167 réponses à ce sujet

[Whyp_2]

Sorry for the hate, but I just have to say this.

I am so pissed at BW just now. They have confirmed that only a few of our previous squadmates will be back as permanent squadmates, or will be with you for only a mission or two, or only make a cameo. Now this is annoying. I mean, what was the point of even having the old squad with you? Yeah, I've seen all the thread on "why [insert squadmate here] will be leaving the Normandy for this and that kind of reasons" and all threads I've read about just sounds dumb.

BW gave me an awesome squad in ME1, and only a few joined me in ME2, which was dumd. Atleast Garrus and Tali stayed loyal, but what about Ashley and Liara? No?
But we still got other awesome squadmates, like Grunt and Thane, etc. But then I hear that only a few of them will return in ME3 to join me in the Normandy? So NOW you're giving me Ashley and Liara, and some new dude thar we have never met before? Well thanks a lot BW.

And I guess this James Sanders is not the only squadmember we'll get. That's right, I'm sure we're gonna pic some other guys as well. So leaving the ME2 crew behind just to pick up some new dudes is not right. No matter if these new squadmates are better then the old ones, replacing them won't change a thing, no matter how good they are.

[Chewin]

Whyp_2 wrote...
I am so pissed at BW just now. They have confirmed that only a few of our previous squadmates will be back as permanent squadmates, or will be with you for only a mission or two, or only make a cameo. Now this is annoying.

*Sigh*

If everyone from the previous games returned as a permanent party member, introducing new characters would be difficult...and the character selection screen would be a mess. The trick is giving gamers a satisfying payoff to the relationship they've built while managing the roles that each characters can play, from cameo to major player.

[Fat Headed Wolf]

You know the classic poem "The Waste Land" by T.S. Eliot? This thread reminds me of it. How so you ask, well let me explain.

In the poem Eliot writes the classic line, "I will show you fear in a handful of dust."

I always wondered what that meant. "Fear in a handful of dust"? I know the whole poem is about modern man being cut-off from tradition, but what does "fear in a handful of dust" mean?

This thread helps me understand.

I am scared because someone can be irate over a game with only a few details revealed (we know very little--almost nothing) and the dust is my small amount of dry, almost-nonexistent hope for humanity blowing away in the wind.

[Whyp_2]

Chewin3 wrote...
*Sigh*

If everyone from the previous games returned as a permanent party member, introducing new characters would be difficult...and the character selection screen would be a mess. The trick is giving gamers a satisfying payoff to the relationship they've built while managing the roles that each characters can play, from cameo to major player.

Maybe, but from what I've been hearing, the way BW is heading, this doesn't sound good at all.


@Fat Headed Wolf Good for you. It was my pleasure to help you

[JunMadine]

Chewin3 wrote...

Whyp_2 wrote...
I am so pissed at BW just now. They have confirmed that only a few of our previous squadmates will be back as permanent squadmates, or will be with you for only a mission or two, or only make a cameo. Now this is annoying.

*Sigh*

If everyone from the previous games returned as a permanent party member, introducing new characters would be difficult...and the character selection screen would be a mess. The trick is giving gamers a satisfying payoff to the relationship they've built while managing the roles that each characters can play, from cameo to major player.

The Normandy is a Heavy Frigate not a cruiser.  The squad selection screen would be nightmarish.  Squad members would be under utilized if there were no limitations. 

Besides would you rather have the squad members not show up at all or have their moment as your party member and then move on to do something significant later in the game?  There is no perfect solution but I think bioware took the best option considering.

[Fat Headed Wolf]

Whyp_2 wrote...
@Fat Headed Wolf Good for you. It was my pleasure to help you

I was just joking. Didn't mean anything personal. Anyone on these forums who knows me could tell you the same. 

I was just coming up with a clever way to tell you to:

Step one: Take a deep breath.

Step two: Relax.

