87 réponses à ce sujet

[lolwut666]

@GoldenOwl

Give her a chance, yo.

It's not like she is beyond redemption. She never committed a hate crime, for example.

She is just ignorant, like a lot of people are (arguably, we are all ignorant; just not always about the same things)

[1Minsc1]

lolwut666 wrote...

@GoldenOwl

Give her a chance, yo.

It's not like she is beyond redemption. She never committed a hate crime, for example.

She is just ignorant, like a lot of people are (arguably, we are all ignorant; just not always about the same things)

GoldenOwl was one of the very few people i meet here who is really interested in discussing this topic. Take a look at he "Why I think people hate Ashley Williams" thread.


@ to all: perhaps we should discuss only in that thread. So we don´t have to check two threads which cut across. There are also a lot of good post there, especially the OP by GoldenWarrior470

[Alamar2078]

Less Trolling == good

[PrinceLionheart]

She's a nationalist. I'm leaving it at that.

[Alamar2078]

1Minsc1 wrote...
@ to all: perhaps we should discuss only in that thread. So we don´t have to check two threads which cut across. There are also a lot of good post there, especially the OP by GoldenWarrior470

This ...

[Alamar2078]

Saphra Deden wrote...

Rusted Cage wrote...

Golden Owl, I like your post and your point about ignorance. However, is it fair to say Ashley remains ignorant and her viewpoints unchanged depite the passage of two years?

She's not ignorant. In fact she's got a lot more practical knowledge than most of the paragon characters out there except for maybe Kaidan.

IIRC didn't Ash indicate that she didn't know much about aliens?   If so that's pretty much the dictionary definition of being "ignorant" about aliens.

[Golden Owl]

Rusted Cage wrote...

Have things got so bad that people can openly campaign as anti-Tali? Only joking, I'm all for personal freedom

Folks, let me again apologise for this thread - I don't know what
came over me. I just couldn't resist that "wouldn't it be funny if"
demon that lives inside me.

Please, listen to your inner paragon and forgive a foolish old man :innocent:

NEVER........Just kidding...

[Golden Owl]

Rusted Cage wrote...

Golden Owl, I like your post and your point about ignorance. However, is it fair to say Ashley remains ignorant and her viewpoints unchanged depite the passage of two years?

Could it not be argued that while she may have been ignorant at the start of Mass Effect, the elapsed time between attack on the Citadel and the Collector assault on Horizon is ample for her opinions to have changed?

It's easy forgive ignorance once a person has learned the eror of their ways, yet not so easy if somebody makes a conscious decision.

Speaking of forgiveness, please could everyone forgive me for creating this thread? Pretty please? Pretty please with sugar on top?

That one of the points though Rusted Cage....She appears not to have grown over the 2 years...I don't know how different the conversations are with her on Horizon, depending on LI choices, morality choices, etc...I run a paragon Shep and did not romance Ash...Ash states in her Horizon conversation with him that she is "No fan of Aliens"....that sealed the deal for me that Ash does have issues with Aliens, not just mere jealousy....Sorry, very early in the morning here, still trying to warm up, trying to ram brain into gear, so could be a bit rusty at the moment.

[Golden Owl]

jamesp81 wrote...

No, she's not a racist.

She's a human nationalist, not a human supremacist. And that's fine, I'm a human nationalist too. I don't got anything against aliens or want to subjugate them, but as an Alliance soldier, my oath is to advance the interests and security of the Alliance and Humanity. Nothing wrong with that.

James, take this post over to the other thread, this post would fit very nicely there.

[Golden Owl]

Destroy Raiden wrote...

She doesn't want to kill aliens because they exist. She's not racist. She has views on aliens because of her relative I think it was her grandfather or something he was blamed for something he didn't do and aliens have been the cause of her family's misery in an indirect way ever sense.

Though it was the Alliance who scr*wed her Grandfather over on that one....If I remember correctly, doesn't she realize that in her conversations that the Alliance was directly responsible for that? Why she feels the need to be better than the best in the Alliances eyes to be deemed good enough?....something along those lines anyway.

