251 réponses à ce sujet

[hex23]

I play mostly Paragon....not 100% Paragon because in some cases it's too much. Some people need to be shot.

Anyway, I don't see how it's possible for hardline Renegades to succeed. I'm not saying this because I prefer Paragon....hell, I think you should play the game however you want. But most of the big Renegade choices have you pissing off and/or alienating half the galaxy, be it your own crew, or people who've only met you once. 

I'm not saying I agree with this design choice, but it would be crazy if Bioware made it virtually impossible for hardcore Renegades to beat the Reapers. Again, I'm not promoting this....but it kinda makes sense. If you spent the last few years pissing off everyone around you, betraying team mates, getting people killed either through incompetance or indifference....who would answer your call when it came time to fight the Reapers? Realistically, no one. It would be a direct way for Bioware to show that there is consequences to what we do in this game.

Modifié par hex23, 16 avril 2011 - 04:55 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

I never play 100% Paragon or Renegade. But from what I gather, Renegades are the BA's. They do what they want when they want to and even if everything falls around them, they themselves will win. That's how it's worked so far.

[NoxNoctum]

Uh pretty much all the renegade decisions are just whether or not to let some criminal live or just throw him out the window/blast his head off. Either that or not taking BS from someone, which is just a different (better IMO as history as shown) style of leadership: see Patton. Or making some tough choice about whether to sacrifice certain people to save some other people. Or not talking to some ****** reporter about top secret stuff. I mean cmon.

I can't really remember ANY that involved backstabbing teammates or anything like that.

Renegades aren't "evil", they just get the job done regardless of the cost. Which is what probably MOST people would do if they were faced with an enemy that threatened to wipe out all sentient organic life.

Modifié par NoxNoctum, 16 avril 2011 - 05:02 .

[Mr. Gogeta34]

The Council decision was the more realistic decision, but he did it with malice toward the Council. The Collector base was just a realistic decision.

Personally I chose neutral for the Council and kept the Collector Base.

[hex23]

NoxNoctum wrote...

Uh pretty much all the renegade decisions are just whether or not to let some criminal live or just throw him out the window/blast his head off. Either that or not taking BS from someone, which is just a different (better IMO as history as shown) style of leadership: see Patton. Or making some tough choice about whether to sacrifice certain people to save some other people. Or not talking to some ****** reporter about top secret stuff. I mean cmon.

I can't really remember ANY that involved backstabbing teammates or anything like that.

Renegades aren't "evil", they just get the job done regardless of the cost. Which is what probably MOST people would do if they were faced with an enemy that threatened to wipe out all sentient organic life.

Huh?

Here's direct examples.

During Tali's Loyalty mission if you give the evidence over to the trial that implicates her father, that is 30 Renegade points. She is found not guilty but she isn't Loyal. Why? Because she begged you not to do that, and you did anyway.

If you replace Samara with Morinth, that's 45 Renegade points.

That's just two examples off the top of my head where you back stab a team mate and/or disregard their feelings and get Renegade points because of it. If I sat here and really thought about it I could come up with a lot more.

For the most part the game doesn't paint Renegades as "bad asses who will do whatever it takes to win"....that's an antihero. I have no problem with antiheroes....the game mostly paints Renegades as as*holes, honestly.

Modifié par hex23, 16 avril 2011 - 05:14 .

[omgodzilla]

How do we know that saving the Rachni Queen doesn't ****** off half the Galaxy as well?

[GodWood]

Renegade =/= pissing off companions or failing loyalty quests.
You can fail those being paragon too.

[Seboist]

omgodzilla wrote...

How do we know that saving the Rachni Queen doesn't ****** off half the Galaxy as well?

Or rewriting the Heretic Geth.

[hex23]

GodWood wrote...

Renegade =/= pissing off companions or failing loyalty quests.
You can fail those being paragon too.

How you fail them and/or why they are mad is totally different though, which is my point.

Tali's trial is a perfect example of Renegade done right, and wrong.

If you have sufficient morality rep you can Intimidate the crowd into exonorating Tali. This earns you 30 Renegade points.

If you don't have high enough morality rep, you can hand over the evidence even though Tali begged you not to. This also earns you 30 Renegade points.....but despite them both being Renegade one is obviously "bad ass" and one is a d*ck move, basically for no reason. That's what I meant what I said the "hard line" Renegades, and not Renegades in general.
 

Modifié par hex23, 16 avril 2011 - 05:39 .

[GodWood]

[Potential] Benefits of Renegade Decisions:

Sacrificing the council: Arms race between Humans and turians means more Ships to combat the Reapers.
Killing the Rachni Queen: No indoctrinated rachni soldiers, no rachni wars/hostilities post Reaper War.
Destroying Genophage Cure: Wrex's system stays in tact, smaller but unified krogan army, no krogan hostilities post Reaper war.
Blowing up Heretic Geth: Heretic geth's memories not intergrated with other geth - lessened chance of geth heretics popping up again.
Saving Collector Base: Greater knowledge of Reapers, new advanced technology.

EDIT: What other BIG choices is there?

Modifié par GodWood, 16 avril 2011 - 05:46 .

[omgodzilla]

hex23 wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Renegade =/= pissing off companions or failing loyalty quests.
You can fail those being paragon too.

How you fail them and/or why they are mad is totally different though, which is my point.