We know almost nothing. And just because a character hasn't been confirmed now doesn't mean they are not full time squaddies. If I remember correctly we didn't get an offical announcement on Garrus being in the ME2 squad all the way up to launch.

If I upset you with my joke, please take my sincere apology good sir/madam. 

Modifié par Fat Headed Wolf, 02 mai 2011 - 04:57 .

[Lady Luck]

JunMadine wrote...

Chewin3 wrote...

Whyp_2 wrote...
I am so pissed at BW just now. They have confirmed that only a few of our previous squadmates will be back as permanent squadmates, or will be with you for only a mission or two, or only make a cameo. Now this is annoying.

*Sigh*

If everyone from the previous games returned as a permanent party member, introducing new characters would be difficult...and the character selection screen would be a mess. The trick is giving gamers a satisfying payoff to the relationship they've built while managing the roles that each characters can play, from cameo to major player.

The Normandy is a Heavy Frigate not a cruiser.  The squad selection screen would be nightmarish.  Squad members would be under utilized if there were no limitations. 

Besides would you rather have the squad members not show up at all or have their moment as your party member and then move on to do something significant later in the game?  There is no perfect solution but I think bioware took the best option considering.

Agreed on both parts.

+1 to both of you boys;)

[Tripedius]

First off, they join you for a mission. From which they might not return. They do their job, live (or die) and are happy to return to their 'normal' lives. Which do exist. At the end of ME2 the reaper threat isn't as iminent as the collectors abducting humans. What should have the done? Hang around in the cargo bay all day? Besides the Normandy is probably impounded by the alliance. It actually makes sense that the go back and do their thing and not stay with Shep like they have no life.
Secondly some squad members could have died. BW needs to deal with that without (assuming) writing big parts for those easily killed. As much as I like Mordin he can get killed pretty easily so he will probably play a cameo role.

[crimzontearz]

Ash/Kaiden and Liara did not join in ME2 because the point of ME2 was that everyone could die and they are too pivotal to ME3 to die in ME2

but I agree that Bioware need to find the quad to say "you killed everyone in ME2? Deal with the consequences and therefore less content"....otherwise what was the point?

[Clonedzero]

i completely understand them not giving us all of ME2's cast plus a bunch of other people, that'd be way too many.

there are alot that make more sense as a cameo than a full squadmate regardless of how awesome the character is.

Samara - no reason to keep following you. she has her code and fulfilled her promise to you.
Thane - he's probably dead, or his disease has progressed too far to be of any use. (hope they dont backpedal on his dying status as it was a huge part of his personality and character in ME2, the whole reflecting on his life before he dies thing)
Both DLC characters, Zaeed and Kasumi - both were just being paid to do the mission.
Mordin - while one of my favorite characters in ME2, he makes more sense as a cameo, as he should be in a lab doing his thing instead of fighting. maybe the normandy's science officer restricted to the lab.
Tali - personally i think she makes far more sense as a noncombat person. either dealing specifically with the quarians or just being your chief engineer on the ship.
Jacob - seems fairly insignificant. he's not particularly useful in a story perspective against cerberus since he was just a glorified rent-a-cop. only reason he'd have a larger role is his possible LI status.
Wrex - i hope they dont cheapen him to squadmate status. he's pretty much the king of the krogans, he's got more important things to do than follow shepard around. maybe have him be a temporary squadmate.
Liara - i know she's pretty much confirmed as a full squadmate, but i would have rather preferred her being your info person, maybe the person on the radio feeding you info throughout missions

while other characters would be more important to the overall story or just make sense as squadmates.
Garrus - already confirmed, but he's a great choice as a squadmate.
Miranda - loyal to you, and would be a great asset to fight against cerberus since she was an extremely high ranked cerberus officer.
Grunt - you're his battlemaster and greatly respects you. other than maybe going to help Wrex unite the clans i dont see him doing anything else than helping you kill stuff.
Legion - he's your liaison to the geth.
Jack - i could potentially see her rejoining the crew. i think it'd be best to leave her joining you specifically up to what you did in ME2. helping her deal with her issues results in her rejoining you, not helping would result in her being a cameo status where she doesnt join you.
the VS - confirmed to be rejoining, which im happy about. as i'd like to see their characters progress, especially since they could be former LI and promoted to spectre.

thats how i'd do it. i think i might have forgotten someone though lol.

