382 réponses à ce sujet

[wildannie]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

From looks of it he personally does not want a complete return to anytime branching dialogue but would be completley willing to have a middle ground. Unfortantly the price of becomming another 'cinematic' style game with 'VO' like the millions of others out there means the only difficult part is making the cutscenes matching the fact anywhere could mean camera problems.

But one thing is for sure the way it was done in DA2 for me was extremely inadequate. You got sometimes one and sometimes couple timed event cutscenes per act for each character to interact with them, these were forced and became chores of "Oh Fenris quest time lets go see what it is". This limitation on how often can interact and such is lazy and below par imho.

There was no reason why they could not have when enter say as example Fenris's mansion, Hanged Man or other places to talk with them a lot more scenes where you could learn more and have such dialogue. In the end what we got was a few timed quest dialogues and most of the rest of time single one liners akin to go away phrases or I'm busy, get lost. Mass Effect though is a cinematic game did it vastly better than DA2... Though I am and have stated that my opinion is they had 2 style of games ME being the action orientated cinematic franchise and DAO being the older D&D or BG classic style, now we have one style and thats action cinematic types for both series (narrowing the fanbase not broadening it).

The only thing new about DA2 at all really to me genre or game mechanics wise is switching from paragon/renegade or charm/intimidate to emotion type. Everything else and I do mean everything else has been done before on vast scale from wave system to a nobody rising to power or losing family in games even time skips and retrospective story telling approach.

agreed

@ night prowler 76 - no problem 

[Dragoonlordz]

Chugster wrote...
4) just like all of you, i have the right to post whatever i want, but, ive not been nasty, racist, sexist, trollish or anything, yet people are hating on me as well...i like game forums, but when i see so much crap i try to take a stand

Post your thoughts on the game and not the people talking about it. Seems simple enough to me. Like I said write a review and I for one will be glad to read and talk about it, the various things you like and dislike as opposed to trying to belittle people opinions claiming unless they are "technical facts" through word play in the title, they aren't valid and don't make a game bad. If you wanted to know just the technical facts this thread would not even be here you would do, as I told you many times go read the technical sections.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 09 mai 2011 - 06:55 .

[Chugster]

Gotholhorakh wrote...

Chugster wrote...
but when i see so much crap i try to take a stand

What is crap, and what are you taking a stand against?

Other people not being satisfied with something they have paid for and not being quick enough to "shut up" when the vendor laughs in their faces?

That's quite a remarkable thing to take a stand against. Vive la revolucione, eh??

obviously you chose to not read my posts and start flaming....read my previous posts about posts filled with hate and bile end emotional overreation...that is the crap im against....not contstructive stuff...

its all in my posts

[Master Shiori]

tmp7704 wrote...

Ehh, it is still the system of use one skill to put effect on a target, use the second skill on the affected target to get the bonus damage.

Ofc it is. Except where before only mages could put an effect on a target and you had only one effect regardless which of the 3 spells you used, now every class can put an effect and exploit it.

tmp7704 wrote...



"Complex" just isn't a word i'd use to describe such a system.

Then give me an example of a "complex" system from any other rpg. It's the standard "debuff and exploit for extra damage" system you can find in mmo's like WoW. 

tmp7704 wrote...



It could even be argued the system got simplified down in a way -- rather than having a dozen of different combinations between specific skills you now have 3 combinations which can be both invoked and utilized by multiple abilities each.

Sorry, but have you played the game at all?

A "dozen of different combinations between specific skills" is exactly what you have in DA2, while the "3 combinations" is what you had in Origins, except it was actually one effect that could be placed by 3 different spells.

DA2 actually rewards careful selection of abilities and good group setups. In Origins all you had to do is pile in as many mages as you could, while other classes had no sinergy between them whatsoever.

[Lumikki]

Just because someone else behave badly, doesn't mean we should do it too. Meaning one bad action doesn't justify continue same.

Bioware hasn't give anyone middle finger, you self have done it to your self by not accepting that everyting isn't about you.

Game company makes games for anyone willing to buy them. If you feel that game isn't for you after buying it, too bad, you buyed wrong game. If you think Bioware should make games just for you taste of games, what the hell are you smoking? Bioware makes games, that's all they do, they have no responsibility for us.

Now we give constructive critics as feedback so Bioware can improve they games. How ever, bashing or blaming or name calling Bioware or EA or they games or people who play's they games doesn't do anyone any good. We aren't children who cries when they don't get what they wanted. We aren't "bad people" who revenge others, because our own disapointment. We are adults who knows how to behave. We may feel bad about our dispoinments, but we are still adults and should behave that way.

