541 réponses à ce sujet

[Nimrodell]

ExtremeOne wrote...

If TIM was going to use Shepard why bring him back only to kill him again . It makes no sense at all . Anti Cerberus fans do not give a sh*t they have what they want and that was a retcon of ME 2 . But the story does not make sense at all with 2 .

Well, this is a long shot, but TIM can actually be against Shepard that didn't destroy the Collector's Base... What if TIM was exposed to indoctrination in that very Collector's Base or some object that layed dormant there. It doesn't even have to do with Collector's Base - for all Shepard variations that scenario could happen. As I said, it would be a long shot since from Grayson's case we know that TIM protects himself and has great knowledge, but yet again he is willing to risk and play with new toys he gets. Even the trial could be used to invoke TIM's wrath on renegade Shepard, so there are many possibilities on how TIM chasing Shep is not a possible future plothole. Just wait and see how the things will play out.

[HTTP 404]

ExtremeOne made so many assumptions about Me3. Did you play Me3? do you know these things are going to happen? did you know most major decisions and impact will happen more in Me3 than in Me2 as Me3 is the last of the series? how can plotholes be pointed out when we only have a fragment of it?  it annoys me to no end when assumptions of that magnitude are made.

Modifié par HTTP 404, 22 avril 2011 - 07:56 .

[ExtremeOne]

Nimrodell wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

If TIM was going to use Shepard why bring him back only to kill him again . It makes no sense at all . Anti Cerberus fans do not give a sh*t they have what they want and that was a retcon of ME 2 . But the story does not make sense at all with 2 .

Well, this is a long shot, but TIM can actually be against Shepard that didn't destroy the Collector's Base... What if TIM was exposed to indoctrination in that very Collector's Base or some object that layed dormant there. It doesn't even have to do with Collector's Base - for all Shepard variations that scenario could happen. As I said, it would be a long shot since from Grayson's case we know that TIM protects himself and has great knowledge, but yet again he is willing to risk and play with new toys he gets. Even the trial could be used to invoke TIM's wrath on renegade Shepard, so there are many possibilities on how TIM chasing Shep is not a possible future plothole. Just wait and see how the things will play out.

  







I can understand The Illuisve Man and Cerberus being pissed off at Shepard  for destroying the base at the end of 2 if you chose the paragon ending . So yeah that would make them come after you and try to kill you . What I can not understand is . If you give TIM the base then that should mean you reamin apart of Cerberus and keep the SR 2 . 
Bioware is saying in the GI article that Cerberus is after Shepard and want to kill him.  They keep saying choices from ME 1 and 2 will matter in 3 . Well then the choice at  the end of 2 should mean  your Shepard made a choice in who to align with.  Its a retcon to Me and a very stupid one 

[Zeratul20]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Nimrodell wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

If TIM was going to use Shepard why bring him back only to kill him again . It makes no sense at all . Anti Cerberus fans do not give a sh*t they have what they want and that was a retcon of ME 2 . But the story does not make sense at all with 2 .

Well, this is a long shot, but TIM can actually be against Shepard that didn't destroy the Collector's Base... What if TIM was exposed to indoctrination in that very Collector's Base or some object that layed dormant there. It doesn't even have to do with Collector's Base - for all Shepard variations that scenario could happen. As I said, it would be a long shot since from Grayson's case we know that TIM protects himself and has great knowledge, but yet again he is willing to risk and play with new toys he gets. Even the trial could be used to invoke TIM's wrath on renegade Shepard, so there are many possibilities on how TIM chasing Shep is not a possible future plothole. Just wait and see how the things will play out.

  







I can understand The Illuisve Man and Cerberus being pissed off at Shepard  for destroying the base at the end of 2 if you chose the paragon ending . So yeah that would make them come after you and try to kill you . What I can not understand is . If you give TIM the base then that should mean you reamin apart of Cerberus and keep the SR 2 . 
Bioware is saying in the GI article that Cerberus is after Shepard and want to kill him.  They keep saying choices from ME 1 and 2 will matter in 3 . Well then the choice at  the end of 2 should mean  your Shepard made a choice in who to align with.  Its a retcon to Me and a very stupid one 

Not necessarily, EO. You don't know what effect your choices'll have in ME3.  Just wait and see, who knows how they'll implement it.
That, and do you remember the "Shepard - KIA" trailer? Who knows what they'll eventually do with it?

