813 réponses à ce sujet

[Dormiglione]

Its really difficult to give an objective rating to DA2 when you played and loved DAO.

Dragon Age 2 from the view as an Action Adventure: 8.5/10
Dragon Age 2 from the view as a RPG: 6/10

[Jerrybnsn]

I never can understand why they call a third person character a roleplaying game. I never thought of Mass Effect as role playing. That had been always reserved for first person characters. I guess the confusion started when games started having acted out cutscenes with voice acting. Yet it was only the Japanese games that had the third person character, hence the jrpg.

[abaris]

Dormiglione wrote...

Its really difficult to give an objective rating to DA2 when you played and loved DAO.

Dragon Age 2 from the view as an Action Adventure: 8.5/10
Dragon Age 2 from the view as a RPG: 6/10

Problem is, it talks about itself as a RPG. Action Adventure was never part of the deal.

Jerrybnsn wrote...

I never can understand why they call a
third person character a roleplaying game. I never thought of Mass
Effect as role playing.

Well, it has choices, you can develop your kind of character by the choices you make and you're influencing your environment and the worlds at large. So yes, it is a RPG in my book. The RPG elements in ME are as strong as they are in DAO. Only the setting is different.

Modifié par abaris, 21 avril 2011 - 11:10 .

[SilentK]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

I played the demo, and said "WTH happened to my Dragon Age?!" So I started to do some research on Dragon Age and this site kept coming up a lot. I can definitly say after reading posts from this site that date back to last summer, Bioware was definitly aware that there would be a backlash from this game.

Anyhow, feeling gypped out of my Dragon Age sequel, I decided that it was this place that messed up my favorite game. So I'm adding my voice hoping that I'll be heard.

You haven't played the game?  Hmmm.... why not give it a try before deciding      There are some changes that I really like, some things that I miss. But I think it's easier do discuss those things after playing the game and being able to make comparisons. Me, I really love my Hawke having a voice and would be over the moon if they keept that in DA3. I think the combat is more fun in DA2 but I could live with a little less exploding/ *splash* -deaths.

Give the game a try, if you don't like it after playing then you can always draw on your own examples  

Modifié par SilentK, 21 avril 2011 - 11:11 .

[Jerrybnsn]

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

[abaris]

SilentK wrote...

Give the game a try, if you don't like it after playing then you can always draw on your own examples.

He would have to buy it first. And if you're already uncomfortable with the demo's presentation, the money's probably wasted.

I totally disliked the demo, but borrowed the whole game from a friend of mine. I admit, I was that put off by the changes, that I didn't even finish the borrowed game.

For me, it always boils down to the things I already noticed in the demo. The new combat system isn't my cup of tea, to put it mildly. Companion interaction only when the game wants, not when you want - that already put me off with Awakenings. No unmodded possibility to change companion's outifts.

That's already present in the demo and it doesn't go away with the complete game.

[SilentK]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

Well   =)   you will definetly hear about dogs in the game! There are several cute mentions from both Merrill and Anders. Avaline too. Hmm.... I loved the Alistair romance and in DA2 it's been a lot of Anders and Fenris. Gahh... for non-spoilers but they have some really sweet romance scenes          but I don't want to go all Anders- & Fenris- fangirl. That's what the companion-treads are for.

[Jerrybnsn]

SilentK wrote...

You haven't played the game?  Hmmm.... why not give it a try before deciding      There are some changes that I really like, some things that I miss. But I think it's easier do discuss those things after playing the game and being able to make comparisons. Me, I really love my Hawke having a voice and would be over the moon if they keept that in DA3. I think the combat is more fun in DA2 but I could live with a little less exploding/ *splash* -deaths.

Give the game a try, if you don't like it after playing then you can always draw on your own examples  

No.  I said I played the demo.  I said I read the reviews and the posts about this game from this place.  You can't say I don't know anything about this game.  So many posters on here wished that they didn't pre-ordered the game and waited for the reviews.  I waited for the reviews and the videos on the game.  No thanks.

[Zeratul20]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Let's all please remember to keep the name-calling and personal insults out of the discussion. We can disagree with each other without resorting to childish behaviour. Thank you.

