698 réponses à ce sujet

[Dean_the_Young]

I wouldn't. He's too vain (in terms of wanting others to appreciate his intellect and ethics), as well as too emotional. Brilliant, sure, but better as a team player than a stand-alone. Similar reason I wouldn't want Jacob as a Spectre: better as a team player.


I'll just throw out that I disagree with some of the common assumptions being thrown around about the requirements of a Spectre: specifically, Spectres don't need diplomatic skills, nor do they need super-tactical gun skills. Spectres have only one commonality, and that's their ability to get results. How they get results need not be through firepower or diplomacy.

[Almostfaceman]

The VS is going to make a fine Spectre.

[XavierL]

[quote]ncvbrp wrote...

[quote]XavierL wrote...


[quote]XavierL wrote...



By that logic, every Spec-ops veteran of every race is worthy of becoming a Spectre. Every Salarian in the STG member, every human in Spec-ops, every Krogan battlemaster/warlord, and every Asari commando only needs to put a few years in their respective organization and they are good enough to be a Spectre. 
No. Many of you people are throwing the Spectre status around very loosely. It is meant for the exceptional. No, they don't have to super effing amazing at every little thing, but a Spectre has to be someone special. [/quote]

Does saving the galaxy from complete extinction count as exceptional?

[/quote]
They did no such thing. Yes, they were on the team, but they were in the background while Shepard did all the work. That's like saying (I've said this before) a 2nd string lineman is worthy of an MVP ring because they were on the team that won the super bowl. 


[/quote]
They were on the team, so that's already something valuable, and 2 years passed, I'm sure they went on important missions and, if they already hadn't, earned the Spectre title.[/quote]


Going on a few top-secret missions isn't enough. They lack the charisma and leadership abilities. Ash is a pawn. A really well trained and skilled pawn, but she is in no way on the level of Garrus, Miranda or any of the people already granted Spectre status. 

Ash is a great soldier. I am not denying that. She is spec-ops level for sure. But can she do what Shepard did? Can she do what Saren did? What about Vasir? Can she do what Garrus did on Omega? 

[gorrillasnake]

i think thats the case..i was looking at my gameinformer mag....and i was looking at ashleys suit and there is a logo on her left breast....its kind of blurry

[XavierL]

gorrillasnake wrote...

i think thats the case..i was looking at my gameinformer mag....and i was looking at ashleys suit and there is a logo on her left breast....its kind of blurry

Screw the logo. I was just looking at the breast. 

[100k]

I think that we got off the point slightly though.

Do I feel that either VSs should be Spectres? In all honesty, no. Not one bit.

Ashley is a great character. She's also a b!tch. Easily angered, and very emotional, she doesn't have the same level of control as Shepard, Miranda, or Garrus; the kind of control that allows Shepard to make hard decisions (though I suppose that's not really an argument in a thread about an RPG).

[ExtremeOne]

Almostfaceman wrote...

The VS is going to make a fine Spectre.

  


Oh please you VS fans got your wish those 2 pieces of crap are in 3 as well being squad mates . what more do you want .   

[gorrillasnake]

LMFAO!! me too...........

XavierL wrote...

gorrillasnake wrote...

i think thats the case..i was looking at my gameinformer mag....and i was looking at ashleys suit and there is a logo on her left breast....its kind of blurry

Screw the logo. I was just looking at the breast. 

[Almostfaceman]

XavierL wrote...

Going on a few top-secret missions isn't enough. They lack the charisma and leadership abilities. Ash is a pawn. A really well trained and skilled pawn, but she is in no way on the level of Garrus, Miranda or any of the people already granted Spectre status.

Nope, you're wrong.

Ash is a great soldier. I am not denying that. She is spec-ops level for sure. But can she do what Shepard did?

Of course she can't, that's sorta the point.  Shep is a one-of-a-kind.

Can she do what Saren did? What about Vasir? Can she do what Garrus did on Omega? 

Yup, she can.

[Almostfaceman]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

The VS is going to make a fine Spectre.

  


Oh please you VS fans got your wish those 2 pieces of crap are in 3 as well being squad mates . what more do you want .   

The VS is going to make a fine Spectre.

[Dante Angelo]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

The VS is going to make a fine Spectre.

  


Oh please you VS fans got your wish those 2 pieces of crap are in 3 as well being squad mates . what more do you want .   

