220 réponses à ce sujet

[abaris]

Take all these interviews with a pinch of salt.

I'm certainly not defending the game in itself, but any employee being interviewed is thouroughly briefed by the PR department. Its not the person speaking their mind, its the company trying to sell a product and - in addition - trying to appease.

Just try to envision yourself giving an interview about your own place of work. Wouldn't you think about the unemployment line and a lawsuit on top before telling the world at large what you really think about the last project?

[Chromie]

Off topic but I never realized how short Greg is to Ray!

[MDarwin]

Warheadz wrote...

Looking back at Dragon Age II, there was some fan disappointment with certain aspects of the game. Is there anything behind the scenes that you think contributed to that and are there any big changes in store for the next installment?

Muzyka: "It’s been polarizing to see the feedback, frankly. There’s been a lot of people that have been really delighted about what we’ve provided in Dragon Age II. People rating it 90 to 100 and really being happy with all the features and the focus on action intensity and the voiced protagonist and the way the story unfolds with the framed narrative and a lot of the things that are quite innovative and different.

There are other people that were expecting more Dragon Age Origins and more of the spiritual successor to Baldur’s Gate. Some of them have expressed disappointment. It’s something we really take seriously. We’re taking that feedback to heart and we’re seeing what we can do to continue to surprise and delight our fans in the future.

We’ve actually attracted a lot of new people to the franchise. Dragon Age II is selling faster than Dragon Age Origins. It’s probably part because it’s drawing a lot of new fans in. And that’s exciting to us. But our core fans are really important to us. I can’t emphasize that enough. They helped get us to where we are today. They’re the core of what we do, and we want to make sure we’re making games that satisfy them."

They don't say at any point or even imply that they acknowledge the game's shortcomings. They just say that yeah, core fans are important, but we got new fans with DA2 and it's selling faster than Origins! Yay!

I don't believe that they will really make what the "core fans" want.

That is the Impression I get from it too. After all only "Some of them have expressed disapointment". They don't seem to get it.

[planed scaped]

I actually hope Bioware fires Mike Laidlaw.

He obviously has no ******* clue about what he's doing. The fact that he still defends all the games failures to this moment really leads me to beleive that he is completely out of touch.

[abaris]

planed scaped wrote...

I actually hope Bioware fires Mike Laidlaw.

He obviously has no ******* clue about what he's doing. The fact that he still defends all the games failures to this moment really leads me to beleive that he is completely out of touch.

So what do you expect him to do?

What would you do in his place? And please don't say, you would admit to the world at large, you failed. That would be a sure ticket for the unemployment line.

I actually can't believe I'm defending that guy, because I don't agree one bit with his view of what a game should be. But tough as it may seem, you won't find any employee wanting to keep their job, telling you they screwed up. Just think of your own job and think about what your boss would do to you if you went public with a failure.

[planed scaped]

Yeah I wouldn't expect him to say it sucked.

But I honestly think hat he thinks that it is spectacular.His interviews are full of lies, bull**** and no u it was awesome's

They don't have to fire him. They do need to kick him off the Dragon Age project..

[TheMadCat]

abaris wrote...

So what do you expect him to do?

What would you do in his place? And please don't say, you would admit to the world at large, you failed. That would be a sure ticket for the unemployment line.

I actually can't believe I'm defending that guy, because I don't agree one bit with his view of what a game should be. But tough as it may seem, you won't find any employee wanting to keep their job, telling you they screwed up. Just think of your own job and think about what your boss would do to you if you went public with a failure.

Is that some special rule of EA's? I've seen quite a few developers come out and admit they screwed up over the years.

[abaris]

TheMadCat wrote...

Is that some special rule of EA's? I've seen quite a few developers come out and admit they screwed up over the years.

Not five weeks after release. They're still trying to make a dime.

Everything else would be professional suicide.

[TheMadCat]

abaris wrote...

Not five weeks after release. They're still trying to make a dime.

Everything else would be professional suicide.

At this point in time what BioWare really says is pretty much irrelevant to sales. The players and critics note fairly frequently where it's more serious flaws lay and what problems the game that keeps it from being on par with BioWare's usual works. Those individuals who pay enough attention to catch an acknowledgment of the games flaws by BioWare are for the most part aware of the games flaws anyways as they certainly frequent game sites to some capacity anyways. Don't see how them acknowledging the games faults as faults and admiting there were some poor design choices made would have any relevant effect on sales.

[bEVEsthda]

planed scaped wrote...

I actually hope Bioware fires Mike Laidlaw.

He obviously has no ******* clue about what he's doing. The fact that he still defends all the games failures to this moment really leads me to beleive that he is completely out of touch.

