22 réponses à ce sujet

[Fenrishowl]

Hi all, i have a question about this skill, the adrenaline skill.
Dont know if its a bug or what, but right now im on the deep roads (near the end of chapter 1 i think) and the last skill ive bought is Adrenaline Rush (first upgrade), then ,for curiosity, i decided to enable the damage numbers to see the diference between attacking only with berserk activated and with a lot of adrenaline ( 5 or 6 times in a row).

The results: nothing, in the inventory screen nothing changes, and the damage done to the enemies keeps the same.
Am i doing something wrong, or its that i dont fully understand how this works?

Thanks.

[Sabotin]

Well damage bonuses don't show anywhere, so those you won't see. But the damage should have increased by quite a bit. Only reason why it didn't that I can think of is that you also lowered your stamina too much with it (since berserk gives bonus based on remaining stamina) and the effects kinda cancelled out?

[Fenrishowl]

I was right now testing that out, but it seems it doesnt work for me, now i tried to use adrenaline 1 or 2 times (full stamina) I dintnt notice anything, and of course if i deplete the stamina using adrenaline (strangely) I get reduced damage (i mean, less than having full stamina and not using adrenaline).
So i dont get it.

Thanks for reply.

[Fenrishowl]

Well, i forgot to tell you, im running the pc version of the game, yesterday i keeped trying this ability for a wile with not big conclusions at all.

Hope that other berserker players help me out on this because i really like this specialization and if its bugged Ill be forced to change it, or at least not completing the tree.

Thanks!

[mr_afk]

Do you know how the berserk mechanics work?
10% or 15% of your your current stamina level added as damage?
As adrenaline uses up 20stamina this is effectively reducing your base damage by ~2. If you use it twice that's ~4.
As adrenaline only increases your damage by 5% (or 8% if upgraded) unless you have around 80 damage you will be better off not using adrenaline.

This will change as you level up and your damage increases but in general, you don't want to be using abilities besides cleave/claymore and maybe barrage while you are at full stamina as using abilities is reducing the damage bonus from berserk.
For spike damage it should be more beneficial to use adrenaline - especially if you stack it up to around 8 times. This gives you ~+56% damage which should be more than the bonus provided from berserk.

The berserker tree is pretty powerful so you might as well get them all. Just use barrage instead and if you don't like adrenaline just don't upgrade it. Focus more on your vanguard/reaver tree instead maybe?

Modifié par mr_afk, 02 mai 2011 - 08:23 .

[DKJaigen]

What mr_afk said is correct.

adrenaline rush simply cost to much stamina to be usefull.

Strange that you dont see the buff in the screen,

Modifié par DKJaigen, 02 mai 2011 - 10:24 .

[Fenrishowl]

I believe too that Mr afk is correct, only thing that pisses me off is that to reach death blow (and the upgraded barage) you have to spend a point in adrenaline....
Quite wierd that they didnt fixed this already.
And nope, i dont get any feedback when I activate the skil (only the graphic effect i mean).

Thanks for reply!

[mr_afk]

Actually I might be wrong. I forgot it was +% damage. If i'm not wrong that affects the total damage dealt not just the base damage... How embarrassing. Not sure what I was thinking.

Anyhow, what that means is that if you deal 100+ damage, 8% will give you 8 damage. So it's actually not such a bad talent. Everyone always under-rates it but for a late-game warrior adrenaline will pretty useful as it will affect the total damage output by 8% which is a lot more than ~2 base damage reduction for the stamina cost. Basically tbh, late game this is one of the best warrior talents for spike damage - beaten only by claymore and maybe some of the increase attack speed ones.

Modifié par mr_afk, 02 mai 2011 - 12:31 .

[Fenrishowl]

Quite true, the damage done by adrenaline its 5 or 8+ % of your damage stacking every time you use it.
I noticed this didnt work well when i purchased the Adrenaline rush upgrade (no cooldown) after stacking it 6 or 8 times i didnt notice anything at all (and we are talking of 40% + damage), so yes, from the start i realiced that this ability have a great potencial, but right now its not working.
For example i tried it vs a Shade, first i attacked it only with Berserk w/full stamina, and i was doing about 50-60 damage points, then i did the same but stacking adrenaline until i ran out of stamina (7 times or so, i have 150 stamina, so we have 35%+ damge) so i should have had a damge ouput of 70-81 damage points per strike, wich i didnt.
So Ill try it a few more times, but im prety sure i have this skill bugged.
If you can please try it too, so we can compare.
Thanks.

