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[Schneidend]

Mass Effect 2 was leaps and bounds ahead of its predecessor. ME1's combat is virtually unplayable in comparison.

[Ahglock]

JaegerBane wrote...

Ahglock wrote...
Jack she is coming along because why, you got her off an exploding prison and promised her computer access?  What the hell is keeping her around once she got access to the computer, she what honors her deals?  Hell the deal wasn't even to come on a sicide mission it was just come with me off this blowing up space station.   A couple mercs are coming on a suicide mission because ah you helped them on a job.  How's nice of you, commit suicide sure, that sounds great I always put the paycheck first up until this point but now I just want to help  my best buddy. Mordin is about the only one who has a remotely valid reason to be there and even that is stretching it.  

It's true about Jack, and Kasumi as well - their reasons aren't really well explored or obvious. The rest of them have pretty good reasons for doing the mission, though.

- Samara is bound by her code. No further motivation for her is necessary. She has pledged to assist Shepard and that is all there is to it for her.
- Zaeed is shown to be psychologically unstable, near suicidal and driven primarily by seeking a challenge.
- Grunt is obsessed with pitting himself against impossible odds for personal reasons.
- Tali and Garrus are not only close friends with Shepard, and personally aware of the Reaper threat, but have become disillusioned with their prior path
- Miranda and Jacob are under orders from an organisation they're commited to (at least initially)
- Thane and Mordin are taking part in the mission out of a sense of penance for what they see as past crimes
- Legion literally has no fear and is ideologically in favour of the reasonings behind the mission

The rest have got very good reasons for being on the mission.

No they have reasons to go on something suicidal maybe.  But reasons to go on "your" mission they don't have.  There is nothing tieing them to the story at all, it is just a radom collection of badasses who have I will do something really dumb hooks.

Mordin at the least discovered a virus attacking a group he was carring for and the collectors are a source of that plague.  Almost everyone else have no particular reason to join your bit of stupidity over any other bit of stupidity in the galaxy.  In ME1 even Ash/Kaiden were there for eden prime so they had a connection to the catch Saren story on top of the follwing orders thing.  

At least 4 of the crew was aware of the reapers so that is a decent enough excuse to go after the collectors, but still nothing really tied them to the story. Garus/Tali had continuation from ME1 which is enough in a series.  And hell all the members of Cobra(Cerberus)at least have the human supremecy, collectors going after humans angle.  But even still it is all very general, nothing ties them to the story.  They weren't on a colony that got collected they don't have family that was collected, they weren't experimented on by collectors but managed to escape, nothing. 

A large ammount of the crew is there just because.  None of the stories moved the story forward in any way, they didn't have any personal reasons to be there, it was just a collection of characters that the designers thought were cool.  

[theSteeeeels]

JaegerBane wrote...

theSteeeeels wrote...
are u kidding me? ur not fooling anyone. DUNCE

Oh sweet lordy.....

The point was that his post was so full of hyperbole that the best way of responding was to do it tongue-in-cheek.

Good lord. Is that clear enough? Do I need to use smaller words? Do I need to explain line by line what the point was? Do I have to explain sarcasm to you? Do I have to explain hypocrisy to you? Do I need to explain how idiotic it makes someone look to keep shouting 'DUNCE!' like it's supposed to mean something?

It seems I have fooled at least one person on here, genius. Though I did it unintentionally, as I didn't think anyone was honestly dim enough to miss the point...

alright smart guy, keep telling yourself you arent going back on what you said. the more you believe the more it'll be true!

and keep making those posts where its full of paragraphs saying one thing.... but where you actually mean the exact oppisite! wonderful!

[Ahglock]

Schneidend wrote...

Mass Effect 2 was leaps and bounds ahead of its predecessor. ME1's combat is virtually unplayable in comparison.

I mostly agree, I replay ME2 all the time for this reason.  It still can use a lot of improvement, and I have been hearing good things in this regard about ME3.  Wider areas, better AI, ladders/high ground etc.  

[ReveurIngenu]

As others have said, I don't hate the game, but I was certainly disappointed.  Mostly by the story because I felt there was none.  In ME1, the story evolves step by step and you discover things along the way.  Yet in ME2, you pretty much know the outcome of the game by the end of the first hour or so and spend the rest of the time recruiting members.  While this may have been the "story" of ME2, I felt it certainly was a crappy one at that. 