In every post that you have made that I've read you seem like your angry at the world (and Bioware).

[CulturalGeekGirl]

XavierL wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...


And if Mordin were 10 years younger, I'd make him a Spectre in a heartbeat.

Mordin as a Spectre...hmm...sorry, I can't see it. He's not well rounded enough. He has the skill with a gun and a few good tech abilities, but not worthy of becoming a Spectre. He's STG material for sure. Even Leauge of One quality, but not Spectre. He is also lacking in other attributes. He doesn't have the leadership traits that 100k talked about. He's a team player for sure, and he can get things done, but not on the level of Vasir, Shepard or Saren. 

I wonder if there are Salarian Spectres then, based on what you're implying would be required of one. I'm not trying to be sarcastic there... it just seems to me that the "best person for the job" by Salarian standards is different than almost any other race. So far we've just seen Spectres of the "I'm a cop and I'm in your FACE" variety, but I'd imagine there are other kinds. Maybe I'm wrong.

If you're good enough to be League of One, you're good enough to be a Spectre in my book, since the Spectres were partially based on the League of One/STG. Now, I'm not sure what rules govern Spectres, but I don't think you have to show up everywhere and say "Hey Guys! Spectre here! What's goin' on in this thread?" In my mind one of the benefits of a Mordin-style spectre is that people wouldn't suspect he was one until it was too late. "Turians, Krogans, Vorcha, all obvious threats... never see me coming" 

I also think Mordin does have proven leadership ability. His recruitment mission shows that he is capable of instilling great loyalty in those around him. Running a clinic isn't the same as running a starship, but it might actually be slightly more difficult. Then again, he might be firmly in the "would refuse post if offered" category, with Wrex.

[Zen]

What's with the hostility dudes?

Anyway..What exactly were they up to in those two years? I forget exactly what the conversations consisted of, I always skip it because I can only take their disingenuous accusations once. Lol.

Like I said though, I hope Kaiden got the implants, he doesn't stand a chance otherwise.

[jeweledleah]

lets see. what did Saren do. ally himself with the reapers and get indoctrinated, because he didn't think we could possibly win against them. what did Garrus do. managed to make enemies of pretty much every major Mercenary group in Terminus system and would have died if not for Shepard's timely arrival. What did Vasir do? became Shadow broker's puppet for occasional extra titbit of information and blew up several stories worth of innocent civilians just to attempt and kill ONE shadow broker enemy.

What did Ashley do. form the start - she held off against overwhelming number of Geth, despite not knowing much about them beyond basic high school info. Managed to get a ton of commendation and promoted several times despite her entire family being black listed and eventualy assigned to the Normandy.

what did Kaidan do? come out of the BAAt training a functional human being, one of the few rare stable l2 biotics, multiple commendations, only one rank bellow Shepard despite questionable biotic status (L2's are not exactly trusted by majority of people), personally selected by Anderson (just like Shepard) to serve on a Normandy as a head of Marine detachment.

what did both/either one of them do? Assisted Shepard, the first human spectre through entirety of hunt for Saren. worked for Anderson personally, after the fall of Saren and subsequent death of Shepard, send on variety of special classified assigenemtns - so classified that even shadow broker or TIM cannot get the exact info on what they were doing, but considering that among other things they were sent to work, on their own, into terminus systems as alliance representatives? I'd say they are plenty qualified and capable of leadership

Not to mention they are the only characters who stood their damn ground against the steamroller Shepard and stuck to their values, unlike everyone else who just rolled over.

Edited to add - VS fans got some information a partial confirmation of the characters role in third game after years and years of silence and no resolution to their storylines, unlike oh, every other character in a game.  We didn't exactly get special treatment her, we're finaly getting something resembling equal treatement.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 22 avril 2011 - 01:04 .

[XavierL]

Almostfaceman wrote...

XavierL wrote...

Going on a few top-secret missions isn't enough. They lack the charisma and leadership abilities. Ash is a pawn. A really well trained and skilled pawn, but she is in no way on the level of Garrus, Miranda or any of the people already granted Spectre status.

Nope, you're wrong.

Ash is a great soldier. I am not denying that. She is spec-ops level for sure. But can she do what Shepard did?

Of course she can't, that's sorta the point.  Shep is a one-of-a-kind.

Can she do what Saren did? What about Vasir? Can she do what Garrus did on Omega? 

Yup, she can.

