331 réponses à ce sujet

[Maria Caliban]

Merced652 wrote...

Really? So you're telling me its impossible to be loyal at point A, but due to circumstances not be loyal by point B? Its totally binary?

"I bought a dozen games from you that I loved, but I don't like this one, so I'm finished with the IP," isn't loyalty. That's like saying you're loyal to your friends but only when they're fun to be around.

[Arken]

neppakyo wrote...

Elhanan wrote...

@ OP

Much like yourself, I was brought to Bioware games via NWN1, and have played many of them since. And I can empathize that when someone becomes disppointed in a product or employee, this would create frustration and a need to do something to change it. And leaving the brand appears to be the tact you have chosen.

However, I think you are wrong to attempt to punish the entire company and maybe commonity for your perceived actions of one, or a single product in which you find displeasure. Persoanlly, I hope you enjoy ME3, and if your anger wanes, then scan the forums occasionally to look for games in which you may find better suited to your desires.

Good luck moving forward!

To the bolded. I will be getting ME3, just not as a pre-order or a first day buy. I'll wait for the price drop before I pick it up, and check out user reviews. If the majority of reviews for ME3 are postive, then I may buy it not long after launch. DA2 taught me a wait and see approach to Bioware games. Laidlaw is to blame for that.

I did enjoy ME2, its a series I don't expect much RPG from. If in ME3 they put back RPG elements, all the better. ME2 was a better designed game than DA2, and 10x more enjoyable.

This is what gets under my skin sometimes. People forget that Dragon Age II was made by Canadian Bioware, and Mass Effect is developed in U.S. They are in two entirely separate countries. They don't share project leaders. Casey Hudson is th eproject leader of Mass Effect, and he has nothing to do with his Canadian co-workers who he rarely ever sees if ever.

Dragon Age II was a rush job like everything in the Dragon Age series was after the initial game came out. Every single DLC, the expansion, and now this game screamed "rushed." That is separate issue from the Bioware making Mass Effect. Mass Effect can take as long as it wants to come along, because it has EA supporting it all the way.

Dragon Age? It was never as popular so why invest as much in it? That is the logical way to look at it. Dragon Age II suffered from repeat dungeons, poor story telling, (which is really the fault of the writers who are also separate from the Mass Effect team) lack of real choices, and grinding gameplay. The wrost parts of the game are due to design choices which would have been the same regardless of time, but part of it is just that the game was rushed. Why in the world did they have some many grinding side-quests? I don't know, but I doubt another eight months of development would magically make them go away. It was just a bad choice. Why was the story so weak with little to it? I don't know. Maybe because for once they had to tell a story that didn't have a monster that goes "RAH RAH RAH!" Oh wait. That's right. They literally through that in the final boss fight for no reason.

At the end of the day it isn't the changes from the previous game that hurt Dragon Age II. It's the fact that the game was clearly made to make a quick buck. Probably did since they saved so much money by not spending more time developing it.

Complaining isn't going to change much. I love Bioware. Mass Effect is a great series, and I hope any future spin-offs or sequels with new heroes do well. I just did not feel that Dragon Age II meet the standards of a triple A game in any respect.

I do look forward to Mass Effect 3. Which is made by a DIFFERENT Bioware. Yeesh people.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Mr.House wrote...

mrcrusty wrote...

Used to be a time when companies would just use patches to add in things that they didn't have time to finish or perfect before the game launches.

Now, it's via DLC. I think that's the problem Jabba has.

Or, idk.

But yes, I would like some DLC that fixes up the game especially in terms of story and quest content. Obsidian is doing the same thing with their New Vegas DLCs to better flesh out a more personal story for your character.

I don't think DLCs will "fix" Dragon Age 2 from my perspective, unless it completely overhauls a lot of the game, many of my problems lie in design, structures and oversight. DLCs usually don't fix anything like that but good DLCs will undoubtedly make the game better. That's something that's hard to legitimately complain about. Unless they are expensive of course.

Patchs never added new story and such, that's what expansions did, and you had to pay for that.