[Clonedzero]

crimzontearz wrote...

Ash/Kaiden and Liara did not join in ME2 because the point of ME2 was that everyone could die and they are too pivotal to ME3 to die in ME2

but I agree that Bioware need to find the quad to say "you killed everyone in ME2? Deal with the consequences and therefore less content"....otherwise what was the point?

yeah. them playing too safe and going "well some people might have ____ dead in their save so we cant make them significant in any way" is a total cop-out. people should have serious consquences for having people be dead. they should miss out on entire missions in some cases.

obviously some people are more significant than others. mordin and miranda easily playing a heavy role in ME3, while samara and thane playing less.

[Whyp_2]

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...
I was just joking. Didn't mean anything personal. Anyone on these forums who knows me could tell you the same. 

I was just coming up with a clever way to tell you to:

Step one: Take a deep breath.

Step two: Relax.

We know almost nothing. And just because a character hasn't been confirmed now doesn't mean they are not full time squaddies. If I remember correctly we didn't get an offical announcement on Garrus being in the ME2 squad all the way up to launch.

If I upset you with my joke, please take my sincere apology good sir/madam. 

*Takes a deap breath*

*Starts relaxing*

Yes, you're right, but I don't like what I am hearing. Yeah, I know there's still like half a year til ME3 arrives, but some squadmates will only make cameos. GameInformer and OXM confirmed it.

Don't worry, I didn't get upset

Modifié par Whyp_2, 02 mai 2011 - 05:05 .

[Fat Headed Wolf]

^ Indeed they some will be just cameos, but you just gotta hope it isn't your favorite.

To quote the legendary George Michael--

"Ya gotta have faith!"

[The_Illusive]

OP, have a chill-pill. And a little patience, and everything is gonna be alright

[Pani Mauser]

Chewin3 wrote...

If everyone from the previous games returned as a permanent party member, introducing new characters would be difficult...and the character selection screen would be a mess. The trick is giving gamers a satisfying payoff to the relationship they've built while managing the roles that each characters can play, from cameo to major player.

This actual part of GI-article made me very frustrated and destroyed all my hype for ME3. It says "Liara and VS are important, we need new character for newcomers, and everyone else can be thrown awat for all we care", only not that honest.

I'd love to see reaction of Liara and VS fans, if their favourites stayed cameos in ME3 and developers claimed to give those players "a satisfying payoff ". Were VS and Liara fans happy with cameos of their favourite characters in ME2? I have't seen that.

Seeing your favourite character as only a cameo is NEVER 
satisfying


And the character selection screen argument is ridiculous. Fighting games somehow manage to keep roasters of 30+ characters and doesn't seem to have an issue with it.

[SalsaDMA]

crimzontearz wrote...

Ash/Kaiden and Liara did not join in ME2 because the point of ME2 was that everyone could die and they are too pivotal to ME3 to die in ME2

but I agree that Bioware need to find the quad to say "you killed everyone in ME2? Deal with the consequences and therefore less content"....otherwise what was the point?

Agree.

They are basicly throwing good storytelling out of the window just to make things easier and faster to produce.

[Pani Mauser]

Fat Headed Wolf wrote...

^ Indeed they some will be just cameos, but you just gotta hope it isn't your favorite.

To quote the legendary George Michael--

"Ya gotta have faith!"

My faith is already crushed. Two slots on permament squad are already filled with the characters I wanted to see on the squad the least. And BW says that they won't be able to fit eveyone on the squad. So for me it meant that two characters I actually like won't be on the squad for sure.

