45 réponses à ce sujet

[JfBorrego]

kormesios wrote...

For my tastes, the action vs. flavor presentation is a bit off. I'd prefer 'quests' (side- or sub-) that take a couple to several hours, with natural breaks of travel/sleep/talk to NPC in between each one. (This is also the logical time to catch up on the generic history Codex entries IMHO.)

A few chantry or thief side quests were almost that way, but most of the game is the four or five very long main plot quests. Which means long stretches of fairly limited 'role playing' (ie, with other characters), unless you're the type of player who goes to camp in the middle of quests.

Insult and berate NPCs? They keep coming back for more and offer to join with you.

Insult the king to his face? Same result as if you grovelled.

This isn't RP by a long shot - It's a scripted "along for the ride" game...

We must have played a different game. I lost two companions, both of whom I would've preferred keeping. One to a choice I made and the other because they liked me, but not enough not to betray me. A third potential companion was killed by an existing companion. I alienated (and lost the support of) royalty, and I'm 99% sure I missed out on several NPC non-companion allies.

I know two other companions are alienable for a certain choice as well.

That's over 50% of the party being for-certain "make the wrong choices and they're gone". Far more than in most NPC heavy games I've played. I don't know what you're comparing it to (unless PnP roleplaying, which is a different breed.)

So the only impact to the entire storyline for any choices you make is losing NPC party members?

That doesnt make this an RPG - that's just a micro attempt at very low level faction.

No matter what you do, the story unfolds exactly the same..

[Shannara13]

I felt a bit bored toward the end and I blame this on the "complete objectives in any order you want" section. I felt that this method really hurt the foward momentum of the story. By necissity the game must treat each of the 4 areas as self contained. So after completing one it felt like the game essentially just reset back to when you left Lothering and pretended you chose a differen't area. So it was like complete an area, rewind, complete an area, rewind, complete an area, rewind. Then after you did that it felt like is skipped right to the end. It may just be me but it gave the impression that the story ended almost right after it started.

[dwwilson57]

I logged 70 hours in 6 days playing this game. I'm the opposite of burned out: I feel empty and undescriably sad, not only because of the ending but for the fact THAT the game ended. Characterization and dialogue (and voice acting -- stellar) should be enough to carry this game for anyone, unless you're used to reading Dan Brown and playing, like, Unreal Tournament with a bunch of jocks.

[JfBorrego]

dwwilson57 wrote...

I logged 70 hours in 6 days playing this game. I'm the opposite of burned out: I feel empty and undescriably sad, not only because of the ending but for the fact THAT the game ended. Characterization and dialogue (and voice acting -- stellar) should be enough to carry this game for anyone, unless you're used to reading Dan Brown and playing, like, Unreal Tournament with a bunch of jocks.

180 opposite here.

I had to turn off the dialogue and map the ESC button tomy mouse to make the game tolerable..

[feroxthegreywarden]

purplesunset wrote...

BearClaw, don't blame yourself entirely. I think your issues are valid, and struck something in me.

You see, this EXACT same thing happened to me while playing the OC's of both NWN 1 and NWN 2 (but particularly NWN 1's OC)

The game was going fine, but after a while, the constant repitition of the combat started to get to me. The streets started to look too small, the areas too empty and lifeless, too much loot in my inventory that I had no real use for etc.


In other words, there reached a point where the immersion was gone and I just saw myself running around clicking my mouse button. I felt like I was just some guy sitting down clicking away at his mouse, instead of being carried away to another world.

You see there are different types of gamers. Many people wouldn't be bothered about things like suspension of disbelief and immersion. But for some of us gamers the experience has to be more than "just another game, " and if the constant and repetitive nature of the combat contributes to making you lose motivation, then it's not entirely the gamer's fault.

I completely agree.. the only time I ever feel immersed in this game is when I'm doing dialogues... the fighting just gets boring and repetitive, regardless of difficulty.. I can't that  this game ISN'T an rpg.. but the game "style" of top down 3rd person pointy clicky I have never liked going back to the days of fallout , baldur's gate, and before.

Best part of this game is the story and the writing, the game mechanics are pretty poor and I cannot stay "immersed" all the time, it does get to a point where I'm very aware of pointy clicky. Which is ironic because I loved KOTOR and Mass Effect and never got this feeling.

Modifié par feroxthegreywarden, 19 novembre 2009 - 02:51 .

[Wishpig]

As someone pointed out, to RPG fans the reasons your bored may very well be the reasons they play in the first place.



Personally, I do one of two thing if a part of the game seems to be dragging on (like the start of Orz)



I either set the game to easy so I can breeze through the actuall fights and get more story, OR I turn the difficulty to high or nightmare to make battles more challenging and fresh.



To much easy leads to a bored wishpig, to much hard/nightmare reloading leads to a bored wishpig, and sometimes to much normal combines the worst of both difficulties.



For the record the game is too good both combat and story wise to ever have me REALLY bored, I just make it a little more intresting by toying w/ difficulty every once in a while.

[kormesios]

JfBorrego wrote...
So the only impact to the entire storyline for any choices you make is losing NPC party members?