It was mostly through expansions, yes, but patches too from time to time. Remember the mounted combat in NWN. Warcraft 3 added a lot of non expansion based content through patches. And so on. It does happen, or did.

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

what's Jade Empire?

An Eastern Mythology based Action RPG that came out in like 2005 (?).

Modifié par mrcrusty, 04 mai 2011 - 03:00 .

[ImoenBaby]

marshalleck wrote...

mrcrusty wrote...

In any case, it's far too early to claim that the IP is dead.

Just wait and see how things go during Dragon Age 3's development (if there is one).

I like how the second sentence quoted here invalidates the first. Acknowledging there may not be a Dragon Age 3 validates concerns the IP may not see any more full-length game development. Because let's face it, if Dragon Age 2 had been a smashing success, a third game would be a given. 

No.

Both statements are compatible with each other.  The first points out that we don't know if the IP is dead. The second is also uncertain about the IP's future.

There is no contradiction or "invalidation".

[Mr.House]

Bioware should just give Mike resources to work on JE2, it's what he wants. Get a good LD for DA3 that knows what the hell they are doing.

[Mr.House]

mrcrusty wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

mrcrusty wrote...

Used to be a time when companies would just use patches to add in things that they didn't have time to finish or perfect before the game launches.

Now, it's via DLC. I think that's the problem Jabba has.

Or, idk.

But yes, I would like some DLC that fixes up the game especially in terms of story and quest content. Obsidian is doing the same thing with their New Vegas DLCs to better flesh out a more personal story for your character.

I don't think DLCs will "fix" Dragon Age 2 from my perspective, unless it completely overhauls a lot of the game, many of my problems lie in design, structures and oversight. DLCs usually don't fix anything like that but good DLCs will undoubtedly make the game better. That's something that's hard to legitimately complain about. Unless they are expensive of course.

Patchs never added new story and such, that's what expansions did, and you had to pay for that.

It was mostly through expansions, yes, but patches too from time to time. Remember the mounted combat in NWN. Warcraft 3 added a lot of non expansion based content through patches. And so on. It does happen, or did.

That's Blizzard, not Bioware. Bioware has never done things like with patchs.

[Maria Caliban]

Arken wrote...


This is what gets under my skin sometimes. People forget that Dragon Age II was made by Canadian Bioware, and Mass Effect is developed in U.S. They are in two entirely separate countries. They don't share project leaders. Casey Hudson is th eproject leader of Mass Effect, and he has nothing to do with his Canadian co-workers who he rarely ever sees if ever.

Dragon Age and Mass Effect are both from the Edmonton office, which is in Canada. They do have different project leads, however.

The Austin, TX office is developing The Old Republic.

[AngryFrozenWater]

@Terror_K: I have a couple of people in my friend list that abandoned BW for some reason or another after being loyal for years. They've vanished. The difference between you and them is that you needed a melodramatic escape. The effect is the same. You'll be forgotten soon. Too bad, because I liked your input. Cya.

[Emeraq]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
I don't really see how. They didn't like how they rushed development of the game, so they're taking time to make sure they at least get the DLC part right. That should speak enough about the staff. They could've just said "Well we rushed this game. Let's not even put any effort into the DLC. Not like it will matter anyway." But they didn't. So I fail to see what is wrong with that.

Cleary they should not do anything, they should just let DA2 rot.

That seems to be the general consensus with most of the people on here.


If it isn't broken, don't fix it

yet DA2 is broken. Shouldn't they try to fix it?

I, for one, hope they attempt to improve upon DA2 and will pay for at least one story based DLC and expansion. If they give us more than an hours worth of play that includes more than just a romp or two through the same rehashed dungeons with only new gear to throw at us.... If we get more of the same, then and only then (at least for me) can DA2 rot.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Mr.House wrote...

That's Blizzard, not Bioware. Bioware has never done things like with patchs.

NWN = Neverwinter Nights. So yes, Bioware too.

[Arken]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Arken wrote...


This is what gets under my skin sometimes. People forget that Dragon Age II was made by Canadian Bioware, and Mass Effect is developed in U.S. They are in two entirely separate countries. They don't share project leaders. Casey Hudson is th eproject leader of Mass Effect, and he has nothing to do with his Canadian co-workers who he rarely ever sees if ever.

