305 réponses à ce sujet

[Dragoonlordz]

Zjarcal wrote...

Persephone wrote...
Does she look like me? Heck, NO. Neither does my Warden, they are all WAY prettier than I can ever hope to be.

And it's not like one couldn't try to make their character's face match their own.

A first person player does while a third person player does not. Perse is a third person style player by preference (imho).

The kind of person who prefers ME/ME2/DA2 to DAO and Fallout 3 as example. This doesn't mean she does not enjoy them all, it is just likley given her play style from her replies that is what I think would apply to her preferences.

You can argue till your blue in the face it will not change the fact the game was made towards one style and not another if you wish to argue with who and what was created as and for take it up with the developers. I explained the difference so did the developers as I showed, if you just 'don't understand' that is your own fault.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 05 mai 2011 - 10:47 .

[Persephone]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Does she sound like me? No. But I love her VO and her delivery is spot on.

Does she look like me? Heck, NO. Neither does my Warden, they are all WAY prettier than I can ever hope to be.

As for the last question: Resounding YES!:happy:

You proved my point yourself. You played and enjoyed more someone elses voice, you create your characters based on someone else a ideological appearence one that is not you. The only thing you attributed to yourself was choices (this is a first person play style)  but because of the first two answers you are already playing as someone else by choice and preference.

Why not have a beautified version of "me"? I always do that in games. (Besides, recreating my face is a PAIN) And I WISH I had the female Warden's figure that's "forced" on me. (In "The Guild II" I could have a meatier gal, but it was done poorly) As for the voice, I don't need a mute character to RP him/her as myself. As for those rules, according to that I should NEVER play as a male, a dwarf or an elf. Or any Warden, given that the Wardens are all younger than I am and I share none of their backgrounds.

[Dragoonlordz]

Persephone wrote...

Why not have a beautified version of "me"? I always do that in games. (Besides, recreating my face is a PAIN) And I WISH I had the female Warden's figure that's "forced" on me. (In "The Guild II" I could have a meatier gal, but it was done poorly) As for the voice, I don't need a mute character to RP him/her as myself. As for those rules, according to that I should NEVER play as a male, a dwarf or an elf. Or any Warden, given that the Wardens are all younger than I am and I share none of their backgrounds.

You don't appear to have read what it is I wrote prior.

Games designed for first persona style does not preclude third persona style players from doing so if they can get over the silent protaganist and few other things. However games designed for third persona style are vastly harder for first persona RP gamers to get into.

"Perse is a third person style player by preference (imho). The kind of person who prefers ME/ME2/DA2 to DAO and Fallout 3 as example. This doesn't mean she does not enjoy them all, it is just likley given her play style from her replies that is what I think would apply to her preferences."

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 05 mai 2011 - 10:57 .

[Persephone]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

You don't appear to have read what it is I wrote prior.

Games designed for first persona style does not preclude third persona style players from doing so if they can get over the silent protaganist and few other things. However games designed for third persona style are vastly harder for first persona RP gamers to get into.

Hmmmmmmm..........maybe my Adventure background comes into play there. I always try to put myself into the character I play (Via imagination etc.), no matter the genre. Sometimes I succeed (DAII, DAO) and sometimes I fail. (The Witcher)

[Dragoonlordz]

Persephone wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

You don't appear to have read what it is I wrote prior.

Games designed for first persona style does not preclude third persona style players from doing so if they can get over the silent protaganist and few other things. However games designed for third persona style are vastly harder for first persona RP gamers to get into.

Hmmmmmmm..........maybe my Adventure background comes into play there. I always try to put myself into the character I play (Via imagination etc.), no matter the genre. Sometimes I succeed (DAII, DAO) and sometimes I fail. (The Witcher)

It's not impossible for both RP style gamers to enjoy either type however how the game is designed aka (third type) makes it harder for first person RPers to create that character in their image/sound and sometimes choices like in jRPGs etc and ME series even DA2 it breaks immersion for a first persona player when the voice is not their own, when they prefer a VO or not using the CC to recreate themselves by choice they are prefering third persona style.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 05 mai 2011 - 11:04 .

[neppakyo]

Dragoonlordz wrote pretty much how I feel. I'm more of a first person persona, probably due to years of playing NWN1/NWN2 persistant worlds. With ME1/2 I never really got into shepard. I just treated the game as an interesting story that I blow sh!t up in, and shut my brain off. Not to say I didnt fine shepard interesting or ME not fun. I did enjoy it, I just didnt require any brain power to do it

Sorry pepsi, his dragon symbol and logic wins. We both have to concede defeat to him

Modifié par neppakyo, 05 mai 2011 - 11:07 .