From what I believe I have gleaned from interviews and blogs, Laidlaw had rather little responsibility for what kind of game DA2 was to be. This was company decision. He was probably a member of the group that eventually made those decisions, but we have not much reasons to believe these were his ideas. He was told to improve graphics, make it more into an action game with combat revamped to better suit the consoles. And those things came out pretty well. After that you can blame most flaws in DA2 on too little time. How short would the game have been, had it not reused dungeons? Had it not thrown in filler quests? Had it split resources on a less linear structure? And once again, I don't think those 18 months was Laidlaw's idea.

Laidlaws talk in interviews is marketing-speak, or damage-control. You'll never get anything else from anyone in his situation. And it's his duty.

I wish people could understand that it's not so easy, as just to find some scapegoat and take out the anger on him/her.
I really have serious problem with lynchmob mentality.

[Mecher3k]

bEVEsthda wrote...

Laidlaws talk in interviews is marketing-speak, or damage-control. You'll never get anything else from anyone in his situation. And it's his duty.

Right... Marketing speak and damage control.

Something Laidlaw is doing the complete opposite of.

He's attitude he making people not want to buy another Bioware product again. Yea great marketing when it makes people NOT want to buy the product.

And for that same reason the concept of him doing damage control is just ROFL worthy.

[bEVEsthda]

Mecher3k wrote...

bEVEsthda wrote...

Laidlaws talk in interviews is marketing-speak, or damage-control. You'll never get anything else from anyone in his situation. And it's his duty.

Right... Marketing speak and damage control.

Something Laidlaw is doing the complete opposite of.

He's attitude he making people not want to buy another Bioware product again. Yea great marketing when it makes people NOT want to buy the product.

And for that same reason the concept of him doing damage control is just ROFL worthy.

Right.
But if you're basing this assessment on the interview in the thread labeled "new" interview with Mike Laidlaw, you need to know that that interview is actually quite old. He's not so much responding to criticism against the game. He's responding to expressed worries about the combat system, brought on by the demo.

And EA sucks at communicating with gamers. This is the Spore debacle all over again. I'm convinced there is a standing order from EA marketing to not discuss the game. While I can think of many good reasons for such a strategy, it doesn't work with this crowd, and it didn't work with the Spore crowd either. People just get more angry by the stonewall.
All while EA marketing hopes that many millions and millions of kids will start to play the game. Unfortunately, those kids are caught up in playing more complex and more challenging games, like Pokemon.

It's a stark contrast to how the NWN:OC disaster was handled (only BW game I've never bothered to finish).That time Bioware saved their ass by communicating on their forums.

[abaris]

TheMadCat wrote...
Don't see how them acknowledging the games faults as faults and admiting there were some poor design choices made would have any relevant effect on sales.

That's not how the corporate world works.

Noone can go out on their limb and tell the world they screwed up. There are shareholders holding the suits responsible, the suits hold the staff responsible and the staff holds the employees responsbile. Everything being said in public is filtered by the PR department.

So no, anyone being employed there, will be well aware its his job on the line if he blows the whistle. And a lawsuit against the whistleblower might be the cherry on top.

[Supreez]

abaris wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...
Don't see how them acknowledging the games faults as faults and admiting there were some poor design choices made would have any relevant effect on sales.

That's not how the corporate world works.

Noone can go out on their limb and tell the world they screwed up. There are shareholders holding the suits responsible, the suits hold the staff responsible and the staff holds the employees responsbile. Everything being said in public is filtered by the PR department.

So no, anyone being employed there, will be well aware its his job on the line if he blows the whistle. And a lawsuit against the whistleblower might be the cherry on top.

Exactly...  Even though its probably horse**** in this case stocks are so swayed by public perception that everyone has their A holes sealed tight when it comes to PR.  Honesty is a crime in the corporate world, sometimes literally.

that's why im not to angry that no one is admitting any fault and taking the little half assed admissions more seriously then they should be on face value.

Modifié par Supreez, 17 avril 2011 - 10:29 .

[Macrake]

The least you could do is give us a decent story, since you're stripping everything from the game to make it playable on consoles. I could be satisfied with that, since i have no illusions that we'll ever get anything like bg2 as long as you're developing for consoles.

Why not get a team to do action rpg with story for consoles+pc? And a team for bg2 style pc only?
This wierd 1/4 of each to make 1/2 a game is just blah.

[abaris]

Supreez wrote...

that's why im not to angry that no one is admitting any fault and taking the little half assed admissions more seriously then they should be on face value.

Oh, they say a lot, if you're reading between the line. Especially Laidlaw's defensives are very telling.

[ankuu]

MrTijger wrote...

Phantom13NWN2 wrote...

