380 réponses à ce sujet

[didymos1120]

MGIII wrote...

In ME2, the VS was nothing to write home about. They were sent out to some nowhere colony on a non-critical mission to install some turrets, which was in part manipulated by Cerberus just to draw the Collectors out.

Um, no: they were sent solo into the Terminus, which is usually avoided, under the pretense of a non-critical mission to install some turrets.  They were actually there to investigate Cerberus and its possible involvement in the abductions.

[Elite Midget]

ANdrewJ wrote...

Of cource she is a spectre, alliace need a loyal pawn to please politics and keep Anderson in the councilors.
You still have authorities on earth that needed to be pleased to keep them in LINE.

Although it is formal, paper "replacement" of us, and promoting loyal to anderson agent to carry out orders and assignments.

Ashley is:
space n.a.z.i. that realy to kill aliens in a heartbeat, loyal to the alliance dog and her breasts got promoted too (and perhaps promoting still), have nice combat skills, not to mention Saren chase.

Overall nice candidate, but not perfect one - he is some kind of Saren - hates everything but his kind, ready to blow up refineries with aliens with even less thinking that Saren do.
("Some asari mumbo-jumbo", "should we let aliens walk everywhere", "stuck in heavy armor with big gun (and get raped by AP round/rocket)")

There's so much wrong with this post I don't even know where to start. You're such an ignorant and naive man... I hope you never attempt procreation because you would be giving the bird to the next generation if you somehow prove successful. A slim chance I might add but a chance I would prefer not to be taken at all.

Your lineage should die with you along with your ignorance.

[Praetor Knight]

Bluko wrote...

Manic Sheep wrote...

What’s with all this not on "Shepards level” crap? How arrogant.

Wait you don't know?

Shepard is one of the few fighters in the galaxy with a power level...



OVER 9000!!!

That pic smells of Vegeta

And that brings a craving for a taste of Vegemite for some odd reason

[GodWood]

MGIII wrote...

GodWood wrote...

MGIII wrote...
Liara: Catalyst to uncovering the location of the Conduit, most accomplished biotic in party, rescues Shep's body from the SB and Collectors, becomes accomplished information broker herself in a short time, takes out Shadow Broker and assumes that position.

What are you basing this on?
I'd figure Jack, Samara and Morinth are all superior biotics.

Relative to ME characters (I mean, I thought it was obvious considering Liara isn't a squadmate in ME2).

kk

And if you really want to get into it, gameplay wise, Liara's biotics >>> any other squadmember.

Indeed but gameplay power =/= actual power.

[MGIII]

didymos1120 wrote...

MGIII wrote...

In ME2, the VS was nothing to write home about. They were sent out to some nowhere colony on a non-critical mission to install some turrets, which was in part manipulated by Cerberus just to draw the Collectors out.

Um, no: they were sent solo into the Terminus, which is usually avoided, under the pretense of a non-critical mission to install some turrets.  They were actually there to investigate Cerberus and its possible involvement in the abductions.

You're right. Slightly alters my point. They still did nothing.

Indeed but gameplay power =/= actual power.

True enough, but they both have impressive feats in cutscenes. How else would we even gauge who's superior?

Modifié par MGIII, 23 avril 2011 - 09:41 .

[Manic Sheep]

MGIII wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

MGIII wrote...

In ME2, the VS was nothing to write home about. They were sent out to some nowhere colony on a non-critical mission to install some turrets, which was in part manipulated by Cerberus just to draw the Collectors out.

Um, no: they were sent solo into the Terminus, which is usually avoided, under the pretense of a non-critical mission to install some turrets. They were actually there to investigate Cerberus and its possible involvement in the abductions.

You're right. Slightly alters my point. They still did nothing.

The only reason shepard could do anything was because he/she had special armour protecting him/her from the collector probes. Without that armour Shepard would have been screwed too.

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 23 avril 2011 - 09:44 .

[didymos1120]

MGIII wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

MGIII wrote...

In ME2, the VS was nothing to write home about. They were sent out to some nowhere colony on a non-critical mission to install some turrets, which was in part manipulated by Cerberus just to draw the Collectors out.

Um, no: they were sent solo into the Terminus, which is usually avoided, under the pretense of a non-critical mission to install some turrets.  They were actually there to investigate Cerberus and its possible involvement in the abductions.

