616 réponses à ce sujet

[Gatt9]

didymos1120 wrote...

VanTesla wrote...

 Industry CEO's on average are evil incarnate.

Well, that still doesn't magically make that statement all that informative.  It's a bunch of vague jargon that essentially translates to "Please don't sell your shares."

They're not worried about people selling shares because ME3 slipped.  Me1 sold 2 million units,  ME2 sold 1.6 million,  investors aren't hanging on waiting for ME3.  They're far more worried about Star Wars,  Sims,  and NFL. 

The statement very likely has some meaning that won't end well,  much the same as DA2,  though thankfully I'm guessing it's nothing worse than some form of multiplayer.

[JeffZero]

Gatt9 wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

VanTesla wrote...

 Industry CEO's on average are evil incarnate.

Well, that still doesn't magically make that statement all that informative.  It's a bunch of vague jargon that essentially translates to "Please don't sell your shares."

They're not worried about people selling shares because ME3 slipped.  Me1 sold 2 million units,  ME2 sold 1.6 million,  investors aren't hanging on waiting for ME3.  They're far more worried about Star Wars,  Sims,  and NFL. 

The statement very likely has some meaning that won't end well,  much the same as DA2,  though thankfully I'm guessing it's nothing worse than some form of multiplayer.

Oh god, are those VGChartz numbers or something? ME2 sold over four million.

[aridor1570]

Shadowbanner wrote...

JoeClose wrote...

I'm so sick of seeing all the worried people about how "their" game is going to be dumbed down for "COD players". Seriously grow up and have some faith in the company that delivers you games like Mass Effect, KOTOR, and many others. Sick of this crap.

Why so sick?

Look at what happened to DA2 when they stripped off RPG elements to appeal to mainstream console-players (COD crowd). Read this thread and see how people who post on BioWare forums rate this change over DA:O:

On a scale of 1 to 10, how do you rate DA2?

The universal trend in the above thread is to rate DA2 lower than DA:O.

Why? Because it was dumbed-down "to address a larger market opportunity". Sounds familiar? That is exactly what JR is saying now on ME3 and its delay. He specifically says that ME2 tried to do this half-heartedly and ME3 will do it even more decisevely. Many people, including myself, complained on how ME2 removed many RPG features to bring it closer to a shooter.

If you think there is no source for concern on ME3 you are sorely mistaken after whast the boss of EA has declared and I quote:

Joystiq

When asked about the delay, EA boss John Riccitiello said, "Essentially, step by step, [BioWare is] adjusting some of the gameplay mechanics and some of the features that you'll see at E3 that can put this into a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG, and essentially address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach."

I don't know about you but I think this "consolization" or "casualization" trend is very worrisome as its killling RPGs as we know them. And I'm a console-player.

Yes, they've removed the inventory system, totaly ruined the game, all of those highly positive reviews are false, ME2 is ruined forever because of the inventory loss.


/sarcasm

[Shadowbanner]

Hi

I'm not saying ME2 is ruined. The game was very good, and I would probably rate it as a 9/10, BUT it no longer felt like an RPG and definitely lost the essence of ME1. Capisce?

What JR is saying is that they will now consolidate this trend and make it even more apparent which imo is not good because it removes RPG elements to achieve it. And I happen to buy it because its an RPG. If I want a shooter, I buy BF3 or COD.

You think otherwise, fair enough.

Don't put words in my mouth that I haven't said. You are just making things up to defend your point of view.

Modifié par Shadowbanner, 05 mai 2011 - 11:51 .

[didymos1120]

Azzlee wrote...

That wasn't entirley directed at you personally but for those who aimed at all "this is just talking ****e to investors".

You don't talk crap to investors mate.

OK, look it's pretty simple: can you tell me what that statement actually means in terms of specifics? Can any useful, concrete information be extracted from it?  I'm not saying he's lying.  I'm saying it's so vague and could mean just about anything that even trying to apply "true" and "false" to it is futile, much less figuring out what's going on with the game.  I'm also saying this is highly typical of corporate-speak in general.

