34 réponses à ce sujet

[HSHAW]

What do you think the source of the taint is?

Also, consider Avernus' letter.

The last shipment was quite helpful for my research Commander. If you could double the supply next time, it would prove most effacious. Additionally, the information regarding The Architect has proven invaluable--we have made several breakthroughs recently. As the Architect surmised, considerable untapped power exists within Grey Warden blood. When properly prepared, it's effects can be remarkable.

But my research has revealed some alarming implications, which I've attached in the old Acanthan cipher. I urge you to send this to the First Warden at once.

I will conduct further tests as long as I'm able. My documentation is very thorough---if time finally claims me, others may follow in my footsteps.

Avernus.

[Agamo45]

It is the Makers punishment for the evil of the Tevinter magisters.

[HSHAW]

Agamo45 wrote...

It is the Makers punishment for the evil of the Tevinter magisters.

Ignoring the Chantry idea since there's more evidence of Fen'harel than him.....(but that's a topic for another thread.)

[Blacklash93]

Agamo45 wrote...

It is the Makers punishment for the evil of the Tevinter magisters.

It can't be that simple. That should be obvious.

The Old Gods calling and its relation to lyrium certainly points at something more complex.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 07 mai 2011 - 04:56 .

[frustratemyself]

Could be something viral or allergy-like with the tainted persons body trying to adapt to and fight it.
The wrath of the Maker could have been used as the reason for a few things that people had no other explanation for, that science could explain in later ages.

[LobselVith8]

The darkspawn first appeared in the Deep Roads, where they encountered the dwarves. It seems to be an infection since the darkspawn corrupt everything around them, feast on the living, and they procreate by violating women. There does seem to be some possible connection with the Old Gods, who are also underground, and the darkspawn hear the "song" from the Old Gods that compels the darkspawn towards them.

I wonder if the "mysterious mission" that is repeatedly eluded to in DA2 has anything to do with the Old Gods or the darkspawn.

As for the Maker being responsible, I don't believe it's true. There's no proof to back up the Chantry's claims that the Maker is responsible for the corruption, the Blights, and the Archdemons.

[IanPolaris]

Here's an idle thought I've had for some time. Doesn't it strike you that the song that drove Bartrand mad (esp when he could no longer hear it from the idol) seems to share some of the same characterstics that the Song that "Mother" claimed could no longer hear and drove her mad. I am wondering if there is a connection between these Primeval Dwarves and the first Darkspawn/Arch-Demons.

-Polaris

[HSHAW]

LobselVith8 wrote...

The darkspawn first appeared in the Deep Roads, where they encountered the dwarves. It seems to be an infection since the darkspawn corrupt everything around them, feast on the living, and they procreate by violating women. There does seem to be some possible connection with the Old Gods, who are also underground, and the darkspawn hear the "song" from the Old Gods that compels the darkspawn towards them.

I wonder if the "mysterious mission" that is repeatedly eluded to in DA2 has anything to do with the Old Gods or the darkspawn.

As for the Maker being responsible, I don't believe it's true. There's no proof to back up the Chantry's claims that the Maker is responsible for the corruption, the Blights, and the Archdemons.

Possibly, but it's just as likely that the secret mission is dealing with the Harvesters.

[LobselVith8]

It sounds like a possibility, Ian. And the primeval thaig codex mentions that it looks like it was crafted by magic, which implies the ancient dwarves may have wielded magical ability during it's inception.

[LobselVith8]

HSHAW wrote...

Possibly, but it's just as likely that the secret mission is dealing with the Harvesters.

Given how Orsino turns into a Harvester, you'd think the research from Amgarrak would have been mentioned once. The Wardens seened very secretive about their plans. Hard to say what they were doing, but Nathaniel did want to investigate the primeval thaig. While GoA ended in such a way as to imply that a wave of Harvesters would be impending, we never hear one word about them in the seven years Hawke spends in Kirkwall.

[Maria Caliban]

HSHAW wrote...

What do you think the source of the taint is?