I remember wanting to play the game thoroughly (as I always do), but at one point, I started getting sick of recruiting team members and doing their loyalty quests and wanted to get to the real storyline.  That is, until I realized that recruiting members for the "final mission" was the storyline!  Can't explain in words how at felt at that moment.  And I'm serious, there was an actual moment when that realization come, an epiphany of what the game was, and that's when I knew I was disappointed.  I was just like, "That's it, that's the storyline?" to myself.

Not only that, but without the Mako, everything felt closed in and small.  You really felt like you were in a galaxy, being able to land on a whole bunch of planets, roam freely, etc in ME1, all of which was taken out in ME2.  Everything from the storyline to the small closed-off environments contributed to making ME2 feel smaller, less important, and less significant than ME1.

So yeah, ME2 was a disappointment and I only played it once.  I couldn't bring myself to replay the final mission when one of my members died (I wanted a perfect run) nor replay the game from the beginning.

[Ahglock]

ReveurIngenu wrote...

As others have said, I don't hate the game, but I was certainly disappointed.  Mostly by the story because I felt there was none.  In ME1, the story evolves step by step and you discover things along the way.  Yet in ME2, you pretty much know the outcome of the game by the end of the first hour or so and spend the rest of the time recruiting members.  While this may have been the "story" of ME2, I felt it certainly was a crappy one at that. 

I remember wanting to play the game thoroughly (as I always do), but at one point, I started getting sick of recruiting team members and doing their loyalty quests and wanted to get to the real storyline.  That is, until I realized that recruiting members for the "final mission" was the storyline!  Can't explain in words how at felt at that moment.  And I'm serious, there was an actual moment when that realization come, an epiphany of what the game was, and that's when I knew I was disappointed.  I was just like, "That's it, that's the storyline?" to myself.

Not only that, but without the Mako, everything felt closed in and small.  You really felt like you were in a galaxy, being able to land on a whole bunch of planets, roam freely, etc in ME1, all of which was taken out in ME2.  Everything from the storyline to the small closed-off environments contributed to making ME2 feel smaller, less important, and less significant than ME1.

So yeah, ME2 was a disappointment and I only played it once.  I couldn't bring myself to replay the final mission when one of my members died (I wanted a perfect run) nor replay the game from the beginning.

I find it interesting to see what makes people replay games.  Me it is more the game play, the shooting and froinlaven.   The story effects my 1st run through only, after that I'm like yeah yeah he sends assassins I get it, skip the cut scene plow through the talky talky, get to the killing and maiming already.  I think ME1 was a better game in my initial play through since I think the story was a lot better.  But I like ME2 just as much overall since I think the game play was hugely better so I can get a lot more replay value out of it.  I only replay ME1 like once a year or something when the story starts to become a bit hazy in my mind.  

[tonnactus]

ReveurIngenu wrote...


Not only that, but without the Mako, everything felt closed in and small.  You really felt like you were in a galaxy, being able to land on a whole bunch of planets, roam freely, etc in ME1, all of which was taken out in ME2.  Everything from the storyline to the small closed-off environments contributed to making ME2 feel smaller, less important, and less significant than ME1.

Of course.I hoped that in addition to the "old" big citadel omega would be a big hub to explore.Instead,all "hubworlds" were nothing more then glorified shopping mals.
You can get claustophobia in Mass Effect 2.

[tonnactus]

Ahglock wrote...
  Me it is more the game play, the shooting and froinlaven. 

Gameplay in a rpg,the replay value of it are the options to build a character(main character and teammembers). While the first game already was a rpg light,the second game is a farce in this regard.
Especially teammembers with 3 active powers at best.(ammo isnt a power)
And the soldier basicly only has bullet time and grenade shot.

Modifié par tonnactus, 27 avril 2011 - 06:03 .

[JaegerBane]

theSteeeeels wrote...
alright smart guy, keep telling yourself you arent going back on what you said. the more you believe the more it'll be true!

and keep making those posts where its full of paragraphs saying one thing.... but where you actually mean the exact oppisite! wonderful!

Awww, are all these nasty paragraphs taxing you too much? Too many big words?

This is an internet forum, genius. If you don't like reading you've come to the wrong place.