[ExtremeOne]

HTTP 404 wrote...

ExtremeOne made so many assumptions about Me3. Did you play Me3? do you know these things are going to happen? did you know most major decisions and impact will happen more in Me3 than in Me2 as Me3 is the last of the series? how can plotholes be pointed out when we only have a fragment of it?  it annoys me to no end when assumptions of that magnitude are made.

  






people hate when their favorite developer gets called out for a bull sh*t story and a stupid way of telling a story .  Its clear that Bioware has no desire or interest in telling us why Cerberus turned on Shepard . So you go and look at the story so far .  The ME 2 story is not matching the story from the GI article . It makes no sense at all that Cerberus would spend 4 Billion credits to bring Shepard back to destroy the reapers and collectors . Then in ME 3 they want to kill him. Its called a retcon and when a developer does 3 retcons on a single part of a story of a series there is a serious issue there .  You can have all the game play and graphics you want in a game but if the story is crap its just a virtual shooting gallery . 

[ExtremeOne]

Zeratul20 wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

Nimrodell wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

If TIM was going to use Shepard why bring him back only to kill him again . It makes no sense at all . Anti Cerberus fans do not give a sh*t they have what they want and that was a retcon of ME 2 . But the story does not make sense at all with 2 .

Well, this is a long shot, but TIM can actually be against Shepard that didn't destroy the Collector's Base... What if TIM was exposed to indoctrination in that very Collector's Base or some object that layed dormant there. It doesn't even have to do with Collector's Base - for all Shepard variations that scenario could happen. As I said, it would be a long shot since from Grayson's case we know that TIM protects himself and has great knowledge, but yet again he is willing to risk and play with new toys he gets. Even the trial could be used to invoke TIM's wrath on renegade Shepard, so there are many possibilities on how TIM chasing Shep is not a possible future plothole. Just wait and see how the things will play out.

  







I can understand The Illuisve Man and Cerberus being pissed off at Shepard  for destroying the base at the end of 2 if you chose the paragon ending . So yeah that would make them come after you and try to kill you . What I can not understand is . If you give TIM the base then that should mean you reamin apart of Cerberus and keep the SR 2 . 
Bioware is saying in the GI article that Cerberus is after Shepard and want to kill him.  They keep saying choices from ME 1 and 2 will matter in 3 . Well then the choice at  the end of 2 should mean  your Shepard made a choice in who to align with.  Its a retcon to Me and a very stupid one 

Not necessarily, EO. You don't know what effect your choices'll have in ME3.  Just wait and see, who knows how they'll implement it.
That, and do you remember the "Shepard - KIA" trailer? Who knows what they'll eventually do with it?

  






I am sure they will make it all fit together . I am just one that is a story freak . I  would  like for stories in games to be good . So one day video game stories can get on the same level as books and movies . so yeah I hit story points hard and call bull sh*t when I see them  not making sense . The days of video games being stupid and silly need to end . especially when Mass Effect is so closely releated to Star Trek 

[Zeratul20]

ExtremeOne wrote...

HTTP 404 wrote...

ExtremeOne made so many assumptions about Me3. Did you play Me3? do you know these things are going to happen? did you know most major decisions and impact will happen more in Me3 than in Me2 as Me3 is the last of the series? how can plotholes be pointed out when we only have a fragment of it?  it annoys me to no end when assumptions of that magnitude are made.

  






people hate when their favorite developer gets called out for a bull sh*t story and a stupid way of telling a story .  Its clear that Bioware has no desire or interest in telling us why Cerberus turned on Shepard . So you go and look at the story so far .  The ME 2 story is not matching the story from the GI article . It makes no sense at all that Cerberus would spend 4 Billion credits to bring Shepard back to destroy the reapers and collectors . Then in ME 3 they want to kill him. Its called a retcon and when a developer does 3 retcons on a single part of a story of a series there is a serious issue there .  You can have all the game play and graphics you want in a game but if the story is crap its just a virtual shooting gallery . 