Modifié par didymos1120, 05 mai 2011 - 11:49 .

[Jebel Krong]

Gatt9 wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

VanTesla wrote...

 Industry CEO's on average are evil incarnate.

Well, that still doesn't magically make that statement all that informative.  It's a bunch of vague jargon that essentially translates to "Please don't sell your shares."

They're not worried about people selling shares because ME3 slipped.  Me1 sold 2 million units,  ME2 sold 1.6 million,  investors aren't hanging on waiting for ME3.  They're far more worried about Star Wars,  Sims,  and NFL. 

The statement very likely has some meaning that won't end well,  much the same as DA2,  though thankfully I'm guessing it's nothing worse than some form of multiplayer.

why do you keep quoting random sales numbers that everyone knows are wrong to back your argument? BW confirmed the series has sold over 7 million, and we know they already confirmed ME1's sales at 2-2.5, so the math should be pretty simple even for you...

[lolwut666]

Shadowbanner wrote...

Hi

I'm not saying ME2 is ruined. The game was very good, and I would probably rate it as a 9/10, BUT it no longer felt like an RPG and definitely lost the essence of ME1. Capisce?

Who cares about "essence" if the game is good?

You mean you just want ME3 to be more of an RPG for the heck of it, regardless of weather it might improve or ruin the gameplay?

[Da Mecca]

Man essence turns good games into amazing classics.

[lolwut666]

Yeah, I'm sure it's ME1's gameplay that made it a "classic". /sarcasm

It's all about the plot, which ME2 has and ME3 will have as well.

Gameplay should be fun. If that means drifting apart from RPG elements, so be it.

Modifié par lolwut666, 05 mai 2011 - 11:55 .

[LostHH]

Oh dear god. Sounds like half the biodrones would be better off watching a film if all they want is good story lol

[Shadowbanner]

lolwut666 wrote...

Shadowbanner wrote...

Hi

I'm not saying ME2 is ruined. The game was very good, and I would probably rate it as a 9/10, BUT it no longer felt like an RPG and definitely lost the essence of ME1. Capisce?

Who cares about "essence" if the game is good?

You mean you just want ME3 to be more of an RPG for the heck of it, regardless of weather it might improve or ruin the gameplay?

That's because I would give ME1 a 10/10 as an excellent game.

So in a way the changes made it less enjoyable for me.

Sure I agreed with many of the changes: the inventory did get over cluttered at times, the mako was pretty boring at times planet-exploring, heavily re-used environments in sidequests, less lift-time etc.

But other changes detracted from game play joy: the lack of weaponry available, the lack of tinkering with your in-game inventory, the lack of not being able to customize weapons, armor, payload etc.. all these stripped off RPG elements made ME2 less enjoyable for me. So for me, at least, it does matter if they consolidate the trend of removing RPG elements to appeal to a broader fanbase (which may even dislike RPGs) and are more into shooters; the COD crowd.

Think of it. Why delay ME3 in to 1Q of 2012? Because its now more of a Shooter than an RPG.

EA are pushing hard for BF3. They want it to oust COD once and for all. So ME3 is competing more in the windowframe of BF3 and COD (Shooters) than, say, with Skyrim or TW2 (RPGs). Hence the most sensible thing to do is to delay it to the next fiscal year which is not overcrowded by Shooters.

Look at what happened to DA2. The general consensus, even on this BioWare forum, is that DA2 was a much worser game than DA:O

On a scale of 1 to 10, how do you rate DA2?

I like BioWare and its games because it released top-class RPGs, not shooters or Action-RPGs. Since it was purchased by EA that's exactly what they are doing. i.e. ME2, DA2.

Modifié par Shadowbanner, 05 mai 2011 - 12:11 .

[aridor1570]

LostHH wrote...