[DarthSliver]

Clonedzero wrote...

i completely understand them not giving us all of ME2's cast plus a bunch of other people, that'd be way too many.

there are alot that make more sense as a cameo than a full squadmate regardless of how awesome the character is.

Samara - no reason to keep following you. she has her code and fulfilled her promise to you.
Thane - he's probably dead, or his disease has progressed too far to be of any use. (hope they dont backpedal on his dying status as it was a huge part of his personality and character in ME2, the whole reflecting on his life before he dies thing)
Both DLC characters, Zaeed and Kasumi - both were just being paid to do the mission.
Mordin - while one of my favorite characters in ME2, he makes more sense as a cameo, as he should be in a lab doing his thing instead of fighting. maybe the normandy's science officer restricted to the lab.
Tali - personally i think she makes far more sense as a noncombat person. either dealing specifically with the quarians or just being your chief engineer on the ship.
Jacob - seems fairly insignificant. he's not particularly useful in a story perspective against cerberus since he was just a glorified rent-a-cop. only reason he'd have a larger role is his possible LI status.
Wrex - i hope they dont cheapen him to squadmate status. he's pretty much the king of the krogans, he's got more important things to do than follow shepard around. maybe have him be a temporary squadmate.
Liara - i know she's pretty much confirmed as a full squadmate, but i would have rather preferred her being your info person, maybe the person on the radio feeding you info throughout missions

while other characters would be more important to the overall story or just make sense as squadmates.
Garrus - already confirmed, but he's a great choice as a squadmate.
Miranda - loyal to you, and would be a great asset to fight against cerberus since she was an extremely high ranked cerberus officer.
Grunt - you're his battlemaster and greatly respects you. other than maybe going to help Wrex unite the clans i dont see him doing anything else than helping you kill stuff.
Legion - he's your liaison to the geth.
Jack - i could potentially see her rejoining the crew. i think it'd be best to leave her joining you specifically up to what you did in ME2. helping her deal with her issues results in her rejoining you, not helping would result in her being a cameo status where she doesnt join you.
the VS - confirmed to be rejoining, which im happy about. as i'd like to see their characters progress, especially since they could be former LI and promoted to spectre.

thats how i'd do it. i think i might have forgotten someone though lol.

I actually see Miranda going off to protect her sister from Cerberus or her Dad. Remember  Cerberus was only protecting her because Miranda was working for them.

But I hope to have Legion and Liara on my ME3 squad. I hope Legion isnt reduced to an insignifcant role like a Cameo if his not a full squadmate. 

[DarthSliver]

SalsaDMA wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

Ash/Kaiden and Liara did not join in ME2 because the point of ME2 was that everyone could die and they are too pivotal to ME3 to die in ME2

but I agree that Bioware need to find the quad to say "you killed everyone in ME2? Deal with the consequences and therefore less content"....otherwise what was the point?

Agree.

They are basicly throwing good storytelling out of the window just to make things easier and faster to produce.

I agree as well, hearing that in GI it just makes ME2 almost completely pointless. I mean the majority of the game your recruiting and doing loyalty missions. BW needs to man up and force players to lose content because they decided to kill Tali off or decided to throw away Jacob because he was annoying.  I mean this is a game Trilogy where choices are suppose to matter and mean something. ME3 is the final game for Shepard so they need to make it mean something in ME3. We can hope they dont reduce them down to cameos only and give them temp squadmates.
But what they should do is since its limited squad rooster we can have, we should be able to choose who we want on our permanent rooster from the ME2 squad. But i do hope they are mostly not reduced to just a cameo and if they are, it actually makes sense rather than because "they could die" excuse. I also expect the DLC characters to only make a cameo if we have the dlc since they were for hire people.

[TobiTobsen]

Babe Mause wrote...

I'd love to see reaction of Liara and VS fans, if their favourites stayed cameos in ME3 and developers claimed to give those players "a satisfying payoff ". Were VS and Liara fans happy with cameos of their favourite characters in ME2? I have't seen that.

