73 réponses à ce sujet

[Sussurus]

She's no Jaheira but is very close.
I know they never let you consumate the relationship, and Donnic gets to be her guard.
However you note only one option is to break the sub - romance after the long road and that gains friendship.

I think it's a out a very small one, that you and she are closer than she'd admit openly.

[Maladismal]

Sussurus wrote...

She's no Jaheira but is very close.
I know they never let you consumate the relationship, and Donnic gets to be her guard.
However you note only one option is to break the sub - romance after the long road and that gains friendship.

I think it's a out a very small one, that you and she are closer than she'd admit openly.

Jaheira is more fun and interesting and ****y.


Alot more ****y.

[Sussurus]

Maladismal wrote...

Sussurus wrote...

She's no Jaheira but is very close.
I know they never let you consumate the relationship, and Donnic gets to be her guard.
However you note only one option is to break the sub - romance after the long road and that gains friendship.

I think it's a out a very small one, that you and she are closer than she'd admit openly.

Jaheira is more fun and interesting and ****y.


Alot more ****y.

I still get weak if I hear her accent when she says "grating on my nerves".
I loved the way Jaheira rolled her R's, though high heels and cobblestones do that.

Modifié par Sussurus, 30 avril 2011 - 02:59 .

[Maria Caliban]

I love Aveline. She's my favorite character.

Though I dislike how people show their support of her by insulting the other two female characters.

JnEricsonx wrote...

Ok, now that that bad joke's out of the way, it was kind of suprising when after The Long Road Aveline kissed my Femhawke in thanks for helping her.  New line I hadn't heard her say before: "I was mute, now I want to sing."  My Hawke's response: "maker, please don't."

Yeah, I tried to get the kiss or the 'did we ever have a chance?' dialogues for Aveline and never did. Sadness.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 30 avril 2011 - 03:01 .

[Amagoi]

The unrequited love Hawke or the player can have for Aveline makes her a much better character I think. I personally really wanted to romance her before the launch, and was diasappointed. But it's a good example of how not everyone is going to be interested in the PC. Maybe that's to offset how it seems that way with the LIs who are attracted to Hawke regardless of gender or attitude.

Nothing wrong with leaving 'em wanting more. Though I wonder if Aveline would show up as a companion later? I don't feel like she would. Killing off Donnic so she'd be available would just be too cruel anyway. So the inability to romance her may end up making her more memorable than if she had been.

[kyles3]

I guess a romance option could have worked, but Donnic and Female Cop Face really are a perfect couple.

[Cutlass Jack]

kyles3 wrote...

I guess a romance option could have worked, but Donnic and Female Cop Face really are a perfect couple.

That's 'Lady Man-Hands' to you.

[Maladismal]

Cutlass Jack wrote...

kyles3 wrote...

I guess a romance option could have worked, but Donnic and Female Cop Face really are a perfect couple.

That's 'Lady Man-Hands' to you.

Lana Kane cameo'd in Dragonage 2?

[Brawne]

Aveline is prude and she was left to collect dust in the barracks. I kinda hated her the moment I saw her, even before she opened her mouth and started preaching.

[Beerfish]

Prude? Far from it. And if you hate preaching you probably had a very small group of companions, Most of them preach.

[Brawne]

Beerfish wrote...

Prude? Far from it. And if you hate preaching you probably had a very small group of companions, Most of them preach.

Yes, reason why I mostly use Varric, Merrill and Isabela, they dont moan your ear off like Aveline, Fenris and Anders. Fenris and Anders in one group is even worse, like two emo cutters sucking all the fun out of life.
And who needs those suckers when you can make Merrill crazy powerful blood mage and Varric a minigun wielding terminator.

[LobselVith8]

Oneiropolos wrote...

So those looking for a male LI don't end up that much better unless they're Anti-Chantry and Pro-psychotic mages.

Not one of Hawke's companions is pro-psychotic mages.

[darrylzero]

Maladismal wrote...

FedericoV wrote...

Aveline is the best charachter in the game and I would even say that it's the best charachter of the franchise so far. I don't really understand all the hate/dismissive judgements toward her. She has the best companion quest and some of the best dialogue lines.

She seems the only charachter that do not depend on Hawke to define herself. Infact, she is the only charachter I felt some form of comraderie for. And I think that the fact that she wasn't romancable helped to define the charachter in a good way.

