243 réponses à ce sujet

[Loc'n'lol]

I guess you can call it an action-RPG. Which doesn't make it less of an RPG, just not an RPG for players who have a negative dex modifier...

[wowpwnslol]

Calling DA2 a role playing game is by far the most preposterous thing ever written on these forums. It's a glorified action/adventure game for consoles.

[Anathemic]

wowpwnslol wrote...

Calling DA2 a role playing game is by far the most preposterous thing ever written on these forums. It's a glorified action/adventure game for consoles.

No it's not, I wish people would stop spewing this nonsense. DA2 doesn't deserve to be in the Action RPG genre, it's a disgrace. Compare it with top Action RPGs such as Diablo and Dungeon Siege, DA2 is a PoS.

[wowpwnslol]

Anathemic wrote...

wowpwnslol wrote...

Calling DA2 a role playing game is by far the most preposterous thing ever written on these forums. It's a glorified action/adventure game for consoles.

No it's not, I wish people would stop spewing this nonsense. DA2 doesn't deserve to be in the Action RPG genre, it's a disgrace. Compare it with top Action RPGs such as Diablo and Dungeon Siege, DA2 is a PoS.

Touche

[KilrB]

Just my opinion but I wouldn't classify it as ANY kind of roleplaying game.

There's not enough RP in it!

If DA2 is an a/rpg, then so are every fps and hack-n-slash fighter I've ever played.

[alan614]

DA2 is an action RPG, the even one of the guys who created Bioware, Ray Muzyka says it is. Skip to 0:38, "As much as anything, it's an Action RPG"

http://www.g4tv.com/...Access-Preview/

Action RPGs tend to focus more on the action though, which to an extent takes a bit of focus away from the player's interaction with the story. But I'm sure there can be some out there which can successfully and deeply branch stories based on the player's decision, DA2 just didn't feel that kind of game, to me at least.

Modifié par alan614, 27 avril 2011 - 02:19 .

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Dragon Age 2 does not stop being an Action RPG or an RPG simply because you think it's a bad one.

There are plenty of terrible (Action) RPGs on the market.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 27 avril 2011 - 02:24 .

[Anathemic]

mrcrusty wrote...

Dragon Age 2 does not stop being an Action RPG or an RPG simply because you think it's a bad one.

There are plenty of terrible (Action) RPGs on the market.

I didn't dispute the credibilty of Action RPG or not, all I stated is that it doesn't deserve to be in the specific genre.

[Gatt9]

alan614 wrote...

DA2 is an action RPG, the even one of the guys who created Bioware, Ray Muzyka says it is. Skip to 0:38, "As much as anything, it's an Action RPG"

http://www.g4tv.com/...Access-Preview/

Action RPGs tend to focus more on the action though, which to an extent takes a bit of focus away from the player's interaction with the story. But I'm sure there can be some out there which can successfully and deeply branch stories based on the player's decision, DA2 just didn't feel that kind of game, to me at least.

While it is an ARPG in this case,  I have to point out,  just because a Developer claims a game is something doesn't make it so.

Bethseda's a great example.  Neither Fallout nor Oblivion are RPGs,  they're Shooter and Adventure game respectively.  This is easily seen because it fails the Character Based Skill test*,  but Bethseda will swear up and down "It's an RPG!!!!".  What a Developer claims is irrelevant,  what it plays like is all that matters.
 
*(A Role requires your character's skill to be dominant,  if it's all your skill,  you didn't take on a Role)

[slimgrin]

From what I played in the demo, it wasn't an action rpg. Thats because I don't consider DA:O an action rpg either.

[Anathemic]

Gatt9 wrote...

alan614 wrote...

DA2 is an action RPG, the even one of the guys who created Bioware, Ray Muzyka says it is. Skip to 0:38, "As much as anything, it's an Action RPG"

http://www.g4tv.com/...Access-Preview/

Action RPGs tend to focus more on the action though, which to an extent takes a bit of focus away from the player's interaction with the story. But I'm sure there can be some out there which can successfully and deeply branch stories based on the player's decision, DA2 just didn't feel that kind of game, to me at least.