Point is there is difference between constructive critics about game it self and feedback based our own emotional feelings based expectations and assumtions done by our self. Emotions aboug game when you play it, isn't same as emotional expectation about the game. Meaning there is different what we wanted it to be and what it is. Give feedback based as what it is, not based your own fantasy dream world of perfect game for you self. Meaning don't cry when something wasn't the way you wanted. Just say you did not like something with some constructive reasons ....

Modifié par Lumikki, 09 mai 2011 - 07:16 .

[Chugster]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Chugster wrote...
4) just like all of you, i have the right to post whatever i want, but, ive not been nasty, racist, sexist, trollish or anything, yet people are hating on me as well...i like game forums, but when i see so much crap i try to take a stand

Post your thoughts on the game and not the people talking about it. Seems simple enough to me. Like I said write a review and I for one will be glad to read and talk about it, the various things you like and dislike as opposed to trying to belittle people opinions claiming unless they are "technical facts" through word play in the title, they aren't valid and don't make a game bad. If you wanted to know just the technical facts this thread would not even be here you would do, as I told you many times go read the technical sections.

holy smeg...does no one read?

I dont mind constructive, well thought out posts on the faults of DA2, but i do mind posts full of 'BW sucks' and 'Laidlaw must die' crap

[erynnar]

Gotholhorakh wrote...

It seems to me that in the face of massive customer dissatisfaction WRT this product, where we are striving in large part to find a civilised middle ground, this sort of thread exists to throw petrol on the flames of consumer ire.


We have enough to do to stay civil in the face of a very direct and offensive middle finger from BioWare after this non-refundable purchase, in the hope that things will get back on the right track and we will all be friends again, without this... this nonsense.

Fans of the game? YEAH. SURE. I don't remember ever spending time on forums trying to shut up detractors with straw man arguments, instead of playing a game I thought was good.

Perhaps, somewhere, some billy goats have been able to cross their local bridge unmolested since this thread started, but that's about the sum total of its worth.

Yeah, I never went on the DAO forums to ask people who complained about it to stop. I never went on it at all until I started posting fanfiction. I should have given positive feedback, but I was too busy playing and loving  it

[Dragoonlordz]

Chugster wrote...

holy smeg...does no one read?

I dont mind constructive, well thought out posts on the faults of DA2, but i do mind posts full of 'BW sucks' and 'Laidlaw must die' crap

The only person here using those terms is you... Ironic really.

[xCirdanx]

Master Shiori wrote...
A "dozen of different combinations between specific skills" is exactly what you have in DA2, while the "3 combinations" is what you had in Origins, except it was actually one effect that could be placed by 3 different spells.

DA2 actually rewards careful selection of abilities and good group setups. In Origins all you had to do is pile in as many mages as you could, while other classes had no sinergy between them whatsoever.

Thats not what you have, but i agree that Origins was also not like this, but the "3 different spells" thing is crap.

Not that it actually matters, DA2 isn´t difficult, hence there is no need to bother with the search for a perfect built. However that maybe still fun for min/max players, but they are even more of a minority than so called "old school rpg players."

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

Gotholhorakh wrote...


It's classic straw man argument and there are at least 3 people on this forum who do it time and time again for their own ends, whatever those are.

/facepalm

This was unintentionally hilarious.

[Sabriana]

OP, I've tried many times in your thread to point out that your behavior is worse than the behavior of many of those who post criticism. You are making sweeping generalizations, and thereby inviting negativity in an almost baffling regularity.

Please stop. I've asked you very politely to please state your problems in a manner that makes them suitable for mature debate. I also told you that your attempt to "teach us a lesson" will only end in more negativity, and that it may well be aimed at you.

Your posts are full of "I want", "I think", "you are all wrong", "I wanted to proof", "I want everyone to do as I wish" "I want this to stop", "I want everyone who thinks differently than I to shut up and go away.". This will simply not work.

If a post or a thread bother you that much, you need to step away, and take a deep breath. I've been on forums and boards for a long time, and there is simply no way to "shut" people "up". Especially when they feel that their purchase didn't meet with what was offered and/or their expectations. You simply do not have the right to tell other paying customers what to do.

Live with it.

