 million mark than there has to be some mention of it.  But the only thing that kept coming up was this site http://gamrconnect.v...d=106963&page=3 which is based on an article in April of last year were the writer just states that Mass Effect sold 6.6 million copies.  If you read all the comments following it most agree it was a misprint.  In fact, the comments brought to my attention something that I wasn't aware of before.  Mass Effect 2 sales for the PC was abysmal.  Granted we are not talking about DD in these figures.

So according to my research.  I still stand by the statement that ME2 did not sell as well as Origins.

Correct me if I'm mistaken though.

[SilentK]

Hmm... I guess that I don't see the audio that you don't get to hear in the specific play that you are doing at the moment as wasted. For me it's more something new the hear on the next play. I haven't tired male shep yet, or male hawke so that is still left for me.
I have this annoying habit of remembering things that are not in any way shape or form important, commercials and such, and the entire lists of sentences to say. Remember on of my favorite conversations with Alistair and I could see that list in front of me, he was my first LI in my first bioware game so I was completely into the game. It just wasn't as fun when I could do that the second time around. Now I have rivalmanced and romanced Anders, not the entire game because rivalmance is bugged in the end. I have have heard something completely new and I didn't know it in advance because I hadn't chosen it before. And if you don't choose it then you don't get to hear it this time.
I can see where people are coming from, if you don't like a voiced protagonist that is a huge cost that doesn't give extra value for you. Hence not your favorite move. For me it was the thing that connected me with my Hawke and it made my game so much better. I like the wheel and paraphrase because I have a much more difficult time committing speech to memory. When I can read everything I just end up holding the conversation in my head in advance and click through it. In this game, all of a sudden it feelt more like an actual conversation. I know that there are a lot of people who don't like this system, but for me it just was the first time that I could play two or three games in a row and I didn't know what was coming all the time. Wish there was a way to get more people happy at the same time, haven't figured it out yet.

Modifié par SilentK, 15 avril 2011 - 11:21 .

[sackyhack]

Wow, it's really sad how he characterizes the feedback.  According to him in one camp are people who LOVED all the "innovation and drama" and in the other camp are the curmudgeon refuseniks that like Dragon Origins too much.  No, it's not the excessive bugs, lack of ending, reused maps, waves of enemies to pad gameplay time, and meaningless time jumps, ofcourse not.  People who don't like DA2 are people who don't like innovation and intensity.

Seriously Bioware, I'll gladly play your game after patch 1.03, and I'll even enjoy it, but please stop lauding supporters and characterizing critics as old-skool nostalgics.  Those "new fans" you're so happy about aren't the people that keep buying your games.  It's us long time fans that are always willing to give you a second chance, and it's us that feel the most insulted every time one of you responds to a question about negative criticism.

[Dracotamer]

But we are mindless consumers? We surely couldn't know best right?

[Rixxencaxx]

So Bioware is in deny.....then acceptance will come....
The game "initially sold" faster cause of origins popularity. THEN people started to vote on the sequel itself and almost stopped buying.
Bioware didn't gain any new fan cause origins sold approx 3 million and da2 sold approx 1,2 million and sales almost stopped......

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

O' mighty Bioware lords. If not for circumstance, our places could be quite opposite. Forgive me this tiny heresy. You too could be amongst the unwashed masses in perhaps a seperate dimension. Lend us a kind ear and do not destroy us with your brilliant rays.

Ahem, I really do think they are crossing their fingers and hoping for the best right now. Remember, if they admit it's a failure openly then they will be tossing out their own money and collectively shooting themselves in the foot. It's difficult for them to respond to interviewers who sneak in a very legitimate question while in this sensitive time. We'd love to know their opinion, but they can't really be as candid as they like, it's bad business.