[Dragoonlordz]

I enjoy ME series a great deal but I can't play it as first persona implanting myself in that universe, it will always be sheperd. It is, what it was designed as and I understood that so I had already accepted that and played it as such. However what annoys me is DAO was designed as first style and DA2 was not, in DAO I could play as first person and in DA2 I could not because there was too much that broke that immersion. I would have prefered ME series was the third type and that they kept the first for DA franchise instead of now what is essentially 2 series both from now on third person style (which is great if your preference is that play style which mine is not because I had hoped DA franchise would stay first person instead). Even though I know why they did change it to make more sales as there are vastly more third than first persona players but in the end I do lose out on something that was special for me.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 05 mai 2011 - 11:52 .

[snackrat]

I am fine with the dialogue WHEEL, including the icons. What I find awkward is the dialogue PARAPHRASING.

[Zem_]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Just because you cannot comprehend it doesn't change the reality of it. You may not understand how a plane flys doesn't mean that they don't fly.  Some people can't imagine possibilities but thats your own issue, lack of imagination and understanding. I am a first persona style RP gamer. I can see the clear difference between what is and what is not first or third person in games. My type of game is the former and others (yours apparently because you can't comphrend my way) makes you only play in third person.

You're going off the deep end here.  This is not about reality.  It is about perception and as such there is no real right or wrong.  If YOU believe you are "inhabiting" the warden and only directing Hawke then that is your business.  Just as you, however, are stating this opinion, I am stating another one and giving my own reasons why I do not see the two situations as so different.  This is not objective reality as is the science of why planes fly.

DAO was first person and ME1/2 and DA2 are third person that is how they are designed.

First and third person are about perspective.  A game designer can tell you how they intend you to view their game.  They cannot tell you how to view the game.   To me there is absolutely no difference between the two experiences.  Cousland is no different than Hawke.  Both are characters designed by someone else, with back stories and families and everything designed by someone else.  I get to pick appearance, gender, and class/skills which, incidentally, is just like Cmdr. Shepard.  Everything else is the same.  The dialogue is written by someone else and I only get to choose a line. 

So what makes it third person vs. first?  Is it the number of Origins then?  How many is enough to go from third to first?  Just two?  Half a dozen?  Is it a function only of being voiced or not?  What is the defining characteristic of first vs. third person if it is NOT how *I* choose to view the game.  Not you.  Not Drs. Bioware.

Most of the time third persona RP players tend to favor ME series and DA2 over DAO and they can't pin it down to why but list silent main protgantist as the main reason why they dislike DAO amongst other things (first persona attributes but they don't realise is one of many things that effect a first person/third person play style).

I played and enjoyed both games.  Frankly, I don't care if the character is voiced or not, dialogue wheeled or listed.  These just are not religious war issues for me.  Gimme the game.  Tell me how it works.  I'll do the rest with that imagination and comprehension you claim I don't have.

[sonsonthebia07]

Karsciyin wrote...

I am fine with the dialogue WHEEL, including the icons. What I find awkward is the dialogue PARAPHRASING.

This is about how I feel. Sometimes the paraphrasing leads to the PC saying things completely off from what you were expecting.

I actually prefer the wheel to older systems in Bioware games.

[erynnar]

neppakyo wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote pretty much how I feel. I'm more of a first person persona, probably due to years of playing NWN1/NWN2 persistant worlds. With ME1/2 I never really got into shepard. I just treated the game as an interesting story that I blow sh!t up in, and shut my brain off. Not to say I didnt fine shepard interesting or ME not fun. I did enjoy it, I just didnt require any brain power to do it

Sorry pepsi, his dragon symbol and logic wins. We both have to concede defeat to him

Me too. I am a first person player. I just can't get into being Hawke or Shep. I like Shep, but she isn't me and neither was Hawke. I played my city elf totally different from my Cous Cous. It was still me, but they were totally different people. I guess it fufills the frustrated actor in me. I still regret not taking drama in school.

[neppakyo]

erynnar wrote...

Me too. I am a first person player. I just can't get into being Hawke or Shep. I like Shep, but she isn't me and neither was Hawke. I played my city elf totally different from my Cous Cous. It was still me, but they were totally different people. I guess it fufills the frustrated actor in me. I still regret not taking drama in school.