Dragon Age and Mass Effect are both from the Edmonton office, which is in Canada. They do have different project leads, however.

The Austin, TX office is developing The Old Republic.

Ooops. My mistake. I knew I was slipping up today. My bad on that last part. I know Casey is in charge of Mass Effect, and that he has nothing to do with Laidlaw. Point is it is silly to say all Bioware games will be terrible when not all of them are made by the same team.

Side-Note: Crap. I can't remember how Bioware is built anymore. Could have sworn Mass Effect was developed from a different location. So the two are like on different floors? Maybe two Biowares in Edmonton? Damn it! Where the hell is Wiki when you need it?

[Mr.House]

mrcrusty wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

That's Blizzard, not Bioware. Bioware has never done things like with patchs.

NWN = Neverwinter Nights. So yes, Bioware too.

I stand corrected then.

Modifié par Mr.House, 04 mai 2011 - 03:07 .

[slimgrin]

Terror K has been on the forums a while, longer than I have I believe. You guys should cut him some slack. It's easy to troll a post like his.

To be honest, I've basically given up on the DA franchise as well, especially if Laidlaw's the one in charge. ( no offense, he just doesn't make my kind of game.)

[neppakyo]

Arken wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Arken wrote...


This is what gets under my skin sometimes. People forget that Dragon Age II was made by Canadian Bioware, and Mass Effect is developed in U.S. They are in two entirely separate countries. They don't share project leaders. Casey Hudson is th eproject leader of Mass Effect, and he has nothing to do with his Canadian co-workers who he rarely ever sees if ever.

Dragon Age and Mass Effect are both from the Edmonton office, which is in Canada. They do have different project leads, however.

The Austin, TX office is developing The Old Republic.

Ooops. My mistake. I knew I was slipping up today. My bad on that last part. I know Casey is in charge of Mass Effect, and that he has nothing to do with Laidlaw. Point is it is silly to say all Bioware games will be terrible when not all of them are made by the same team.

Side-Note: Crap. I can't remember how Bioware is built anymore. Could have sworn Mass Effect was developed from a different location. So the two are like on different floors? Maybe two Biowares in Edmonton? Damn it! Where the hell is Wiki when you need it?

lol Maria beat me to it. And I can't remeber anymore either. 

I think BW TX was made wwhen EA bought them, maybe for the TOR project. And If you read my lousy pararaphs, I said I like ME, and I didn't like DA2. But, with DA2, I am going to be more cautious when it comes to buying bioware games.

Think I said that.

Modifié par neppakyo, 04 mai 2011 - 03:09 .

[Arken]

neppakyo wrote...

Arken wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Arken wrote...


This is what gets under my skin sometimes. People forget that Dragon Age II was made by Canadian Bioware, and Mass Effect is developed in U.S. They are in two entirely separate countries. They don't share project leaders. Casey Hudson is th eproject leader of Mass Effect, and he has nothing to do with his Canadian co-workers who he rarely ever sees if ever.

Dragon Age and Mass Effect are both from the Edmonton office, which is in Canada. They do have different project leads, however.

The Austin, TX office is developing The Old Republic.

Ooops. My mistake. I knew I was slipping up today. My bad on that last part. I know Casey is in charge of Mass Effect, and that he has nothing to do with Laidlaw. Point is it is silly to say all Bioware games will be terrible when not all of them are made by the same team.

Side-Note: Crap. I can't remember how Bioware is built anymore. Could have sworn Mass Effect was developed from a different location. So the two are like on different floors? Maybe two Biowares in Edmonton? Damn it! Where the hell is Wiki when you need it?

lol Maria beat me to it. And I can't remeber anymore either. 

I think BW TX was made wwhen EA bought them, maybe for the TOR project. And If you read my lousy pararaphs, I said I like ME, and I didn't like DA2. But, with DA2, I am going to be more cautious when it comes to buying bioware games.

Think I said that.