You're right. Slightly alters my point. They still did nothing.

Neither did Nihlus, unless you consider getting shot in the head "something".  We should posthumously revoke his Spectre status.  He clearly sucked.

[MGIII]

Manic Sheep wrote...

MGIII wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

MGIII wrote...

In ME2, the VS was nothing to write home about. They were sent out to some nowhere colony on a non-critical mission to install some turrets, which was in part manipulated by Cerberus just to draw the Collectors out.

Um, no: they were sent solo into the Terminus, which is usually avoided, under the pretense of a non-critical mission to install some turrets. They were actually there to investigate Cerberus and its possible involvement in the abductions.

You're right. Slightly alters my point. They still did nothing.

The only reason sheaprd could do anything was because he/she had special armour protecting him/her from the collector probes. Without that armour Shepard would have been screwed too.

All true. How they came out of nowhere inexplicably to talk to Shepard is still beyond me. It's the problem of debating about topics that just weren't revealed in the story. However, as it's known to us, the player, the only thing on the VS resume that puts them into Spectre consideration territory is helping Shepard on his mission.

Might as well make the whole party Spectres if that's all it takes.

Neither did Nihlus, unless you consider getting shot in the head
"something".  We should posthumously revoke his Spectre status.  He
clearly sucked.

Not a logical comparison but okay. Nihlus died in the line of duty. He had long since proven himself Spectre-worthy. Different situations. Not even kind-of-similar situations.

This debate is losing focus. I started making rebuttals for why the VS shouldn't be a Spectre, but that's not my real stance at all. Just that Shepard > VS. Goes without saying, but eh.

Modifié par MGIII, 23 avril 2011 - 09:51 .

[Ahriman]

MGIII wrote...
You're right. Slightly alters my point. They still did nothing.

Emm, they did. Or fact that they discovered who is really capturing colonists and role of Cerberus in all that is nothing?

[Timon44]

Thanks a lot for the massive spoiler in the title. In the SPOILER-FREE forum...

Modifié par Timon44, 23 avril 2011 - 09:56 .

[MGIII]

Wizz wrote...

MGIII wrote...
You're right. Slightly alters my point. They still did nothing.

Emm, they did. Or fact that they discovered who is really capturing colonists and role of Cerberus in all that is nothing?

Them discovering who's really abducting people out in the Terminus systems is irrelevant. You could go to the Citadel and tell the Council/Anderson yourself if you feel like it. Come on now.

[Ahriman]

MGIII wrote...
Them discovering who's really abducting people out in the Terminus systems is irrelevant. You could go to the Citadel and tell the Council/Anderson yourself if you feel like it. Come on now.

Shepard was working for a terrorist organisation. Is that so difficult to imagine that Council/Anderson didn't trust Shepard?

[didymos1120]

MGIII wrote...

Neither did Nihlus, unless you consider getting shot in the head "something".  We should posthumously revoke his Spectre status.  He clearly sucked.

Not a logical comparison but okay.

The comparison is in regards to circumstances: in both cases, they were out of the person's control.  What matters is that both were trusted to deal with a potentially tricky and important situation.  And the Horizon situation was potentially much trickier due to the possible political fallout of operating in the Terminus and definitely more important at the time the assignment was given.

[didymos1120]

MGIII wrote...

Them discovering who's really abducting people out in the Terminus systems is irrelevant. You could go to the Citadel and tell the Council/Anderson yourself if you feel like it. Come on now.

And Anderson wanted confirmation of that in addition to discovering whether or not Cerberus was involved too.  They got him answers for both.

Modifié par didymos1120, 23 avril 2011 - 10:01 .

[MGIII]

Wizz wrote...

MGIII wrote...
Them discovering who's really abducting people out in the Terminus systems is irrelevant. You could go to the Citadel and tell the Council/Anderson yourself if you feel like it. Come on now.

Shepard was working for a terrorist organisation. Is that so difficult to imagine that Council/Anderson didn't trust Shepard?

Yeah. Given that it makes no sense whatsoever for said organization with a radical pro-human agenda to be abducting humans, whereas the mysterious enigmatic Collectors who are well known for their, er, collecting make a convincing fit considering they have the technology, ship and history for such an endeavor.