 She works with them, she talks to them, she tolerates them don't expect her to be like kelly and shack up with every alien she sees just to prove she's fine and dandy with them. Her reasons and reaction is logical unlike that one Turian on the citadel who keeps screaming how humans are racist.

No, we certainly don't need another Kelly, I remain suspicious that a certain little red head maybe responsible for the Scale Itch.......and if we were to take into account every bit player NPC's comments, we would never get through this, lets stick to Normandy crew and major NPC's....or my head will explode, ME1 was rife with inter species 'Speciest' accusations.

[Golden Owl]

1Minsc1 wrote...

lolwut666 wrote...

@GoldenOwl

Give her a chance, yo.

It's not like she is beyond redemption. She never committed a hate crime, for example.

She is just ignorant, like a lot of people are (arguably, we are all ignorant; just not always about the same things)

GoldenOwl was one of the very few people i meet here who is really interested in discussing this topic. Take a look at he "Why I think people hate Ashley Williams" thread.


@ to all: perhaps we should discuss only in that thread. So we don´t have to check two threads which cut across. There are also a lot of good post there, especially the OP by GoldenWarrior470

Thank you Minsc...appreciated.

[Golden Owl]

lolwut666 wrote...

@GoldenOwl

Give her a chance, yo.

It's not like she is beyond redemption. She never committed a hate crime, for example.

She is just ignorant, like a lot of people are (arguably, we are all ignorant; just not always about the same things)

lolwut...you may be interested in taking a look at the other thread...I'm still trying to wake up at this point, early here, but preparing to attempt to warm things up on in there, Talimancers are not going to be happy...I am seeing a correlation between the two.

Yes, most of us are Ignorent in one way or another, but the challenge for all of us is to be aware of this and always be open to expanding our knowledge and being prepared to change and grow.

[Xeranx]

Ashley is as racist as I am rich.

[Errol Dnamyx]

Not being a fan of aliens = racist? Seriously?

I think there's a much more important question, that needs to be answered:
Is Rusted Cage a bad poaster? The answer to that one is quite a bit easier to find.
Rusted Cage is the worst poaster.

Modifié par Errol Dnamyx, 06 mai 2011 - 07:42 .

[GuardianAngel470]

Xeranx wrote...

Ashley is as racist as I am rich.

What a well reasoned, well articulated, and well explained point. I think we should all take lessons from this man as he is so good at conveying exactly what he's trying to say.

(Just kidding dude/dudette, no malice here)

Modifié par GuardianAngel470, 06 mai 2011 - 07:43 .

[GuardianAngel470]

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

Not being a fan of aliens = racist? Seriously?

I think there's a much more important question, that needs to be answered:
Is Rusted Cage a bad poaster? The answer to that one is quite a bit easier to find.
Rusted Cage is the worst poaster.

I think you're confusing poster with toaster... I don't know if inserting bread into some orrifice on Rusted Cage's body would turn said bread into toast while simultaneously creating a forum comment about racism.

[H4nniba11]

I killed Ashley because she shoots Wrex if given a chance!!!

[Ultai]

H4nniba11 wrote...

I killed Ashley because she shoots Wrex if given a chance!!!

I would too if I felt a higly irate mercenary is about to put a new hole into my commanding officer.

[Rusted Cage]

Errol Dnamyx wrote...

Not being a fan of aliens = racist? Seriously?

I think there's a much more important question, that needs to be answered:
Is Rusted Cage a bad poaster? The answer to that one is quite a bit easier to find.
Rusted Cage is the worst poaster.

But I already said I was sorry! What are you trying to do, get me lynched? Put that torch and pitchfork down if you please:D

And if I see one slice of bread near any of my orifices other than my mouth ther'll be trouble!

[Thompson family]

I used to think so, before I played as a FemShep. Now I think she's afraid that any trust she gives to aliens would might backfire, worsening the gloom over her family.