I did sorta did take drama in grade 8, but I felt like an idiot on stage so I stopped that. Plus I couldn't sing. Stupid Nickleodian play *shakes fist* I do not want to put another nickle in!

Modifié par neppakyo, 06 mai 2011 - 02:27 .

[Tommy6860]

erynnar wrote...

neppakyo wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote pretty much how I feel. I'm more of a first person persona, probably due to years of playing NWN1/NWN2 persistant worlds. With ME1/2 I never really got into shepard. I just treated the game as an interesting story that I blow sh!t up in, and shut my brain off. Not to say I didnt fine shepard interesting or ME not fun. I did enjoy it, I just didnt require any brain power to do it

Sorry pepsi, his dragon symbol and logic wins. We both have to concede defeat to him

Me too. I am a first person player. I just can't get into being Hawke or Shep. I like Shep, but she isn't me and neither was Hawke. I played my city elf totally different from my Cous Cous. It was still me, but they were totally different people. I guess it fufills the frustrated actor in me. I still regret not taking drama in school.

I agree to an extent here. But ME plays more to RPG elements than does DA2 by far. Shep may not be my character that I created, but the game format was made so that Shep worked well within the frame of RPG elements. Hawke simply doesn't as I am guided through the game to areas of which I have no choice in choosing and companion conversation that only happen when scripted event is triggered and I meet them at their bases.

For example, to get to the end of Act I in DA2, I am simply following the mission/quest forced in a way that I have to do them in the order they come to get there. All the while most of those quests have little to do with the overall story, I am limited to how my companions interact with me as well. In ME There is no set stage I have to go by, I can go to either Feros, Therum or Noveria in any one order, which causes the game to change somewhat, even between companion interactions (Liara is simply a hoot is she's gotten last as a companion). I can talk to my companions anytime on the ship, which is one location and depending on how far along I am, the convos can change. The convos are still very limited though, when compared to Origins type games. I can name a few more, but I think you get the idea.

Edit: Also add that DA2 doesn't really follow well to Origins in style, gameplay and story, where the ME series so far is still very relevant in those areas.

Modifié par Tommy6860, 06 mai 2011 - 02:29 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Zem_ wrote...
 

It's not my job to educate you, I have explained about 3 pages worth of posts in these forums on the subject.

The games are designed with ideologies in mind they add game mechanics to push the game in that direction. It is not just about perception it includes specific design choices reflected in actual components in game.

Like I said earlier you can argue till your blue in the face, you cannot convince me the sun is green just because you keep replying again and again tweaking your responses saying it over and over hoping for a ****** in my armour/position. I have explained it many times as have the developers of which I linked part of the article which partially covered some of their responses towards this aspect and others regarding dialogue.

Now I'm done talking about this because I have had this same debate many times on these forums from people not 'understanding'. The original post (including article) was about dialogue and while persona plays a part in that it is not the only issue and I have gone into enough detail about that on top of the developers comments explaining it.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 06 mai 2011 - 03:00 .

[Zem_]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

It's not my job to educate you,

Don't flatter yourself.   

[Boiny Bunny]

It's very rare that I find an RPG that I play in the first person. DA:O, DA2, ME, ME2 were all definately 3rd person games for me. I was playing 'Hawke' or 'Shepard' - but not 'being' them. Same with all Bioware games actually, going back to BG.

Definately 3rd person with The Witcher (seeing as it seems to be the favorite comparison game here) also.

Basically, if I'm going to play in a first person perspective, I need a complete blank slate of a character that I can do more or less anything with. Surprisingly, this results in me playing most open world games in the first person (e.g. Morrowind, Fallout 3 + NV - not so much earlier Fallouts though). I also very much played the first Dead Space (before Isaac learned how to talk) in the first person perspective. And most horror games actually (DOOM 3 also springs to mind) - no other way to play them.

I would say there are two major factors (to me) that contribute to being played in the first person:

1) Immersiveness. This is instant for a good horror game, and not bad for some Bioware games, extremely high for The Witcher (one of the main reasons I like that game so much). This depends on a variety of factors - how well the lore of the world is described, how well the world is depicted including following its own rules/lore, graphics, attention to little details, the music, etc.