That doesnt make this an RPG - that's just a micro attempt at very low level faction.

No matter what you do, the story unfolds exactly the same..

Huh?  Where did you get "only" from my post?

I gave a half-dozen examples of losing party members, something you said didn't happen.  I also gave an example of alienating royalty, something else you said didn't happen.  In short, I responded specifically to the only specific complaints you brought up. 

I assumed they were signficant to you, since they were the two you thought to complain about.  Apparently they were minor gameplay quibbles, irrelevant to your opinion, which makes highlighting them a little odd.  I obviously can't read your mind and respond to the secret problems you have.  Heck, I might even share them, since I don't think the game's perfect.

But lack of consequences doesn't seem high on my list. There are, of course, plenty of others--off the top of my head, non-companion NPCs can die through negligence, malice or benevolence; you can determine the leaders and direction of four major Ferelden factions; areas you visit thrive or suffer in the course of the campaign.

Just to be clear, this is also not an exhaustive list.

I'd be curious to hear what you expect from a cRPG in terms of consequences if you think these are so sub-par as to be non-existent.  Do you simply mean branching endings?

[mastorofpuppetz]

Why do you think we give a crap, seriously, ge ta blog.

[Schyzm]

it is a little tiring getting ambushed, especially if I'm farting around or trying to get potions. "lol here's a 10 minute ambush fight!" and then that dude laughs at you, that's not cool, laughing isn't cool. no1 respects the interstate anymore.

[kormesios]

Shannara13 wrote...

I felt a bit bored toward the end and I blame this on the "complete objectives in any order you want" section. I felt that this method really hurt the foward momentum of the story. By necissity the game must treat each of the 4 areas as self contained. So after completing one it felt like the game essentially just reset back to when you left Lothering and pretended you chose a differen't area. So it was like complete an area, rewind, complete an area, rewind, complete an area, rewind. Then after you did that it felt like is skipped right to the end. It may just be me but it gave the impression that the story ended almost right after it started.

I'd agree with that.  There's a little interaction between sites, and you can re-visit and follow up side quests, but its core design is massive sub-quests with no main "plot advancement" for about 80% of the game.   In that you don't slowly uncover secrets that advance the main story; things are roughly as they are laid out to be.

Not that there aren't twists and surprises, but those all happen within areas.  So any surprises about the main story are all clustered near the end.

[mastorofpuppetz]

feroxthegreywarden wrote...

purplesunset wrote...

BearClaw, don't blame yourself entirely. I think your issues are valid, and struck something in me.

You see, this EXACT same thing happened to me while playing the OC's of both NWN 1 and NWN 2 (but particularly NWN 1's OC)

The game was going fine, but after a while, the constant repitition of the combat started to get to me. The streets started to look too small, the areas too empty and lifeless, too much loot in my inventory that I had no real use for etc.


In other words, there reached a point where the immersion was gone and I just saw myself running around clicking my mouse button. I felt like I was just some guy sitting down clicking away at his mouse, instead of being carried away to another world.

You see there are different types of gamers. Many people wouldn't be bothered about things like suspension of disbelief and immersion. But for some of us gamers the experience has to be more than "just another game, " and if the constant and repetitive nature of the combat contributes to making you lose motivation, then it's not entirely the gamer's fault.

I completely agree.. the only time I ever feel immersed in this game is when I'm doing dialogues... the fighting just gets boring and repetitive, regardless of difficulty.. I can't that  this game ISN'T an rpg.. but the game "style" of top down 3rd person pointy clicky I have never liked going back to the days of fallout , baldur's gate, and before.

Best part of this game is the story and the writing, the game mechanics are pretty poor and I cannot stay "immersed" all the time, it does get to a point where I'm very aware of pointy clicky. Which is ironic because I loved KOTOR and Mass Effect and never got this feeling.

Game mechanics poor? Are you for real? Do you even know what game mechanics are? They are as good as they get for a game like this. And Mass Effect is total garbage compared to Dragon Age please. A RPG for simpletons. Game style? You mean a true rpg? Because that is what it is, mass effect is a shooter RPG hybrd that was very simplistic by comaprison. Maybe stick to easy, watered down console games
.
Notice the only people complaining are console gamers who think Mass Effect is one of the best RPG s ever? Biowares worse actually.

Did you rush through Da not paying attention, only one game does consequences for your actions and choices for  as good, and that was the witcher.

Saying everything is scripted makes me realise you have zero clue what you are talking about, or are just a mindless troll.

Modifié par mastorofpuppetz, 19 novembre 2009 - 04:18 .

[SolaFide03]

I've had to force myself to take a 1 month break in 2009 from Lord of the Rings Online. Good long games require a break every so often. However with DA:O, unless I am backtracking, I literally walk everywhere in the game. I'm not trying to stretch it out, but just seems more natural in an RPG. Did that with Oblivion, Fallout 3, you name it.



I don't understand how Soldiers Peak can be completed in 5 minutes through. It's not a Halo map after all.