[mr_afk]

Hmm... Maybe i'll whip out my warrior play-through later. Just about to have dinner though so probably can't atm. Hadn't heard of a bug though.

It only lasts 8seconds though? So unless you've upgraded it to 0sec cool-down you can only effectively get +20% damage (from 4 stacked) and only if you use them the instant they cool-down.. So the damage output could about right....

Modifié par mr_afk, 02 mai 2011 - 01:03 .

[Fenrishowl]

Ok, thanks, but have in mind that im trying this with adrenaline plus the two upgrades with berserk also with the two upgrades, and im not getting anything relevant when i use this skill.

Bon apetit!

[mr_afk]

damn this is hard to test. really shouldn't have got blood frenzy. Makes things awkward when you pump out 1243 off a crit compared to ~68 basic attacks at full stamina.
I'm starting to realise why people can solo with a warrior so easily though.

Using maths though, I had 195 available stamina after taking into account sustains.
this gives 29.25dmg from berserk, After 8 adrenalines the available stamina drops to 35 which gives 5.25dmg.
Okay this means that base dmg will drop from 75.75 (28 from weapon, 18.5 from strength, berserk) to 51.75.
With 64% extra damage this goes up to 84.87 - which means that you should actually be doing more damage with adrenaline fully pumped which is odd because I didn't see that from my tests either.

The tests I did found an average 124 of a group of those random kirkwall at night critters. This dropped to 74 after 8 adrenalines -which  interestingly shot up to even higher than 124 (~150) for that brief period between killing people (and regaining full stamina) and having adrenaline still pumping.

but yeah, I'm starting to doubt the practical value of it unless I didn't stack it properly. I suppose it would have better synergy with talents. E.g. if you were trying to get huge damages off a CCC you could stack adrenalines, drink a stamina potion or use second wind, then do a mighty blow on a brittle target and get ~64% increased damage off ~1000+ damage. That would be considerable. If you are using only basic attacks I wouldn't really recommend it as it does seem to reduce your damage (until you refill your stamina) and only lasts for 8secs. If it lasted longer it could be useful as regaining stamina is so easy for a warrior. So unless you are trying to crack out some 'highest damage ever' hits you probably will be safe to leave it un-upgraded and just use more practical talents like cleave.

I probably should have done more tests but I think i'll head back to my (failing) attempts at a Xeberkeck speed run. After I fail a few more times I'll have another shot figuring this out. I'll respec my warrior so it doesn't have any passives and won't leave any sustains on. 

On another note, I forgot how fun it is to hack things apart with a warrior. Maybe I might postpone my mage playthrough and do another warrior run......
Bleh, just remembered I probably should do a proper DW-rogue first. But only if I can think up some new experimental glass cannon build..

Modifié par mr_afk, 02 mai 2011 - 03:47 .

[TheAwesomologist]

I never found Adrenaline Rush useful. I noticed it didn't seem to be adding any damage either early on but I just figured that since it consumes stamina it's directly fighting against your Berserk anyways.

I always save Berserker as the my second tree and only pick up Berserk and Barrage. I usually don't pick up Death Blow til late in Act 3 after I've gotten everything I need from Two-Handed, Vanguard, Reaver, and even Battlemaster before putting more than 2 points into Berserker.

[Fenrishowl]

Well, i guess this is it.
I find this "bug-thing" quite anoying and ridiculous, to have a skill in the same tree, that depends on other and on the same hand, counteract it... I don´t get it.
Well I was fun while it lasted, anyway, I was starting to bore with this build, i was hoping more of this spec, hope Bioware tweak this a bit.
Thanks for everything!

Modifié par Fenrishowl, 02 mai 2011 - 06:11 .

[mr_afk]

testing literally atm. will give proper results in a sec-


argh it's pretty tough to test it at 8 times.
i'll try at one first. 
What's really odd is that you can actually stack them faster than one a second if you move a little bit each time.
So move pause, move pause... may allow you to get more time at 64%. anyway, im still testing :/

Modifié par mr_afk, 02 mai 2011 - 06:16 .