2) How 'free' you are to navigate through the world as you would if you were really a part of it. For me, Bioware games (and The Witcher) are sorely lacking in this department. All force you into an incredibly linear story, with the option of switching the order of a few quests around, and little else. There are choices to be made, but ultimately 95% of the gameplay is controlled by what the developer wanted you to do.

[erynnar]

Tommy6860 wrote...

erynnar wrote...

neppakyo wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote pretty much how I feel. I'm more of a first person persona, probably due to years of playing NWN1/NWN2 persistant worlds. With ME1/2 I never really got into shepard. I just treated the game as an interesting story that I blow sh!t up in, and shut my brain off. Not to say I didnt fine shepard interesting or ME not fun. I did enjoy it, I just didnt require any brain power to do it

Sorry pepsi, his dragon symbol and logic wins. We both have to concede defeat to him

Me too. I am a first person player. I just can't get into being Hawke or Shep. I like Shep, but she isn't me and neither was Hawke. I played my city elf totally different from my Cous Cous. It was still me, but they were totally different people. I guess it fufills the frustrated actor in me. I still regret not taking drama in school.

I agree to an extent here. But ME plays more to RPG elements than does DA2 by far. Shep may not be my character that I created, but the game format was made so that Shep worked well within the frame of RPG elements. Hawke simply doesn't as I am guided through the game to areas of which I have no choice in choosing and companion conversation that only happen when scripted event is triggered and I meet them at their bases.

For example, to get to the end of Act I in DA2, I am simply following the mission/quest forced in a way that I have to do them in the order they come to get there. All the while most of those quests have little to do with the overall story, I am limited to how my companions interact with me as well. In ME There is no set stage I have to go by, I can go to either Feros, Therum or Noveria in any one order, which causes the game to change somewhat, even between companion interactions (Liara is simply a hoot is she's gotten last as a companion). I can talk to my companions anytime on the ship, which is one location and depending on how far along I am, the convos can change. The convos are still very limited though, when compared to Origins type games. I can name a few more, but I think you get the idea.

Edit: Also add that DA2 doesn't really follow well to Origins in style, gameplay and story, where the ME series so far is still very relevant in those areas.

I can't speak to ME yet, I just started playing. Well, ME2. I stopped in the hopes that hubby will left go of ME1 for me to play before I start ME2. So, I shouldn't say Shep isnt' me, I only played her really briefly. My bad on that. But good to know that ME2 is more RPG than DA2 (which I didn't like being a car on an obvious rail, I prefer bumper cars like DAO).

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

Karsciyin wrote...

I am fine with the dialogue WHEEL, including the icons. What I find awkward is the dialogue PARAPHRASING.

/signed

Pictures indicating intent/tone I have little problem with. Paraphrasing I didn't like. It was too Third Person for my delicate FP RPG stomach.

Not that I don't like Third Person on its own merits. Heck, the more recent Monkey Island games had full text AND full VO, so it's not like Bioware couldn't do the same, right? Or is that too much reading? I know! Another Toggle! Toggles solve everything! People can bounce between full text and paraphrases. Or go 'No Text' mode and just have icons (like in The Bard's Tale reboot)!

*goes back for more coffee*

[Nathan Redgrave]

What I like about the dialogue wheel is the at-a-glance aspect, which is actually improved upon through the use of those nifty icons (hope they bring those back in ME3). It's easy to determine which option you want, select it on the fly, and keep the conversation rolling smoothly, whereas with Origins- or Oblivion-style "select from a list of sentences" choices, you're almost always going to stop and read all the options every few seconds before proceeding. The voice is a secondary perk; even in Faery: Legends of Avalon (think "a poor man's Mass Effect with turn-based combat and fairies"), the dialogue wheel's innate swiftness kept the pace up nicely, and all the dialogue was text in that game.

The problem with the system is that it requires a lot of work on the designers' part to ensure that 1) character dialogue choices don't swing too unbelievably far away from each other as to make a mix-and-match approach to decision-making jarringly out-of-character (DA2 had this problem), and 2) that the dialogue wheel's text and icon prompts are as clear as they can be so that what comes out isn't contrary to the player's intention (they've all had this problem at some point or other).