[kormesios]

mastorofpuppetz wrote...
Game mechanics poor? Are you for real? Do you even know what game mechanics are? They are as good as they get for a game like this. And Mass Effect is total garbage compared to Dragon Age please. A RPG for simpletons. Game style? You mean a true rpg? Because that is what it is, mass effect is a shooter RPG hybrd that was very simplistic by comaprison. Maybe stick to easy, watered down console games

Meh.  I liked the mage stuff when it came to game mechanics, I wasn't thrilled at the fighter and melee rogue.  As even the enthusiastic GameSpot review said, there's a tendency to run out of fatigue and just "stand and fight", quaffing potions occasionally.

Personally I don't think they're above average, but they aren't beyond criticism.

[sugasugaki]

Why are there so many Bioware suck-ups that doggedly insist this game is the pinnacle of perfection? For these people the only posts that are allowed are happy posts that talk about how great the game is. Gimme a break.



I agree with some of the points made in this thread. Without getting into major spoilers, I feel like all the endings funnel into one (I'm referring to a major plot twist that possibly sets up for an expansion/DLC).



There were certain areas that just dragged on forever and ever too, like Orz. I think what killed the pacing for me were some deceptively large "dungeons." There were one or two where you're going into a "house," only for it to have the square footage the size of a small village inside. That really detracts from the experience.



Plus, I hated how whenever I asked a different king/ruler to ask for their help, it inevitably entailed some long dungeon grind. It struck me as rather uncreative. They all essentially broke down to:



1) Me: I need your help against the Blight w/ your army.

2) Ruler: I'd love to, but you need to enter and defeat

[Challseus]

I agree with the OP to a point. One particular quest (I am sure everyone is talking about the same thing) just dragged on and on for me, to the point where I was like, "Screw this, I'm turning this to easy and running through as much as I can". I honestly think I spent the exact time it took me to beat Fable 2 on one quest alone!

That said, I have already tried out another Origin since beating it, and I am about to start another one when I am done with this post

[PhantoMSouljaX]

JfBorrego wrote...

WickedAwesome wrote...

JfBorrego wrote...
I like RPGs when you can actually RP.

In DA:O everything is 95% preset adn nothing you do will really cahnge much.

Insult and berate NPCs?  They keep coming back for more and offer to join with you.

Insult the king to his face?  Same result as if you grovelled.

This isn't RP by a long shot - It's a scripted "along for the ride" game...

LOL
ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME
KTHX

By this you mean fall in line and "play" the game as the development team scripted it?

If so, why include all those non-imapcting dialogue options?  Why include 90% of the crap they did when it doesn;t make a real difference anyways?

To show case their "creative writing abilities"???

Your a pathetic troll who will get no understanding or sympathy on these forums,TRUE RPG fans and gamers know a great rpg when we are given one,and we love them,so if your objective is to somehow change our minds about this game or others like it then i say go back under your bridge!

[I HAS A FLAVOUR]

ENCHANTMENT!

[S1lenz07]

JfBorrego wrote...

daguest wrote...

JfBorrego wrote...

For me the major challenge is not getting burnt out spamming ESC all the time to get through the mind numbingly bad cut scenes.

Was this supposed to be a game or a lame attempt at low budget movie making???

Try modern warfare 2. You don't seems the sort of guy who enjoy rpg. Or only if you can play a Troll.

I like RPGs when you can actually RP.

In DA:O everything is 95% preset adn nothing you do will really cahnge much.

Insult and berate NPCs?  They keep coming back for more and offer to join with you.

Insult the king to his face?  Same result as if you grovelled.

This isn't RP by a long shot - It's a scripted "along for the ride" game...

I don't know wtf you're talking about, I'm at the end of the game and I already lost two companions. I would have lost 3 if it wasn't for a decision I made. ****** off or don't pay attention to your companions and they'll drop you like a bad habit. You should really try playing the game before you start complaining about things that aren't broken.

[feroxthegreywarden]

**double post due to forum lag**

Modifié par feroxthegreywarden, 19 novembre 2009 - 06:05 .

[feroxthegreywarden]

sugasugaki wrote...

Why are there so many Bioware suck-ups that doggedly insist this game is the pinnacle of perfection? For these people the only posts that are allowed are happy posts that talk about how great the game is. Gimme a break.

I agree with some of the points made in this thread. Without getting into major spoilers, I feel like all the endings funnel into one (I'm referring to a major plot twist that possibly sets up for an expansion/DLC).

There were certain areas that just dragged on forever and ever too, like Orz. I think what killed the pacing for me were some deceptively large "dungeons." There were one or two where you're going into a "house," only for it to have the square footage the size of a small village inside. That really detracts from the experience.

Plus, I hated how whenever I asked a different king/ruler to ask for their help, it inevitably entailed some long dungeon grind. It struck me as rather uncreative. They all essentially broke down to:

1) Me: I need your help against the Blight w/ your army.
2) Ruler: I'd love to, but you need to enter and defeat

very much agreed... it created a rinse and repeat feel to the game..


as for what is an rpg... that is different to different people and what they grew up thinking their definition was.

[Schyzm]

boy none of you guys must hand your companions gifts.