[JaegerBane]

Ahglock wrote...
No they have reasons to go on something suicidal maybe.  But reasons to go on "your" mission they don't have.

Barring Jack, anyone on your mission who isn't doing it for the pay has a pretty personal reason to do so - I thought your issue was why would someone do a suicide mission for the pay...

I mean, some of these nutters are only doing 'your' mission purely because yours was the first one that came along with a big paycheck. Grunt in particular is only doing your mission initially because Shep's mission is literally the first thing he encounters.

Mordin at the least discovered a virus attacking a group he was carring for and the collectors are a source of that plague.  Almost everyone else have no particular reason to join your bit of stupidity over any other bit of stupidity in the galaxy.  In ME1 even Ash/Kaiden were there for eden prime so they had a connection to the catch Saren story on top of the follwing orders thing.  

Granted, some of the reasons given are a little personal, but I wouldn't go so far as to say they have no particular reason. Garrus and Tali in particular would clearly prefer to be doing whatever Shep is doing, thanks to past endeavours.

Some of them may not have any reason to join shep's suicide run over any other, but I'm not sure why you find it so unlikely that they're on your team if that is their motivation.

A large ammount of the crew is there just because.  None of the stories moved the story forward in any way, they didn't have any personal reasons to be there, it was just a collection of characters that the designers thought were cool.  

Depends on what you consider 'large' - the only one I found was there just because was Kasumi. If your task is to venture into uncharted space and figure out a way of stopping a given enemy, I can totally understand having a group of commandos and specialists that are used to fighting in small numbers against numerically superior opponents and bad odds - something that is true of every single member of your team barring Kasumi (who generally doesn't do fighting at all).

[Therefore_I_Am]

One of the few things I disliked about ME1 was the loot system. From beginning to start I felt like I was OD'ing on loot... And more than half of that stuff would be melted down to omni-gel... not to mention that I couldn't simply leave the stuff in the storage crate. It got to the point where I became cheesily rich or overflowing with omnigel, and never ran out of either resource. Plus Shepard could easily become a god towards the end of the game and anything you come across would not be much of a challenge, all enemies being promptly one-shotted... that goes for my Engineer, and he was on veteran difficulty. Got to the point when it wasn't much of an intense challenge at all. ME2 fixed this to a large degree.

Anyway... I read through much of the thread, and it seems that most of the ME2 haters are the ones who played ME1 before ME2. Drawing from that observation, it's clear that these people have "original syndrome". They have developed too much of a mindset, that if a sequel is nothing like the original in terms of atmosphere, character portrayal, and combat mechanics, they automatically think it sucks because it's nothing like the original. Does this mean ME2 sucks? No, it's just different.

Well, so much for adaptibility.... All I see are disgruntled ME1 fanatics that are blowing things way out of proportion, while screaming "Get off my lawn! *waves cane wildly*". And if anyone thinks this is going down the route of the CoD franchise, than they need their head examined.

As for the ME2 plot, why in the hell are people even getting upset about it? It makes perfect sense; why fight something that isn't even present? In ME2 the reapers are not even in the galaxy yet, all things considered. Wouldn't make sense to fight something that isn't there, so instead we fight their minions, thus giving us time to do loyalty missions and exploring different parts of the ME universe. There are no worlds being cataclysmically destroyed, nothing for us to warrant such attention... yet.

To me, ME2 takes it a step further, (starting with Soveriegn from ME1) teasing us with the Lovecraftian plot, because the horrors from beyond- I mean the reapers- are still unknowable, still mysterious, still raising questions, still being ominous... And most of all still provoking a sense of dread in that they are coming soon to wipe all sentient life from the galaxy.

Modifié par Therefore_I_Am, 27 avril 2011 - 07:24 .

[Daydreamer_91]

I loved both games I have to say first one was just more polished and ... I dunno how to described it just left me in awe
I still love the second one but it wasn't as good I just hope they will make the third one more like the first

[Jo Dan 28]

My biggest beef with ME2, and its already been mentioned, is the feeling that the world is way small. Unlike ME which had planets to land on and then seamless loading (for most areas) the world felt larger. ME2 feels like I am moving from one box to another with loading screens inbetween. Now, in a game like KoTOR, that is completely okay because that is the way the game was originally portrayed. But coming off of ME, ME2 feels like a major step back in atmosphere.

[Daydreamer_91]

Jo Dan 28 wrote...

