51 réponses à ce sujet

[bealzebub]

Now that I have the Undermountain .mods out of the way, I've picked this project up again. I think the short 19 month hiatus did me good
After playing through what I have, I think this campaign is 90% complete. Why didn't I just finish it?
The talk above, about Hommlet and the Temple of Elemental Evil was just madness, please disregard it. What was I thinking?

The first three modules of this four module campaign are completed.
A1- Slave Pits of the Undercity
A2- Secret of the Slavers Stockade
A3- Assault on the Aerie of the Slave Lords

The fourth module, A4- In the Dungeons of the Slave Lords, has all the areas built and about 75% of the encounters implemented.
And I ask again, why didn't I just finish it?
The world may never know.

[rjshae]

Perhaps you needed a break? I know I like to work on a variety of different projects in order to avoid burnout; it keeps the mind fresh and springy...

[Eguintir Eligard]

Sorry folks, beezlebub has been banned for bumping 3 and a half year old posts

[bealzebub]

Hey folks,

I've been making great progress getting this project ready for testing. I'm at the point now, where I'm going through and making sure all the journal entries make sense, and making sure the story is cohesive.

I can't make up my mind about something and was hoping for some feedback.

The beginning of this campaign is a bit story intensive. Several of the beginning areas are only to move the plot along, with no real action. Since I've been concentrating on the story aspect of this, I think another actionless story area would tie things together quite nicely. My concern is that I'm over doing it, and I should just get to the action.

I know their is no real answer for me and that it's just a personal play style preference, but what do you all think? Is it better to just get to the point and start the action, or is a well crafted story more important, even though you may have a while of just conversations and cut scenes?

It's hard for me to find the balance. I think that a storyless .mod is no fun, just hack and slash, but I have also quickly gotten bored of a module after the first hour is nothing but npcs and text.

any opinions?

[rjshae]

I once read some sage advice about DM-ing PnP games: namely, to start things off with a bang. That garners the player's interest, after which you can do some story and character development.

 

Perhaps it could begin with an engaging prelude, then settle into the story phase? Or you could entice them with a dramatic cut scene. The latter seems to work for many commercial RPGs.

[Dann-J]

As you said, Bealzebub, getting the balance right is tricky. Too much story that gets in the way of the action can be as bad as too little story.

 

Personally, I don't like long-winded cut scenes where control is taken away from the player for too long. I prefer to keep mandatory plot-related conversations to the barest essentials, and offer the player the option of asking follow-up questions afterward. If the player isn't interested in knowing the minutia of the storyline, then I'd rather not force such details on them.

 

Another thing I'm not a big fan of is uncharacteristic exposition. If the bad guy truly is a bad guy then he'll most likely attack you on sight, rather than explain his 'secret' plans at length before attempting to kill you. Although I can see how that'd be a good deliberate strategy to allow the players' buffs to wear off before engaging them in combat.  

 

The original Baldur's Gate had some nice introductory cut scenes for certain areas, like the tracking shot that introduced you to the Friendly Arm inn, or the introduction to Nashkel with the kobolds being revealed near the end. They were nice and quick so they never out-stayed their welcome, and generally used visual shots to set the scene rather than actual sentences.

[Tchos]

I think another actionless story area would tie things together quite nicely. My concern is that I'm over doing it, and I should just get to the action.

I know their is no real answer for me and that it's just a personal play style preference, but what do you all think? Is it better to just get to the point and start the action

 

If by "action" you mean fighting, it depends on the kind of module you're making.  To me, fighting is not necessarily the "point" of playing modules.  If I thought fighting was the sole point or raison d'être, there are arena-style modules with nothing but fighting.  Conversely, I've played numerous short modules where there was no fighting at all, because they were atmospheric puzzle-oriented object-manipulation modules (like Elysius' excellent contribution to the BouncyRock Halloween campaign), or puzzle dungeons (such as Seraphimsage's Gold & Ebony: Temple of Time).  There are also investigation/mystery focused modules that have minimal fighting and a lot of atmosphere.  Don't just put in gratuitous fighting if it doesn't fit with the flow of things.

[rjshae]

I don't think action necessarily needs to be combat; it could be an annual celebration with free loot to be collected, the birth of a ruler's child followed by reveling in the streets, a public execution or flogging, two dandies engaging in a sword fight over a woman, or a group of people fighting a building fire. Just distinctive unique events that break up a slow development and provide an opportunity for the player to intervene. Or not.

[PJ156]

I think Balance is important. Long periods without combat or some other distraction from text reading and response need to be broken down. As RJS said, these could be non plot related but keep the player engaged in the "feel" of the region.

 

We don't charge for our work and so we can do whatever the hell we like, people can like or lump it, however if you want it to get the largest player base/response (and there's not so many of them any more) then I believe you should keep some balance throughout the module.

 

PJ

[bealzebub]

Hey everybody,

thanks for the feedback. I just needed some affirmation for what I already knew.

By "action" I just meant doing something other than walking around town and talking to npcs.

