98 réponses à ce sujet

[Big I]

So either the darkspawn got to the original qunari homeland, or the qunari had a presence in Thedas before the invasion of Par Vollen. Interesting.

[Rifneno]

Crow_22 wrote...

Actually there is many scientific theories that back this up. MAny underwater caves dot the oceans and go well intm the mainland around our world. And Dwarves would have been cut off from entrances such as that because of monsters, cave ins, floods, lava flow, and many other factors like lack of sleep, food, supply lines, ect. And thus, it would seem reasonable to ME that either Qunari landed and were taken OR that the Deep Roads are indeed spanning across most of the world, if not all. OR even both, it seems reasonable to me is why.

As for why Dwarves are small, perhaps a genetic disorder that came from humans and thus they seperated, forming two different races? Or the Maker made them XD. Either one would be logical to me XD

Underwater caves is a whole different thing.  I don't mean that there can't be caverns at the bottom of the ocean, I mean that a manmade tunnel spanning thousands of miles under the ocean is an idle fantasy even in our world where technology for the most part makes Thedas' magic look like child's play.  And for multiple reasons.  It's too hot to do, and barring some huge revelation regarding ancient civilization's technological or magical scrying power, it'd be impossible for them to have even the slightest idea where to dig.  How deep, how far, when to make a surface exit, ect.  All it takes is one mistake when you're dealing with tunnels near an ocean and the entire Deep Roads is underwater forever.

Although like I said, it's possible they'll ignore the real science behind such a feat.  Honestly I wouldn't blame that much.  I don't know enough about geology to be sure but I'd be surprised if the Deep Roads even as we know them are logically possible.  While even more unlikely, I suppose it's possible Thedas is on a planet with a Pangea type landmass.

[Zeevico]

David Gaider wrote...

Since this question arises again, a few points:

1) The Ogres look akin to the way we originally intended the Qunari to look. It was the Qunari who initially changed, not the Ogres. The new Qunari appearance is, in fact, closer to our original vision for them.

2) The "allies" I referred to way back in the day are ghouls. Ogres are not ghouls.

3) Ogres have indeed appeared in previous Blights, prior to the arrival of the Qunari at Par Vollen. This is not a mistake. I am not, however, going to give you the answer that explains this-- yet. If anyone wishes to prefer to think of this as a plot-hole until then, feel free. The phrase "plot-hole" gets thrown around a lot these days, so why should it be any different here?

The obvious answer is that darkspawn had access to Qunari (somehow) prior to their arrival at Par Vollen.

If the Qunari do not know what a "blight" is, this raises questions about their exposure to darkspawn. It is possible that they were always exposed to stragglers but never a horde--who knows how far the Underdark, oops, the Deep Roads--go. Who knows? Some explanation may some day appear and I look forward to reading about it. To claim that this is a "lore/plot hole" in such a well developed world is unlikely, to say the least. The writing team had a number of years to think about all this.

Modifié par Zeevico, 04 mai 2011 - 02:37 .

[pallascedar]

Zeevico wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Since this question arises again, a few points:

1) The Ogres look akin to the way we originally intended the Qunari to look. It was the Qunari who initially changed, not the Ogres. The new Qunari appearance is, in fact, closer to our original vision for them.

2) The "allies" I referred to way back in the day are ghouls. Ogres are not ghouls.

3) Ogres have indeed appeared in previous Blights, prior to the arrival of the Qunari at Par Vollen. This is not a mistake. I am not, however, going to give you the answer that explains this-- yet. If anyone wishes to prefer to think of this as a plot-hole until then, feel free. The phrase "plot-hole" gets thrown around a lot these days, so why should it be any different here?

The obvious answer is that darkspawn had access to Qunari (somehow) prior to their arrival at Par Vollen.

If the Qunari do not know what a "blight" is, this raises questions about their exposure to darkspawn. It is possible that they were always exposed to stragglers but never a horde--who knows how far the Underdark, oops, the Deep Roads--go. Who knows? Some explanation may some day appear and I look forward to reading about it. To claim that this is a "lore/plot hole" in such a well developed world is unlikely, to say the least. The writing team had a number of years to think about all this.

Also, the great part about making up your own world is that if someone is like "This doesn't make sense." you can make up a reason for it. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that either.