Eluvian pointed at the golden city.

[HSHAW]

Just a thought, but Avernus' notes say that the taint in the blood gets stronger with age and get Darkspawn magic is fuelled by taint, does that mean that a Darkspawn mage gets more powerful as they get older?

[IanPolaris]

HSHAW wrote...

Just a thought, but Avernus' notes say that the taint in the blood gets stronger with age and get Darkspawn magic is fuelled by taint, does that mean that a Darkspawn mage gets more powerful as they get older?

Seems likely.  We know that the Architect is very old.

-Polaris

[HSHAW]

IanPolaris wrote...

HSHAW wrote...

Just a thought, but Avernus' notes say that the taint in the blood gets stronger with age and get Darkspawn magic is fuelled by taint, does that mean that a Darkspawn mage gets more powerful as they get older?

Seems likely.  We know that the Architect is very old.

-Polaris

Another question, how likely is it that the original source of the Darkspawn Taint(the creator of it) is tainted themselves?

[TEWR]

IanPolaris wrote...

Here's an idle thought I've had for some time. Doesn't it strike you that the song that drove Bartrand mad (esp when he could no longer hear it from the idol) seems to share some of the same characterstics that the Song that "Mother" claimed could no longer hear and drove her mad. I am wondering if there is a connection between these Primeval Dwarves and the first Darkspawn/Arch-Demons.

-Polaris

you're not the only one who thought that. I've had that thought myself since DA2 came out, and about 3 days ago I made a thread discussing the whole Red Lyrium/Primeval Thaig stuff. Here it is:

http://social.biowar...4/index/7291020

[Rifneno]

Agamo45 wrote...

It is the Makers punishment for the evil of the Tevinter magisters.

frustratemyself wrote...

Could be something viral or allergy-like with the tainted persons body trying to adapt to and fight it.
The wrath of the Maker could have been used as the reason for a few things that people had no other explanation for, that science could explain in later ages.

It has to be something more than microorganisms like those that cause normal disease.  We're told, albeit jokingly, that magic can cure diease (in specifically, STD's) rather easily.

IanPolaris wrote...

Here's an idle thought I've had for some time. Doesn't it strike you that the song that drove Bartrand mad (esp when he could no longer hear it from the idol) seems to share some of the same characterstics that the Song that "Mother" claimed could no longer hear and drove her mad. I am wondering if there is a connection between these Primeval Dwarves and the first Darkspawn/Arch-Demons.

-Polaris

I definitely think that's the case.  I've wondered before if the idol is actually the imprisoned soul of an archdemon.  In fantasy writing when an enemy is immortal and there's no accessable way to  truly kill them, they're usually banished or imprisoned somehow.  It makes sense that this ancient culture, without Grey Wardens, would've sought another way to deal with an archdemon.  It would also make that "the prison has been breached" line make more sense.  The Thaig may not be an ancient city, it may be an ancient prison to hold the captured archdemon soul.  The only part that doesn't add up is that the thaig is "far older" than the First Blight.

[TEWR]

Maybe the first Blight was really the Second?

[Crossroads_Wanderer]

Well, there is a type of hypersensitivity reaction when blood with different antibodies and antigens come in contact. The blood cells are destroyed. It's a terrible way to go. Though it generally requires a relatively large dose to be fatal. I suppose it's possible that there is a much higher concentration of antibodies for human blood factors in darkspawn blood, requiring a smaller dosage of the blood to be fatal. Still, this type of hypersensitivity reaction generally requires the incompatible blood to enter the bloodstream directly and it seems unlikely that darkspawn blood would enter the bloodstream in anything more than trace amounts through a wound, which would be pumping blood outward, not sucking blood inward. This also doesn't explain the ongoing taint of the Wardens, unless there is somehow also a viral component of darkspawn blood which inserts its DNA into the relevant cells. It's unlikely that darkspawn red blood cells would be produced, as RBCs are produced in the bone marrow, which is difficult to infect, but maybe the darkspawn blood antibodies are produced.

