843 réponses à ce sujet

[AkiKishi]

Gavinthelocust wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

If it was then there would have been no need for epilogue cards.

That was the appendix.  The fixed story was over.

If it was fixed there would have been no need for epilogue cards. The very fact you have them means the story is not fixed. I'm not sure how many possible variables there are in the epilogue but it's definately more than one.

You will become Warden, Archdemon will die.
That's fixed.

You will become Hawke you will dissapear , see how easy it is ? 

If you choose to be obtuse and not understand , I really don't care.

[AlanC9]

MorrigansLove wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Of course not. Bioware clearly made this game to troll you. They are ashamed of their product and hate themselves and you. They also didn't spend two days working on epilogue cards because that would obviously be a waste of precious resources and wasn't the result of a creative decision at all[/b].

You really need to stop with the personal remarks. You're being very immature.

There's nothing personal about that remark. He's ridiculing your reasoning with satire, sure, but satire is a legitimate form of rhetoric.

[Edli]

Dave of Canada wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

This is what CRPGs do. If there is a fixed story then it's not really a CRPG. It's more like a JRPG.

DA:O had me forced to become a Warden against my will and eventually stop the Blight and become the Hero of Ferelden, it was pretty fixed.

DA:O told the story of the warden and how he gathered the armies and killed the archdemon. That was the story. Of course you'll gona be the warden. At least DA:O gave you different races and origins. It gave you the freedom to start off from 6 different backrounds.

Modifié par Edli, 18 avril 2011 - 09:36 .

[orbit991]

Volourn wrote...

"Cliffhangers cannot be justified unless they are done like Empire Strikes Back where we know what has happened to all the characters, and are not left hanging."

Bull. Cliffhangers are awesome. Then again, you just quoted a lame SW movie so can'tt ake you seriously at all. L0LZ

And judging by the way you spell and post "lolz" we can't take you seriously either little homie.

[Gavinthelocust]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

What did my Hawke do with Feynreil?  What about the mages in Thrask's quest?  What happened to my sibling at the end of Act 1?  How about Act 3?  What was the ultimate fate of Isabela? Fenris? Anders?  How did the Qunari crisis end?  Where's Bartrand?  Where's his piece of the (spoiler)?

Going by what people here say none of that ever happened.

[AkiKishi]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

If it was fixed there would have been no need for epilogue cards. The very fact you have them means the story is not fixed.

I disagree.  Each game has elements that are fixed and elements that are dynamic.  

Yet one has many different possible epilogue cards and the other has Hawke disapearing.

[upsettingshorts]

BobSmith101 wrote...

Yet one has many different possible epilogue cards and the other has Hawke disapearing.

Because one chose to include them and the other did not.  The idea that DA2 couldn't have possibly had epilogue cards is nonsense.

Gavinthelocust wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

What did my Hawke do with Feynreil?  What about the mages in Thrask's quest?  What happened to my sibling at the end of Act 1?  How about Act 3?  What was the ultimate fate of Isabela? Fenris? Anders?  How did the Qunari crisis end?  Where's Bartrand?  Where's his piece of the (spoiler)?

Going by what people here say none of that ever happened.

Indeed.  Every single one of those things would have resulted in an epilogue card had it been DAO.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 18 avril 2011 - 09:35 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

BobSmith101 wrote...

If it was then there would have been no need for epilogue cards.

That was the appendix.  The fixed story was over.

Even I can see you just moved the goal posts because the position did not suit you.

[upsettingshorts]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Even I can see you just moved the goal posts because the position did not suit you.

What?  I've been saying that epilogue cards were unsatisfying and shouldn't even count - especially as they are not the Word of God - from the very second I got into this silly argument.

Edit: Here you go, goalposts regarding epilogue cards and my position on them have been in place since at least page 15.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 18 avril 2011 - 09:39 .

[Dave of Canada]

They could have added epilogue cards for DA2 and I heavily doubt it would've suddenly have made you guys see the game's story any less fixed, the epilogue card events happen ingame instead of having a card randomly show up in the finale saying "Yeah, that dude you saved? He eventually did this thing.".

[MorrigansLove]

Dave of Canada wrote...

They could have added epilogue cards for DA2 and I heavily doubt it would've suddenly have made you guys see the game's story any less fixed, the epilogue card events happen ingame instead of having a card randomly show up in the finale saying "Yeah, that dude you saved? He eventually did this thing.".

I would have liked epilogue cards more than a cliffhanger.

[upsettingshorts]

DA2 does have a sort of epilogue card/Mass Effect 2 email hybrid thing going on. You'll get letters from characters you were involved in from previous or current acts that update you on the consequences of your decisions. Also various dialogues can and do change, in certain quests - nothing major of course, but then epilogue cards are brief as well.

[AkiKishi]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Because one chose to include them and the other did not.  The idea that DA2 couldn't have possibly had epilogue cards is nonsense.

All it would have done is shown how inconsequential Hawkes actions were in the bigger picture.

I'm not going to write an eplilogue for DA2 here because of the non spoiler rule. But "write" one in your head and you realise just how lame it would sound.

[Dave of Canada]

MorrigansLove wrote...

I would have liked epilogue cards more than a cliffhanger.

Cliffhanger would've happened regardless, it was the entire point of the story.

[MorrigansLove]

Dave of Canada wrote...

MorrigansLove wrote...

I would have liked epilogue cards more than a cliffhanger.

Cliffhanger would've happened regardless, it was the entire point of the story.

You've truly opened my eyes to what I did not see.

[upsettingshorts]

BobSmith101 wrote...

All it would have done is shown how inconsequential Hawkes actions were in the bigger picture.

Doesn't Darkspawn Chronicles show the events of DAO would have taken place without the Warden as well?