Thanks I was looking for that, one thing that sticks out in muzykas response is how he says that DA2 sells faster, by now he must have seen the numbers showing that DA2 sales are dropping at an alarming rate, so why does he say that? to get more people to buy the game. Even the Dr.'s have been infected with the EA advertising virus.

They're running a business not a charity for traditional RPG lovers.

But their business is based on the RPG lovers, not Action lovers. It's like Pepsi would change its formula to appeal to natural-fruit-juice lovers but keep its colour. Then say "Look it's the same! Just without bubbles! And with other ingredients...and...".

[SoR82]

abaris wrote...

Supreez wrote...

that's why im not to angry that no one is admitting any fault and taking the little half assed admissions more seriously then they should be on face value.

Oh, they say a lot, if you're reading between the line. Especially Laidlaw's defensives are very telling.

Exactly he doesnt say much... and what he deoesnt say is alot more telling than what he does. Its a shame he sucks at dodging and misdirection.

[TheMadCat]

Supreez wrote...

abaris wrote...

TheMadCat wrote...
Don't see how them acknowledging the games faults as faults and admiting there were some poor design choices made would have any relevant effect on sales.

That's not how the corporate world works.

Noone can go out on their limb and tell the world they screwed up. There are shareholders holding the suits responsible, the suits hold the staff responsible and the staff holds the employees responsbile. Everything being said in public is filtered by the PR department.

So no, anyone being employed there, will be well aware its his job on the line if he blows the whistle. And a lawsuit against the whistleblower might be the cherry on top.

Exactly...  Even though its probably horse**** in this case stocks are so swayed by public perception that everyone has their A holes sealed tight when it comes to PR.  Honesty is a crime in the corporate world, sometimes literally.

that's why im not to angry that no one is admitting any fault and taking the little half assed admissions more seriously then they should be on face value.

I understand everything is said through a filtered mouthpiece, but many times admiting fault is a solid PR move as it helps connect with your consumers and critics with any distaste they have with your product. And that's my point, doing so acknowledges that you're listening to the critics and the consumer base and benefits you more then sticking you're head in the sand and saying "People just can't adapt to our evolutionary brilliance". At this point it time the effect on sales would be insignificant, investors are concerned with tangibles rather then intangiables. 

I'm not saying they need to come out and say it's a bad game and they royally screwed up because in reality neither of those is the case. But admitting there were some poor design choices and a few corners got cut, (Both of which are undeniable), and that while it's still a good game it's not up to BioWare's high standards of excellence and everything will be done to prevent it from happening again.  That's it, and acknowledement. Nothing that will cost sales, nothing that will get get investors antsy because it doesn't effect sales. I just don't know how much longer they can take the PR approach they have been and still expect people to take them as seriously as they once did, between the way they've tried to sell DA2 to their reposne to the criticism and everything inbetween. Anything's better then what they've been doing for the past 6 months.

Modifié par TheMadCat, 17 avril 2011 - 07:02 .

[SoR82]

And a little hint guys simpoly saying what translates as "Im right your wrong because your stupid" is not a good move for a business of any size

[ankuu]

SoR82 wrote...

And a little hint guys simpoly saying what translates as "Im right your wrong because your stupid" is not a good move for a business of any size

I am sure half of the hate would have been gone if they would have come and said:

"We wanted to try something different this time, we are sorry if we dissapointed some of you. There are people who do enjoy it though, and we thank them for that. We will read your comments and take your opinions into condiseration to improve the key aspects of the game."

I certanly would have been happy! Me and my friend just ignore that DA2 ever existed...

[Warheadz]

ankuu wrote...
I certanly would have been happy! Me and my friend just ignore that DA2 ever existed...

DA2 is like the FO:Brotherhood of Steel to my Fallout.

[AkiKishi]

Warheadz wrote...

ankuu wrote...
I certanly would have been happy! Me and my friend just ignore that DA2 ever existed...

DA2 is like the FO:Brotherhood of Steel to my Fallout.

Ouch.

[Sad Dragon]

TheMadCat wrote...

I understand everything is said through a filtered mouthpiece, but many times admiting fault is a solid PR move as it helps connect with your consumers and critics with any distaste they have with your product.

While I kind of agree that I like it when people own up to their mistakes and that would give them more cred. I don't expect someone to do it while they are still trying to make it work -- or in this case, sell the game.

That time might come further down the line however.

- The Sad Dragon

[abaris]

Sad Dragon wrote...

That time might come further down the line however.

- The Sad Dragon

I don't think so. We're talking about shareholder business, not some entrepeneurial spirits owning a gaming company. Owning up to mistakes is bad for the stock market. Hence the PR department works overtime on damage control and sends out some folks to issue meaningless lines about caring for the core fans.