200 réponses à ce sujet

[Romantiq]

haha check out comments on youtube for this interview he gave to Gamespot

Modifié par Romantiq, 18 avril 2011 - 11:59 .

[nopho]

toggled wrote...

Aermord wrote...
Now back to Biowares interview and seemingly lack of understanding of the damage they have done. They are doing damage control now, except that it results in quite the opposite among their (former) fans,

I disagree with your statement that Bioware is in damage control mode... or at least it doesn't tell the whole story. I think Bioware is in total denial. Groupthink has taken over at Bioware HQ, and the groupthink is: our game is awesome! Anyone who doesn't like the game just hates change! 

To me, groupthink at Bioware is the most terrible thing to come from the fiasco known as Dragon Age 2. If someone refuses to recognize a problem, the problem won't be fixed; therefore, we can expect future Bioware titles to be just as lackluster at the most recent title.

i disagree with you disagreeing.
things like the -spawns (in ME2 they at least come from somewhere) or the massivly recyceled enviroments and lots other stuff wich i guess i have to explain noone here.
bioware are programmers, they programm games for a living, they know when something isn't good enough. i imagine it like the papers i have to write for my university. when i write a paper wich should take 10days in one night then i know how good it is the moment i file it. my luck i until now always managed to talk me a good grade later on when defending it
thats what keeps me here for a part, i am so very interested in how this all will turn out.

[Mecher3k]

Romantiq wrote...

haha check out comments on youtube for this interview he gave to Gamespot

I haven't even seen John Smedley get comments like this. Ok, so I did but it seems Laidlaw is getting a lot more of it. Damn Bioware, you really herr derped it this time.

[Altima Darkspells]

Yes, word of mouth is what made Origins great and probably butchered DA2.

Yes, BioWare is constantly playing up DA2 because they, well, have to. There's just too much to lose (like their jobs) if they don't. We have to remember that BioWare's had months to get used to the steaming pile that DA2 was--and no one can convince me that many of the devs for the project didn't think there was gonna be a **** storm when the game was launched. A game as recent as Mass Effect was criticized for re-using areas, and it pales in comparison to DA2's instance of that, for example.

On the other hand, I think we're clearly allowed to be annoyed with BioWare's scrambling and PR damage control attempts.

Someone said earlier that the best thing for the franchise would be to either discontinue it or for BioWare to make DA3 great. That's not true. Option Three is that DA3 is given to, say...Obsidian! Of course, I don't think they're bat-**** enough to make a game for EA. After all, they're still an independent studio, and only one successful game is needed to be published by EA to be eaten up...

[Boiny Bunny]

Ideally, I would like a game that Obsidian write, but have absolutely nothing to do with the programming, art design, or soundtrack for. They are rather poor at all of these things (especially the programming part!) - but excellent writers.

[Altima Darkspells]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

Ideally, I would like a game that Obsidian write, but have absolutely nothing to do with the programming, art design, or soundtrack for. They are rather poor at all of these things (especially the programming part!) - but excellent writers.

BioWare ain't too hot at programming lately, either.

[neppakyo]

Romantiq wrote...

haha check out comments on youtube for this interview he gave to Gamespot

haha, funny in a sad way..

I like this youtube comment

"Not even Obamacare could save this game.Lack of detail, bad story telling, restrictive gameplay"

[Boiny Bunny]

Altima Darkspells wrote...

Boiny Bunny wrote...

Ideally, I would like a game that Obsidian write, but have absolutely nothing to do with the programming, art design, or soundtrack for. They are rather poor at all of these things (especially the programming part!) - but excellent writers.

BioWare ain't too hot at programming lately, either.

That's true - it's clear that multiple aspects of DA2 were completely untested.

[Altima Darkspells]

Boiny Bunny wrote...


That's true - it's clear that multiple aspects of DA2 were completely untested.

And in Origins.  And Awakening.  And ME2 for the PS3.

Traditionally, BioWare games were pretty buggy on release, but they used to be good about patching them up (whereas Obsidian, well, didn't, hence their reputation).  Ever since BioWare went multiple platforms, it's gotten progressively worse.

While Obsidian has gotten better (or more average, at least) in that aspect.

So, really, I can't think of a reason now why BioWare would be a better studio other than they have a bigger paycheck, but given that the many, many excuses we heard about DA2 revolved around the lack of zots, I'm not even sure that's a point anymore.

