1033 réponses à ce sujet

[Elhanan]

Foolsfolly wrote...

Fired for their opinion? Yeah, that's illegal.

If I worked at a game store I'd give my opinions to anyone who asks. They ask me "Hey, how's Dragon Age 2?" I'd tell them frankly, "Meh. I'd wait until the bargain bin. Once it hits bargain bin they'll have another patch out and maybe some substancal DLC."

heh! Good luck with that; hope you ain't on commission....

I bought the game brand new on its first hour. I wish I didn't. It's overpriced for a crazily bugged mediocre game.

But it is appears to be good purchase for those of a varied POV like myself, so choose your salesmen and opinions carefully.

Modifié par Elhanan, 29 avril 2011 - 10:22 .

[Sabriana]

GvazElite wrote...

Sabriana wrote...

*looks at OP join-date*
*looks at username*
*reads "who cares about Europe?"*

*leaves*

Haha you care about these pointless things

Yeah. I do tend to get a tad irked at "who cares about Europeans" or posts similar to that. I might be biased, because I am one, but do not let that stop your jocularity.

Although I should have added

"looks at user-name"
"looks at tone of post'

[mdugger12]

Another well thought out thread.
How about we don't compare DA2 to anything else but games that came out this year. We could say spring but either way, What game is racking up sales and killing it that was released this spring? What are these great games that have been released this year that people are buying instead of DA2? Because since the tone of this thread is that the fans have spoken (they aren't speaking for me obviously) and that they've taken their money elsewhere then where exactly are they taking it? Since metacritic is so reliable all of a sudden and VGChartz as reliable info where are all of these critical and commercial masterpieces that released this year that eclipse DA2. Please tell me.

[Droma]

read my posts correctly, it comes down to how the retailer warns about the game. i have nothing against a retailer who gives a objective info about the game, he even can share is subjective opinion about the game but he should clearly say thats his personal opinion. only because your retailer disliked the game doesn't mean it is bad. but if he/she is bashing about it no matter what it is likely you miss a game which you could have really enjoyed.

ah and btw saying it is bull****, that da:o price dropped 2 weeks after the launch is yeah, just bull**** =D but i know it's allways easy to say something without proof. to actually proof that da:o price indeed dropped after 2 weeks just look here: http://camelcamelcam...duct/B0045ZB66I

da:o was released on nov 3. the pirce just went up again cause of christmas

[Gotholhorakh]

Elhanan wrote...

heh! Good luck with that; hope you ain't on commission....

Hey.. not everyone on commission is a liar and a thief.

(which is what you are if you knowingly sell people something you think is a very bad product while telling them it's great)

mdugger12 wrote...

Another well thought out thread. 
How about we don't compare DA2 to anything else but games that came out this year. We could say spring but either way, What game is racking up sales and killing it that was released this spring? What are these great games that have been released this year that people are buying instead of DA2? Because since the tone of this thread is that the fans have spoken (they aren't speaking for me obviously) and that they've taken their money elsewhere then where exactly are they taking it? Since metacritic is so reliable all of a sudden and VGChartz as reliable info where are all of these critical and commercial masterpieces that released this year that eclipse DA2. Please tell me.

Shogun 2: Total War is going quite well, actually (and while I was wary of having massive expectations it's not surprising to me, it's a good game - effort has been put in to please the fans of the series, and love has been put into both gameplay and content as if the developers/publishers cared about about making an enjoyable game). It's led steam's 200 million Q1 this year.

Ditto Portal 2.

Oh, and of course TW2 and a couple of other excitin' games that are yet to be released.

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 29 avril 2011 - 10:45 .

[mean W_Girl]

I just bought the DA 2 Signature Edition for the PS/3 but their network is down courtesy of a web-hack so nothing is going to let me enjoy the game until they go back online. I think some blood mage is responsible!

[Droma]

because da2 is a very bad product -.- damn it people start to try seeing the world through some objective eyes and not your own objective dissapointed ones. very bad games include games like movie based games or barby games or whatsoever. you can call da2 an average game or a good game (which is pretty good represented by the 8,2 metacritics rating) but saying it is total garbage is just as false as saying it is a perfect game.

Modifié par Droma, 29 avril 2011 - 10:46 .