[Tommy6860]

erynnar wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

erynnar wrote...

neppakyo wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote pretty much how I feel. I'm more of a first person persona, probably due to years of playing NWN1/NWN2 persistant worlds. With ME1/2 I never really got into shepard. I just treated the game as an interesting story that I blow sh!t up in, and shut my brain off. Not to say I didnt fine shepard interesting or ME not fun. I did enjoy it, I just didnt require any brain power to do it

Sorry pepsi, his dragon symbol and logic wins. We both have to concede defeat to him

Me too. I am a first person player. I just can't get into being Hawke or Shep. I like Shep, but she isn't me and neither was Hawke. I played my city elf totally different from my Cous Cous. It was still me, but they were totally different people. I guess it fufills the frustrated actor in me. I still regret not taking drama in school.

I agree to an extent here. But ME plays more to RPG elements than does DA2 by far. Shep may not be my character that I created, but the game format was made so that Shep worked well within the frame of RPG elements. Hawke simply doesn't as I am guided through the game to areas of which I have no choice in choosing and companion conversation that only happen when scripted event is triggered and I meet them at their bases.

For example, to get to the end of Act I in DA2, I am simply following the mission/quest forced in a way that I have to do them in the order they come to get there. All the while most of those quests have little to do with the overall story, I am limited to how my companions interact with me as well. In ME There is no set stage I have to go by, I can go to either Feros, Therum or Noveria in any one order, which causes the game to change somewhat, even between companion interactions (Liara is simply a hoot is she's gotten last as a companion). I can talk to my companions anytime on the ship, which is one location and depending on how far along I am, the convos can change. The convos are still very limited though, when compared to Origins type games. I can name a few more, but I think you get the idea.

Edit: Also add that DA2 doesn't really follow well to Origins in style, gameplay and story, where the ME series so far is still very relevant in those areas.

I can't speak to ME yet, I just started playing. Well, ME2. I stopped in the hopes that hubby will left go of ME1 for me to play before I start ME2. So, I shouldn't say Shep isnt' me, I only played her really briefly. My bad on that. But good to know that ME2 is more RPG than DA2 (which I didn't like being a car on an obvious rail, I prefer bumper cars like DAO).

You'll see how much more you will like being Shep than you did Hawke, trust me, even when the romance happens, anyway...

Don't touch ME2 at all until you play ME thoroughly and I mean listen and pay attention to every convo, seriously, the story is really deep. I  agree with your "bumper car" analogy, I am the same way, but I don't limit myself as I did a few decades ago when I started on cRPGs. Not until Daggefall, then the first two Fallouts that I really started to appreciate cRPG gaming and it works. But is it changing and I will give the newer releases a chance. ME turned out to be much more than I thought, and I was worried considering it is a futuristic shooter type RPG, but it was Bioware, so..... There are also side missions in ME that are heavily tied in to ME2 and they are revealing to say the least. If per chance, you want to little spoiler or just a hint, message me when you get to points in ME and ME2, or shoulder tap hubby to get clues .

Modifié par Tommy6860, 06 mai 2011 - 12:41 .

[Tommy6860]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

It's very rare that I find an RPG that I play in the first person. DA:O, DA2, ME, ME2 were all definately 3rd person games for me. I was playing 'Hawke' or 'Shepard' - but not 'being' them. Same with all Bioware games actually, going back to BG.

Definately 3rd person with The Witcher (seeing as it seems to be the favorite comparison game here) also.

Basically, if I'm going to play in a first person perspective, I need a complete blank slate of a character that I can do more or less anything with. Surprisingly, this results in me playing most open world games in the first person (e.g. Morrowind, Fallout 3 + NV - not so much earlier Fallouts though). I also very much played the first Dead Space (before Isaac learned how to talk) in the first person perspective. And most horror games actually (DOOM 3 also springs to mind) - no other way to play them.

I would say there are two major factors (to me) that contribute to being played in the first person:

1) Immersiveness. This is instant for a good horror game, and not bad for some Bioware games, extremely high for The Witcher (one of the main reasons I like that game so much). This depends on a variety of factors - how well the lore of the world is described, how well the world is depicted including following its own rules/lore, graphics, attention to little details, the music, etc.

2) How 'free' you are to navigate through the world as you would if you were really a part of it. For me, Bioware games (and The Witcher) are sorely lacking in this department. All force you into an incredibly linear story, with the option of switching the order of a few quests around, and little else. There are choices to be made, but ultimately 95% of the gameplay is controlled by what the developer wanted you to do.