But the Council is nothing if not dangerously stupid, so I concede this point to you on all accounts.

The comparison is in regards to circumstances:
in both cases, they were out of the person's control.  What matters is
that both were trusted to deal with a potentially tricky and important
situation.  And the Horizon situation was potentially much trickier due to the possible political fallout of operating in the Terminus and definitely more important at the time the assignment was given.

Anderson trusts the VS? You don't say.

Modifié par MGIII, 23 avril 2011 - 10:10 .

[Manic Sheep]

MGIII wrote...
All true. How they came out of nowhere inexplicably to talk to Shepard is still beyond me. It's the problem of debating about topics that just weren't revealed in the story. However, as it's known to us, the player, the only thing on the VS resume that puts them into Spectre consideration territory is helping Shepard on his mission.

Might as well make the whole party Spectres if that's all it takes.

What did shapard have when shepard became a spectre in ME1? Excellent record and one notable event that made his/her career and got him/her noticed. Both the VS have excellent records. Kaidan is a N7, is one of the few stable and powerful L2 biotics and has dozens of special commendations in his file. Ashley has a spotless record and great test results and it’s implied the only reason she wasn’t promoted was family issues. They then go on to aid Sheprad in taking down Saren and saving the citadel and they contribute just as much as any other squadmate. Also once again, two year gap and we have no idea what they have been up too in that time or how they have developed/improved.

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 23 avril 2011 - 10:13 .

[MGIII]

Manic Sheep wrote...

What did shapard have when shepard became a spectre in ME1? Excellent record and one notable event that made his/her career and got him/her noticed. Both the VS have excellent records. Kaidan is a N7, is one of the few stable and powerful L2 biotics and has dozens of special commendations in his file. Ashley has a spotless record and great test results and it’s implied the only reason she wasn’t promoted was family issues. They then go on to aid Sheprad in taking down Saren and saving the citadel and they contribute just as much as any other squadmate. Also once again, two year gap and we have no idea what they have been up too in that time or how they have developed/improved.

I've referenced this on multiple occasions.

[jeweledleah]

MGIII wrote...

Yeah. Given that it makes no sense whatsoever for said organization with a radical pro-human agenda to be abducting humans, whereas the mysterious enigmatic Collectors who are well known for their, er, collecting make a convincing fit considering they have the technology, ship and history for such an endeavor.

most residents of council space and actualy, most residents of terminus systems have never seen collectors and majority regard them as a myth... a boogyman if you please.

Cerberus however, has been experimenitng on humans for decades in a variety of ways, some of which we discover in ME1.  when it comes to dissapearing remote colonies and certain rumors floating about, who are you going to suspect first?  mythological species or an Organization with a history of unscrupulous experiments.

as for the original topic.  whether VS becomes a spectre or not is still speculation.  however, they are about as qualified for it, even if they haven't improved between ME1 and ME2 as Shepard was when Shepard was made a spectre.  and at the very least we know that both Ash and Kaidan were promoted and had their records clasified.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 23 avril 2011 - 10:22 .

[snfonseka]

MGIII wrote...

Wizz wrote...

MGIII wrote...
You're right. Slightly alters my point. They still did nothing.

Emm, they did. Or fact that they discovered who is really capturing colonists and role of Cerberus in all that is nothing?

Them discovering who's really abducting people out in the Terminus systems is irrelevant. You could go to the Citadel and tell the Council/Anderson yourself if you feel like it. Come on now.

Did they? Because I still can remember something Ash said "Collecters are working for/ with Cerberus"... or some other crap like that. Basically Ash didn't know anything besides what she saw and have to note that Shep saved her ass (again) in there.

I think Jacob has more qualifications than Ash to be a Spectre. Too bad he is working for Cerberus now....

Modifié par snfonseka, 23 avril 2011 - 10:27 .

[jeweledleah]

She/he says what if collectors are working for Cerberus? which.. is not outside of the realm of possibility, considering that Cerberus haven't exactly shied away from using aliens before, they just don't recruit them to be part of organization.. just like blue suns don't make every freelancing merc their recruit into official blue sun's member.

I'm still wondering about exactly what happened with that collector ship and falsified distress signals.