[Sabriana]

Gotholhorakh wrote...

Elhanan wrote...

heh! Good luck with that; hope you ain't on commission....

Hey.. not everyone on commission is a liar and a thief.

(which is what you are if you knowingly sell people something you think is a very bad product while telling them it's great)

Not to mention that lyng to your customers will make you lose credibility. The money is in the return customer, not the one-time-haha-I got your money customer.

Yes, you should be honest. If returns and plummeting sales are happening, something is wrong. Tell your customers ot try it out first, or research more. You don't even have to say "it's bad". But deceiving a customer will lead to that person to never, ever trust you again. And perhaps try a new store.

Note: No, this is not an analogy to DA 2. Even though I was very, very disappointed in it, I still think that Bioware is a superb team. I'll find out later, but I'll not abandon them. Not yet.

[Gotholhorakh]

Sabriana wrote...

Not to mention that lyng to your customers will make you lose credibility. The money is in the return customer, not the one-time-haha-I got your money customer.

Yes, you should be honest. If returns and plummeting sales are happening, something is wrong. Tell your customers ot try it out first, or research more. You don't even have to say "it's bad". But deceiving a customer will lead to that person to never, ever trust you again. And perhaps try a new store.

Note: No, this is not an analogy to DA 2. Even though I was very, very disappointed in it, I still think that Bioware is a superb team. I'll find out later, but I'll not abandon them. Not yet. 

Agreed, I don't work selling games but as an individual my advice is always rent first if I didn't like it, and to be honest and say "I thought it was rubbish", so that the person asking me has a fair warning to make up their mind with caution.

and no, I will not abandon BioWare either. At the moment I feel like a family member who has been unjustly shunned or abused because of the whole "everyone who disliked this game is a £"$% lalalalala" attitude, but I can't forget the experiences I've had from BioWare over the years, and I'm hoping that it will blow over (and that BioWare will reach out to their FANBASE - remember that word?) eventually.

Droma wrote...

because da2 is a very bad product -.- damn it people start to try seeing the world to some objective eyes and not your own objective dissapointed ones. very bad games include games like movie based games or barby games or whatsoever. you can call da2 an average game or a good game (which is pretty good represented by the 8,2 metacritics rating) but saying it is total garbage is just as false as saying it is a perfect game.

Oh please cease with the silly "objective eyes". As well to claim there is objective truth in which bands are better than others (I hope everyone here realises by the age of 15 there isn't, since this isn't a nintendogs forum)..

The reality is that lots and lots of people think this game is bad.

You don't honestly think you can debate what other people think is good/bad art or entertainment in objective terms, do you?

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 29 avril 2011 - 10:57 .

[Aldaris951]

Well David it's your job on the line at the end of the day. If EA needs to make some cuts I'm sure the dragon age team is out of the door first.

[Night Prowler76]

mdugger12 wrote...

Another well thought out thread.
How about we don't compare DA2 to anything else but games that came out this year. We could say spring but either way, What game is racking up sales and killing it that was released this spring? What are these great games that have been released this year that people are buying instead of DA2? Because since the tone of this thread is that the fans have spoken (they aren't speaking for me obviously) and that they've taken their money elsewhere then where exactly are they taking it? Since metacritic is so reliable all of a sudden and VGChartz as reliable info where are all of these critical and commercial masterpieces that released this year that eclipse DA2. Please tell me.

Crysis 2 has 1.4 million in sales in 4 weeks
Homefront has 1.68 million in sales in 4 weeks
Pokemon Black/White 10.68 million in sales
Call of Duty Black Ops has sold around 4.5 million sinche January 1st


Mortal Combat and Portal 2 sold around 800k in their first week, so there are numerous games that have outsold DA2, I imagine that TW2 will outsell DA2 even tho its a PC exclusive title.

There hasnt been alot of AAA titles to compare DA2 to for sales, but when you do compare it to the AAA titles, it doesnt really surpass them in sales as you can see.

[Night Prowler76]

I care for Europeans, those accents just make me melt :>

[Gotholhorakh]

Night Prowler76 wrote...

I care for Europeans, those accents just make me melt :>

Well, hello there...

Aldaris951 wrote...