How is it made clear, according to you? We've sene two articles, so far, full of tiny little tidbits of information. Again (and I swear I'll stop posting and get back to work after this): relax and wait untill we have more info.
Heck, I want the story to be good as well, but we can't know if it's going to be good or not based on this.

Modifié par Zeratul20, 22 avril 2011 - 08:11 .

[Clover Rider]

Modifié par Some Geth, 22 avril 2011 - 08:17 .

[Clover Rider]

ExtremeOne wrote...

HTTP 404 wrote...

ExtremeOne made so many assumptions about Me3. Did you play Me3? do you know these things are going to happen? did you know most major decisions and impact will happen more in Me3 than in Me2 as Me3 is the last of the series? how can plotholes be pointed out when we only have a fragment of it?  it annoys me to no end when assumptions of that magnitude are made.

  






people hate when their favorite developer gets called out for a bull sh*t story and a stupid way of telling a story .  Its clear that Bioware has no desire or interest in telling us why Cerberus turned on Shepard . So you go and look at the story so far .  The ME 2 story is not matching the story from the GI article . It makes no sense at all that Cerberus would spend 4 Billion credits to bring Shepard back to destroy the reapers and collectors . Then in ME 3 they want to kill him. Its called a retcon and when a developer does 3 retcons on a single part of a story of a series there is a serious issue there .  You can have all the game play and graphics you want in a game but if the story is crap its just a virtual shooting gallery . 

 

[ExtremeOne]

Zeratul20 wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

HTTP 404 wrote...

ExtremeOne made so many assumptions about Me3. Did you play Me3? do you know these things are going to happen? did you know most major decisions and impact will happen more in Me3 than in Me2 as Me3 is the last of the series? how can plotholes be pointed out when we only have a fragment of it?  it annoys me to no end when assumptions of that magnitude are made.

  






people hate when their favorite developer gets called out for a bull sh*t story and a stupid way of telling a story .  Its clear that Bioware has no desire or interest in telling us why Cerberus turned on Shepard . So you go and look at the story so far .  The ME 2 story is not matching the story from the GI article . It makes no sense at all that Cerberus would spend 4 Billion credits to bring Shepard back to destroy the reapers and collectors . Then in ME 3 they want to kill him. Its called a retcon and when a developer does 3 retcons on a single part of a story of a series there is a serious issue there .  You can have all the game play and graphics you want in a game but if the story is crap its just a virtual shooting gallery . 

How is it made clear, according to you? We've sene two articles, so far, full of tiny little tidbits of information. Again (and I swear I'll stop posting and get back to work after this): relax and wait untill we have more info.
Heck, I want the story to be good as well, but we can't know if it's going to be good or not based on this.

  





good point . Maybe the GI article was messed up I am not sure but we will have to wait and see you are right 

[Foolsfolly]

I think it's safe to say that ExtremeOne believed what a lot of people did about the choice at the end of ME2: It decided if you stayed with Cerberus in ME3 or not.

So after thinking that for all these months to hear that Cerberus is a villain to the game...well it steals from the importance of giving TIM the base. Because there is no choice if the outcome is the same regardless of what you did.

But like others have said, we have no idea why TIM is after Shepard and who knows maybe all the magazine knew was that Shepard was shown fighting Cerberus and not that the scenes are from an Anti-Cerberus Shepard import or not.

Who knows at this point?

But I can understand EO's fear that a huge choice in ME2 might be made moot. I just played Dragon Age 2 last month and all the choices in that game ended up being moot by there only being one ending. And Shadow Broker and Arrival both have no choices for Shepard to make. So I understand the fear that BioWare as a company is leaving choices behind.

But we have no proof of that at this time. I'm willing to believe that DA2 was simply a rush job and the DLC had no choice because it's more-or-less background for ME3, like the comics and books.

[Seboist]

Foolsfolly wrote...

I think it's safe to say that ExtremeOne believed what a lot of people did about the choice at the end of ME2: It decided if you stayed with Cerberus in ME3 or not.