Tali's trial is a perfect example of Renegade done right, and wrong.

If you have sufficient morality rep you can Intimidate the crowd into exonorating Tali. This earns you 30 Renegade points.

If you don't have high enough morality rep, you can hand over the evidence even though Tali begged you not to. This also earns you 30 Renegade points.....but despite them both being Renegade one is obviously "bad ass" and one is a d*ck move, basically for no reason. That's what I meant what I said the "hard line" Renegades, and not Renegades in general.
 

It does have a reason. It was made for those of us who hate Tali.

[GodWood]

hex23 wrote...
If you don't have high enough morality rep, you can hand over the evidence even though Tali begged you not to. This also earns you 30 Renegade points.....but despite them both being Renegade one is obviously "bad ass" and one is a d*ck move, basically for no reason. That's what I meant what I said the "hard line" Renegades, and not Renegades in general. 

You're releasing information that condemns a war criminal for his actions and proves Tali's innocence.
It's perfectly justifiable and not d*ckish at all.

Funnily enough it's one of the paragon choices that gets her exiled.

[Ausstig]

GodWood wrote...

[Potential] Benefits of Renegade Decisions:

Sacrificing the council: Arms race between Humans and turians means more Ships to combat the Reapers.
Killing the Rachni Queen: No indoctrinated rachni soldiers, no rachni wars/hostilities post Reaper War.
Destroying Genophage Cure: Wrex's system stays in tact, smaller but unified krogan army, no krogan hostilities post Reaper war.
Blowing up Heretic Geth: Heretic geth's memories not intergrated with other geth - lessened chance of geth heretics popping up again.
Saving Collector Base: Greater knowledge of Reapers, new adanced technology.

EDIT: What other BIG choices is there?

Saving Feros, though I did that as a renegade.
 

[jbblue05]

You're not being an ass to Tali handing over the evidence will scare the Quarian about the Geth military potential.

But I won't lie it was totally awesome pissing Tali off but for some reason she didn't die but I can still find enjoyment in her being all emo

Modifié par jbblue05, 16 avril 2011 - 05:51 .

[AdmiralCheez]

Renegades have the better awesome button.

[GodWood]

Ausstig wrote...
Saving Feros, though I did that as a renegade.

Feros isn't in the PS3 comic thing so I doubt it'll have any major impact in ME3.

[hex23]

omgodzilla wrote...

It does have a reason. It was made for those of us who hate Tali.

Which is pointless in the grand scheme of things. If you're willing to back stab a team mate simply because you dislike them, realistically who would listen to you?

No one. This is why I said certain Renegades.

Modifié par hex23, 16 avril 2011 - 06:02 .

[CulturalGeekGirl]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Renegades have the better awesome button.

Truth.

Sometimes I think the intended benefit of being Renegade is more that you get to see all that awesome stuff, while Paragons have to be all "polite" and "respectful" and stuff.

I was watching a Youtube video of Sheploo hanging up on the council over and over again and I was like "Damn. That... that is cool. I wish I'd been able to do that." But nooooo, I'm trying to be nice. And in the end, it doesn't matter... if you saved their lives, they totally forget that you hung up on them. And if they die, none of it mattered anyway! 

(Also, your avatar lures me into threads I have been avoiding. Rrrrrr.)

[GodWood]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
Renegades have the better awesome button.

[hex23]

GodWood wrote...

You're releasing information that condemns a war criminal for his actions and proves Tali's innocence.
It's perfectly justifiable and not d*ckish at all.

Funnily enough it's one of the paragon choices that gets her exiled.

You're making it seem like her not getting exiled is the primary objective. It isn't. Job 1 is earning her Loyalty, which the d*ck move Renegade option makes impossible.

And regardless of your justification for handing over the info, a friend....or at the very least a team mate....asked you not to. Again, if you're willing to betray their trust, what would you do to other people? It doesn't really paint you as a trustworthy leader.

[jbblue05]

Saphra Deden wrote...

I don't see how anybody can beat the Reapers, be they Renegade or Paragon.

Also I agree with GodWood about Tali's trial. Frankly I think the Renegade/Paragon options there should have been reversed. A Paragon would want to do what is right whether it pisses Tali off or not. A Renegade however just want's her focused on the mission so he wouldn't care.

I think the Paragon and renegeade decisions are correct.

Paragon your doing a favor for your friend just to make them happy which is selfish

Renegade your thinking about all the Quarians  not just Tali.  THe Quarians will not win the war with the Geth, so you try to install fear and steer their attention towards the Reapers

[hex23]

And I pick almost every Renegade interrupt. I'm not a 100% Paragon. I blew up the Council simply because I hated the Turian and his air quotes. So I'm not saying "hey guys, be a space hippy and try to get along with everyone". It's just that certain Renegade choices are 100% d*ck moves, for no apparent reason, that portray Shepard as a douche bag. Picking even a handful of those, it's hard to imagine why anybody would want to follow him.

Modifié par hex23, 16 avril 2011 - 06:00 .

[theelementslayer]

Renegade does not mean dick I play a 70-30 mix and sometimes it just makes more sense to get the job done. Like am I really going to care if elnora wanted to be part of the elciplse or not, she made her choice and she has to live by it. Im not going to spend time worrying about her when I have to find someone to save the galaxy with. If that makes me renegade then so be it.