[GenericPlayer2]

There is so much about the darkspawn and qunari we do not know. I don't think darkspawn started because Tevinter magisters entered the golden city - I don't even believe the maker actually exists. None of that has been shown in the game to be anything other than chantry lore. What if Ogres existed because the first darkspawn were a Qunari experiment gone bad?

Also, from what I understand Thedas is a continent and not the entire world, so maybe the Qunari had an ancient exploration ship that arrived on the shores of Thedas long ago than was originally thought. You know, kind of like with that Viking guy and the North American continent.

[Greta13]

I'm just going to randomly ask a question that kinda sorta fits in with this topic...
Why aren't there orge emissary's? Seeing as orges come from Qunari brood mothers, and since there are Qunari mages, why aren't the orge emissary's? Or did I just miss one in a DLC or something?

[Elessie]

Greta13 wrote...

I'm just going to randomly ask a question that kinda sorta fits in with this topic...
Why aren't there orge emissary's? Seeing as orges come from Qunari brood mothers, and since there are Qunari mages, why aren't the orge emissary's? Or did I just miss one in a DLC or something?

I was gonna make a comment about ogres running into walls all the time and not being smart enough to cast spells, but I don't recall ever seeing a shriek emissary either.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Elessie wrote...

Greta13 wrote...

I'm just going to randomly ask a question that kinda sorta fits in with this topic...
Why aren't there orge emissary's? Seeing as orges come from Qunari brood mothers, and since there are Qunari mages, why aren't the orge emissary's? Or did I just miss one in a DLC or something?

I was gonna make a comment about ogres running into walls all the time and not being smart enough to cast spells, but I don't recall ever seeing a shriek emissary either.

The Emissaries you meet in DA2 are shrieks. And there are nothing in lore preventing Ogres from being Emissaries either. However, since Ogres are rare, and Emisarries are rare too, an Ogre Emissary would be extremely rare.

[WhiteKnyght]

You have proof of that? Cause the Emissaries look more like the Archietect than Shrieks, which are inhuman looking creatures with stealth abilities.

[Viyu]

David Gaider wrote...

Since this question arises again, a few points:

1) The Ogres look akin to the way we originally intended the Qunari to look. It was the Qunari who initially changed, not the Ogres. The new Qunari appearance is, in fact, closer to our original vision for them.

2) The "allies" I referred to way back in the day are ghouls. Ogres are not ghouls.

3) Ogres have indeed appeared in previous Blights, prior to the arrival of the Qunari at Par Vollen. This is not a mistake. I am not, however, going to give you the answer that explains this-- yet. If anyone wishes to prefer to think of this as a plot-hole until then, feel free. The phrase "plot-hole" gets thrown around a lot these days, so why should it be any different here?

Just because it gets thrown around a lot hardly means that the developers don't have a lot of explaining to do on issues that ARE plotholes, and clearly don't make sense. I just suddenly get the feeling like you're brushing a lot of us off that notice there is clearly a problem in regards to other matters. It's bad enough that you, no offense, pulled a really clumsy move by removing the impact of the epilogues, and then on top of that did that WITHOUT finding a way to inform non-forumers who would naturally have a good reason to be confused when they started playing. Try not to play with fire.

Modifié par Viyu, 06 mai 2011 - 04:49 .

[ajm317]

Greta13 wrote...

I'm just going to randomly ask a question that kinda sorta fits in with this topic...
Why aren't there orge emissary's? Seeing as orges come from Qunari brood mothers, and since there are Qunari mages, why aren't the orge emissary's? Or did I just miss one in a DLC or something?

I don't know whether or not there are any ogre emissaries, but whether or not there are any probably doesn't have anything to do with whether or not there are Qunari mages.  Consider for example that there are Genlock emissaries.

Ogres aren't Qunari remember, they're darkspawn that are birthed from a Qunari female who has been mutated into a broodmother.

[Herr Uhl]

Greta13 wrote...

I'm just going to randomly ask a question that kinda sorta fits in with this topic...
Why aren't there orge emissary's? Seeing as orges come from Qunari brood mothers, and since there are Qunari mages, why aren't the orge emissary's? Or did I just miss one in a DLC or something?

Ogres are rare amongst darkspawn, and emissarries even rarer. You can see why we haven't met any?

There is nothing in the lore suggestig that they're an impossibility though.

[Sepewrath]

Well that would depend on there being some kind of range limit on the Grey Wardens being able to sense Darkspawn. A Blight happening for this long, I think the Wardens would have known about it by now. And Sten would have probably mentioned it in Origins.