Oh dear god. Sounds like half the biodrones would be better off watching a film if all they want is good story lol

An RPG with a bad story is not a good RPG at all, would you rather play a game that has no meaning at all? that's called a Hack'n'Slash.

[lolwut666]

@LostHH

And you should go play a JRPG, if you like inventories and meaningless stuff so much, fanboy.

Or go back to ME1. It will always be there for you to play, you know.

The point is that you can whine all you want, but you are *not* important. People like you, who enjoy useless gameplay elements, are in the minority.

[ExtremeOne]

VanTesla wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

LostHH wrote...

The inventory system wasn't ****. If you didn't like it then go back to your d-pad inventories of Gears of ****, which EA/Bioware are obviously trying to make.
The funny part is that everyone will buy the game to see which squad mate they can date anf **** next.
Might as well make ME3 a dating sim

    



Gears of War 3 will most likly sell 6 - 8 million judging from the response in the beta . so yeah you dam right EA wants ME 3 to sell that much .   shooter games make the most money simple 

I don't understand the shooter appeal at all... I guess it has to do with a basic violent instinct in humans that cares little for anything else in games mostly... I wish shooters would die down just a little.

   


I agree with your point . 

[Shadowbanner]

aridor1570 wrote...

LostHH wrote...

Oh dear god. Sounds like half the biodrones would be better off watching a film if all they want is good story lol

An RPG with a bad story is not a good RPG at all, would you rather play a game that has no meaning at all? that's called a Hack'n'Slash.

Which is exactly the case of DA2 after the changes made over DA:O "to appeal to this broader market opportunity" thingy. It is no longer an RPG, its a button-masher hack-n-slash with a very bad story riddled with plot holes.

Modifié par Shadowbanner, 05 mai 2011 - 12:04 .

[Someone With Mass]

lolwut666 wrote...

Yeah, I'm sure it's ME1's gameplay that made it a "classic". /sarcasm

It's all about the plot, which ME2 has and ME3 will have as well.

Gameplay should be fun. If that means drifting apart from RPG elements, so be it.

I never cared that much about the RPG elements aside from the dialogue system in ME1 to begin with, so good riddance.

By the way, an RPG can be so much more than just some silly inventory.

[Blarty]

Personally, I think that they can't make a massively huge departure from ME2 based on the fact that ME3 is essentially a continuation of the ME1 & ME2 games.... I can see them leveraging more the iPad, iPhone, Android and Facebook (ala DA: Legends) type games. For those going on the COD route... since when has COD a) been an RPG, and had anything remotely like skill trees... and remember that COD is mostly judged on it's multiplayer element....

Now, if the storyline and production quality is unaffected, would anyone be upset if another team came in and worked alongside the current BW team to make a multiplayer part to the franchise, or an MMO?

Please stop all this gesticulatin' and speculatin' and wait for E3

[ExtremeOne]

didymos1120 wrote...

Azzlee wrote...

That wasn't entirley directed at you personally but for those who aimed at all "this is just talking ****e to investors".

You don't talk crap to investors mate.

OK, look it's pretty simple: can you tell me what that statement actually means in terms of specifics? Can any useful, concrete information be extracted from it?  I'm not saying he's lying.  I'm saying it's so vague and could mean just about anything that even trying to apply "true" and "false" to it is futile, much less figuring out what's going on with the game.  I'm also saying this is highly typical of corporate-speak in general.

    



What it means is EA will be making Mass Effect 3 to appeal to a wider audience by tweaking some of the game's mechanics .  

[hawat333]

Dasher1010 wrote...

This means that all abilities and leveling up will be stripped from the game and ME3 is being retooled into a pure shooter.

Oh noes. I was hoping for a game that runs on a rail and there's only some occasional quick time events. Yet, not the hard ones, but the "Press Enter in 30 seconds to continue the cutscene" type.
Hm. We better not give EA ideas.

[lolwut666]

I heard DA2 has a good story. Never played it myself, though.

And it's not the gameplay that makes an RPG, but I won't even bother explaining this because the RPG "purists" are deaf to this kind of reasoning.