While it is an ARPG in this case,  I have to point out,  just because a Developer claims a game is something doesn't make it so.

Bethseda's a great example.  Neither Fallout nor Oblivion are RPGs,  they're Shooter and Adventure game respectively.  This is easily seen because it fails the Character Based Skill test*,  but Bethseda will swear up and down "It's an RPG!!!!".  What a Developer claims is irrelevant,  what it plays like is all that matters.
 
*(A Role requires your character's skill to be dominant,  if it's all your skill,  you didn't take on a Role)

Not sure on Fallout 3, but I'm pretty sure Oblivion was in fact a RPG. Oblivion with its sandbox world is great rolepaly environment/potential. To role paly means to take on a role, and in Oblivion you can make up that role from the start of the game and take it upon yourself.

Modifié par Anathemic, 27 avril 2011 - 02:38 .

[alan614]

Gatt9 wrote...

alan614 wrote...

DA2 is an action RPG, the even one of the guys who created Bioware, Ray Muzyka says it is. Skip to 0:38, "As much as anything, it's an Action RPG"

http://www.g4tv.com/...Access-Preview/

Action RPGs tend to focus more on the action though, which to an extent takes a bit of focus away from the player's interaction with the story. But I'm sure there can be some out there which can successfully and deeply branch stories based on the player's decision, DA2 just didn't feel that kind of game, to me at least.

While it is an ARPG in this case,  I have to point out,  just because a Developer claims a game is something doesn't make it so.

Bethseda's a great example.  Neither Fallout nor Oblivion are RPGs,  they're Shooter and Adventure game respectively.  This is easily seen because it fails the Character Based Skill test*,  but Bethseda will swear up and down "It's an RPG!!!!".  What a Developer claims is irrelevant,  what it plays like is all that matters.
 
*(A Role requires your character's skill to be dominant,  if it's all your skill,  you didn't take on a Role)

*(A Role requires your character's skill to be dominant,  if it's all your skill,  you didn't take on a Role) -- I completely agree with this statement. It was the very thing that annoyed me in Fallout 3 and Oblivion as well, those damn minigames, especially the lockpicking, it was so easy, close to no chance of failure when the game allows you to perform it. It should have just been statistics in that lockpicking success should have just depended on how high your character's skill was. It's why I liked Morrowind better as well as Fallout 1 & 2.

Modifié par alan614, 27 avril 2011 - 03:12 .

[Tantum Dic Verbo]

Anathemic wrote...

I didn't dispute the credibilty of Action RPG or not, all I stated is that it doesn't deserve to be in the specific genre.

I think the discussion on these boards alone is enough to dispense with the idea of RPG's as a specific genre.

[Volourn]

"RPG, Roleplaying Game. You roleplay a character, drive the story with choices, interact with NPC's or other players. Its not about combat."

Have you ever played classic rpgs like the the gold box games? Do you even know what the gold box games are? L0LZ

[Statulos]

Volourn wrote...

"RPG, Roleplaying Game. You roleplay a character, drive the story with choices, interact with NPC's or other players. Its not about combat."

Have you ever played classic rpgs like the the gold box games? Do you even know what the gold box games are? L0LZ

Yes, I´m one of those dudes that knows what SSI and stuff such as Pool of Radiance was long time ago. Back when Neverwinter Nights was not the next project after Baldur´s Gate series...

[Volourn]

Yeah, but that wasn't directed at you but the people who claim that role-playing has nothing to do with combat when classic RPGs were nothing *but* combat. Heck, the 'mother of all rpgs' D&D started out as a table top war game.

A game can have little to no story or just a plain awful story andf still be a rpg.

[Statulos]

Volourn wrote...

Yeah, but that wasn't directed at you but the people who claim that role-playing has nothing to do with combat when classic RPGs were nothing *but* combat. Heck, the 'mother of all rpgs' D&D started out as a table top war game.

A game can have little to no story or just a plain awful story andf still be a rpg.

Bioware has been to videogame RPG´s what White Wolf was to tabletop ones: the poeple that made the narrative matter.

I wish DA2 had pushed for a less combat-centric model of game, honestly.

[AlanC9]

Sure, Statulos, but wanting less combat in RPGs has nothing to do with whether something isn't an RPG, or is a bad kind of RPG.