[Aedan_Cousland]

Sareth Cousland wrote...

I think that PR-wise, all that is being done at the moment is damage control, and you can't really fault a company for that. Final decisions will be made when the total sales revenues (as prices are already declining sharply, units are no longer a measure of success in DA2's case) are known - at about the same time, you should hear a few open statements on whether the changes were for better or worse.

This.

DA2 is still a new release. I can't fault them for going into damage control mode, and trying to drive up sales. I'll be more interested in hearing what Bioware has to say about DA2 while DA3 is in development. If we hear nothing but a 'head-in-the-sand' defense of how DA2 turned out, I won't be buying DA3.

Modifié par Aedan_Cousland, 19 avril 2011 - 05:11 .

[Volourn]

People who suck up to Betehsda who are the worst game developer EVAR make me laugh. Skyrim will be another crappy game in a series of crappy games. L0L Elder Scrolls. What a joke.

[petipas1414]

I tell all my friends who game not to buy to buy this.

Glad to see it's getting the hate it deserves

[MakeSense]

Bioware forgot what is the primary asset for every company in history: customers. 

They thought they were being super-smart by targeting an audience perceived as "dumb", and they thought they could do it by simply "dumbing down" the game, while also cutting every possible corner and sparing a lot of money in the process. 
Turns out the CoD crowd is not really "dumb": they're just gamers who, like any other, perfectly know what they like. They won't buy millions of copies of a game just because it's been dumbed down. They will buy it if offers what they're after.

So they basically:

• Vastly underestimated the audience they thought they could lure to a rushed game
• Vastly disrespected the audience they already had
• Vastly misjudged gamers as a whole, forgetting that they're all people able to think, process and exchange opinions, not just walking wallets

This is the beginning of the End for Bioware.
And every time Laidlaw speaks, or Gaider, or one of the moderators here, treats users like they're doing recently, another line of the Epitaph gets carved on the stone.
They will not be mourned.
Eventually a new developer with some integrity will replace them, and a new cycle will begin.
 

Modifié par MakeSense, 19 avril 2011 - 06:57 .

[Sabriana]

Cataca wrote...

I will assure you, that game reviewers need bioware as much as the other way round. Early, overly positive reviews will drive up sales, as much as early reviews will rise the viewer base of the review site/paper, its a symbiotic relationship. Its in Biowares, and more importantly in EA's best interest to keep that relationship healthy.
Openly admitting that the game had serious flaws, will also implicate that the reviews have been dishonest in their conclusion, it would shake the faith of the consumers and thus impact  the reviews have, negatively influencing sales.

<snip>

Hmm, but I would think that the damage to those 'professional' reviewers is already done. It seems as if they never thought that a bioteam title would bomb in that fashion, especially the successor to DA:O, which despite it's flaws was very well received.
-
Opinions are what they are, and everybody has one, but there are flaws in that game that would get a DigSim graduate candidate ripped apart by her/his instructors/professors. I'm not even talking about the bugs, even though that "rescue" bug was simply awful. Everyone had it, there was no way to claim that it was system induced. If you cut content, make sure that everything is cut, surely that is not too much to ask. It tended to imply apathy toward their own product.

Even the most verocious fan of DA 2 can't deny the recycled areas, and the same map without so much as bothering to even alter the map to give the illusion that it's something different. If you love tash-mobs, fine, but them coming out of thin air, landing right on-top of the PC and her group? Plot-holes so big that you can pull Shaori's Fell through?

I have seen games ripped into tiny little bite-sized shreds for far lesser offenses by those same 'professional' reviewers. For me, they simply lost all their credibility, especially the one who rated DA 2 "perfect".

A professional can also be a gamer. The private gamer might be able to shrug off the greatest flaws, and get plenty of joy out of a game (and I'm happy for her/him), but the same person in her/his professional mantle should never do this, imo. To me, that is very unprofessional behavior.

All this contributes to a negative 'word-of-mouth. Because it gives fuel to an already angry backlash, because it adds to the overall negative feeling.

[Shadowbanner]

MakeSense wrote...

Bioware forgot what is the primary asset for every company in history: customers. 