I like aveline. I think she is a strong character and well written. My problem with her is she's boring.

She's a guardsmen. Thats essentially the end of her aspiration.

Merril wants to restore an ancient peice of magical history and who knows what comes with it.
Isabella wants to return to sail the free sea's and go where the winds take her.
Varric wants luxory, fun, fame and all the adventures and comfort that come with it.
Anders wants(and does) to start a revolution advocating Mage rights and freedoms.
Sebastain wants to retake his home city state of Starkhaven from Usurpers.

So you see she's kind of boring because she has nothing else going for her other then she's a good guardsmen.

And eh, who uses Hawke to define themself? I'd say they all make their own choices by and large.

She also should let her hair down. She'd be more attractive if she used her hair to frame her chin a bit better.

I kind of agree, but I think allowing different kinds of intereactions might be enough.  I ended up with her at about a 60% rivalry or so, I think, and our rivalry didn't make quite as much sense as I would have liked.  As a rogue who really didn't care much about law and order in Kirkwall, I would have liked the chance to end up in more confrontations with her, to deceive her and hide things from her, so that there was more genuine tension. 

The reasons she would stick by you to a certain extent, even as a rival, are there -- your common experience as refugees, saving the city from the qunari, both of you resenting the excesses of the Templars (at least to a certain extent)... I think the potential for a really good rivalry with Aveline is there.  I think that more interactions about smuggling and skirting the law and the like could have made me feel more like something was really at stake in her choice to continue to treat Hawke as an ally of sorts.

The reasons for the rivalry my Hawke had with Fenris were obvious enough (mages), and that really worked.  I loved getting him to side with me at the end despite it all.  I ended up in kind of a confusing rivalry with Merrill (where I got far enough to rival side without really grasping why and then every gift and everything just went sour), but it kind of worked too, because it made Merrill seem very distrusting of my intentions in a way that I found interesting.  But with Aveline, the issues often felt kind of inconsequential.

[Heather Cline]

To get Aveline to kiss Hawke you have to be using the witty dialogue options. Any other options and she doesn't do it.

Aveline is cool as a friend character but I'm not one for romancing her. Fun to flirt with her, to talk to her but I like Isabela more.

[Auroras]

Hope Fen-ris don't miind it

[NinaDA]

I love Aveline, because she was written in a relatable, multi-dimensional way. She evolves over the years and we do get a strong sense of friendship from her. She's the only character with Varric that doesn't obsess over a single thing for 10 years, with most dialogue being about that. She was closest to how the companions were written in Origins in that sense. I enjoyed the other companions as well, but Anders, Fenris and Merrill certainly felt more one-dimensional in their dialogue options with Hawke.

[Oneiropolos]

LobselVith8 wrote...

Oneiropolos wrote...

So those looking for a male LI don't end up that much better unless they're Anti-Chantry and Pro-psychotic mages.

Not one of Hawke's companions is pro-psychotic mages.

That's why my sentence BEFORE that contained the word "may" in regards to how someone may view Anders. I regard him as a pro-psychotic mages because he continually makes excuses for the mages that, frankly, go psychotic throughout the game. "Well, the Templars FORCED them to do that" "It was out of desparation!" and so forth. He refuses to acknowledge that people, no matter whether the fact they are going to die or not exists, have a choice that was an argument on this very boards: Whether they die as themselves or they turn to vengeance before their death. In a mage's case, while turning to vengeance might kill those templars around you, it may also kill a ton of innocents if demonic-you kills all the templars around you and then walks out the door. Then, you know, Anders murders a ton of people. (Yes, murder is the right word: Kill (someone) unlawfully and with premeditation). Some may find excuses for his actions too, the same way he preaches against blood magic but finds excuses for mages turning to it when they get scared. - I - view Anders as, whether he realizes it or not, pro-psychotic mages. He may be just horribly naive and not really get how power corrupts and how mages have more power than the normal person and so they are constantly living with temptation. He wants to believe he's right, and he's so firmly entrenched in it that he'll come up with any reason he can to brush off the mages that choose to endanger others.

