131 réponses à ce sujet

[MarchWaltz]

Anyone have a picture of the derelict reaper core?

[IntrepidProdigy]

Sapienti wrote...

Strike a nerve? Nah pimp suit, a block of text on the internet only has as much emotion as the reader puts into it. Apparently you wanted me to be ragin but that isn't the case. Anyway, my post was addressing that your rationale in the first place. The way you posted it beforehand was simply flawed, (even going so far as to call it a plothole, which implies you don't know the definition of the term). 

I'll put it this way; you go outside because you want to see if the sun exists, you don't see the sun. The sun must be an urban legend - - Or maybe it was night time?

The whole "where is it then?" thought process just seems stupid to me if a person has the presence of mind to question his own logic. Anyway, I'm not on a high horse I'm afraid of high places. And if I jerk my knee my arthur-itis acts up. 

Ah ok, just making sure, chief. I detected a lot of butt-hurt and blind fan rage in your last post, so I just wanted to make sure you were clear on what I was saying. You must be getting the wrong impression if you think I was out to make you rage. Nobody's out to get you, so relax. Next time before you address a post that I made, read the entire thread first so you can get the entire context of where I currently stand.

My past argument wasn't "where is it then?" I was saying that since we were heading to the reapers second most important structure (if not the most important) which enables it to function, I would have thought that we would have run into some remnant/clue of its true core. The thing about the sun, it's out in the open and functions with the rest of the sky in order to give us daylight.

[Mir5]

It's still stupid as hell. Though I am beyond of caring, oh well.

[sponge56]

IntrepidProdigy wrote...

Sapienti wrote...

Strike a nerve? Nah pimp suit, a block of text on the internet only has as much emotion as the reader puts into it. Apparently you wanted me to be ragin but that isn't the case. Anyway, my post was addressing that your rationale in the first place. The way you posted it beforehand was simply flawed, (even going so far as to call it a plothole, which implies you don't know the definition of the term). 

I'll put it this way; you go outside because you want to see if the sun exists, you don't see the sun. The sun must be an urban legend - - Or maybe it was night time?

The whole "where is it then?" thought process just seems stupid to me if a person has the presence of mind to question his own logic. Anyway, I'm not on a high horse I'm afraid of high places. And if I jerk my knee my arthur-itis acts up. 

Ah ok, just making sure, chief. I detected a lot of butt-hurt and blind fan rage in your last post, so I just wanted to make sure you were clear on what I was saying. You must be getting the wrong impression if you think I was out to make you rage. Nobody's out to get you, so relax. Next time before you address a post that I made, read the entire thread first so you can get the entire context of where I currently stand.

My past argument wasn't "where is it then?" I was saying that since we were heading to the reapers second most important structure (if not the most important) which enables it to function, I would have thought that we would have run into some remnant/clue of its true core. The thing about the sun, it's out in the open and functions with the rest of the sky in order to give us daylight.

running into the core would kindof ruin the end completely though. If we knew the core was made out of reaped species then we know why the colonists have been abducted, which makes the end mission redundant. I can see where your coming from, but as it is a story it has to follow a narrative structure, and stories can't explain everything as they go along.

[Gill Kaiser]

Stinkface27 wrote...

Well, that's nice to know. Although I think a lot of people kinda figured as much. Terminator-Reaper didn't seem exactly aerodynamic.

You know that you don't need aerodynamism in space, right? And Mass Effect fields mean that it isn't particularly needed in atmosphere either.

[IntrepidProdigy]

sponge56 wrote...

running into the core would kindof ruin the end completely though. If we knew the core was made out of reaped species then we know why the colonists have been abducted, which makes the end mission redundant. I can see where your coming from, but as it is a story it has to follow a narrative structure, and stories can't explain everything as they go along.

True, I whole heartedly agree with the narrative aspect. I just wish it was handled a little better some how, but it's a minor complaint and doesn't put me off mass effect whatsoever. Otherwise I wouldn't be here.

[didymos1120]

MarchWaltz wrote...

Anyone have a picture of the derelict reaper core?

The Mass Effect core?  Why do you want one?  It's a completely different system from the core Walters was talking about.

[didymos1120]

Nyoka wrote...

What I don't understand is why the core of the reaper should have the physical figure of the species it's made out of.

There's no "should" about it.  They look that way because they're built that way. The H-R exterior was completely mechanical.  It's done deliberately.  As to why they do that...no way to know.  We're given no other information.  Right now, it's like trying to answer the "Why do Reapers reap?" question based off of ME1-only: they just do.

[88mphSlayer]

Mir5 wrote...

