148 réponses à ce sujet

[daguest]

BG2 was awesome. DA is awesome. I don't think there is a better game from both.

[thestreaker]

BG2 used to be good, now it's just old. The cinematic-like presentation of DA:O adds a lot to the experience that BG2 never had.

[JfBorrego]

thestreaker wrote...

BG2 used to be good, now it's just old. The cinematic-like presentation of DA:O adds a lot to the experience that BG2 never had.

" cinematic-like" meaning teh cut scenes, aka the self indulgent crap of the game developers trying to prove they're creative???

[Seifz]

I, for one, enjoy cut scenes and real, voiced dialogue.

[Legion-001]

If I wanted something that has Cinematic presentation... I buy a movie, I'm looking for a game where I can have massive spell battles with warriors and summoned monsters from both sides engaging in a epic battle THAT I AM CONTROLLING NOT WATCHING, I want to see fireballs and lightning bolts flying across the battlefield... DA:O doesn't do that, BG2 does.

Modifié par Legion-001, 19 novembre 2009 - 02:16 .

[JfBorrego]

Legion-001 wrote...

If I wanted something that has Cinematic presentation... I buy a movie, I'm looking for a game where I can have massive spell battles with warriors and summoned monsters from both sides engaging in a epic battle THAT I AM CONTROLLING NOT WATCHING, I want to see fireballs and lightning bolts flying across the battlefield... DA:O doesn't do that, BG2 Does.

DING DING DING We have a winner!

100% agree

Don't trick me into buying a game to pay for your dreams of being some sort of Peter Jasckson in the making pipe dreams...

[Legion-001]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

If I wanted something that has Cinematic presentation... I buy a movie, I'm looking for a game where I can have massive spell battles with warriors and summoned monsters from both sides engaging in a epic battle THAT I AM CONTROLLING NOT WATCHING, I want to see fireballs and lightning bolts flying across the battlefield... DA:O doesn't do that, BG2 does.

If I wanted good story telling I'd buy a book.

Not the fantasy tripe in games like BG1/2, NWN1/2, DA:O, etc.

They shouldn't even try because their writing just comes off as juvenile garbage.

I don't recall anywhere in lord of the rings anyone getting annoyed at anything a villager said and so proceeded to kill them and then massacre the entire village... You can't do that in DA:O but you can in BG2.
Although I do miss the Bar-room brawls of BG1.

Modifié par Legion-001, 19 novembre 2009 - 02:23 .

[Shannara13]

Sinfulvannila wrote...

I just wrote a blog touching on this last night. I know a lot of you are going to disagree with me, but whatever.Here goes...

I have alot of problems with your article

"One such problem was a lack of customization."

BG2 had far more character customization than DA:O has. BG2 had 11 classes each of which had 3 or so kits along with multiclassing,  dual classing if you are human, weapon proficiencies, various spell setups for casters.

DA:O has 3 classes. Warriors and Rogues share many of the same talent trees. Specializing in more than 1 talent tree servers no purpose. No multiclassing or dual classing. Its spell selection is much smaller.

"It even takes the polished combat of BG and adds a few twists, such as
flanking, spell/talent combos, traps, "splash" weapons and item
crafting."

You do realize that BG2 contained almost all of those "twists", don't you?

[JfBorrego]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

If I wanted something that has Cinematic presentation... I buy a movie, I'm looking for a game where I can have massive spell battles with warriors and summoned monsters from both sides engaging in a epic battle THAT I AM CONTROLLING NOT WATCHING, I want to see fireballs and lightning bolts flying across the battlefield... DA:O doesn't do that, BG2 does.

If I wanted good story telling I'd buy a book.

Not the fantasy tripe in games like BG1/2, NWN1/2, DA:O, etc.

They shouldn't even try because their writing just comes off as juvenile garbage.

Don't trick me into buying a game for your dreams of becoming some sort of George R.R. Martin or JRR Tolkien.

Kindred spirit...

I'm finishing up Brandon Sanderson's Book 1 of the "Mistborn" series, so maybe being exposed to GOOD writing is affecting my jugdement of DA:O.

Maybe I need to read the Sunday comic strips for a few weeks and then try again...