Now, do I think DAII went a little too far in having mages turn abomination at the drop of a hat? Yes. It's ridiculously silly at points. But the comment you picked out was a flippant one about how both sides, to me, have that insane one. It's unfortunate that the insane one on both sides seems to be a mage. Sure, the female LI is much more SWEET about her insanity (one could say Anders is quite passionate in his insanity and that's a reason why he's worth doing at least one romance playthrough for), but being obssessed with restoring a mirror that took your friends life and refusing to listen to ALL of your other friends about what a bad idea it is and so instead you turn to a supernatural being to help you who most call a demon? That's also insane to me. Chances are, if you're the only one saying something is right and totally beneficial to do- it's not.  I know the history books list all these people who made 'discoveries' or who argued for the existence of things, and they were right and went against the grain! Except the problem is, most of the people the history book lists? They weren't the first ones to argue their points. They had quite a few people help smooth the path in front of them... in many cases with those people's corpses when others disagreed with the concepts they were saying... and that's the only reasons they were able to gain acceptance or support. And none of them had a powerful artifact that they didn't know what it did except HAD hurt someone before (two someones, if your warden was Dalish). 

Anyway,  on the ACTUAL TOPIC, Aveline and Varric are generally too rational and good-hearted. They just don't fit in with the tempests of the other LIs in DAII. That's why they had to be denied to us. In a sense, they exemplify the normalcy and calmness that has been completely denied Hawke. Which is kinda sad to view it that way, but it's how it seems. Neither of them are keeping dark secrets, both of them come to you when they're having a problem, even if in Aveline's case it's just with dating, because they are also there for you when you're having a problem. They are completely steadfast and loyal. Though to someone earlier in the thread about Isabella and Fenris, yes they discontinue the relationship for three years, which I HATE and view as an artificial boundary placed by the concept of the game having to 'go over ten years', but it's up to the individual player on which one is the hardest one to swallow on that. Isabella LEAVES for three years literally, which to me, makes it harder to justify Hawke just  hanging around waiting and hoping. Fenris stays by Hawke's side, but refuses to talk about that night. Still, it's alot easier to keep a flame for someone who you're constantly seeing, even if it's frustrating. I think it depends  on individual personalities there. Absence makes the heart grow fonder, some argue, while I reach a point and go out of sight, out of mind. So Isabella is less convincing to me. Some may have a more difficult job with the concept of not getting over someone who seems to lead you on for three years by never leaving your side. But all I said is they seemed the more 'sane' romance options. I'm not about to argue that they are more satisfactory to romance or enjoyable. That's all personal opinion for each person to decide. 

[LobselVith8]

Oneiropolos wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

Oneiropolos wrote...

So those looking for a male LI don't end up that much better unless they're Anti-Chantry and Pro-psychotic mages.

Not one of Hawke's companions is pro-psychotic mages.

That's why my sentence BEFORE that contained the word "may" in regards to how someone may view Anders. I regard him as a pro-psychotic mages because he continually makes excuses for the mages that, frankly, go psychotic throughout the game. "Well, the Templars FORCED them to do that" "It was out of desparation!" and so forth.

His first love Karl was made tranquil illegally by Ser Alrik, so I'd imagine he's still dealing with killing Karl when he begged to die rather than be a "templar puppet." And we see from the child Ella (as Bethany called her in the letter she sent to Hawke) being threatened with rape and tranquility that there is a problem for the mages.

Oneiropolos wrote...

He refuses to acknowledge that people, no matter whether the fact they are going to die or not exists, have a choice that was an argument on this very boards: Whether they die as themselves or they turn to vengeance before their death.

Anders calls out the mages for trying to kill them in "Act of Mercy."

Oneiropolos wrote...

In a mage's case, while turning to vengeance might kill those templars around you, it may also kill a ton of innocents if demonic-you kills all the templars around you and then walks out the door.

Not all mages are the same, and Anders abhors blood mages and abominations.

Oneiropolos wrote...

Then, you know, Anders murders a ton of people. (Yes, murder is the right word: Kill (someone) unlawfully and with premeditation). Some may find excuses for his actions too, the same way he preaches against blood magic but finds excuses for mages turning to it when they get scared. - I - view Anders as, whether he realizes it or not, pro-psychotic mages.

And your opinion doesn't match up with the facts. Anders advocates killing mages who use "forbidden magic" or have become abominations.

[Maria Caliban]

I envy you all.