So after thinking that for all these months to hear that Cerberus is a villain to the game...well it steals from the importance of giving TIM the base. Because there is no choice if the outcome is the same regardless of what you did.

But like others have said, we have no idea why TIM is after Shepard and who knows maybe all the magazine knew was that Shepard was shown fighting Cerberus and not that the scenes are from an Anti-Cerberus Shepard import or not.

Who knows at this point?

But I can understand EO's fear that a huge choice in ME2 might be made moot. I just played Dragon Age 2 last month and all the choices in that game ended up being moot by there only being one ending. And Shadow Broker and Arrival both have no choices for Shepard to make. So I understand the fear that BioWare as a company is leaving choices behind.

But we have no proof of that at this time. I'm willing to believe that DA2 was simply a rush job and the DLC had no choice because it's more-or-less background for ME3, like the comics and books.

The problem isn't just the whole Cerberus issue, a lot of things we did in ME1 just ended up as mere e-mails and cameos in ME2. Things like the fate of the council which were implied to be big decisions were made irrelevant.

Some on here will say that all of our choices will come to fruition in ME3 but if that was the case why weren't we given the dignity of choosing to remain aligned with Cerberus? Especially after all the implications that we could in ME2?

[didymos1120]

Foolsfolly wrote...

I think it's safe to say that ExtremeOne believed what a lot of people did about the choice at the end of ME2: It decided if you stayed with Cerberus in ME3 or not.
 

Never understood this.  Even Kept-the-base Shep is quite standoffish with TIM and tells him s/he's calling the shots from then on as far as s/he and the crew goes.

[Foolsfolly]

didymos1120 wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

I think it's safe to say that ExtremeOne believed what a lot of people did about the choice at the end of ME2: It decided if you stayed with Cerberus in ME3 or not.
 

Never understood this.  Even Kept-the-base Shep is quite standoffish with TIM and tells him s/he's calling the shots from then on as far as s/he and the crew goes.

But I understood it. Shepard was brought back to win the war against the Reapers. TIM sent Shepard on a suicide mission and while surrounded by advanced unlimited monsters TIM changes the objective of the mission to be "Capture the Base for Study" and Shepard fulfils that objective for TIM.

Why wouldn't a Pro-Cerberus Pro-TIM Shepard not still be with TIM? Shepard fulfilled another mission for TIM, proving Shepard's worth and the Reaper threat is still looming.

I understood the belief. I even thought it was likely. At this moment, seeing these pictures with Shepard fighting Cerberus agents...I'm thinking it has to be a consquence of a choice in the game. I can't believe we're fighting Cerberus regardless.

TIM doesn't waste resources and Shepard is still the best chance to win this war. And it would be short-sighted and stupid of TIM to throw all that away because Shepard got a little uppity after fulfilling a stressful mission that nearly cost everything.

[Zeratul20]

My main issue with Bioware is... I appear to have no spine whatsoever and keep on coming back to the forums.
*slaps self* GET TO WORK, DRONE!

[didymos1120]

Foolsfolly wrote...

TIM sent Shepard on a suicide mission and while surrounded by advanced unlimited monsters TIM changes the objective of the mission to be "Capture the Base for Study" and Shepard fulfils that objective for TIM.

Yeah, but that wasn't presented as something you were doing for TIM.  Shep does it because s/he agrees that it could help in the coming war.  That is the extent of it. The epilogue for that ending is basically just Shep saying "Let's be perfectly clear here, guy: I did NOT do this for you OR Cerberus. Don't screw around: I mean it."

Modifié par didymos1120, 22 avril 2011 - 09:38 .

[Foolsfolly]

Yeah, but that wasn't presented as something you were doing for TIM. Shep does it because s/he agrees that it could help in the coming war. That is the extent of it. The epilogue for that ending is basically just Shep saying "Let's be perfectly clear here, guy: I did NOT do this for you OR Cerberus. Don't screw around: I mean it."

::shrugs::

I saw it as something for Cerberus. They have the resources to salvage the base, not Shepard. They have the technicians to work on it, not Shepard. I saw the little mouthing off to be more of a "Keep the goal in mind, this isn't about grabbing power."