This^ I can associate with a great deal. It be great to have an open world roamer like Oblivion/Fallout/Morrowind, etals, be first person, but have the complete RPG elements of a BG, DA:O, etc. I can only dream for that with the graphics capabilities of today. I really loved how I could roam in Fallout 3, but the story was so weak (though the dark humor was totally great) and though it had the typical RPG element of stat and character builds, the interactions were weak, but that is typical Bethesda for the most part.

[Morroian]

Tommy6860 wrote...

I agree to an extent here. But ME plays more to RPG elements than does DA2 by far. Shep may not be my character that I created, but the game format was made so that Shep worked well within the frame of RPG elements. Hawke simply doesn't as I am guided through the game to areas of which I have no choice in choosing and companion conversation that only happen when scripted event is triggered and I meet them at their bases.

Depends what you consider role playing elements. From your post I would say a lot of what you consider role playing elements are in actual fact just common rpg tropes IMHO. I've said it in other threads but I managed to create and role play more vivid and rounded Hawke characters than I managed to for Shepherd in either ME game or the Warden. 

I agree that there are 1st and 3rd person role playing styles but as I've said before a 3rd person playing style can include just as much role playing 1st person.

Modifié par Morroian, 06 mai 2011 - 12:55 .

[Tommy6860]

Morroian wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

I agree to an extent here. But ME plays more to RPG elements than does DA2 by far. Shep may not be my character that I created, but the game format was made so that Shep worked well within the frame of RPG elements. Hawke simply doesn't as I am guided through the game to areas of which I have no choice in choosing and companion conversation that only happen when scripted event is triggered and I meet them at their bases.

Depends what you consider role playing elements. From your post I would say a lot of what you consider role playing elements are in actual fact just common rpg tropes IMHO. I've said it in other threads but I managed to create and role play more vivid and rounded Hawke characters than I managed to for Shepherd in either ME game or the Warden. 

Well, there you go, the tropes work for you, where they didn't for me. It's all how you like a game, and if you enjoy the game, that's all that matters, really.
:happy:

[G00N3R7883]

I've never had a problem with the paraphrasing in the dialogue wheel. Having played through ME1 4 times, ME2 3 times, and DA2 1 time, the only time I can remember seriously thinking "I didn't actually want to say that" was in DA2 when one of Hawke's "amusing/sarcastic" options said something about "so I shouldn't slit my wrists and dance around naked?". Other than that, Shepard and Hawke said what I wanted to say.

[Rockpopple]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

It's very rare that I find an RPG that I play in the first person. DA:O, DA2, ME, ME2 were all definately 3rd person games for me. I was playing 'Hawke' or 'Shepard' - but not 'being' them. Same with all Bioware games actually, going back to BG.

Definately 3rd person with The Witcher (seeing as it seems to be the favorite comparison game here) also.

Basically, if I'm going to play in a first person perspective, I need a complete blank slate of a character that I can do more or less anything with. Surprisingly, this results in me playing most open world games in the first person (e.g. Morrowind, Fallout 3 + NV - not so much earlier Fallouts though). I also very much played the first Dead Space (before Isaac learned how to talk) in the first person perspective. And most horror games actually (DOOM 3 also springs to mind) - no other way to play them.

I would say there are two major factors (to me) that contribute to being played in the first person:

1) Immersiveness. This is instant for a good horror game, and not bad for some Bioware games, extremely high for The Witcher (one of the main reasons I like that game so much). This depends on a variety of factors - how well the lore of the world is described, how well the world is depicted including following its own rules/lore, graphics, attention to little details, the music, etc.

2) How 'free' you are to navigate through the world as you would if you were really a part of it. For me, Bioware games (and The Witcher) are sorely lacking in this department. All force you into an incredibly linear story, with the option of switching the order of a few quests around, and little else. There are choices to be made, but ultimately 95% of the gameplay is controlled by what the developer wanted you to do.

DING DING DING! WE HAVE A WINNNAHHHH! Dragon Age: Origins was no more a 1st person Roleplaying game by design than Dragon Age II or Mass Effect or the Witcher was. Ny-uh. 

I mean, if one chooses to play them as 1st person games, have at it hoss! Bust the nut of fun! Dance the dance of life! 

But those that chose to play them in the 3rd person were not doin' it rong. 

Now we just have to wait until Hermione Gra- I mean, Dragoon comes back and tells us all that we're simply plebeians who don't understand the true intent of these games because of our limited imaginations, brain size, and possible the size of our johnsons. Those of us who have johnsons. 

Modifié par Rockpopple, 06 mai 2011 - 03:02 .