Aveline. Why don't you love me? ../../../images/forum/emoticons/crying.png

[mesmerizedish]

Maria Caliban wrote...

I envy you all.

Aveline. Why don't you love me? ../../../images/forum/emoticons/crying.png

You're not snarky enough.

[Sussurus]

The way she lays it on you as well.

That one sucker kiss is enough to show how much of whirling force she is.

Modifié par Sussurus, 30 avril 2011 - 09:51 .

[Oneiropolos]

LobselVith8 wrote...

And your opinion doesn't match up with the facts. Anders advocates killing mages who use "forbidden magic" or have become abominations.

Oh, and the fact that Anders says it's totally fine for Thrask to die? He flat out says better to kill one templar... despite the fact  AS YOU SAID he is upset by the mages in that SAME quest using blood magic. But hey, better to let potential blood magic users go free and kill the actual -sympathetic templar-, right? Grace PROVES to be psychotic herself later, but Anders is all "Yep, let's kill at templar for them. What do you mean that Templar called us here specifically in order to try to help make sure these mages got to leave alive? It's easier if we kill him." Look. It's fine if you like Anders. But don't try to say "Your opinion doesn't match up with the facts" when you complete ignored what my argument was. I don't say Anders supports blood magic, but he DOES make excuses when mages turn to it in death. REPEATEDLY. That's what I actually said. I know Anders does not support blood magic. I've played the game five times, and I have done an Anders romance playthrough and and Anders rival friendship, and an Anders regular friendship. I'm not sitting there cherry picking what Anders does to suit my point. He makes excuses for mages who turn into abominations because, like I also said, he may not REALIZE he's being pro-psychotic mages but his actions continually prove that it's the case. He thinks he's being all liberation for mages, he can only see mages as victims. Which MANY mages -are-. His cause is not wrong. But even when your mother dies, he's all like, "I can't believe a mage would do that. I'm sorry." He can't believe a mage would do that? HE'S The one who keeps making the argument that mages are just like every other human in their emotions and deserve to be treated like human beings. He must be viewing the world with rose colored glasses because I'm pretty sure my warrior and rogue Hawkes aren't all "Gah, we got attacked by a gang? I can't believe someone wielding a sword/dagger would use it that way..." I'm pretty sure my Hawke just accepts that people can be evil. She doesn't make exceptions just because she's sympathetic to other Fereldans because she is one. Even though they get to live in the slums and barely manage to make any coin, working for people like Hubert because no one else will hire them. Instead, she judges them on personal merit and actions. Not "But the city has oppressed you so I get why you turned to trying to kill me for money! I must destroy the viscount!" 

Don't assume because someone doesn't agree with Anders and his radical decisions that they're automatically anti-mage and think mages should just put up with Templar abuse. This thread was about Aveline. I made a throw away, even mostly joking comment, about the other LI's. You made a separate post picking that -one statement- out to turn this into another Anders debate. The board is already covered in them. And maybe I shouldn't have replied to this, but I really don't appreciate someone being condescending towards me when it's just completely not necessary. I gave Anders outs of being naive in some points, and even not realizing that status when I explained. I even stated that I thought DAII had overdone the mages-turning-to-abominations thing. But as the game stands, Anders is forced into continually supporting mages that turn psychotic and making excuses for them. That's what he does. Yes, every chance he gets, he tells the blood mage in our group how insane blood magic is. But that doesn't change the facts that he keeps up the mantra of "It's not their fault" for the other mages in the majority of the cases. It's understandable, psychologically, that he does. He's preparing to die for them and so of course he wants to only see others to blame and the mages as innocents. But THAT doesn't match up with the facts for most of the mages we run into in the game. It does for a few. Alain, Ella, and Emile are solid examples of mages that are in incredibly crappy situations and don't go all abomination on you. Alain uses blood magic to free a person, but it was the only way he knew how to undo it. It's not THEM I have an issue with. It's the rest of the times Anders makes a commentary of people being pushed into their situation. It's a choice. They make a bad one. Anders can despise the Templars, but he can't ignore the choice of the mage involved. Yet he does ignore it as best as he can. He does make a few comments against them, but they are far outweighed by the comments that make excuses for them in the game. 

Modifié par Oneiropolos, 30 avril 2011 - 10:03 .

[TheKristoffski]

Oneiropolos wrote...