Blimey. Everytime I see a Bioware tag, I think it might contain some interesting information. But it's just a warning not to cuss, most of the time.

Then again, there -is- quite a lot of vitriol to be found on these forums.

On topic: I'm only a couple of hours into the game so far, and...
- I really miss my tactical camera. Especially when the buggers spawn behind you to attack your mages/archers. Aiming AoE spells is difficult. I had heard you get a special camera when you need to aim those, but I can't seem to get that to work...? Does anybody know how to get that targeting cam?
- The difficulty is strange. Hard is really, really unforgiving (partially due to the lack of oversight and the sudden respawns), but set it to Normal and you'll blow through most enemies without much trouble.
- Combat is.. Strange. It's often excessively crowded, and sometimes a tad tedious. I guess that might still improve later on, though.

So, on that topic, I wouldn't mind to go back to Origins. Combat was more enjoyable. Then again, I haven't finished the game yet, so maybe I just need more time to get used to the controls.
Nothing to say story-wise, though. At least so far. It's a bit weird to "skip" some large parts of the story, and have people act all "buddy-buddy" afterwards, but still, that's not bad.

Modifié par Zeratul20, 21 avril 2011 - 11:41 .

[SilentK]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

SilentK wrote...

You haven't played the game?  Hmmm.... why not give it a try before deciding      There are some changes that I really like, some things that I miss. But I think it's easier do discuss those things after playing the game and being able to make comparisons. Me, I really love my Hawke having a voice and would be over the moon if they keept that in DA3. I think the combat is more fun in DA2 but I could live with a little less exploding/ *splash* -deaths.

Give the game a try, if you don't like it after playing then you can always draw on your own examples  

No.  I said I played the demo.  I said I read the reviews and the posts about this game from this place.  You can't say I don't know anything about this game.  So many posters on here wished that they didn't pre-ordered the game and waited for the reviews.  I waited for the reviews and the videos on the game.  No thanks.

Ohh yes    =)    I saw that you played the demo and didn't like it. There are just some cool things in game that wasn't shown in the demo. And you haven't seen a couple of favourites of mine. A personal q for Aveline and a really really funny q with Varric. No worries   =)  

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

I don't know about Darth Gaider's books but gamewise, I think he's not doing well if he doesn't feel expository is important for character depth. Probably he's playing Super Mario too much that all he can only see is straight linear side scrolling story. Where the heck he get such an idea "realm of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development"? He's exaggerating.

Modifié par Sacred_Fantasy, 21 avril 2011 - 11:52 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

Link? I'd like to read the full statement/interview.

[Slayer299]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

When did Gaider say this and do you have a link to that interview because I'd love to read it.

To what you said though, if that is Gaider's view on charachter interaction why have any at all? Just keep it to random, odd comments from the NPC's while travelling, cut out any NPC talks and you'll save any more useless resources of 'expository dialogue' <_<

[Galad22]

What op fears is funnily enough exactly what I am hoping will happen to DA franchise.

[GodWood]

Galad22 wrote...
What op fears is funnily enough exactly what I am hoping will happen to DA franchise.

Same.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

I think David Gaider is right to a certain degree, but he's using the idea of removing expository dialogue then linking that to removing all dialogue with companions outside of random banter and plot related conversations.

Expository dialogue (writing) and talking to your companions freely (gameplay) are not necessarily linked. You can have expository dialogue without talking to companions freely and you can talk companions freely but not have expository dialogue.

I will say that Dragon Age Origins had more of it than Dragon Age 2, but that wasn't a result of cutting out expository dialogue specifically, it was the result of cutting the amount of companion interaction altogether.

[AlexXIV]

I think the problem of RPGs is that it is half story half game. To get these things together without disappointing either the people who are more on the story side or those on the game side seems really difficult if not even impossible. Unless they make it a '2 in 1' aka making a game that is worth 2 other games and selling it as one. That's where it gets unprofitable.

[Galad22]

Slayer299 wrote...

When did Gaider say this and do you have a link to that interview because I'd love to read it.

To what you said though, if that is Gaider's view on charachter interaction why have any at all? Just keep it to random, odd comments from the NPC's while travelling, cut out any NPC talks and you'll save any more useless resources of 'expository dialogue' <_<

Here is link. He is just talking here in these forums.

social.bioware.com/forums/forum/1/topic/305/index/7154827/1

Page 1.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Melca36 wrote...

plokoon9619 wrote...