I don't need to be a BIG BLOODY HERO to feel like my character was important or his journey had meaning.

BobSmith101 wrote...

I'm not going to write an eplilogue for DA2 here because of the non spoiler rule. But "write" one in your head and you realise just how lame it would sound.

It actually sounds great to me.  But then, maybe I lucked into a good character concept to roleplay in DA2.  

That being said, most of the epilogue cards of DAO weren't about the mainplot, they detailed the fate of the hub areas and various characters - the same could be done for DA2 quite easily - had they wanted to. 

[AkiKishi]

MorrigansLove wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

MorrigansLove wrote...

I would have liked epilogue cards more than a cliffhanger.

Cliffhanger would've happened regardless, it was the entire point of the story.

You've truly opened my eyes to what I did not see.

That was too funny.

[Dragoonlordz]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Even I can see you just moved the goal posts because the position did not suit you.

What?  I've been saying that epilogue cards were unsatisfying and shouldn't even count - especially as they are not the Word of God - from the very second I got into this silly argument.

I got nothing against you per se but the epilogue cards should count, because they extend the storyline. Even if they are merely text based it is no different then removing the dialogue between each time skip in DA2. Imagine how disjointed the game would have been if that had happened, even more so than it already felt for a lot of people. The epilogue cards change based on your actions during gameplay. They add to complettion in that the show/explain the effects of your choices past the obvious and clear ones that was shown during gameplay.

DA2 used the same method between acts to explain the passing of time and with a game advertised on the premise of spanning a decade when the actual game spans a mere 30% of that time in gameplay and rest time skips, it does lead to a feeling of disappointment.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 18 avril 2011 - 09:47 .

[Dave of Canada]

BobSmith101 wrote...

I'm not going to write an eplilogue for DA2 here because of the non spoiler rule. But "write" one in your head and you realise just how lame it would sound.

Mm... thinking of Feynriel epilogue cards or Keran epilogue cards and they seem just like DA:O's epilogue cards, I much prefered seeing their lives ruined / changed ingame.

[TJSolo]

What did my Hawke do with Feynreil?

Not sure.

What about the mages in Thrask's quest?

I am sure they were in the Gallows after that mission.

What happened to my sibling at the end of Act 1? How about Act 3?

Since you are also asking about Act 3, I guess the mages from Thrask's quest popped again and did something with your sibling then.

What was the ultimate fate of Isabela? Fenris? Anders?

Don't know.

How did the Qunari crisis end?

With them leaving.

Where's Bartrand?

I don't know.

Where's his piece of the (spoiler)?

Most likely providing a stat bonus somewhere, never to be heard from again.

Well my comment was not meant to be a comparative between the two games though. 

Modifié par TJSolo, 18 avril 2011 - 09:46 .

[Dave of Canada]

MorrigansLove wrote...

You've truly opened my eyes to what I did not see.

You seem too blinded by the hate of the cliffhanger ending that you're not seeing the bigger picture, but then again... you're not even trying to argue reasonably, more interested in insulting people.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 18 avril 2011 - 09:45 .

[Edli]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Even I can see you just moved the goal posts because the position did not suit you.

What?  I've been saying that epilogue cards were unsatisfying and shouldn't even count - especially as they are not the Word of God - from the very second I got into this silly argument.

Seriously what's with your obsession with the cards. Cards told only the consequences that took time to take effect from you choices. DA:O lasted for what, 2 weeks at max? Did you want to wander in Ferelden for 2 years till Bhelen or Alistair proved to be good or bad leaders?

You put Bhelen on the throne and you're off killing the archdemon and possibly die. Of course you're not going to know how's he going to rule Orzamar from the get go. There were a lot of other choices you made that had immediate effect. Those that needed time like the ashes part where you kill or not genitivi to keep or not the secret, that's what the cards were for.

It was a story told in a short time span unlike DA2.

[AkiKishi]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

It actually sounds great to me.  But then, maybe I lucked into a good character concept to roleplay in DA2.  

That being said, most of the epilogue cards of DAO weren't about the mainplot, they detailed the fate of the hub areas and various characters - the same could be done for DA2 quite easily - had they wanted to. 

PM it to me.

Not without actually adding some real variables. There are a few, but nothing like the number that was in DA.

[upsettingshorts]

[quote]TJSolo wrote...

I am sure they were in the Gallows after that mission.[/quote]

I didn't ask where they were, but what I did with them.  They are of course, different questions.

[quote]TJSolo wrote...

Since you are also asking about Act 3, I guessing the mages from Thrask's quest popped again and did something with your sibling.[/quote]

No actually, more the endgame state.

[quote]TJSolo wrote...

With them leaving.[/quote]

After what happened in the keep?

[quote]TJSolo wrote...

Most likely providing a stat bonus somewhere, never to be heard from again. [/quote]

That's fair.

All the "don't know" are pretty obviously opportunities for player choice, as are the ones we've yet to nail down are they not?

Well my comment was not meant to be a comparative between the two games though. 
[/quote]

[Il Divo]

Edli wrote...

Seriously what's with your obsession with the cards. Cards told only the consequences that took time to take effect from you choices. DA:O lasted for what, 2 weeks at max? Did you want to wander in Ferelden for 2 years till Bhelen or Alistair proved to be good or bad leaders?

You put Bhelen on the throne and you're off killing the archdemon and possibly die. Of course you're not going to know how's he going to rule Orzamar from the get go. There were a lot of other choices you made that had immediate effect. Those that needed time like the ashes part where you kill or not genitivi to keep or not the secret, that's what the cards were for.

It was a story told in a short time span unlike DA2.

Dragon Age: Origins spanned two whole years, for the record.