[Shannara13]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

If I wanted something that has Cinematic presentation... I buy a movie, I'm looking for a game where I can have massive spell battles with warriors and summoned monsters from both sides engaging in a epic battle THAT I AM CONTROLLING NOT WATCHING, I want to see fireballs and lightning bolts flying across the battlefield... DA:O doesn't do that, BG2 does.

If I wanted good story telling I'd buy a book.

Not the fantasy tripe in games like BG1/2, NWN1/2, DA:O, etc.

They shouldn't even try because their writing just comes off as juvenile garbage.

I don't recall anywhere in lord of the rings anyone getting annoyed at anything a villager said and so proceeded to kill them and then massacre the entire village... You can't do that in DA:O but you can in BG2.
Although I do miss the Bar-room brawls of BG1.

Getting annoyed at a villager and following by killing the entire village? 

That is exactly the kind of juvenile GARBAGE I'm talking about, LOL.

So freedom to do what you want is juvenile garbage and worse than the "on the rails" method that DA:O employs? We are clearly very different people.

[Legion-001]

Correct me if I'm wrong but computer games are meant to be interactive stories, IE there is a base story but the detail are yours to choose... Games are NOT about standing upon a bridge and WATCHING a massive battle take place, nor are they about reading a story and following it precisely as the script says.

[Seifz]

JfBorrego wrote...

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

If I wanted something that has Cinematic presentation... I buy a movie, I'm looking for a game where I can have massive spell battles with warriors and summoned monsters from both sides engaging in a epic battle THAT I AM CONTROLLING NOT WATCHING, I want to see fireballs and lightning bolts flying across the battlefield... DA:O doesn't do that, BG2 does.

If I wanted good story telling I'd buy a book.

Not the fantasy tripe in games like BG1/2, NWN1/2, DA:O, etc.

They shouldn't even try because their writing just comes off as juvenile garbage.

Don't trick me into buying a game for your dreams of becoming some sort of George R.R. Martin or JRR Tolkien.

Kindred spirit...

I'm finishing up Brandon Sanderson's Book 1 of the "Mistborn" series, so maybe being exposed to GOOD writing is affecting my jugdement of DA:O.

Maybe I need to read the Sunday comic strips for a few weeks and then try again...

Oh, man.  I thought that I knew what good fantasy writing was before, but Mistborn is in a whole different league.  Those three books are by far the best story that I've ever experienced in any book, movie, show or game.  If you like them, definitely pick up Elantris, too.  Hell, even the new Wheel of Time book had one of those amazing Sanderson endings!

Anyway, DA:O balances cinematics, story, and gameplay quite well.  It's not a "movie game" like Metal Gear Solid or a silly sandbox game like Oblivion, and that's a good thing.  Killing an entire village because someone annoyed you?  Yeah, that's a good way to ruin a story and totally break immersion.

[JfBorrego]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

Correct me if I'm wrong but computer games are meant to be interactive stories, IE there is a base story but the detail are yours to choose... Games are NOT about standing upon a bridge and WATCHING a massive battle take place, nor are they about reading a story and following it precisely as the script says.

Which is exactly why CRPG writing/dialogue/story comes off as juvenile tripe.

Whoever described DA:O as an "On the Rails" game hit the nail on the head.  I am adding that to my lexicon.

[cw8]

No chance, I love DAO but BG2 still tops everything. Firstly, Minsc and Boo and Irenicus. Secondly, voice-acting in BG2 is legendary(check the voiceactor cast). Thirdly, Irenicus's background and story behind him is awesome, you grow with him and even come to understand why he choose to become a villian. Fourthly, sidequests in BG2 rule, they come with their own plots with betrayals, murder, investigation etc. DAO sidequests feel like MMORPG types. Not to mention scale and length are also bigger.

[Sinfulvannila]

Shannara13 wrote...

Sinfulvannila wrote...

I just wrote a blog touching on this last night. I know a lot of you are going to disagree with me, but whatever.Here goes...

I have alot of problems with your article

"One such problem was a lack of customization."

BG2 had far more character customization than DA:O has. BG2 had 11 classes each of which had 3 or so kits along with multiclassing,  dual classing if you are human, weapon proficiencies, various spell setups for casters.