[Zepher99]

If you compare DA2 to DAO then it's SERIOUSLY lacking in all departments. It seems like bioware rushed this game just to make money off the name.
1) Graphics are good till you hit the cut sceens. Then you notice all the lines they didn't smooth over.
2) Voice overs royally suck in this game, many times it sounds like your talking while your head is in the bottom of a barrel
3) Recycling of lvls. Now this is what really gets to me. In DAO they had the forsight and imagination to make you feel like you were really there. LOTS to explore and to look at, Very impressive. In DA2 SOME of the areas are huge, however there really is no exploration and the areas are extremely bare and dull, there really is no eye candy till you hit the CGI. The areas lack the life that DAO gave the player.
4) Armor is an issue. One of the fun parts of the orginal was being able to choose what type of armor you other characters could use and how they could make use of it. For example having a heavy armor archer to help make up for the lack of health and def. Also you never had to buy items to equip to your other characters. Tired of they way their armor looks, change it. In DA2 your stuck with buying or finding armor upgrades. You find a really good item you can't use, well you can't use it on your other characters because...oh ya they only wear one type of armor.
5) Character interaction/Romance In the orginal the diologue was orginal and unique, LOTS of laughter while playing through. In DA2 it's a joke. It really feels like boiware rushed through this part only half hearted with the characters. I have to admit that the romance sequences are 100% improved, however the journey to get there is tedious at best. It's worse then trying to Romance Alistar in DAO. BTW there is no character interaction outside of quests and at your house....to a VERY small degree.
6) Damage modifier is busted. Have you noticed that reguardless what your character is they do ****** poor damage compared to the rest of your party?? I've played through the game twice since playstation servers went down and no matter what class I am or how i do up my stats, the other party memebers ALWAYS do so more damage. I sit there with my 2 handed warrior pounding on a enemy whos health would be a 1 or 2 hit in DAO while Avaline will MOW down enemys with 5X the amount of health in a fraction of the time. 2 handed in DAO ment slow but massive damage depending on your character build. Not in this game however. Same with the mage. When the mage in question isn't controlled by you they ROYALLY shred enemies. The moment you become a mage it's like trying to take down goliath with a pea shooter

I could go all day on the massive missteps that they made while making DA2. DAO set the bar for the next generation of RPG. DA2 with the way it's was handled feels like it should belong to the ps1 or ps2 generation
I will admit that it's fun to pound wave after wave of enemies, but thats about all the value that lies in it. If i hadn't played the orginal then ya i would be semi pleased with it. However with seeing what boiware could do with the orginal this seems like a slap in the face to all of us who put the money down and had MAJOR hopes for their product to remain strong.
If I were rating this i would only give it 2/5 stars

[Cutlass Jack]

Gotholhorakh wrote...

Fans of the game? YEAH. SURE. I don't remember ever spending time on forums trying to shut up detractors with straw man arguments, instead of playing a game I thought was good.

Because haters of the game do none of these things. I don't remember ever spending time on forums trying to put down a game I hated (or the people who loved it). Instead of playing a game I actually enjoyed.

Fans spending time on forums talking about things they love makes perfect sense to me. You can finish the game and still love talking about it. People clearly love talking about Origins but aren't playing that full time either.

[erynnar]

Chugster wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Chugster wrote...
4) just like all of you, i have the right to post whatever i want, but, ive not been nasty, racist, sexist, trollish or anything, yet people are hating on me as well...i like game forums, but when i see so much crap i try to take a stand

Post your thoughts on the game and not the people talking about it. Seems simple enough to me. Like I said write a review and I for one will be glad to read and talk about it, the various things you like and dislike as opposed to trying to belittle people opinions claiming unless they are "technical facts" through word play in the title, they aren't valid and don't make a game bad. If you wanted to know just the technical facts this thread would not even be here you would do, as I told you many times go read the technical sections.

holy smeg...does no one read?

I dont mind constructive, well thought out posts on the faults of DA2, but i do mind posts full of 'BW sucks' and 'Laidlaw must die' crap

Okay, I have read this thread through, and I haven't seen (but for the occasional troll, or emotional post, and you're going to get those no matter what) really doing that.  What you have received, mostly, are well thought out criticisms. So, again, why the fuss? 

And once again, you can't  control those people who post Laidlaw should die/be fired/ incenerated/ <insert ridiculous hyperbole here>. That is the moderators' jobs, not yours, and they do just fine.  So it seems to me that you aren't just targeting those posts, you want all of us to shut up. And that ain't gonna happen.

Modifié par erynnar, 09 mai 2011 - 07:24 .