[Fenrishowl]

Ok, I´ll keep checking the tread for your results!

[mr_afk]

Okay. It seems to definitely work - but only for around one second. Haha
At no berserk and no sustains: Average attack (of 20): 41.667
With berserk around full stamina: Average attack (of 20): 79.238
With berserk around and one adrenaline rush so close to full stamina: Average attack (of 13): 83.57
Adrenaline stacked to around maximum, zero stamina: A couple hits ~100+ the rest dropping down to ~50

If you can really be bothered and stack on one each time you move an inch (I stacked on quite a few) you get to see your numbers drop from around 100 (at zero stamina - so quite impressive) eventually down to around 40-50.

There were some testing issues in that while I kept some things constant: same target (reloading every time he died), the attacks (moving back then only measuring the lunge forward attack), health (after receiving minor injuries I used health potions/devour to keep health pretty much full) and stamina levels for the berserk test (stamina potions)
The last test was impossible to test properly (e.g. I sometimes had better luck spamming adrenaline than others) and sometimes I was at higher stamina levels than zero when attacking.

But overall I would say there isn't a bug or anything - it's just that this ability is really hard to use properly. With a cooldown of 8seconds (it might be further reduced by magic resistance if a similar thing to the haste bug occurs) this means you only have about 3-4 seconds of full increased damage with each second after dropping the amount. But if you look at it - 100 or so damage from 40 damage base (assuming that there isn't too much stamina left) implies around a 100+% increase in damage with similar values achieved by cleave (by itself). Of course I probably had some stamina left so it would be more likely around 60-80% increased damage but still, the game mechanics do appear to be working.

But due to its rather ridiculous length I think this should be only used in those cases where you're dealing crazy damage over very short periods of time - e.g. a mighty blow against a death hexed enemy that has been brittled etc.

Hope that helps

Modifié par mr_afk, 02 mai 2011 - 06:56 .

[Fenrishowl]

Ok, it seems like it´s a REALY a bad abbility to spend points in.
A lot thanks to you Mr AFk!

Til next tread!

[PillarBiter]

thread necromance:

How I use my warrior:I start out with berserk on, cleave and haste is used. When those are used up, I use about 6 adrenalines, followed by second wind. By the time that's run out, I can restart. This way, adrenaline really serves my pretty well, mostly because i still get full benefits from my full stamina due to second wind. Just throught I'd throw that in there...

[mr_afk]

that would work
only issue i see is that you all those adrenalines would give you ~5-6seconds of extra damage (a few seconds taken to pump adrenalines and use second wind) for a decent amount of effort.

Using second wind is pretty good trick in any case, but I don't think the adrenalines would help that much.. I'm still of the opinion that while it does work in increasing dps, its short duration means that its more useful for spike-damage talents - e.g. doing your trick (adrenalines+second wind) just before mighty blowing a brittle.

I personally don't really like berserker so haven't really tried that out much, but in theory ~+54-64% damage can be considerable when you're dealing in the thousands..

[RPGamer13]

Bereserk is really good later on when you've nearly maxed it out and if you get the Reaver ability that increases how fast you attack every time an enemy is felled.

I found out Adrenaline isn't really worth it, not the way I play.

It costs 20 Stamina and even though you regain stamina by killing enemies as a warrior, it's still not enough if your Stamina isn't high enough. I also found out you do slightly more damage putting more points into Strength with Berserker active.

But if you can find the right balance between more Strength past what's required to equip the best armor, and raising Willpower then perhaps that would give you the best damage output and be able to use Adrenaline if one wants to.

Also, now that the secondary costs of equipping armor has been reduced, 17 Points for the Champion Armor, if you don't want to raise your HP you could use the points past 17 for raising either STR or WIL.

[thendcomes]

Adrenaline is counter intuitive when used like Bolster. Sure it boosts your damage, but it has a cast time, so you're losing out on damage you could be causing RIGHT NOW. There's a high opportunity cost.

Adrenaline can be used mid swing or mid-special ability with no loss of time. Repeated use in that way would be worthwhile, but unless you have super human reaction time (or pause every quarter second) there's just no way to take advantage of it when you're attacking so fast.

[jbblue05]

Adrenaline is underrated its at its best when combined with haste and barrage