92 réponses à ce sujet

[Foolsfolly]

You bring Anders because a Grey Warden in the Deep Roads just makes sense; plus he's a healer.

Bethany, dude. You can role-play anything. Knight-Captain Cullen's been asking questions about her in Lowtown. You need to hide her and it's week trip just to the thiag and another week back. That'll allow things to cool down.

Or it's love and you two are best friends and inseparable. Then your love for her kills her/turns her into a Warden.

You decide to listen to her instead of your mother. Bethany wants to come why not bring her?

I mean, Hawke already had her as a mercenary or smuggler. And Leandra brought her to the Templar capital of the world. There's plenty of times in the game where no one cares about Bethany's safety.

I'm sure you can figure out some role-play reason.

[AlexXIV]

Gamer Ftw wrote...

I believe that summed it up so tired of the countless posts on how bad the game is that wasn't even what the thread was about.

The point is there is no roleplay reason to take Bethany anywhere if Hawke is no mage and Bethany is a mage. Because if she stayed at home and acted as a normal person there is a higher chance the templars wouldn't know about it. And taking Bethany with you to protect her better is probably the most stupid answer of all. Because that would imply that Hawke is allmighty. But how does Hawke keep Bethany from being infected with the darkspawn plaque or be taken to the Circle? Right, Hawke can't because he/she is human and not god. Exposing Bethany to any sort of danger is just foolish and selfish. And that's where the game fails (again). Because it is never really addressed. This thread is about roleplay reasons? You should know of all people, you started it. Then discuss it or leave it to people who can.

[Asdara]

I took her because she wanted to go. She helped me get all the money together and it isn't like someone has to stay behind and take care of mom, she's not that old and there's uncle screw-up to help out. She's not as particular about being allowed to go as Carver is, but she still wants to go and she still put in during that year of work so she deserves to get out of the city. I have to assume at least the trip to the entrance of the Deep Roads will be nice.

Also, on one particular occasion, I wanted her to die so I could have my LI kidnapped in later Acts. So... that time she came because I was pretty sure the jerks in my old outfit would rat her out to the Templars the minute I wasn't in town to beat them down for it.

[Gamer Ftw]

I think you fail a lot more than the game alex.
Of course every game has faults.

[Icy Magebane]

AlexXIV wrote...

Gamer Ftw wrote...

I believe that summed it up so tired of the countless posts on how bad the game is that wasn't even what the thread was about.

The point is there is no roleplay reason to take Bethany anywhere if Hawke is no mage and Bethany is a mage. Because if she stayed at home and acted as a normal person there is a higher chance the templars wouldn't know about it. And taking Bethany with you to protect her better is probably the most stupid answer of all. Because that would imply that Hawke is allmighty. But how does Hawke keep Bethany from being infected with the darkspawn plaque or be taken to the Circle? Right, Hawke can't because he/she is human and not god. Exposing Bethany to any sort of danger is just foolish and selfish. And that's where the game fails (again). Because it is never really addressed. This thread is about roleplay reasons? You should know of all people, you started it. Then discuss it or leave it to people who can.

It's not our fault that this game is selective in its recognition of mages.  I still think it's risky to leave her in Kirkwall, and what do you know?  My fears were substantiated.  Maybe if the game made perfect sense at all times you could call this a foolish decision, but as long as Anders can routinely identify himself as a mage in front of Templars, then you shouldn't criticize the decisions other players make.

[Rifneno]

I believe Bethany, like many mages, at one point states she'd rather be killed than made tranquil.  And as Anders warns about how overzealous the Kirkwall Circle is in regards to tranquility by comparison to Ferelden (if you ask him some optional questions upon meeting him) then I'd say you could go with the tranquility fear as the reason to bring her along.  Doesn't explain why she'd only go along on that one adventure and not the rest though...

[AlexXIV]

Icy Magebane wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Gamer Ftw wrote...