[Serpieri Nei]

@ the OP - Theres over 80 pages of Constructive Criticism in the Registered Game Owner Forum. And many others located in the other sections. Why don't you do some reading, then if you still don't agree with those posts then point out to us why they are wrong and have a discussion on the boards without attacking people. 

Modifié par Serpieri Nei, 09 mai 2011 - 07:24 .

[Chugster]

Sabriana wrote...

OP, I've tried many times in your thread to point out that your behavior is worse than the behavior of many of those who post criticism. You are making sweeping generalizations, and thereby inviting negativity in an almost baffling regularity.

Please stop. I've asked you very politely to please state your problems in a manner that makes them suitable for mature debate. I also told you that your attempt to "teach us a lesson" will only end in more negativity, and that it may well be aimed at you.

Your posts are full of "I want", "I think", "you are all wrong", "I wanted to proof", "I want everyone to do as I wish" "I want this to stop", "I want everyone who thinks differently than I to shut up and go away.". This will simply not work.

If a post or a thread bother you that much, you need to step away, and take a deep breath. I've been on forums and boards for a long time, and there is simply no way to "shut" people "up". Especially when they feel that their purchase didn't meet with what was offered and/or their expectations. You simply do not have the right to tell other paying customers what to do.

Live with it.

So you fight for peoples rights to post bull**** posts full of hate and other crap but then have a go at me when i try to stop it?

that make you just as much of a hypocrite as you make me out to be...

Sod it...i tried to have intelligent debate on this but i get flamed and misquoted, by you mostly. Some people you just cant have intelligent discourse with...so i shall no longer bother...

its people like you that make these forums an ugly place to visit sometime, I will just have to stick to the Isabela thread and the modding forums...no idiots in there

Enjoy the cesspit you have created for yourselves

[Chugster]

Serpieri Nei wrote...

@ the OP - Theres over 80 pages of Constructive Criticism in the Registered Game Owner Forum. And many others located in the other sections. Why don't you do some reading, then if you still don't agree with those posts then point out to us why they are wrong and have a discussion on the boards without attacking people. 

im not agianst these posts....read my posts

@everyone: dont bother flaming me anymore, i wont be reading this post anymore

Modifié par Chugster, 09 mai 2011 - 07:30 .

[Melca36]

Chugster wrote...

Sabriana wrote...

OP, I've tried many times in your thread to point out that your behavior is worse than the behavior of many of those who post criticism. You are making sweeping generalizations, and thereby inviting negativity in an almost baffling regularity.

Please stop. I've asked you very politely to please state your problems in a manner that makes them suitable for mature debate. I also told you that your attempt to "teach us a lesson" will only end in more negativity, and that it may well be aimed at you.

Your posts are full of "I want", "I think", "you are all wrong", "I wanted to proof", "I want everyone to do as I wish" "I want this to stop", "I want everyone who thinks differently than I to shut up and go away.". This will simply not work.

If a post or a thread bother you that much, you need to step away, and take a deep breath. I've been on forums and boards for a long time, and there is simply no way to "shut" people "up". Especially when they feel that their purchase didn't meet with what was offered and/or their expectations. You simply do not have the right to tell other paying customers what to do.

Live with it.

So you fight for peoples rights to post bull**** posts full of hate and other crap but then have a go at me when i try to stop it?

that make you just as much of a hypocrite as you make me out to be...

Sod it...i tried to have intelligent debate on this but i get flamed and misquoted, by you mostly. Some people you just cant have intelligent discourse with...so i shall no longer bother...

its people like you that make these forums an ugly place to visit sometime, I will just have to stick to the Isabela thread and the modding forums...no idiots in there

Enjoy the cesspit you have created for yourselves

Bye!

Come back when you get older. Maybe then you will understand what intelligent debate is.

[Chugster]

im probably older than you sunshine...

dammit, i cant resist replying to idiots

Modifié par Chugster, 09 mai 2011 - 07:32 .

[Lumikki]

I think Sabriana tries to say, you are doing little wrong ways. Meaning your point is "Leave this forum if you can't post constructive manner". When you point should have been " Please try to post you opinion more constructive manner so it's easyer for everyone".You try to brove there is alot of false emotional "bad" stuff. We all know it, so Bioware developers too, they aren't stupid. Bioware has allready sayed, they know how to "clean" out of bad feedback. Meanign people who don't know how to post constructive , loose they feedback in Developers eyes. Meaning they bark for nothing.. Not because they message, but they behavior in forum..

Modifié par Lumikki, 09 mai 2011 - 07:36 .