She has the skills to do what Garrus did, yes, but not the emotional restraint, she lacks the intellectual capabilities, and she's too much of a xenophobe to even do half the things a Spectre has to do. She says blatenly that she doesn't like aliens, and the only reason she worked with them was because Shepard was in command. A xenophobe as a Spectre? A xenophobe evaluated by the Council and then sent to do work on worlds that may not have a single human living on them? No. She's a pawn. That's it. A really well skilled pawn. Any real Spectre would laugh her out of the room if they heard her say that she was Spectre material. 

[gorrillasnake]

he prob has the ps3 version...so he hasnt played thru the original 
he has less appresiation for the Vs(ashley)

Dante Angelo wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

The VS is going to make a fine Spectre.

  


Oh please you VS fans got your wish those 2 pieces of crap are in 3 as well being squad mates . what more do you want .   

In every post that you have made that I've read you seem like your angry at the world (and Bioware).

[Almostfaceman]

XavierL wrote...

She has the skills to do what Garrus did, yes, but not the emotional restraint, she lacks the intellectual capabilities, and she's too much of a xenophobe to even do half the things a Spectre has to do. She says blatenly that she doesn't like aliens, and the only reason she worked with them was because Shepard was in command. A xenophobe as a Spectre? A xenophobe evaluated by the Council and then sent to do work on worlds that may not have a single human living on them? No. She's a pawn. That's it. A really well skilled pawn. Any real Spectre would laugh her out of the room if they heard her say that she was Spectre material. 

Wrong.

Again.

[didymos1120]

MajesticJazz wrote...

Still waiting for someone to show where it has been firmed that the VS is a Spectre in ME3....

Keep waiting.  There is no reliable confirmation. For an unreliable one, see the latest issue of PS3M.  Most of us at this point are just discussing the premise of them being one, because, well, why not?

Modifié par didymos1120, 22 avril 2011 - 01:09 .

[NKKKK]

Spectres are not soldiers first, but people who get results by any means. Diplomats or influence brokers can just as well qualify.

You're both wrong and right, they may not need to be "soldiers" but they do have to have combat capabilities akin to Special Forces.

Which is why all Specters are Warriors,

[XavierL]

Almostfaceman wrote...

XavierL wrote...

She has the skills to do what Garrus did, yes, but not the emotional restraint, she lacks the intellectual capabilities, and she's too much of a xenophobe to even do half the things a Spectre has to do. She says blatenly that she doesn't like aliens, and the only reason she worked with them was because Shepard was in command. A xenophobe as a Spectre? A xenophobe evaluated by the Council and then sent to do work on worlds that may not have a single human living on them? No. She's a pawn. That's it. A really well skilled pawn. Any real Spectre would laugh her out of the room if they heard her say that she was Spectre material. 

Wrong.

Again.

How am I wrong? Did I misquote her? Is she not a xenophobe? She can use a gun really well. She is a real threat on the battle field, but that's it. Only i the battle field. A Spectre has to be able to get things done outside of the battlefield as well. Ash would only be able to put a team together if she slept with every member first. And, they would have to be human. That or threatened to kill them, and even then, that's not how you get a good team together. She can't talk her way out of any situation multi-race without putting her foot in her mouth. 

[100k]

XavierL wrote...
She has the skills to do what Garrus did, yes, but not the emotional restraint, she lacks the intellectual capabilities, and she's too much of a xenophobe to even do half the things a Spectre has to do. She says blatenly that she doesn't like aliens, and the only reason she worked with them was because Shepard was in command. A xenophobe as a Spectre? A xenophobe evaluated by the Council and then sent to do work on worlds that may not have a single human living on them? No. She's a pawn. That's it. A really well skilled pawn. Any real Spectre would laugh her out of the room if they heard her say that she was Spectre material. 

Pretty much how I feel. It should be noted that Saren was a xenophobe too, but he was also a war hero. What did Ashley achieve?

[M4N0FF4I7H]

XavierL wrote...

Almostfaceman wrote...

XavierL wrote...

Going on a few top-secret missions isn't enough. They lack the charisma and leadership abilities. Ash is a pawn. A really well trained and skilled pawn, but she is in no way on the level of Garrus, Miranda or any of the people already granted Spectre status.

Nope, you're wrong.

Ash is a great soldier. I am not denying that. She is spec-ops level for sure. But can she do what Shepard did?