I think I am going to go with one more area to tie things together, and slip a good, old fashion bar brawl into it. I found a prefab area that is just right, so I don't even need to build it.

thanks again

[Eguintir Eligard]

No matter what you are doing, mostly combat, mostly non combat, whatever the key concept that is center stage for your module, make sure it is like a good pair of underwear. Good underwear breathes.

 

That said this is a combat game engine, not a Kobo E Reader. If the primary focus is walls of text you are using the wrong platform, because this game is very fatiguing to read for long periods. If that isn't something you can back off on, invest in finding a larger and better UI for the text windows to allow some relief in reading.

[bealzebub]

Well, I've got Scourge of the Slave Lords ready for beta testing, but it's not going so well.
It plays perfect for me, beginning to end, but it crashes for my tester.
The campaign loads and starts the first module fine, but 5-30 seconds later it crashes to desktop with no error message.
I don't know if it matters or not, but she is on a mac.
 
Here's what we've tried so far;
I renamed my nwn2 folder and started the game to create a clean folder, I then installed  my campaign with the files I sent her. Everything worked fine.
I had her do the same thing, and she crashed.
I thought it might be a problem with the starting area or conversation, so I moved the start point to a different area and had her try it again. It crashed in exactly the same way.
 
It seems strange to me that the crash doesn't happen until after the campaign and module loads, and things seem to be working for a few seconds. Does anyone have any ideas?
 
If any one wants to download my campaign and give it a try, I would appreciate it. This is my first test, so I'd really like to know if this problem happens to everyone since I can't reproduce it on my end.

campaign: https://dl.dropboxus...tSL_campaign.7z

.haks: https://dl.dropboxus...2/SotSL_haks.7z

.mods: https://dl.dropboxus...L_mods_v0.51.7z

[4760]

Download still in progress (haks still missing)...

I therefore tried without the haks (yes, I removed them from the first module, and changed the appearance of the paintings to go to module A1), and no crash (of course, after I moved the .tlk from the campaign  to the tlk folder).

 

Btw, I couldn't enter any of the houses, although the doors open. I'll check again later, when I finally get the haks. As I don't think it's related though, I suggest you lock the doors and have a message explaining that the lock cannot be picked, or make them not useable.

[4760]

Tested with the haks: no crash... I'm afraid it's a Mac issue, or at least related to your friend's setup.

Did you ask her to try with an empty override, just to rule out some possible conflict with 2da or scripts?

 

Since you mention "beta testing" (don't worry, no spoilers here):

• house doors open but lead to nowhere (see post above)
• in the note you receive at the very beginning, there's a typo ("Nobel", should be "Noble" I think).
• NPC Bellod has no convo. He should at least say that you have to talk to his uncle.
• On the trip cutscene, just before the two travelers arrive near the party, the camera is under the wagon (almost below the ground even).
• Another typo after this cutscene when you speak with your fellow travelers: "Waite", should be "Wait".

 

I didn't go further, I guess that's enough to confirm that the campaign works (Win 7 Pro x64, NWN2 with all expansions 1.23.1765 - by the way, could it be that your friend lacks MotB or SoZ?)

[Tchos]

Easiest solution for the doors is just to click the "static" box for any doors that won't actually lead anywhere.  Better than locking them, because locking implies they might be unlockable and cause players to waste time looking for a way in.

[bealzebub]

thanks guys,

I'm sure her override was empty because I had her create a new nwn2 folder and the doors were on my list but got missed.

I hope it's a mac issue and not my project. It's disconcerting when it fails for the first person to try it.
Only two people have tried it, so I have a 50% fail rate. If anyone else cares to give it a try, I would be grateful.

[bealzebub]

I just posted to the new vault. I'll just wait and see what people say.

[olnorton]

I'm just wondering if Dredd Delgath is compulsory?
If I say I don't need his help (because I'm a wizard myself) then the game crashes, 3 times out of 3.
But if I take him with me it continues.
Can I drop him after accepting him?

[bealzebub]

I'm not sure about the crashing.... so take him with you. You'll have a chance to re-organize your party when you leave the safe house in Highport. He is not compulsory.

[olnorton]

I finished it with just Freda & Blodgett.
I still had the "Aerie of the Slave Lords" quest at the end, so I probably missed a bit, something about an ivory horse head.
It wasn't bad, the crashing I mentioned was the only real bug.
Oric, the slave merchant & his bodyguards respawn every time you enter the area, they end up a small army.
Getting attacked by a spider while locked in conversation with the gnome at the start is not the best for a low level wizard character.
Your journal says Fruhorn will meet you at the wrong place (can't remember where, but it is not the White Knight)
Being able to have a few conversations with my companions would have been nice.

[eLPuSHeR]

Hello.

 

I have started playing this campaign which I am liking so far but I have run into an issue. The Area Transition icon north of drachensgrab hills doesn't trigger for me at all. Any ideas? I think I am at module A2 now.

[bealzebub]

hmmm... that's a new one for me. I'm not sure why it wouldn't fire. It has no conditions or any thing.

[sneakypetev]

I run into a problem w/ the first part of the mod, I am suppose to speak to Behan at the tavern at highpoint, but he just tells me to mind my own business, did I forget to do something ?