[Chugster]

Lumikki wrote...

I think Sabriana tries to say, you are doing little wrong ways. Meaning your point is "Leave this forum if you can't post constructive manner". When you point should have been " Please try to post you opinion more constructive manner so it's easyer for everyone".

maybe, and i did admit that i may have not got my point across properly in my first post, didnt stop the flamers attacking despite me remaking my point several times

Modifié par Chugster, 09 mai 2011 - 07:35 .

[Serpieri Nei]

Chugster wrote...

Serpieri Nei wrote...

@ the OP - Theres over 80 pages of Constructive Criticism in the Registered Game Owner Forum. And many others located in the other sections. Why don't you do some reading, then if you still don't agree with those posts then point out to us why they are wrong and have a discussion on the boards without attacking people. 

im not agianst these posts....read my posts

@everyone: dont bother flaming me anymore, i wont be reading this post anymore

Many people have tried to reach out to you but you have made it clear that you’re unwilling to have a civil discussion. Sadly, the only people you ended up hurting here with your attacks was yourself which has now brought your credibility into question. I suggest in the future that you try to understand that you are part of a community and act accordingly next time.  

Modifié par Serpieri Nei, 09 mai 2011 - 07:46 .

[erynnar]

Chugster wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

I think Sabriana tries to say, you are doing little wrong ways. Meaning your point is "Leave this forum if you can't post constructive manner". When you point should have been " Please try to post you opinion more constructive manner so it's easyer for everyone".

maybe, and i did admit that i may have not got my point across properly in my first post, didnt stop the flamers attacking despite me remaking my point several times

Perhaps your point is not clear at all. I still don't know what you're on about, mate. You don't want hate threads, got it, mods usually put end of the line and lock those. Yes they might go on a little longer than you'd like, but the moderators do catch and lock them. You don't like the hyperbole, got it. Most of us can brush it off.  So what is your point? I am totally confused about what it exactly that has a bee in your bonnet.

Can you post links to the egregious threads that moderators missed that are nothing but hate filled?  So as I have seen, there have been occasional threads (locked) and occasional posts that get out of hand, but for the most part it is constructive criticism and lively debate where we agree to disagree. And for the most part we all agree more than we don't on what was right and wrong in DA2. We all really just differ on whether those things could e overlooked to enjoy the game, or couldn't. It really is that simple and has been for quite a while.

[Gotholhorakh]

Consumers SHOULDN'T shut their mouths and not complain when things aren't to their liking, by the way, because this is a capitalist process and not a bread queue in Soviet Russia - critical reception from customers is what makes things get QC'd and improved at all, and long may it live.

People who care about still playing BioWare games into the future, like me, will continue, here or elsewhere, to let BioWare know that they have not entered into dialogue with us, that yes we are still here wanting to buy their games but that no this game wasn't up to scratch, and that the failure to address concerns rather than publicly deride them has been shabby, because it is useful for that message to remain in the community.

Hey, there is even the possibility that one day the games might be fixed if people don't just "let everything slide". Wouldn't that be nice?

Modifié par Gotholhorakh, 09 mai 2011 - 07:44 .

[Sabriana]

Lumikki wrote...

I think Sabriana tries to say, you are doing little wrong ways. Meaning your point is "Leave this forum if you can't post constructive manner". When you point should have been " Please try to post you opinion more constructive manner so it's easyer for everyone".You try to brove there is alot of false emotional "bad" stuff. We all know it, so Bioware developers too, they aren't stupid. Bioware has allready sayed, they know how to "clean" out of bad feedback.

Thank you, Lumikki, that was indeed what I was trying to say.

OP, you are far too emotional to post in a manner like this. You once again state "when *I* tried to stop it". You are not a moderator, and you have simply no right to stop anyone from voicing her/his opinion.

All your posts are full of sentences that are highly emotional and not very rational. Look at what you accomplished. You stated that you wanted people to see the error of their ways, conform to your way, or else STFU and GTHO. This is about the 5th time I'm telling you that you went about it in the worst way possible - namely in a very subjectiv and highly emotional manner. I see I can make no head-way.

Well, I tried.  I wish you good luck, and I hope you enjoying the game, and I mean that sincerely. You have every right to state that you like the game and sing bioware's praises. However, you also need to accept that those of us who wish to voice criticism/complaints have that same right.


Edited to be confused. Middle finger? What middle finger? What'd I miss now?

Edited the edit: NVM, I see.

Modifié par Sabriana, 09 mai 2011 - 07:47 .