[Funkcase]

How can someone be racist and hate a pro-human organisation becuase they're racist? That doesn't make any sense. She hate's both Cerberus and Terra firma becuase of both groups racism.

She shoots Wrex if Shepard cant calm him, that's nothing to do with race, that's her doing her duty as a soldier. ''Be ready'' When Shepard said that before he spoke to Wrex, he was telling Ash ''get ready to kill him if I cant calm him down''

The only aliens she is worried about on the Normandy is Wrex and Garrus (and this is just when they come aboard, so she hasn't got to know them yet) and thats becuase Krogan are naturally agressive, and humanity fought a war with the Turians. Her distrust is logical, not racist. She doesn't worry about Tali and Liara.

The dog and bear analogy: Humanity was the dog, and the council was the human sicking the dog on the bear (The Reapers) Alot of people got this the wrong way round.

She works well with the Salarians on Virmire, and respects there skill, and she admires the power of the Ascension. She also loves the wards, and want's to buy a place there, now why would a racist love and want to live in such a multicultural place?

Liara: Ash just feels jealous of Liara, she clearly doesn't hate her. Ashley worries about Liara after Benezia dies, and she realizes that Liara is very attractive ''Damn, I hope I look that good when i'm your age!'' And she feels sorry for Liara if you get the confrontation and pick Ashley ''No one want's to feel like they're not good enough''

Tali: Ashley never say's anything bad to Tali, she even tells Tali that ''Hopefully having you help bring down Saren, will stop some humans from blaiming the Quarians for the Geth'' (something like that)

''I cant tell the animals from the aliens'' You tell me Hanar dont look like jellyfish? She wasn't being racist.

So no, she is not racist. I would say it is more appropriate to say Ashley is a compex character, and that is only a good thing.

Modifié par Funkcase, 07 mai 2011 - 09:36 .

[CroGamer002]

Funkcase wrote...

How can someone be racist and hate a pro-human organisation becuase they're racist? That doesn't make any sense. She hate's both Cerberus and Terra firma becuase of both groups racism.

She shoots Wrex if Shepard cant calm him, that's nothing to do with race, that's her doing her duty as a soldier. ''Be ready'' When Shepard said that before he spoke to Wrex, he was telling Ash ''get ready to kill him if I cant calm him down''

The only aliens she is worried about on the Normandy is Wrex and Garrus (and this is just when they come aboard, so she hasn't got to know them yet) and thats becuase Krogan are naturally agressive, and humanity fought a war with the Turians. Her distrust is logical, not racist. She doesn't worry about Tali and Liara.

The dog and bear analogy: Humanity was the dog, and the council was the human sicking the dog on the bear (The Reapers) Alot of people got this the wrong way round.

She works well with the Salarians on Virmire, and respects there skill, and she admires the power of the Ascension. She also loves the wards, and want's to buy a place there, now why would a racist love and want to live in such a multicultural place?

Liara: Ash just feels jealous of Liara, she clearly doesn't hate her. Ashley worries about Liara after Benezia dies, and she realizes that Liara is very attractive ''Damn, I hope I look that good when i'm your age!'' And she feels sorry for Liara if you get the confrontation and pick Ashley ''No one want's to feel like they're not good enough''

Tali: Ashley never say's anything bad to Tali, she even tells Tali that ''Hopefully having you help bring down Saren, will stop some humans from blaiming the Quarians for the Geth'' (something like that)

''I cant tell the animals from the aliens'' You tell me Hanar dont look like jellyfish? She wasn't being racist.

So no, she is not racist. I would say it is more appropriate to say Ashley is a compex character, and that is only a good thing.

+1

[skcih-deraj]

H4nniba11 wrote...

I killed Ashley because she shoots Wrex if given a chance!!!

Dude really? *shaken ma head*

That is the best you've got? No disrespect, but isn't that argument a little weak? Think about an angry giant lizard mercenary is pointing a gun at you.  What do you do next? Talk until things break down and he shoots you?

Modifié par skcih-deraj, 07 mai 2011 - 12:58 .