It's still stupid as hell. Though I am beyond of caring, oh well.

to me it just spells out how incredibly slow and probably un-essential a human reaper would be to the upcoming reaper invasion plans

if - judging by the arrival countdown - the reapers were coming anyways for a full-on invasion at the same time that shepard and squad were trying to bring down the collectors, and judging by the fact that it would've taken a serious amount of human collecting anyways to finish just the human reaper larvae or whatever it's called, who knows how long it would've taken to build an actual reaper juggernaught around said human reaper larvae

simply put by the time the reapers arrive and we either win or lose the reaper invasion, the collector issue would've been unconsequential anyways - if the reapers wiped out humanity and the galaxy was lost this thing still wouldn't have been used at all in the entire war, if we win then what's the point of this thing if it's so unbelievably far away from being complete... for that matter, what's harbinger's deal with the collectors only having one ship and one base? it pigeonholes the entire idea from the start, as if the reapers cared because this was obviously not a "plan B"

[88mphSlayer]

MACharlie1 wrote...

88mphSlayer wrote...

NoUserNameHere wrote...

88mphSlayer wrote...

the derelict reaper itself is a plot hole anyways - need proof of the reapers Shepard? also why is Cerberus using humans and not robots?

Any team sent to verify it would've just been indoctrinated or eaten by husks.  

so use a drone to take pictures/gather evidence

i find it difficult that we can land remote controlled probes on mars today but in 3 centuries we have to throw people into meat grinders to gather data

I can see why they sent an actual team of scientists and not robots. I would imagine it would be efficient to send the team to study the Reaper up close and personal. And, unlike sending a man to Mars, the trip to there isn't six months to a year and very costly. On top of the fact that they believed the Reaper was dead - no longer indoctrinating victims. But even a dead god can dream. 

lessons i learned from the 23rd century: 1) engineers who spend months attaching scaffolding and research equipment to a derelict reaper or build massive facilities on asteroids around a reaper artifact never come under any indoctrination or ill side effects, 2) everything is easier to get in the future - except robots, 3) despite being surrounded by hundreds of scientists and monitoring equipment, nobody in the future would ever find it odd that people start acting strange, furthermore nobody would ever feel the need to report said strange behavior to anybody outside the base, also distress beacons stopped existing because the writers demanded it, 4) scientists in the future don't believe in testing (except when it can be used to villianize somebody)

Modifié par 88mphSlayer, 25 avril 2011 - 12:45 .

[Powgow]

this explanation is irrelevant, mutant human termibabyreaper will remain a thorn in my eye.

Everytime I think about it, it feels like wading waist-deep through a sludge of concentrated stupid.

[esideras]

AH YES, "plot holes". We've dissmissed that claim.

[Aumata]

didymos1120 wrote...

 "Why do Reapers reap?"

Actually they reap because they think they are doing them a big favor by having them ascend the organic state and be imortal like them.  Basically they think it is a honor to be a reaper.  Blue and Orange morality.

[didymos1120]

Aumata wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

 "Why do Reapers reap?"

Actually they reap because they think they are doing them a big favor by having them ascend the organic state and be imortal like them.  Basically they think it is a honor to be a reaper.  Blue and Orange morality.

As I said: you can't answer that question going on ME1 ONLY.  You plucked that completely out of context.

[KnightofPhoenix]

didymos1120 wrote...
As I said: you can't answer that question going on ME1 ONLY.  You plucked that completely out of context.

There are some hints of Reaper "benevolence" even in ME1 though.

Sovereign: "We impose order on the chaos of organic evolution"

Saren: "The relation is symbiotic. Organic and machine entertwined, a union of flesh and steel. The strengths of both, the weaknesses of neither. I am a vision of the future Shepard, the evolution of all organic life. This is our destiny. Join Sovereign and experience a true rebirth."

Very small hints though, and they make more sense after ME2 (where we find out that Reapers are not machines). 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 25 avril 2011 - 04:45 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Stinkface27 wrote...

Well, that's nice to know. Although I think a lot of people kinda figured as much. Terminator-Reaper didn't seem exactly aerodynamic.

I, uh, wasn't aware the cuttlefish were exactly aerodynamic and sensible aircraft forms either.

[CptAwesomePhD]

Dave666 wrote...

CptAwesomePhD wrote...

Calling it now: Harbinger is made of Protheans.

Erm...nope. Pretty sure its said in the game that for whatever reason the Protheans were unsuitable for creating reapers with.

Yeah, turns out you're right. EDI says as much when you discover the Collectors are former Protheans in ME2. I stand corrected.

[Whammo]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Stinkface27 wrote...