Well David it's your job on the line at the end of the day. If EA needs to make some cuts I'm sure the dragon age team is out of the door first.

I hope not - that would be firing your best special forces troopers because they have been commanded and misdirected by a ninnyhammer.

[Addai]

steelfire_dragon wrote...
can we please stop with the whatnot week sales threads.

I find them interesting.  Though most of us who aren't in the industry can't interpret them to mean much.

No doubt it's been said somewhere, but we're also in a long, severe stretch of unemployment and recession and now inflation in most places.  That's got to be affecting the entertainment industry and wasn't the case when Origins was released.

Modifié par Addai67, 29 avril 2011 - 11:02 .

[MrCrabby]

ConnorHawke wrote...

Exactly. I played most of the demo and was certainly suspicious, but had no idea that there would be a tremendous reliance on reused areas, a story that trivialized my involvement, a story that was built on mage discrimination yet ignored the fact I was a mage, endless fetch quests that were triggered with almost no details or meaningful context, parachuting enemies and an empty, lifeless, unmemorable city as the primary location.....

Does anyone really think that any of the new cast are as memorable or popular as Morrigan, Allistair and even Leilana? Good God, there are Allistair fan clubs and I saw someone in a homemade Morrigan t-shirt last week.

None of this could be fairly gleaned from the Demo. Everyone is entitled to their opinion...but I think the general sales outlook is the proof in the pudding in terms of the fan consensus.

I hate Dragon Age 2 as much as most people but I do not agree that the characters are worse then the first game. David Gaider is a tremendously gifted writer.

David Gaider wrote...

I'm
just saying that if one is looking for data to serve as proof of
anything other than confirmation bias, you might want to take more
factors into account. I recognize that some folks are going to take any
statement by a developer that isn't a mea culpa as some kind of "denial
of the truth", but I'd say we're well aware of how DA2 is selling and
how much of a success or failure that is for our company and Dragon
Age's future potential. Whether the lesson we've learned is the one you
think it should be will remain to be seen, I guess. Hopefully so.

This is Gaider-speak for "Believe me we got the messege."

Modifié par MrCrabby, 29 avril 2011 - 11:23 .

[mdugger12]

Night Prowler76 wrote...

Crysis 2 has 1.4 million in sales in 4 weeks
Homefront has 1.68 million in sales in 4 weeks
Pokemon Black/White 10.68 million in sales
Call of Duty Black Ops has sold around 4.5 million sinche January 1st


Mortal Combat and Portal 2 sold around 800k in their first week, so there are numerous games that have outsold DA2, I imagine that TW2 will outsell DA2 even tho its a PC exclusive title.

There hasnt been alot of AAA titles to compare DA2 to for sales, but when you do compare it to the AAA titles, it doesnt really surpass them in sales as you can see.

Cool. Homefront has worst reviews than DA2 and if you follow some of the press for it's release, it was expected to actually move between 8-10 million units and if you look at the sales there has been a drop off similar to that of DA2. Crysis 2 falls in  the same category and was highly anticipated sequel.

So basically you're saying that DA2 didn't sell as many copies as the CoDs of the world. News flash, neiter did DA:O. But DA2 has for the most part kept pretty close pace with those titles.   So what really is the point of your response?  Bringing up Pokemon is a joke. No matter what DA2 was like it could never outsell Pokemon

Where are the games that are killing the market? Where are these great games? What games did DA:O even outsell? What they don't exist? Really? I wonder why.
 

[Urazz]

Foolsfolly wrote...

Droma wrote...

yeah but these retailers are just stupid. it's honorable to try to warn someone of a certain product, but you don't do that like "this sucks and everyone hates it", that's just stupid. they can say this a common complains about the game and this and that is good or something like that, but just because they themself disliked the game doesn't mean everyone else also must hate the game. just retarded imo. maybe your stepfather would have liked it, but he will never know if he doesn't play it himself.

retailers who tell people not to buy stuff, because they themself dislike the product should be fired. you can warn people about this and that and be honest but never generalize your own opinion.

Fired for their opinion? Yeah, that's illegal.