My biggest beef with ME2, and its already been mentioned, is the feeling that the world is way small. Unlike ME which had planets to land on and then seamless loading (for most areas) the world felt larger. ME2 feels like I am moving from one box to another with loading screens inbetween. Now, in a game like KoTOR, that is completely okay because that is the way the game was originally portrayed. But coming off of ME, ME2 feels like a major step back in atmosphere.

very true . also the animations were so stiff and sloppy in ME2 it's hard to imagine so many people didn't even care about that

[Chuvvy]

I preferred ME1's story and characters, to a certain extent. But I love ME2. I just think it could be better.

[Xaijin]

I dislike that Me2 is on rails. I dislike everything about Horizon, including arbitronically disagreeing-with-Shep Kaishley does anything "dramatically" at all and agree with smudboy here and only here, I dislike Miranda and I dislike that it ended when it did.

[Daydreamer_91]

Therefore_I_Am wrote...

One of the few things I disliked about ME1 was the loot system. From beginning to start I felt like I was OD'ing on loot... And more than half of that stuff would be melted down to omni-gel... not to mention that I couldn't simply leave the stuff in the storage crate. It got to the point where I became cheesily rich or overflowing with omnigel, and never ran out of either resource. Plus Shepard could easily become a god towards the end of the game and anything you come across would not be much of a challenge, all enemies being promptly one-shotted... that goes for my Engineer, and he was on veteran difficulty. Got to the point when it wasn't much of an intense challenge at all. ME2 fixed this to a large degree.

Anyway... I read through much of the thread, and it seems that most of the ME2 haters are the ones who played ME1 before ME2. Drawing from that observation, it's clear that these people have "original syndrome". They have developed too much of a mindset, that if a sequel is nothing like the original in terms of atmosphere, character portrayal, and combat mechanics, they automatically think it sucks because it's nothing like the original. Does this mean ME2 sucks? No, it's just different.

Well, so much for adaptibility.... All I see are disgruntled ME1 fanatics that are blowing things way out of proportion, while screaming "Get off my lawn! *waves cane wildly*". And if anyone thinks this is going down the route of the CoD franchise, than they need their head examined.

As for the ME2 plot, why in the hell are people even getting upset about it? It makes perfect sense; why fight something that isn't even present? In ME2 the reapers are not even in the galaxy yet, all things considered. Wouldn't make sense to fight something that isn't there, so instead we fight their minions, thus giving us time to do loyalty missions and exploring different parts of the ME universe. There are no worlds being cataclysmically destroyed, nothing for us to warrant such attention... yet.

To me, ME2 takes it a step further, (starting with Soveriegn from ME1) teasing us with the Lovecraftian plot, because the horrors from beyond- I mean the reapers- are still unknowable, still mysterious, still raising questions, still being ominous... And most of all still provoking a sense of dread in that they are coming soon to wipe all sentient life from the galaxy.

it is only logical that we have played ME1 before the ME2 hence the numbers and the release date and believe me it's not that I have played 3 playthroughs of ME2 and 4 of the first one I agree with you on the story it totally makes sense what I dislike about ME2 is that they got all lazy on us and made the missions so limited with linear maps blocked by boxes and crap which was so annoying also the powers for each characters were so few that they barely made any difference not to mention the leveling system
but nonethe less it was a great great game

[Mynoot]

The Spamming Troll wrote...

JaegerBane wrote...

The Spamming Troll wrote...

every bioware story is EXACTLY the same.

Oh sweet moses Troll, are you still yakking on about this rubbish? Opinions are one thing, but have you somehow managed to miss the s***storm on the DA2 threads about how the storyline is *too* different to DA?

If you're going to go on a perpetual whinge, at least stick to opinions or get a clue about what you're talking about...

i was following the chart. my expertise in bioware games starts and stops with ME and ME2. i couldnt care less about the direction of DA.

sorry if i hurt your feelings or whatever i did by posting that little thing there. im hopeing we can still be besties jaegs.

Yeah, mine is a bit more extensive, going back to the original Bauldur's Gate when it was first released.  Fun game and at the time, the formula for BW story crafting didn't exist.

Then came NWN, Jade Empire, yadda, yadda, yadda. The pieces started to fall together.

[The7Sins]

Schneidend wrote...