Well, that's nice to know. Although I think a lot of people kinda figured as much. Terminator-Reaper didn't seem exactly aerodynamic.

I, uh, wasn't aware the cuttlefish were exactly aerodynamic and sensible aircraft forms either.

Do aerodynamics really matter in space, anyway?

[Dean_the_Young]

Whammo wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Stinkface27 wrote...

Well, that's nice to know. Although I think a lot of people kinda figured as much. Terminator-Reaper didn't seem exactly aerodynamic.

I, uh, wasn't aware the cuttlefish were exactly aerodynamic and sensible aircraft forms either.

Do aerodynamics really matter in space, anyway?

Not at all. Which really leads back to 'why is Human form unreasonable, but squid is 'sensible'?

[Stinkface27]

Re: Aerodynamics - you're right, fair enough I won't profess to know a thing about space travel. It just always seemed unlikely to me that the human-reaper would be flying around in space when the rest of everything you see is completely unlike it, and for the most part in-line with what you would expect to see. Large freight-type ships, huge city-type ships, sleek fighter-type ships - etc.

[Dean_the_Young]

Stinkface27 wrote...

Re: Aerodynamics - you're right, fair enough I won't profess to know a thing about space travel. It just always seemed unlikely to me that the human-reaper would be flying around in space when the rest of everything you see is completely unlike it, and for the most part in-line with what you would expect to see. Large freight-type ships, huge city-type ships, sleek fighter-type ships - etc.

It wouldn't have to fly superman-style. It could do the moon walk as far as sensibility cares. Or it could have a jet back, or fly feet first, or just have hands down the body as it flies head first.

Once you got to the point of 'hey, giant cuttlefish are more sensible than a human space ship', you're arguing more about which clown at a circus is more ridiculous. Neither is a 'sensible' design pattern.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 25 avril 2011 - 03:36 .

[Anacronian Stryx]

Stinkface27 wrote...

Re: Aerodynamics - you're right, fair enough I won't profess to know a thing about space travel. It just always seemed unlikely to me that the human-reaper would be flying around in space when the rest of everything you see is completely unlike it, and for the most part in-line with what you would expect to see. Large freight-type ships, huge city-type ships, sleek fighter-type ships - etc.

To be fair the reapers cuttlefish shape do not seem to confess to any of those "norms" you mention here either.

Edit : Ninja'd by the young

Modifié par Anacronian Stryx, 25 avril 2011 - 03:32 .

[jamesp81]

88mphSlayer wrote...

Mir5 wrote...

It's still stupid as hell. Though I am beyond of caring, oh well.

to me it just spells out how incredibly slow and probably un-essential a human reaper would be to the upcoming reaper invasion plans

if - judging by the arrival countdown - the reapers were coming anyways for a full-on invasion at the same time that shepard and squad were trying to bring down the collectors, and judging by the fact that it would've taken a serious amount of human collecting anyways to finish just the human reaper larvae or whatever it's called, who knows how long it would've taken to build an actual reaper juggernaught around said human reaper larvae

simply put by the time the reapers arrive and we either win or lose the reaper invasion, the collector issue would've been unconsequential anyways - if the reapers wiped out humanity and the galaxy was lost this thing still wouldn't have been used at all in the entire war, if we win then what's the point of this thing if it's so unbelievably far away from being complete... for that matter, what's harbinger's deal with the collectors only having one ship and one base? it pigeonholes the entire idea from the start, as if the reapers cared because this was obviously not a "plan B"

I think the idea was that the result of the invasion for the Reapers would be a new Reaper....a human reaper.  Their invasions are at least partially about their version of reproduction anyway.

I figure after they destroyed all opposition, they'd just round up everyone on Earth and send them to the collector base to complete the human reaper.

[jamesp81]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Stinkface27 wrote...

Well, that's nice to know. Although I think a lot of people kinda figured as much. Terminator-Reaper didn't seem exactly aerodynamic.

I, uh, wasn't aware the cuttlefish were exactly aerodynamic and sensible aircraft forms either.

Actually, they are somewhat.  Generally, anything that's hydrodynamic will also be fairly aerodynamic since both water and air are fluids.

Not that it matters what their shape is.  They have enormous mass effect cores that make aerodynamic considerations when landing on a planet completely irrelevant.  Aerodynamics in space are also irrelevant.

I think the reason ships like the Normandy and fighter craft obviously are aerodynamic is because they are built to handle both atmospheric AND space flight.

Modifié par jamesp81, 25 avril 2011 - 05:14 .

[bald man in a boat]

^I'd like to add that there's nothing in space to cause any drag anyways.^