I believe that summed it up so tired of the countless posts on how bad the game is that wasn't even what the thread was about.

The point is there is no roleplay reason to take Bethany anywhere if Hawke is no mage and Bethany is a mage. Because if she stayed at home and acted as a normal person there is a higher chance the templars wouldn't know about it. And taking Bethany with you to protect her better is probably the most stupid answer of all. Because that would imply that Hawke is allmighty. But how does Hawke keep Bethany from being infected with the darkspawn plaque or be taken to the Circle? Right, Hawke can't because he/she is human and not god. Exposing Bethany to any sort of danger is just foolish and selfish. And that's where the game fails (again). Because it is never really addressed. This thread is about roleplay reasons? You should know of all people, you started it. Then discuss it or leave it to people who can.

It's not our fault that this game is selective in its recognition of mages.  I still think it's risky to leave her in Kirkwall, and what do you know?  My fears were substantiated.  Maybe if the game made perfect sense at all times you could call this a foolish decision, but as long as Anders can routinely identify himself as a mage in front of Templars, then you shouldn't criticize the decisions other players make.

I am not attacking people, I attack the game. I take Bethany everywhere like I said in my first post. Because I know nothing happens to her until the deep roads. But that's metagame information and I want to group with her as long as she is available. But from a role play point of view it still makes no sense. The deep roads are not much more dangerous as any fight for Bethany. She can always die, she can always be spotted by a templar everytime she uses magic. And she is an apostate. Anders is a Grey Warden. Maybe a rogue Grey Warden, but still. I just find it a silly argument to say Hawke takes his sister with him/her to protect her. Then Hawke would have to take his/her mother as well. Because Hawke is so good at protecting people who are with him/her.

[Gamer Ftw]

His mother isn't a mage so she isn't in that much danger if he leaves her.

[AlexXIV]

Rifneno wrote...

I believe Bethany, like many mages, at one point states she'd rather be killed than made tranquil.  And as Anders warns about how overzealous the Kirkwall Circle is in regards to tranquility by comparison to Ferelden (if you ask him some optional questions upon meeting him) then I'd say you could go with the tranquility fear as the reason to bring her along.  Doesn't explain why she'd only go along on that one adventure and not the rest though...

Not really. If she goes with Hawke and casts spells all around Kirkwall the chances of her being exposed as an apostate is much higher than when she spends her time only doing things that normal people do. Of course the idiot Gamlen let it slip first that she is a mage, and of all things to a band of mercs and/or smugglers.

[AlexXIV]

Gamer Ftw wrote...

His mother isn't a mage so she isn't in that much danger if he leaves her.

Have you played past Act2 yet? Just sayin'.

The point is taking family members into dangerous situations isn't the best way to protect them in the normal world. I mean if you were a cop and had a little sister, would you insist she comes with you to hunt criminals because if she stays home someone could rape her while you are away?

[Gamer Ftw]

are you mental?
but honestly I have no idea about sisters in real life I have 4 brothers.

Modifié par Gamer Ftw, 19 avril 2011 - 12:11 .

[AlexXIV]

Gamer Ftw wrote...

are you mental?

Sometimes.

[Bobad]

AlexXIV wrote...

Gamer Ftw wrote...

His mother isn't a mage so she isn't in that much danger if he leaves her.

Have you played past Act2 yet? Just sayin'.

The point is taking family members into dangerous situations isn't the best way to protect them in the normal world. I mean if you were a cop and had a little sister, would you insist she comes with you to hunt criminals because if she stays home someone could rape her while you are away?

Well given that analogy Bethany would also be a cop surely, it's not like she isn't combat proficient.

EDIT: Although if she is spec'd as a healer she might be more of a paramedic.

Modifié par Bobad, 19 avril 2011 - 12:14 .

[AlexXIV]

Bobad wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Gamer Ftw wrote...

His mother isn't a mage so she isn't in that much danger if he leaves her.

Have you played past Act2 yet? Just sayin'.