[Conduit0]

Its entirely possible the Qunari existed on Thedas prior to the first Blight and were wiped out. From the codex that we've gotten so far it seems pretty clear that Thedas' history prior to the first Blight is fairly sketchy and Thedas' history prior to the rise of the Tevinter Emperium is almost completely unknown. So the Qunari could have been living in Thedas already and were wiped out during the first Blight, giving rise to the ogres, and the records of their existance lost to history.

[FieryDove]

team_royce wrote...

Darkspawn are not the same as the original race. They are tainted by the maker's wrath himself. There is nothing to say that a broodmother of a race takes any characteristic of that race, other than the darkspawn's physical form. Based on the new graphic of emisarries and genlocks in DA2 and DA2 legacy respectively its likely that emisarries have their own broodmother. 

A broodmother is a ghoul.
The race of the broodmother directly influences which kind of darkspawn she will give birth to. An elven broodmother will spawn shrieks, a dwarven broodmother genlocks, a human broodmother hurlocks, and a Qunari broodmother ogres. Each broodmother is capable of spawning thousands of darkspawn.
http://dragonage.wik...iki/Broodmother

All it takes is one female quanri and boom...ogre fodder.

I am hoping Quanri go back to bronze skin with purple eyes (Sten) and some red and yellow eyes. What they have now is...not how they were described or shown in the past.

Also we are in violation of necro and will be banned for life. I hope it was worth it.

Modifié par FieryDove, 09 août 2011 - 12:19 .

[CrimsonZephyr]

It's not like Tevinter stretched to Par Vollen. Perhaps the Qunari were there longer than they realized. If so, perhaps they have a connection to the Deep Roads.

[ElvaliaRavenHart]

The Grey Nayr wrote...

andraip wrote...

It's known that Ogres come from Broodmothers who were once female kossith.

It's also known that the first Qunari arrived on Thedas on 6:30 Steel.


So, I was wondering why Ogres existed in Thedas before the Arrival of the Qunari?
Since the 4th Blight ended at 5:20 Exalted, and in the opening cutscene in DAO (who shows the 4th Blight) you can actually see Ogres?
Why does it say in the Ogre Codex (who is optained when Hawke fights the Ogre in the beginning of DA2, or by the Warden in the end of the Tower of Ishal), which you get before the 5th Blight has really begun, that Ogres normally "only appear during a Blight" and "Up to a hundred of these creatures can accompany a darkspawn horde at any one time during a Blight"? How did the Historicians know of this if there were no Blight after the Qunari Arrival?

And if the Darkspawn already had captured female kossith, and turned the into Broodmothers, long before the Qunari arrived in Thedas, then how did the Darkspawn got to the Qunari homeland and how did the Ogres got to Thedas?
Unless the Darkspawn haven't build ships able to cross an ocean or found an underground tunnel that linked continents, how did this happened?


I really would appreceate some feedback (especially from BIOWARE)

Who said the Darkspawn only appear in Thedas? The Deep Roads may span the length of Thedas, but Darkspawn spend centuries tunneling and looking for the old gods. A Female Kossith could have had a run of bad luck.

If you look at the map of Amaranthine in Awakenings it appears on the map that there is a tunnel between Ferelden and the Free Marches under water.  Or it appeared this way to me.  It shows up better in-game when looking at the map.    There is also blackness on the map in the water of the ocean so I don't know if this could represent tunnels under the ocean.  It could also be the veil is very thin over the ocean too.  This was just something that I noticed. 

Someone with more computer skills than I have with editing photos would have to get a screen shot of the map and highlight these. 

It wouldn't surprise me if there are tunnels under the ocean that would connect all of the world to other lands and the darkspawn would be in them.  I think it is very interesting that darkspawn would have found a way into qunari lands underground and captured a female qunari. 

[ShadowLordXII]

Interesting, sounds like the darkspawn's reach had possibly extended far beyond even the Deep Roads in the past and maybe still do.

[Gamer Ftw]

You know they aren't going to admit it's a plot hole now that you pointed it out they will find a way to make it make sense in future games instead of admitting a mistake.

[ladyofpayne]

Deaap Roads are licated under all Thedas. The darkspawn can kidnap quinari woman.

[Adanu]

JabbaDaHutt30 wrote...

Filament wrote...

Click

and messere Gaider opens up another plothole.

Seriously, think before you post if you want people to take you seriously.