LobselVith8 wrote...

And your opinion doesn't match up with the facts. Anders advocates killing mages who use "forbidden magic" or have become abominations.

Oh, and the fact that Anders says it's totally fine for Thrask to die? He flat out says better to kill one templar... despite the fact  AS YOU SAID he is upset by the mages in that SAME quest using blood magic. But hey, better to let potential blood magic users go free and kill the actual -sympathetic templar-, right? Grace PROVES to be psychotic herself later, but Anders is all "Yep, let's kill at templar for them. What do you mean that Templar called us here specifically in order to try to help make sure these mages got to leave alive? It's easier if we kill him." Look. It's fine if you like Anders. But don't try to say "Your opinion doesn't match up with the facts" when you complete ignored what my argument was. I don't say Anders supports blood magic, but he DOES make excuses when mages turn to it in death. REPEATEDLY. That's what I actually said. I know Anders does not support blood magic. I've played the game five times, and I have done an Anders romance playthrough and and Anders rival friendship, and an Anders regular friendship. I'm not sitting there cherry picking what Anders does to suit my point. He makes excuses for mages who turn into abominations because, like I also said, he may not REALIZE he's being pro-psychotic mages but his actions continually prove that it's the case. He thinks he's being all liberation for mages, he can only see mages as victims. Which MANY mages -are-. His cause is not wrong. But even when your mother dies, he's all like, "I can't believe a mage would do that. I'm sorry." He can't believe a mage would do that? HE'S The one who keeps making the argument that mages are just like every other human in their emotions and deserve to be treated like human beings. He must be viewing the world with rose colored glasses because I'm pretty sure my warrior and rogue Hawkes aren't all "Gah, we got attacked by a gang? I can't believe someone wielding a sword/dagger would use it that way..." I'm pretty sure my Hawke just accepts that people can be evil. She doesn't make exceptions just because she's sympathetic to other Fereldans because she is one. Even though they get to live in the slums and barely manage to make any coin, working for people like Hubert because no one else will hire them. Instead, she judges them on personal merit and actions. Not "But the city has oppressed you so I get why you turned to trying to kill me for money! I must destroy the viscount!" 

Don't assume because someone doesn't agree with Anders and his radical decisions that they're automatically anti-mage and think mages should just put up with Templar abuse. This thread was about Aveline. I made a throw away, even mostly joking comment, about the other LI's. You made a separate post picking that -one statement- out to turn this into another Anders debate. The board is already covered in them. And maybe I shouldn't have replied to this, but I really don't appreciate someone being condescending towards me when it's just completely not necessary. I gave Anders outs of being naive in some points, and even not realizing that status when I explained. I even stated that I thought DAII had overdone the mages-turning-to-abominations thing. But as the game stands, Anders is forced into continually supporting mages that turn psychotic and making excuses for them. That's what he does. Yes, every chance he gets, he tells the blood mage in our group how insane blood magic is. But that doesn't change the facts that he keeps up the mantra of "It's not their fault" for the other mages in the majority of the cases. It's understandable, psychologically, that he does. He's preparing to die for them and so of course he wants to only see others to blame and the mages as innocents. But THAT doesn't match up with the facts for most of the mages we run into in the game. It does for a few. Alain, Ella, and Emile are solid examples of mages that are in incredibly crappy situations and don't go all abomination on you. Alain uses blood magic to free a person, but it was the only way he knew how to undo it. It's not THEM I have an issue with. It's the rest of the times Anders makes a commentary of people being pushed into their situation. It's a choice. They make a bad one. Anders can despise the Templars, but he can't ignore the choice of the mage involved. Yet he does ignore it as best as he can. He does make a few comments against them, but they are far outweighed by the comments that make excuses for them in the game. 

Wow i think this is the longest text i have read on these forums

[Oneiropolos]

KristoffMcguffinSmuck wrote...

Wow i think this is the longest text i have read on these forums

 You clearly have not read the extensive Anders debates. Posts get incredibly long in the "Was he right/evil/justified/a mean person/savior of Thedas?" threads. And the threads debating codex entries. But I admit, I generally have too long of posts because I do dislike feeling the need to explain why I stated something AFTER someone's tried to tear one statement to shreds. So I say my line of thought and reasons for it. *looks sheepish* Sorry.