Well... we've already been screwed over. It's someone else's turn now.

But I can udnerstand your anger. We weren't happy about ME2 in that regard. But if you favorite character gets sidelined in the finale. Meh... that sucks.

[AngelicMachinery]

Babe Mause wrote...

Chewin3 wrote...

If everyone from the previous games returned as a permanent party member, introducing new characters would be difficult...and the character selection screen would be a mess. The trick is giving gamers a satisfying payoff to the relationship they've built while managing the roles that each characters can play, from cameo to major player.

This actual part of GI-article made me very frustrated and destroyed all my hype for ME3. It says "Liara and VS are important, we need new character for newcomers, and everyone else can be thrown awat for all we care", only not that honest.

I'd love to see reaction of Liara and VS fans, if their favourites stayed cameos in ME3 and developers claimed to give those players "a satisfying payoff ". Were VS and Liara fans happy with cameos of their favourite characters in ME2? I have't seen that.

Seeing your favourite character as only a cameo is NEVER 
satisfying


And the character selection screen argument is ridiculous. Fighting games somehow manage to keep roasters of 30+ characters and doesn't seem to have an issue with it.

I'm personally quite glad Liara will be back,  she's the only love interest that well sparked my interest in the games.  It did suck that she was dropped to a cameo in ME2 but, truthfully I got over it rather quickly.  I figured there was a purpose behind her absense in the game. 

Also,  I would hate if the character select screen just became little portraits of characters like a fighting game.

[aimlessgun]

Whyp_2 wrote...

Sorry for the hate, but I just have to say this.

I am so pissed at BW just now. They have confirmed that only a few of our previous squadmates will be back as permanent squadmates, or will be with you for only a mission or two, or only make a cameo. Now this is annoying. I mean, what was the point of even having the old squad with you? Yeah, I've seen all the thread on "why [insert squadmate here] will be leaving the Normandy for this and that kind of reasons" and all threads I've read about just sounds dumb.

BW gave me an awesome squad in ME1, and only a few joined me in ME2, which was dumd. Atleast Garrus and Tali stayed loyal, but what about Ashley and Liara? No?
But we still got other awesome squadmates, like Grunt and Thane, etc. But then I hear that only a few of them will return in ME3 to join me in the Normandy? So NOW you're giving me Ashley and Liara, and some new dude thar we have never met before? Well thanks a lot BW.

And I guess this James Sanders is not the only squadmember we'll get. That's right, I'm sure we're gonna pic some other guys as well. So leaving the ME2 crew behind just to pick up some new dudes is not right. No matter if these new squadmates are better then the old ones, replacing them won't change a thing, no matter how good they are.

You didn't actually expect everyone would be back as a full squadmate did you?

Because to expect that would be incredibly naive. It would mean you didn't understand that Mass Effect was a an extremely expensive and difficult to make game produced by a company interested in making money. It would mean you didn't really work out in your head the difficulties and challenges of bringing back every single squadmate. It would mean you expect impossible perfection out of the world you live in.

Being self-righteously pissed at BW for not bringing back every single squadmate is utterly ridiculous.

If you're just venting, fine. But if you truly believe you have some sort of moral high ground here, I don't know what to say.

Modifié par aimlessgun, 02 mai 2011 - 06:51 .

[KainrycKarr]

LI's are coming back full-time either as characters or squadmates, mark my words. The non-LI's will be cameos and whatnot. Heard it here first, folks.

[Manic Sheep]

What actually has been said in terms of squadmates?  I know about the ones confirmed as temp or permanent in the GI article but I haven’t seen any of the latest GI stuff because It will kill my damn bandwidth so if anything was mentioned there I don't know about it (if there is a text summary anywhere people could link me to I would apreciate it)

Modifié par Manic Sheep, 02 mai 2011 - 07:12 .