[Sacred_Fantasy]

I cannot complete DA 2 if I keep thinking about role playing Garret Hawke. So I just pretend I play Dynasty Dragon with Marian Hawke aka Sun San Xiang. 




Yep. Definitely look action game to me.

Modifié par Sacred_Fantasy, 27 avril 2011 - 05:08 .

[Radwar]

DAO, RPG
DA2 RPG Light, in order to cater to the easily confused gamers (The last part was actually said by Laidlaw himself in an interview).

Modifié par Radwar, 27 avril 2011 - 07:55 .

[AkiKishi]

Sacred_Fantasy wrote...

I cannot complete DA 2 if I keep thinking about role playing Garret Hawke. So I just pretend I play Dynasty Dragon with Marian Hawke aka Sun San Xiang. 




Yep. Definitely look action game to me.

Conquest mode in DW7 is so much better.

[hexaligned]

Eh, DA2 has so little to offer in terms of actual player choice, both in terms of character building and personality, I have trouble even thinking of it as an RPG. The closest thing that comes to mind to liken it to are those "Choose Your Own Adventure" children's books I used to read in grade school. I think "Adventure Game" is more fitting. That's not just DA2 though I suppose, I'd put a lot of Biowares other releases in that category too

[Ryllen Laerth Kriel]

I'll just say that DA 2 tried to be an action RPG, while including less traditional RPG elements. To me, it fell short on both counts since sped up animations and simplified character leveling with even less strategic combat don't make for what I would call "action." And forcing a pre-set protagonist with a pregenerated voice with less character creation options to give the players freedom of play limit it more as a RPG than it's predecessor don't make it more of a roleplaying game. I guess action roleplay is fine enough, the overall experience felt pretty generic to me.

[guardian of hades]

relhart wrote...

Eh, DA2 has so little to offer in terms of actual player choice, both in terms of character building and personality, I have trouble even thinking of it as an RPG. The closest thing that comes to mind to liken it to are those "Choose Your Own Adventure" children's books I used to read in grade school. I think "Adventure Game" is more fitting. That's not just DA2 though I suppose, I'd put a lot of Biowares other releases in that category too

So then none of the Final Fantasy games are RPGs?  For the most part classic RPGs especially Japanese ones had very little in terms of character choices.

I think for some people RPGs are only RPGs if they are turn-based and I strongly disagree with that. 

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

DA 2 is an Action RPG.

Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it less of an Action RPG.

Arcania (Gothic 4) was a god awful game that came straight from the bowels of the Broodmother that should've never come to exist.

But it's still an Action RPG.

I wrote...
Dragon Age is a very cinematic Action RPG imo.

Not like that's a bad thing, really. I mean, the Icewind Dale games were Action RPGs and no one gives them slack for not being "true" RPGs.

Don't get why it's supposed to be a negative term. Even games like New Vegas, Witcher and Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines are Action RPGs. I loved all those games and many RPG fans do. Not to mention the Gothic/Risen games.

I see an Action RPG as an RPG with either a focus on combat with little deviation as the primary gameplay device. Even though Origins had a lot of combat for example, you could still use other skills that mattered from a gameplay perspective. Persuasion, Intimidation, Stealing, Crafting, etc. DA 2 is either dialogue (with no character skills) or combat.

Or a combat system that focuses on player skill above character skill. This is where games like VtmB, Witcher and New Vegas fall. Depsite having depth in it's RPG elements, the player > character or player = character combat system is not the player < character system which RPGs traditionally have.

Now, whether Dragon Age 2 is a good Action RPG is another thing entirely.

I would say that it is not. I'd say it's Average. Not bad, not good.

It would be unfair to compare Dragon Age 2 against games like Diablo and Dungeon Siege as an Action RPG.

It still is a narrative based RPG, with Diablo and DS being gameplay based Action RPGs.

Games like Dragon Age 2 will have to come up against the Icewind Dales of the world. Or the Gothic 1/2s and Risens of the world. Or Even the Witchers of the world. It still comes up short, but it's not at the bottom of the dogpile.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 27 avril 2011 - 09:46 .