Dragon Age 2 would still be selling good if it just took everything from origins and improved on it. Look at Dead Space 2. It took everything from Dead Space 1 and improved on it for the single player game and is still selling good(despite the stupid multiplayer). It even got the same metacritic score.

Dragon Age 3 won't happen now because of the failure of DA2, but at least Bioware can go back to DA1 and release DLC or expansion packs. That of course won't happen either even though its the best decision they can make.

There will still be a Dragon Age 3 and hopefully will take what worked in DA:2 and add more of Origins style and create a game that appeals to all fan bases.

Trying to do that is part of what went wrong with DA2.  The last thing they need to do is to try to appeal to "all" fan bases. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

If that's where Gaider wants to go, then yes, it is time.

One of the issues with the companions in DA2 is that if you let yourself stop and think about it, most of them quickly turn into needy meat puppets, who will only have a conversation wtih you when they need your help or you have a gift for them.  

The camp conversations and roadside talks are part of what made the companions in DA:O seem so freaking alive.

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 21 avril 2011 - 12:57 .

[Persephone]

abaris wrote...

SilentK wrote...

Give the game a try, if you don't like it after playing then you can always draw on your own examples.

He would have to buy it first. And if you're already uncomfortable with the demo's presentation, the money's probably wasted.

Well, you can always RENT the game. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

Persephone wrote...

abaris wrote...

SilentK wrote...

Give the game a try, if you don't like it after playing then you can always draw on your own examples.

He would have to buy it first. And if you're already uncomfortable with the demo's presentation, the money's probably wasted.

Well, you can always RENT the game. 

In many areas, you can only rent console versions, and many people who game on a PC haven't bothered buying the latest version of one of the consoles. 

[Persephone]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

If that's where Gaider wants to go, then yes, it is time.

One of the issues with the companions in DA2 is that if you let yourself stop and think about it, most of them quickly turn into needy meat puppets, who will only have a conversation wtih you when they need your help or you have a gift for them.  

The camp conversations are part of what made the companions in DA:O seem to freaking alive.

I dunno. The second time around it felt like interrogating them about rather meaningless topics. (Wynne babbling about the Circle comes to mind. Or Leliana spamming me with stories rather than talking about herself.)

I do not believe that David Gaider could not and would not give use more companion interaction in the next game. It'll just be different from "Interrogation hour at the camp fire".

[AkiKishi]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Well, I guess it's not looking good for DA3. I just found this from the lead writer David Gaider in regards to lack of companion interaction in DAII.

"If you felt less connected to your followers, that's too bad. There could be many reasons for that, but if the requirement to someone feeling connected is having long, rambling conversations in the party camp... I can safely say that's unlikely to happen again. I could see front-loading the characters a bit more so players are more thoroughly introduced (as it was, a lot of the character interaction ended up in Act 2 quite by accident) but I have absolutely no intention of returning to the reams of expository dialogue as a replacement for character development anytime soon"

No more making Alistair squirm by talking about sex? No more conversations about cookies? how Fereldan smells like wet dog? are there Griffons in this story?

It's probably time to put this series to rest.

If that's where Gaider wants to go, then yes, it is time.

One of the issues with the companions in DA2 is that if you let yourself stop and think about it, most of them quickly turn into needy meat puppets, who will only have a conversation wtih you when they need your help or you have a gift for them.  

The camp conversations and roadside talks are part of what made the companions in DA:O seem so freaking alive.

Less conversation means more combat to pad out the play time.

With you on this, not only did it give you an introduction to various aspects of the world in an interesting manner (IE not a codex entry) but it also made the companions appear like much more rounded individuals rather than "quest givers".

[Sacred_Fantasy]

Hmm.. now I see bleak future with DA series. Perhaps BW really hate DA. But before they kill DA, they want to milk as much money as possible. Brent Knowles is right. BioWare is no longer the same company as before. There is no longer any passion for making games for gamer. It's all about fast food and quick money grabbing.

Modifié par Sacred_Fantasy, 21 avril 2011 - 01:19 .