The point is taking family members into dangerous situations isn't the best way to protect them in the normal world. I mean if you were a cop and had a little sister, would you insist she comes with you to hunt criminals because if she stays home someone could rape her while you are away?

Well given that analogy Bethany would also be a cop surely, it's not like she isn't combat proficient.

Yeah but if it was your decision as an older brother/sister, would you rather take her with you in danger or leave her at home? I mean people are a bit too genre savvy maybe because the plot constantly seperates you from people just to kill them off, so I understand that people rather have those they want to survive close. But it isn't really a realistic point of view. In general people who stay at home are safer than those who go out to risk their life for some reason.

[AlexXIV]

Gamer Ftw wrote...
but honestly I have no idea about sisters in real life I have 4 brothers.

Well I have a younger sister. And I am a protective type.

[Gamer Ftw]

Yeah cause people never die at home.....

[AlexXIV]

Gamer Ftw wrote...

Yeah cause people never die at home.....

Actually most people die at home. Or in hospitals.

[Gamer Ftw]

that was sarcasm darn it they need a sarcasm emoticon.

[Icy Magebane]

@AlexXIV - How about Hawke considering his own safety? Maybe he figures it's dangerous to rely on a limited supply of potions when he won't have access to a store in the Deep Roads (Bodhan's stock is also finite). So maybe it would be nice to have one or more trained soldiers on hand who can also mend his wounds? Regardless of any family ties, Bethany is not some helpless girl. There's no reason to rule her out of combat situations just because she's Hawke's sister. Rather, being his sibling should not influence his decisions when he's deciding on a party.

Edit:  Also, if Hawke was worried about the Taint, then he wouldn't be going down there either.  You can't use the end results to dictate how he plans the expedition.

Modifié par Icy Magebane, 19 avril 2011 - 12:33 .

[caradoc2000]

It is bad judgement from Hawke to bring Bethany/Carver to the DR. It is notoriously dangerous place so taking both surviving Hawke siblings there is an unnecessary risk.

[Clangeddin86]

I think that part of this problem is caused by the fact that some parts of the game's story are rushed.
For example, the whole year when you work for smugglers or the mercenaries is the year where you start making yourself known around town by performing tasks here and there. And this part is poorly explained in a few seconds during a cut-scene between prologue and ACT I.
Because of this, you fail to realize that your sister has pretty much zero chance to stay undetected forever in town by the templars, that's because she's also known around as an apostate mage by someone, and that someone might as well talk (or be forced) to templars anytime.
The funny thing is that this is much better explained with Carver during ACT I start.

Another poorly explained (or detailed) part, is the condition of mages in the circle, you can't really understand if they are treated like slaves or if they are treated like "forced guests", in the end you never have a clear idea on what are the conditions of mages inside the circle because you never live that experience (Unlike in DA:O where you have an origin and a companion for that).

This literally doesn't give you any elements to balance the choice between "risk her life in the Deeproads, but hey she's a fighter, she's got the same chance of dying as anyone else. But if I leaver her behind, she could end up as a sort of a slave or even worse, a tranquil, in the circle. That would be a fate worse than death" or "I can't risk her life, the Deep Roads are too dangerous, sure, she may get in the circle, but how bad can it be?"

TLDR version: Imho the story was rushed and not well detailed from a RP point of view.

[Gamer Ftw]

Is there a reason every thread I make turns into a debate? 0.o

[Wulfram]

Gamer Ftw wrote...

Is there a reason every thread I make turns into a debate? 0.o

You make interesting threads?

[AlexXIV]

Point is, if Hawke dies, Leandra loses one more child. If both die, Leandra loses the last two children. Would you do that to your mother? I didn't take Bethany into the deep roads because I didn't want to do that to Hawke's mother. Even more when I knew that if I took Bethany I would return without her for sure. No matter if she is Grey Warden or dead.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 19 avril 2011 - 12:58 .