[man giraffedog000]

I've come to warn you about MAN-GIRAFFE-DOG!! It's the single greatest threat to humanity!! RUN AWAY!!



I'm still more Serial than ever guys.

[man giraffedog000]

OK, there seems to be some confusion about Man-Giraffe-Dog on the forums, notably that it just looks like a Giraffe-Dog. Well... that's the POINT. Why do you think I'm the only one warning you. It's disguised as a Giraffe-Dog until it's ready to take over the world.
OK this is how Man-Giraffe-Dog came to be:


While growing up it was spotted in the wild (but the team was all killed by it and the photos were recovered afterwards)


After which it began its infiltration of humanity, disguised as Giraffe-Dog:


Which leaves us here. Man-Giraffe-Dog is poised to attack and destroy humanity and I'm trying to warn everyone before it's too late. This is totally serial guys. You need to prepare.

Excelsior!

[Azzlee]

didymos1120 wrote...

Azzlee wrote...

That wasn't entirley directed at you personally but for those who aimed at all "this is just talking ****e to investors".

You don't talk crap to investors mate.

OK, look it's pretty simple: can you tell me what that statement actually means in terms of specifics? Can any useful, concrete information be extracted from it?  I'm not saying he's lying.  I'm saying it's so vague and could mean just about anything that even trying to apply "true" and "false" to it is futile, much less figuring out what's going on with the game.  I'm also saying this is highly typical of corporate-speak in general.

From JR

"One of the things that Ray Muzyuka and the team up in Edmonton have
done is essentially step-by-step adjust the gameplay mechanics and some
of the features that you'll see at E3 to put this in a genre equivalent
to shooter-meets-RPG," he said, "and essentially address a much larger
market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 and Mass Effect 2 began to
approach.

"We're huge believers in the IP and are purposefully shifting it to address a larger market opportunity"

From me

"But also as a I said, this could be to cram just that little bit more
awesome into the game. With Riccitello's past though, I can't help but
wonder."

"I can only hope that the delay and this sentence means more content to
appeal to all. That I most certainly wouldn't have an issue with. After
the bitter disappointment at DA2 "broadening" I now have grave concerns
at the direction EA are taking. "

Did you read everything I was saying? The specifics are in his own quote mate and I have made assumptions.

"...some
of the features that you'll see at E3 to put this in a genre equivalent
to shooter-meets-RPG"

The last time this sort of comment came from BW/EA DA2 was released, to my personal disappointment. Shifting to a larger market opportunity means 2 things. A change in the mechanics to make it easier to pick up and play for 5 minutes, or they are trying to cater to as many as they can by filling the game with more stuff.

My issue was people, including yourself, saying that this is just "fob off the investor", which you simply do not do. I hold concerns over the potential direction this game could take following the statement. I will not know until the reports come from E3.

[Blarty]

Shadowbanner wrote...

aridor1570 wrote...

LostHH wrote...

Oh dear god. Sounds like half the biodrones would be better off watching a film if all they want is good story lol

An RPG with a bad story is not a good RPG at all, would you rather play a game that has no meaning at all? that's called a Hack'n'Slash.

Which is exactly the case of DA2 after the changes made over DA:O "to appeal to this broader market opportunity" thingy. It is no longer an RPG, its a button-masher hack-n-slash with a very bad story riddled with plot holes.

How long was DA:O in design and production? A lot less than DA:2 I would imagine.... but a few months ago, t would appear that everyone would be happy for ME3 to slip to Q1 2012....

Remember that Jan 2012 will not have many releases compared to the October/November deluge, so they'll want to appeal to as many gamers as possible.... it's simple economics.... do what you can to increase demand...

...as long as they don't annoy the people who are already demanding the game, of course :innocent:

[terrordactyl1]

 Looks like it's getting dumbed down, just like DA2 was. No more RPG's from Bioware, EA have screwed everything up..This will just be another COD in space, how boring.