DA:O has 3 classes. Warriors and Rogues share many of the same talent trees. Specializing in more than 1 talent tree servers no purpose. No multiclassing or dual classing. Its spell selection is much smaller.

"It even takes the polished combat of BG and adds a few twists, such as
flanking, spell/talent combos, traps, "splash" weapons and item
crafting."

You do realize that BG2 contained almost all of those "twists", don't you?

My problem with the customization was more that once you made the character, it was done being customized except for weapon specializations and dual-classing(only available for humans and I HATED). It lacks the feeling of progression that DA has where your character will probably end the same, but your picks drastically affect the gameply. I probably should have specified that, but I wrote it late, my bad.

Any of that stuff already present in BG2 was only there to add flavor to the game. None of them were polished or balanced enough to warrant long term strategic use. I do remember the traps now, but I also remember them being ineffective.

[Seifz]

To be fair, there's some entertaining writing to be found in CRPGs, and that's especially true with DA:O. More than once I've laughed out loud at something a companion said, or smiled when one responded to something that I said in a way that I didn't expect. In my opinion, the companions really make this game. I keep playing to experience more of them! Stopping a blight is just typical fantasy stuff.

[JfBorrego]

Seifz wrote...

To be fair, there's some entertaining writing to be found in CRPGs, and that's especially true with DA:O. More than once I've laughed out loud at something a companion said, or smiled when one responded to something that I said in a way that I didn't expect. In my opinion, the companions really make this game. I keep playing to experience more of them! Stopping a blight is just typical fantasy stuff.

Wow.. I ditched every one as quick as I could.. their inane blathering gave me a headache...

[X106]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Legion-001 wrote...

If I wanted something that has Cinematic presentation... I buy a movie, I'm looking for a game where I can have massive spell battles with warriors and summoned monsters from both sides engaging in a epic battle THAT I AM CONTROLLING NOT WATCHING, I want to see fireballs and lightning bolts flying across the battlefield... DA:O doesn't do that, BG2 does.

If I wanted good story telling I'd buy a book.

Not the fantasy tripe in games like BG1/2, NWN1/2, DA:O, etc.

They shouldn't even try because their writing just comes off as juvenile garbage.

I don't recall anywhere in lord of the rings anyone getting annoyed at anything a villager said and so proceeded to kill them and then massacre the entire village... You can't do that in DA:O but you can in BG2.
Although I do miss the Bar-room brawls of BG1.

Getting annoyed at a villager and following by killing the entire village? 

That is exactly the kind of juvenile GARBAGE I'm talking about, LOL.

The real crap is when you get annoyed in Fallout 3 and just kill somebody, and then everyone who was watching, then everyone else who knows your Karma.. hmm EVERYONE IN THE GAME

[vekkth]

DA is amazing game, BG2 is a legend.

you shouldnt compare these games, like some guy compared DA with Fallout (first and second), you dont do that. its like comparing beatles to modern chart stars - they are cool, what is a legend should stay as a legend. think of it - Oasis said they are like modern Beatles, do you really can say that? i like Oasis btw, but its not about what i like but the history, the saga, the way it grows.

DA will always be a successor to a games like BG, Fallout, Wizardry, EOB, Dark Sun (ffs ). BG and Fallout made RPG genre big, huge, thus people remember them and praise them.

DA is a very good game but YET it cant be put on the same level. may be later, with more DLC and patches, or with DAII or stuff it will grow enough to become a legend - yet its just a VERY good game.



Think of it, KOTOR was THE amazing game, and it could grew into something of epic proportions - but they did a bad job with KOTOR2, it was too much content cut out, so it was shallow compared to first (still an amazing game). DA might bear the same fate, might not - we will see.



for now, old legends still rule.

[Shannara13]

Crawling_Chaos wrote...

Seifz wrote...

To be fair, there's some entertaining writing to be found in CRPGs, and that's especially true with DA:O. More than once I've laughed out loud at something a companion said, or smiled when one responded to something that I said in a way that I didn't expect. In my opinion, the companions really make this game. I keep playing to experience more of them! Stopping a blight is just typical fantasy stuff.

Once in a while you might find something humorous in the sunday paper comic section or on an online comic.

Doesn't mean there is good writing going on there.

Did you ever play PS:T? That game was packed full of excellent writing.