Of course, TIM will always continue to grab for power. He's an intelligent and ambitious man, first and foremost.

But I'm no authority on this subject. I haven't done a "keep the base" character in forever. I truly believe keeping that base is a mistake. So I could be misremembering.

[ExtremeOne]

Seboist wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

I think it's safe to say that ExtremeOne believed what a lot of people did about the choice at the end of ME2: It decided if you stayed with Cerberus in ME3 or not.

So after thinking that for all these months to hear that Cerberus is a villain to the game...well it steals from the importance of giving TIM the base. Because there is no choice if the outcome is the same regardless of what you did.

But like others have said, we have no idea why TIM is after Shepard and who knows maybe all the magazine knew was that Shepard was shown fighting Cerberus and not that the scenes are from an Anti-Cerberus Shepard import or not.

Who knows at this point?

But I can understand EO's fear that a huge choice in ME2 might be made moot. I just played Dragon Age 2 last month and all the choices in that game ended up being moot by there only being one ending. And Shadow Broker and Arrival both have no choices for Shepard to make. So I understand the fear that BioWare as a company is leaving choices behind.

But we have no proof of that at this time. I'm willing to believe that DA2 was simply a rush job and the DLC had no choice because it's more-or-less background for ME3, like the comics and books.

The problem isn't just the whole Cerberus issue, a lot of things we did in ME1 just ended up as mere e-mails and cameos in ME2. Things like the fate of the council which were implied to be big decisions were made irrelevant.

Some on here will say that all of our choices will come to fruition in ME3 but if that was the case why weren't we given the dignity of choosing to remain aligned with Cerberus? Especially after all the implications that we could in ME2?

  




Thats what I am saying why weren't we given that choice . What reason does Shepard have in 3 for working with the Alliance .  

[Foolsfolly]

Thats what I am saying why weren't we given that choice . What reason does Shepard have in 3 for working with the Alliance

A fleet to hit the Reapers with. Same with anyone who has an army, group of mercs, or fleet. This threat will require as many bodies as possible to win.

[Leonia]

Who says we are working with the Alliance in 3? The Alliance is putting us on trial and they've impounded the Normandy.. there's a good chance we might have a crew full of Alliance types but I think 3 will be mostly about Shepard working for him/herself and getting on with the job at hand. No more playing pawn to everybody else.

Anyway, I am astonished this thread has hit 12 pages.. really, we have two articles and VERY little information about the actual plot. Don't get worked up over nothing.

Modifié par leonia42, 22 avril 2011 - 10:44 .

[didymos1120]

leonia42 wrote...

Don't get worked up over nothing.

That won't work with ExtremeOne.

[ExtremeOne]

Foolsfolly wrote...

Thats what I am saying why weren't we given that choice . What reason does Shepard have in 3 for working with the Alliance

A fleet to hit the Reapers with. Same with anyone who has an army, group of mercs, or fleet. This threat will require as many bodies as possible to win.

  





So if we are working for the alliance in 3 why are they  putting Shepard on trail .  

[ExtremeOne]

didymos1120 wrote...

leonia42 wrote...

Don't get worked up over nothing.

That won't work with ExtremeOne.

 




Oh yeah so No one is suppose to point out Bioware's mistakes in the ME Story .  At least I am not afraid to call them out on bull sh*t when I see it .  I am a story freak while many who play games are graphics freaks . 

[CroGamer002]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Thats what I am saying why weren't we given that choice . What reason does Shepard have in 3 for working with the Alliance

A fleet to hit the Reapers with. Same with anyone who has an army, group of mercs, or fleet. This threat will require as many bodies as possible to win.

  





So if we are working for the alliance in 3 why are they  putting Shepard on trail .  

I don't know, maybe Shepard blow up Mass Relay and killed 300 000 people and they don't believe in Reapers?
Well until Reapers come to witness trial.

[Leonia]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Oh yeah so No one is suppose to point out Bioware's mistakes in the ME Story .  At least I am not afraid to call them out on bull sh*t when I see it .  I am a story freak while many who play games are graphics freaks . 

Have all 12 pages been like this? Why do you guys even bother.