If I worked at a game store I'd give my opinions to anyone who asks. They ask me "Hey, how's Dragon Age 2?" I'd tell them frankly, "Meh. I'd wait until the bargain bin. Once it hits bargain bin they'll have another patch out and maybe some substancal DLC."

I bought the game brand new on its first hour. I wish I didn't. It's overpriced for a crazily bugged mediocre game.

No it isn't illegal.  As a sales clerk, you are supposed to sell games.  Saying something like that is basically not doing your job and costing your store money cause that person decided to wait until it goes to the bargain bin.  You are basically sabotoging the store you work for.

You don't have to say it's the best game ever but you shouldn't be telling people to wait on it.  You could've said it's not as good as the DA:O and list some well accepted flaws in it (dungeon maps being reused alot for example) when you look at the more objective reviews.

Sad that you have had bugs when you got the game but I sure didn't and they are patching the game. 

mdugger12 wrote...

Night Prowler76 wrote...

Crysis 2 has 1.4 million in sales in 4 weeks
Homefront has 1.68 million in sales in 4 weeks
Pokemon Black/White 10.68 million in sales
Call of Duty Black Ops has sold around 4.5 million sinche January 1st


Mortal Combat and Portal 2 sold around 800k in their first week, so there are numerous games that have outsold DA2, I imagine that TW2 will outsell DA2 even tho its a PC exclusive title.

There hasnt been alot of AAA titles to compare DA2 to for sales, but when you do compare it to the AAA titles, it doesnt really surpass them in sales as you can see.

Cool. Homefront has worst reviews than DA2 and if you follow some of the press for it's release, it was expected to actually move between 8-10 million units and if you look at the sales there has been a drop off similar to that of DA2. Crysis 2 falls in the same category and was highly anticipated sequel.

So basically you're saying that DA2 didn't sell as many copies as the CoDs of the world. News flash, neiter did DA:O. But DA2 has for the most part kept pretty close pace with those titles. So what really is the point of your response? Bringing up Pokemon is a joke. No matter what DA2 was like it could never outsell Pokemon

Where are the games that are killing the market? Where are these great games? What games did DA:O even outsell? What they don't exist? Really? I wonder why.

Exactly,  You can't just compare it to just games in the past but also to other games that were released at the same time.  If anything DA2 is doing well when you compare it to those other games you mentioned.

Modifié par Urazz, 29 avril 2011 - 11:12 .

[Night Prowler76]

mdugger12 wrote...

Night Prowler76 wrote...

Crysis 2 has 1.4 million in sales in 4 weeks
Homefront has 1.68 million in sales in 4 weeks
Pokemon Black/White 10.68 million in sales
Call of Duty Black Ops has sold around 4.5 million sinche January 1st


Mortal Combat and Portal 2 sold around 800k in their first week, so there are numerous games that have outsold DA2, I imagine that TW2 will outsell DA2 even tho its a PC exclusive title.

There hasnt been alot of AAA titles to compare DA2 to for sales, but when you do compare it to the AAA titles, it doesnt really surpass them in sales as you can see.

Cool. Homefront has worst reviews than DA2 and if you follow some of the press for it's release, it was expected to actually move between 8-10 million units and if you look at the sales there has been a drop off similar to that of DA2. Crysis 2 falls in  the same category and was highly anticipated sequel.

So basically you're saying that DA2 didn't sell as many copies as the CoDs of the world. News flash, neiter did DA:O. But DA2 has for the most part kept pretty close pace with those titles.   So what really is the point of your response?  Bringing up Pokemon is a joke. No matter what DA2 was like it could never outsell Pokemon

Where are the games that are killing the market? Where are these great games? What games did DA:O even outsell? What they don't exist? Really? I wonder why.
 

They are all AAA titles, they all have outsold DA2, a simple puzzle game like Portal 2 is going to outsell DA2, one point you are missing, Crysis 2, Black Ops, Portal 2, are all sequals and they are outselling or going to outsell their predecessor, DA2 is not however.

You asked what games were outselling DA2, I gave you examples, and you spin them into some sort of dismissive denial for some reason..why is that?

[Night Prowler76]

Gotholhorakh wrote...

Night Prowler76 wrote...

I care for Europeans, those accents just make me melt :>

Well, hello there...

Aldaris951 wrote...