[MGIII]

jeweledleah wrote...

MGIII wrote...

Yeah. Given that it makes no sense whatsoever for said organization with a radical pro-human agenda to be abducting humans, whereas the mysterious enigmatic Collectors who are well known for their, er, collecting make a convincing fit considering they have the technology, ship and history for such an endeavor.

most residents of council space and actualy, most residents of terminus systems have never seen collectors and majority regard them as a myth... a boogyman if you please.

Cerberus however, has been experimenitng on humans for decades in a variety of ways, some of which we discover in ME1.  when it comes to dissapearing remote colonies and certain rumors floating about, who are you going to suspect first?  mythological species or an Organization with a history of unscrupulous experiments.

as for the original topic.  whether VS becomes a spectre or not is still speculation.  however, they are about as qualified for it, even if they haven't improved between ME1 and ME2 as Shepard was when Shepard was made a spectre.  and at the very least we know that both Ash and Kaidan were promoted and had their records clasified.

Collectors are a recognized species. The codex doesn't lie. Residents are stupid in ME, they make that clear numerous times.

And large scale abductions are not Cerberus' modus operandi. Either way, the Council is stupid.

Nice fanart.

[Manic Sheep]

MGIII wrote...

Yeah. Given that it makes no sense whatsoever for said organization with a radical pro-human agenda to be abducting humans, whereas the mysterious enigmatic Collectors who are well known for their, er, collecting make a convincing fit considering they have the technology, ship and history for such an endeavor.

But the Council is nothing if not dangerously stupid, so I concede this point to you on all accounts.

The collectors were not known for large scale collecting like that. Many didn’t even believe they exist. They were hardly ever seen or heard from. Cerberus may be a 'pro human' group but they seem to be doing allot of testing on humans and at the time were a much more visible threat than the collectors. It is not unreasonable to suspect them.

MGIII wrote...

I've referenced this on multiple occasions.

And yet you went on about them being ”borderline useless” and inferior to shepard, despite knowing next to nothing about what has happened in the last two years and how they have improved/ developed?

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 23 avril 2011 - 10:38 .

[MGIII]

Manic Sheep wrote...

And yet you went on about them being ”borderline useless” and inferior to shepard, despite knowing next to nothing about what has happened in the last two years and how they have improved/ developed?

Sorry, forgot to add the disclaimer: pending further information. I like to work with what I'm given, you understand. And theorize based on facts. Can't just conjure badassery out of thin air. As it stands now is how my opinion is shaped.

Modifié par MGIII, 23 avril 2011 - 10:41 .

[didymos1120]

MGIII wrote...

Collectors are a recognized species. The codex doesn't lie.

The Collector Codex entries are from a Cerberus POV, and probably supposed to be excerpts from Cerberus docs.  It's more obvious in the secondary ones, namely because they specifically mention Cerberus monitoring signals and whatnot.  Also, this from the primary entry, which as you say, doesn't lie:

Living beyond the Omega-4 mass relay in the Terminus Systems, the mysterious Collector species is glimpsed so rarely as to be taken for a myth by most in galactic society.

Or did you think that galactic encyclopedias have entires on Scions and Praetorians?

Modifié par didymos1120, 23 avril 2011 - 10:44 .

[Ahriman]

snfonseka wrote...
Did they? Because I still can remember something Ash said "Collecters are working for/ with Cerberus"... or some other crap like that. Basically Ash didn't know anything besides what she saw and have to note that Shep saved her ass (again) in there.

Unfortunately I don't remember her speach exactly, but she saw [let's ignore that seeker swarm and stasis stuff] Collectors abducting colonists and Shepard with Cerberus operatives fighting with Collectors. Not so difficult logical calculations actually.

About topic in general. Ashley (VS) may be good Spectre because she has in both skills and loyalty to Alliance terms, but I personally don't like this idea. I've wanted that Alliance/Council would send someone badass enough [not without some assistance of course] to get that rogue Reaper-conspirator. So I would have some decent fight and impressive dialogs. But now it's going to be some drama like "Why, Shepard, why?".

inb4 VS fans. I know that this drama will be more impressive for you, that's why I used word 'personally'.

Modifié par Wizz, 23 avril 2011 - 10:47 .