They thought they were being super-smart by targeting an audience perceived as "dumb", and they thought they could do it by simply "dumbing down" the game, while also cutting every possible corner and sparing a lot of money in the process. 
Turns out the CoD crowd is not really "dumb": they're just gamers who, like any other, perfectly know what they like. They won't buy millions of copies of a game just because it's been dumbed down. They will buy it if offers what they're after.

So they basically:

• Vastly underestimated the audience they thought they could lure to a rushed game
• Vastly disrespected the audience they already had
• Vastly misjudged gamers as a whole, forgetting that they're all people able to think, process and exchange opinions, not just walking wallets

This is the beginning of the End for Bioware.
And every time Laidlaw speaks, or Gaider, or one of the moderators here, treats users like they're doing recently, another line of the Epitaph gets carved on the stone.
They will not be mourned.
Eventually a new developer with some integrity will replace them, and a new cycle will begin.
 

I agree with everything you've written except its the end of BioWare.

I think they've learnt the lesson and will now move on.

[brownybrown]

Yes the "professional" game review sites that run banner advertisement for games from the same company while giving glowing reviews to sister games from said company... seems pretty widespread.
Due to the DA2 debacle i now am a big fan of
http://www.gamecritics.com/ (US based site, seems to be big on integrity) and the UK based Dark zero http://darkzero.co.uk/

however these sites dont often get advanced copies (not playing ball) or if they do the definitely aren't allowed to post the review before the release date.
http://www.destructo...e--154456.phtml
and in a related note
http://bitmob.com/ar...arly-metascores


and

Modifié par brownybrown, 19 avril 2011 - 09:20 .

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Romantiq wrote...

haha check out comments on youtube for this interview he gave to Gamespot

Goodness! Those comments make me feel sorry for Mike Laidlaw.
Ah.. Well. Time to move on to DA 3 or other superior games.

Hurry up with DA 3 announcement, Mike.

[abaris]

Sabriana wrote...

I have seen games ripped into tiny little bite-sized shreds for far lesser offenses by those same 'professional' reviewers. For me, they simply lost all their credibility, especially the one who rated DA 2 "perfect".

Their heart is where the money is. These companies buy ads and if they buy ads, the editor will tell his underlings to be nice and friendly so as not to ****** them off.

A reviewer is never to be trusted. He lives and dies with the magazine paying his wages and these wages are paid by ad money aquired by the magazine. And by the way, just look at all these nice and shiny EA ads in the gaming magazines and your should get the drift.

Recently I saw a German game mag rating DAII 89 out of 100. Yet the same webpage featured a prominent Crisis skyscraper. I wonder if this had any influence on the ratings? <_<

[Sabriana]

@ Abaris

That appears to be true, unfortunately. In the past, I used to at least read over them, and take their opinion somewhat into consideration, even if it was minimal. That will no longer happen. I will simply ignore the most obvious culprits altogether.

It will save me a lot of time surfing and it'll even save me money purchasing magazines. Because if I no longer trust one part of a gaming media, I will make it easy on myself and don't trust them altogether.

Although, I will still watch "Zero Punctuation". At least until I feel that he too has become a victim of a corporate clamp.

(Note:any corporation; I'm not singling out anyone at all. Because at the bottom line, they're all the same)

[brownybrown]

I think game critics is a sight you can really trust
(and they have good podcasts too)

http://www.gamecritics.com Game

zero punctuation...who doesnt love him:)

Modifié par brownybrown, 19 avril 2011 - 09:54 .

[Sabriana]

Thanks, Brownybrown. I'll give them a try. Later. Atm I'm far too disgusted with so called 'professionals' who give all their ilk a black eye, and a bad name.

[brownybrown]

If only I had read this before
http://www.gamecriti...n-age-ii-review

[Lalue]

i dont know about you guys but im fed up with ppl posting links ...BrownyBrown...cant you just write what you think?

[Sabriana]

Being that this is a personal opinion, here is mine:

Personally, I prefer links. It leaves the threads uncluttered, and I can read the linked items at my leisure.

[abaris]

Sabriana wrote...

@ Abaris

That appears to be true, unfortunately. In the past, I used to at least read over them, and take their opinion somewhat into consideration, even if it was minimal. That will no longer happen. I will simply ignore the most obvious culprits altogether.

Not only does it appear to be true, it is true. I'm working in the media and there have been several instances when the editor threw certain articles out because of the potential of hurting the feelings of a customer. Why should it be different with gaming magazines?