Well David it's your job on the line at the end of the day. If EA needs to make some cuts I'm sure the dragon age team is out of the door first.

I hope not - that would be firing your best special forces troopers because they have been commanded and misdirected by a ninnyhammer.

Well hello you:)

[Aaleel]

Urazz wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Droma wrote...

yeah but these retailers are just stupid. it's honorable to try to warn someone of a certain product, but you don't do that like "this sucks and everyone hates it", that's just stupid. they can say this a common complains about the game and this and that is good or something like that, but just because they themself disliked the game doesn't mean everyone else also must hate the game. just retarded imo. maybe your stepfather would have liked it, but he will never know if he doesn't play it himself.

retailers who tell people not to buy stuff, because they themself dislike the product should be fired. you can warn people about this and that and be honest but never generalize your own opinion.

Fired for their opinion? Yeah, that's illegal.

If I worked at a game store I'd give my opinions to anyone who asks. They ask me "Hey, how's Dragon Age 2?" I'd tell them frankly, "Meh. I'd wait until the bargain bin. Once it hits bargain bin they'll have another patch out and maybe some substancal DLC."

I bought the game brand new on its first hour. I wish I didn't. It's overpriced for a crazily bugged mediocre game.

No it isn't illegal.  As a sales clerk, you are supposed to sell games.  Saying something like that is basically not doing your job and costing your store money cause that person decided to wait until it goes to the bargain bin.  You are basically sabotoging the store you work for.

You don't have to say it's the best game ever but you shouldn't be telling people to wait on it.  You could've said it's not as good as the DA:O and list some well accepted flaws in it (dungeon maps being reused alot for example) when you look at the more objective reviews.

Sad that you have had bugs when you got the game but I sure didn't and they are patching the game. 

I figure most stores would want repeat customers than one time customers.  If a customer asks your honest opinion about the game and you act like nothing but a salesperson.  If they get the game home and think you lied to them or misled them to make a sale.  They'll probably return the game and not come back to your store again.

[Night Prowler76]

Urazz wrote...

Foolsfolly wrote...

Droma wrote...

yeah but these retailers are just stupid. it's honorable to try to warn someone of a certain product, but you don't do that like "this sucks and everyone hates it", that's just stupid. they can say this a common complains about the game and this and that is good or something like that, but just because they themself disliked the game doesn't mean everyone else also must hate the game. just retarded imo. maybe your stepfather would have liked it, but he will never know if he doesn't play it himself.

retailers who tell people not to buy stuff, because they themself dislike the product should be fired. you can warn people about this and that and be honest but never generalize your own opinion.

Fired for their opinion? Yeah, that's illegal.

If I worked at a game store I'd give my opinions to anyone who asks. They ask me "Hey, how's Dragon Age 2?" I'd tell them frankly, "Meh. I'd wait until the bargain bin. Once it hits bargain bin they'll have another patch out and maybe some substancal DLC."

I bought the game brand new on its first hour. I wish I didn't. It's overpriced for a crazily bugged mediocre game.

No it isn't illegal.  As a sales clerk, you are supposed to sell games.  Saying something like that is basically not doing your job and costing your store money cause that person decided to wait until it goes to the bargain bin.  You are basically sabotoging the store you work for.

You don't have to say it's the best game ever but you shouldn't be telling people to wait on it.  You could've said it's not as good as the DA:O and list some well accepted flaws in it (dungeon maps being reused alot for example) when you look at the more objective reviews.

Sad that you have had bugs when you got the game but I sure didn't and they are patching the game. 

mdugger12 wrote...

Night Prowler76 wrote...

Crysis 2 has 1.4 million in sales in 4 weeks
Homefront has 1.68 million in sales in 4 weeks
Pokemon Black/White 10.68 million in sales
Call of Duty Black Ops has sold around 4.5 million sinche January 1st


Mortal Combat and Portal 2 sold around 800k in their first week, so there are numerous games that have outsold DA2, I imagine that TW2 will outsell DA2 even tho its a PC exclusive title.

There hasnt been alot of AAA titles to compare DA2 to for sales, but when you do compare it to the AAA titles, it doesnt really surpass them in sales as you can see.