You said you'll buy Mass Effect 3 after you read reviews, and you will not pre-order. You then said it was Mike Laidlaw's fault.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Mr.House wrote...

mrcrusty wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

That's Blizzard, not Bioware. Bioware has never done things like with patchs.

NWN = Neverwinter Nights. So yes, Bioware too.

I stand corrected on then.

Anyways back to the OP. No, the series is not dead to me. Maybe just a little unconscious, but not dead.

It's not that objectively speaking, Dragon Age 2 type of games are bad. I'm sure there's a market for it and I'm sure there's a lot of people who like games like Dragon Age 2 but it's not the kind of game I really enjoy for an RPG (I don't enjoy Mass Effect for it's RPG elements) and especially when it was rushed the way it was.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 04 mai 2011 - 03:12 .

[Arken]

I keep making posts by mistake. The overall presentation of the game was bad. Recycled levels, repeat side-quests, poor story, little dialogue with companions, (A ton of  conversations were literally them saying some Hawke responding, and then they would close the conversation.) and no sense of the player having any control with their choices.

Modifié par Arken, 04 mai 2011 - 03:16 .

[Bitterfoam]

Boohoo. Boo-boo-hoo-hoo.

No, really, I do actually feel for all the butthurt.

...Really.

[Arken]

The real problem isn't the gameplay changes. I'm fine with gameplay changes. It's the lack of effort that wen into making Dragon Age II.

[Paraxial]

marshalleck wrote...
I expressed almost the exact same thoughts a week or two ago in a similar thread. Sorry, it's not a hive mind. Some people actually aren't impressed with DA2 and Bioware's new direction. 

I can't speak on your arguments, as I haven't seen them and do not care to. But the majority of DA2 'hate' threads that appear on the forums are ridiculous. The majority of the people expressing their distaste for DA2, do it in the most childish and foolish manner i've ever seen. It literally boils down to 'lol this game sux, it's not exactly like the first game and that means Bioware is full of buttheads'. They are as bad if not worse than the people who blindly say that DA2 is a game without flaws and is the greatest thing since sliced bread, just to combat ignorance with ignorance.

People who discuss their problems with the game in an intelligent and constructive manner are few in number.

Yes, it is a hivemind.

[Merced652]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Merced652 wrote...

Really? So you're telling me its impossible to be loyal at point A, but due to circumstances not be loyal by point B? Its totally binary?

"I bought a dozen games from you that I loved, but I don't like this one, so I'm finished with the IP," isn't loyalty. That's like saying you're loyal to your friends but only when they're fun to be around.

No not really. You're overlooking the circumstances that lead to this persons decision. 

So using your analogy very loosely:

Its like saying you're loyal to your friends till they start doing meth, and unflappable in their conviction that meth use is cool and what cool people want to do and therefore are no longer fun to hang out with.  

You did read how they cited Liadlaw's comments as at least part of the reason, correct? 

So to recap for you, cause following along seems to be a problem... Thats bad game + laidlaw saying bad game is good + you don't understand how good bad game is actually a masterpeice of design + bad game is good on hard + bad game is evolution = loss of faith. 

Modifié par Merced652, 04 mai 2011 - 03:18 .

[neppakyo]

Arken wrote...

You said you'll buy Mass Effect 3 after you read reviews, and you will not pre-order. You then said it was Mike Laidlaw's fault.

So I did!

It was because of DA2 I will be cautious of buying future bioware games. And I do blame Mike. It was his vision for DA2, so he is the one to take the praise and the blame, and because of that, bioware games are no longer a go out and buy.

Modifié par neppakyo, 04 mai 2011 - 03:14 .

[Bio-Age]

Nashiktal wrote...

Oh this thread again.

Oh this Post again. LoL

[Mr.House]

Arken wrote...

The real problem isn't the gameplay changes. I'm fine with gameplay changes. It's the lack of effort that wen into making Dragon Age II.

They put alot of effort into a game that had a very short dev time. The big issue with DA2 is it's short dev time. A RPG is not a shooter, you can't just rush one each year. RPGs take time and care, EA failed to relise that and it's bitting them in the ass.

Modifié par Mr.House, 04 mai 2011 - 03:18 .