Of course she can't, that's sorta the point.  Shep is a one-of-a-kind.

Can she do what Saren did? What about Vasir? Can she do what Garrus did on Omega? 

Yup, she can.

She has the skills to do what Garrus did, yes, but not the emotional restraint, she lacks the intellectual capabilities, and she's too much of a xenophobe to even do half the things a Spectre has to do. She says blatenly that she doesn't like aliens, and the only reason she worked with them was because Shepard was in command. A xenophobe as a Spectre? A xenophobe evaluated by the Council and then sent to do work on worlds that may not have a single human living on them? No. She's a pawn. That's it. A really well skilled pawn. Any real Spectre would laugh her out of the room if they heard her say that she was Spectre material. 

You seem like a tool the way you phrase things here,have you ever played mass effect? You seem to be using your personal dislike for the character to back up your assumptions.Ashley isn't a xenophobe no matter how many times you repeat the word and worst of all your saying that someone who doesn't like aliens can't be a spectre?
Seriously did you not play the first game? You know that crazy human hating spectre who pretty much tried to kill you all throughout the game?
Im guessing its either you dislike the VS or your ego can't handle another individual being a spectre.....

[gorrillasnake]

she survived in eden prime..and her whole squad was killed....a sole survivor ...that got shepaloo to become a spectre

100k wrote...

XavierL wrote...
She has the skills to do what Garrus did, yes, but not the emotional restraint, she lacks the intellectual capabilities, and she's too much of a xenophobe to even do half the things a Spectre has to do. She says blatenly that she doesn't like aliens, and the only reason she worked with them was because Shepard was in command. A xenophobe as a Spectre? A xenophobe evaluated by the Council and then sent to do work on worlds that may not have a single human living on them? No. She's a pawn. That's it. A really well skilled pawn. Any real Spectre would laugh her out of the room if they heard her say that she was Spectre material. 

Pretty much how I feel. It should be noted that Saren was a xenophobe too, but he was also a war hero. What did Ashley achieve?

Modifié par gorrillasnake, 22 avril 2011 - 01:14 .

[XavierL]

100k wrote...


Pretty much how I feel. It should be noted that Saren was a xenophobe too, but he was also a war hero. What did Ashley achieve?

Saren wasn't a xenophobe. He was working with the Krogan. Saren just hated humans. There's a difference with hating one race and hating all but your own. 

Ashley is a war-hero as well, but she she didn't lead a group. She only followed orders. She never had to think about anything other than how to shoot an enemy. 

[lyssalu]

jeweledleah wrote...

lets see. what did Saren do. ally himself with the reapers and get indoctrinated, because he didn't think we could possibly win against them. what did Garrus do. managed to make enemies of pretty much every major Mercenary group in Terminus system and would have died if not for Shepard's timely arrival. What did Vasir do? became Shadow broker's puppet for occasional extra titbit of information and blew up several stories worth of innocent civilians just to attempt and kill ONE shadow broker enemy.

What did Ashley do. form the start - she held off against overwhelming number of Geth, despite not knowing much about them beyond basic high school info. Managed to get a ton of commendation and promoted several times despite her entire family being black listed and eventualy assigned to the Normandy.

what did Kaidan do? come out of the BAAt training a functional human being, one of the few rare stable l2 biotics, multiple commendations, only one rank bellow Shepard despite questionable biotic status (L2's are not exactly trusted by majority of people), personally selected by Anderson (just like Shepard) to serve on a Normandy as a head of Marine detachment.

what did both/either one of them do? Assisted Shepard, the first human spectre through entirety of hunt for Saren. worked for Anderson personally, after the fall of Saren and subsequent death of Shepard, send on variety of special classified assigenemtns - so classified that even shadow broker or TIM cannot get the exact info on what they were doing, but considering that among other things they were sent to work, on their own, into terminus systems as alliance representatives? I'd say they are plenty qualified and capable of leadership

Not to mention they are the only characters who stood their damn ground against the steamroller Shepard and stuck to their values, unlike everyone else who just rolled over.

Edited to add - VS fans got some information a partial confirmation of the characters role in third game after years and years of silence and no resolution to their storylines, unlike oh, every other character in a game.  We didn't exactly get special treatment her, we're finaly getting something resembling equal treatement.

this.

shepard didn't do anything more spectacular than they did when (s)he was being considered for spectre training.