Cool. Homefront has worst reviews than DA2 and if you follow some of the press for it's release, it was expected to actually move between 8-10 million units and if you look at the sales there has been a drop off similar to that of DA2. Crysis 2 falls in the same category and was highly anticipated sequel.

So basically you're saying that DA2 didn't sell as many copies as the CoDs of the world. News flash, neiter did DA:O. But DA2 has for the most part kept pretty close pace with those titles. So what really is the point of your response? Bringing up Pokemon is a joke. No matter what DA2 was like it could never outsell Pokemon

Where are the games that are killing the market? Where are these great games? What games did DA:O even outsell? What they don't exist? Really? I wonder why.

Exactly,  You can't just compare it to just games in the past but also to other games that were released at the same time.  If anything DA2 is doing well when you compare it to those other games you mentioned.

Its doing well against 2 mediocre shooters and getting destroyed by Pokemon and Call of duty, when Origins sold over 4 million and the sequal is going to be lucky to sell 2 million copies, there is a problem.

[UltiPup]

Pokemon has such a big fanbase and following that it can destroy ANY game you suggest. Don't compare that to DA2 like it matters. We all know the sales suck for DA2 right now so there is no reason to just keep bringing up sales week after week. Yeah we know profits are ****. Get over it.

[OmegaJudgement]

David Gaider wrote...

Siradix wrote...
Is Gaider trying to make us compare it to Awakening? They were both released March.

I'm just saying that if one is looking for data to serve as proof of anything other than confirmation bias, you might want to take more factors into account. I recognize that some folks are going to take any statement by a developer that isn't a mea culpa as some kind of "denial of the truth", but I'd say we're well aware of how DA2 is selling and how much of a success or failure that is for our company and Dragon Age's future potential. Whether the lesson we've learned is the one you think it should be will remain to be seen, I guess. Hopefully so.

1. Denial:
"No it can't be" "Dragon Age 2 is a good game and 4chan is being mean" "It didn't get released at Christmas, that's why the sales are rapidly declining"

2. Anger:
"I'm going to ban users who say the game is bad - so they can't play the copy they purchased and can't say any more mean things" "I'm going to make a registered game owners section so they can't say anything mean""Every argument put forth by a member of the forum that disagrees with mine I'm going to announce as a logical fallacy using the Kubler-Ross' model of five steps of dealing with grief "

3. Bargaining:
"Hey guys, if we throw in Mass Effect 2 (which won several GoTY awards, has a high score on metacritic from both users and critics despite drastically deviating from the source material), will you please buy our game? Please?"

4. Depression:

5. Acceptance:

 
I don't think you can move on until you stop swapping between stages 1 to 3 - unfortuantely I do not know what is involved in stages 4 and 5 as I have yet to see you go through them.

To pertain back to the original "Dragon Age 2 Week 7 Sales", I'd imagine there would be a boost if it was put on the next Steam Sale, I've seen people buy literally hundreds of games they've never played and never will just because it was so cheap on the Steam Sale. Then at least BioWare can say 'Look how many units we sold'.

Modifié par OmegaJudgement, 29 avril 2011 - 11:49 .

[skan5]

OmegaJudgement wrote...

To pertain back to the original "Dragon Age 2 Week 7 Sales", I'd imagine there would be a boost if it was put on the next Steam Sale, I've seen people buy literally hundreds of games they've never played and never will just because it was so cheap on the Steam Sale. Then at least BioWare can say 'Look how many units we sold'.

... I DO plan to get playing that Overlord pack, I really do! ....
...
Ah who am I kidding... I am so guilty of this...

[Night Prowler76]

UltiPup wrote...

Pokemon has such a big fanbase and following that it can destroy ANY game you suggest. Don't compare that to DA2 like it matters. We all know the sales suck for DA2 right now so there is no reason to just keep bringing up sales week after week. Yeah we know profits are ****. Get over it.

Black ops 24.5 million copies sold
Pokemon Black/White 10.6 million copies sold

So no Pokemon does NOT destroy every game I suggested, anything else?  And I didnt start this thread, I was replying to a poster who asked what games outsold DA2 this year, I gave some examples, and now you guys are crying about it, seriously, dont ask questions if you can't handle the answer, get over it.