Mass Effect 2 was leaps and bounds ahead of its predecessor. ME1's combat is virtually unplayable in comparison.

Wrong. ME1's combat was a fun unique experience that differentiated it from every generic shooter out there and was a good reason why I fell in love with the game. ME2 thanks to a bunch of needless retcons made ME2 into a clone of many other shooter games in addition to the powers getting the stupid universal cooldown which makes no sense and Biotics not working on someone with shields or armor was also crap. although I do agree with Biotics not working on someone with a Biotic Barrier up.
All in all combat was almost as dissappionting in ME2 as its non exisitent plot hole retconed plot was.

Modifié par The7Sins, 27 avril 2011 - 10:15 .

[Murmillos]

Do I dislike ME2?

In a way, yes.

Now don't get me wrong, I think ME2 is a fantastic game and it does many things better then ME1 - in terms of some game play elements. There is also many things about ME1 I don't want to see experience again, but I also feel that ME2 is missing a lot of the charm and style that made ME1 such a hit.

ME2 hard cut features which just need little bit of fixing and tweaking.
1) Too much loot, bad inventory system... reduce items 10fold, introduce omni-tool scanning as a "loot feature".
2) Elevator rides are annoying.. implement ways to cut elevator rides short once loading is done - don't force long "wait" times.
3) Make controls wonky - way too many boring / ill designed worlds... Improve the Mako and invest more then 2 graphic interns make maps.

[Obro]

Schneidend wrote...

Mass Effect 2 was leaps and bounds ahead of its predecessor. ME1's combat is virtually unplayable in comparison.

combat IS better in 2 but role playing and story are definitely not 

[Aumata]

 The problems I have with ME2.

• The protection system.  It is not a good way of balancing the classes.  Hell combative classes didn't even feel any changes at all.
• Tech being for the most part gone.  No damping, sabatoging, tech mining, neural shock being gimped.  I blame the protection system.  Seem like Bioware was heading somewhere with the drone usage and basically messing with enemies, but instead we got incienrate and cryo.
• Thermal clips.  Why do I always run out of ammo, but every one else doesn't.  At least overheat explain that problem well.  That and never using my sniper rifle in the rare case. My current infilitrator reminds me of playing a mage class with so few mana, and it doesn't recharge.
• Infintie respawn.  Nothing says **** you to limited ammo, than respawning enemies.  Made my infilitrator switch to close combat engagement, because mofos kept coming.  It also forces me to stay back instead of pushing forward, because I got shot in the back by a respawning enemy.  Zaheed mission being the biggest offender.
• 12 party memebers.  How am I suppose to learn about them, if I have way to many to use in a single playthrough.  Smaller team in ME3 please.
• Gimping teammates.  Really, don't see why they should have only tree skills, less damage, and longer cooldowns.  There really wasn't much of a change in combat when I did arrival as my adept.  I am hoping for ME3 to give us back full skill sets for teammates. and the same cool downs.  NO GIMPING DAMAGE EITHER.
• No knock back.  Shotgun to your face, and you stand there like a tank.
• ME2 main story line.  What it is there, just not on par with ME1.  **** really makes more since if I thought of TIM as the main anagonist than the collectors.  Yet you were selling the collectors as the main bad guy.
• Linear level design.  ME1 was linear, but big.  ME2 was linear but small.
• Mods for your guns, though that is returning in ME3.
• Since of progression.
• Squad mates with no armor in extreme areas, and combat.

Besides that ME2 was cool.  I rated it the same as ME1.  

• ME1 had a **** inventory.
• The terrain in the mako levels, tended to ****** me off.
• Guns were the same in their categories, only one did different damage.  Which was made redundant with Specter gear.
• Same with armor.  Though looking like a squad was cool as hell though.
• Bad shooting.  I am a N7 marine, and I couldn't shoot to save my life at the begining of the game.  Nor can I use a Assualt rifle, to which I would be sure that what they would teach at basics.
• Mako it controlled like crap, but better defense than hammer head.

Can't wait for ME3.

Modifié par Aumata, 27 avril 2011 - 10:51 .

[Ahglock]

SpaceDesperado wrote...

Hey Ahglock is your name supposed to be a GTA: San Andreas joke? lol

you might be the first perosn to get it.
 "We have Ahglock here with us today"
" Yo, that is O G Loc."