Maybe it's just magic. While there is no demonstrable proof of the Maker, there is certainly demonstrable magic in Thedas.

[TEWR]

you ever wonder if, with all our speculation and trying to explain everything, we end up making the developers' jobs harder?

[Esbatty]

If they spent years coming up with all of the craziness that is Thedas, all that dev time crafting this continent and the history and rules and what not that govern it. They probably have the answer for this. This is why I want Dragon Age 3: At The Speed of Blight starring Warden-Commander Shepard. Element Zero is Lyrium!

[HSHAW]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

you ever wonder if, with all our speculation and trying to explain everything, we end up making the developers' jobs harder?

How so?

[HSHAW]

Crossroads_Wanderer wrote...

Well, there is a type of hypersensitivity reaction when blood with different antibodies and antigens come in contact. The blood cells are destroyed. It's a terrible way to go. Though it generally requires a relatively large dose to be fatal. I suppose it's possible that there is a much higher concentration of antibodies for human blood factors in darkspawn blood, requiring a smaller dosage of the blood to be fatal. Still, this type of hypersensitivity reaction generally requires the incompatible blood to enter the bloodstream directly and it seems unlikely that darkspawn blood would enter the bloodstream in anything more than trace amounts through a wound, which would be pumping blood outward, not sucking blood inward. This also doesn't explain the ongoing taint of the Wardens, unless there is somehow also a viral component of darkspawn blood which inserts its DNA into the relevant cells. It's unlikely that darkspawn red blood cells would be produced, as RBCs are produced in the bone marrow, which is difficult to infect, but maybe the darkspawn blood antibodies are produced.

Maybe it's just magic. While there is no demonstrable proof of the Maker, there is certainly demonstrable magic in Thedas.

I doubt that the Darkspawn taint is non-magical.

#1: It's emanated from the Darkspawn for starters(in other words, gather enough Darkspawn in one place and you'll get clouds of the stuff, incidentally, that does happen in Blights).
 
#2: The taint affects non-living things, (E.G: The Blackened heartwood staff in the Mage Origin) in the stated example, the heartwood has actually begun turning into metal.

#3: IIRC the Taint was toxic enough (heard this from someone else on the forum) that it kills bacteria preventing corpse decay.

[frustratemyself]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

you ever wonder if, with all our speculation and trying to explain everything, we end up making the developers' jobs harder?

Or we may make it easier by giving them ideas

[whykikyouwhy]

This theory has probably been mentioned somewhere before, and I apologize if I am merely echoing it, but what if the origin of the darkspawn taint is either from some coupling between an Old God and a mortal, or from some spilling of an Old God's blood?

In quite a few mythologies, we see a creature, or an entity, result from some liaison between a deity and man, or from between two deities (the cyclops in Greek mythology, for example). So if an Old God were to impregnate a mage, could not the end result be the first tainted creature, bearing tainted blood? Maybe there was more than one Architect-like being, and the most ancient one was the cause of the taint spreading beyond itself.

Harkening back to Greek mythology (it's just a convenient resource, sorry), we have spilled god/creature blood spawning snakes, skeletons, and all manner of pesky beings (especially if you look at any of the old Ray Harryhausen films - not true Greek mythology, but memorable). If the conditions are right (maybe deity blood spilled upon raw lyrium?), perhaps the taint originated in that manner. The question then would be how was the blood spilled - was there a battle, was there an uprising or a sacrifice?

The Maker then becomes a matter of convenience - if that which initiated the darkspawn taint into the world needed to be covered up (if only to keep people from falling into absolute despair or hopelessness), the Maker is inserted into what becomes a moral play, a fable: the taint is punishment from the Maker therefore mortals should be conscious of their actions and keep their ego in check, they should be grateful for the benevolent powers/energies in the world and embrace them, as those are derived from the Maker, etc. It's very much like the flood story (another event that spans across multiple regions/religions).

Just my tarnished 2 cents. I could be completely out in left field with the above.

Modifié par whykikyouwhy, 07 mai 2011 - 12:06 .