941 réponses à ce sujet

[LenaMarie]

The 'masses' are brain dead sheep, without the ability to think for themselves. No one is arguing the base game was not great, it was. The problem is the DLCs are crappy obviously pumped out for extra cash. When they start making DLC thats up to the value and quality of the base game people would stop complaining. The brain dead fanboys arent helping this though, you keep supporting crap, you'll only ever end up with crap. I cant understand the mentality where less for more is good, can anyone truely be that stupid?



I would think everyone would want 3-4 hour DLCs for Dragon Age, more Content to play with. By the way, for blind ignorant fanboys, Bioware already confirmed this DLC is only 20-40 minutes, this isnt an hour of Content or more.

[KalDurenik]

Ok a few notes...



Comparing a MMO to a single player game and saying that "well the DLC is cheaper then the MMO price / month" is abit dumb...



DLC is to stop pirates... No its not there to stop pirates. If i wished to i could just open any of the big torrent websites out there and in around 1min i would have all DLC ever released all items and any special thing they do. For free. DLC is here because its CHEAP to make and they can sell it expensive.

Now some people here will say "LOL 5$ is like poketchange" but buy it 20 times and following the content average time (released so far from ME + DAO) (a average of 1 hour and 10min (and then im very very very very very nice)) and compareing it to a expansion where they would have to make 20-30 hours of content with new features, ideas, textures, creatures and so on and so forth. For only 30-60$....



Well you get the point. If you buy DLC 20 times (and lets say you get to a magical 30 hours of content) and the average price is 7$ you will have spent 140$.



Anyway they are doing it to make money. Is it wrong? No they are a company thats what they do... Try to get as much money as they can. Do i like it? No. Will i complain? Yes. Will it change anything? Most likely no.



Anyway just my 2c

[Charliff01]

40 minutes would be enough for me but then again apparently i am a braindead sheep who shouldn't be allowed to spend his own money on something he likes...

[kjdhgfiliuhwe]

Not sure what can be said that hasn't been said many times before. I can say the pricing is completely out of whack when viewed in relationship to the actual game itself.



The real problem is that DLC creep is a very real and probable future where we'll start seeing games created 'incomplete' while using DLC as an underhand method of increasing the game price. Obviously a business' #1 concern is to make a profit, but there is something distasteful in the current DLC trend. I almost feel as if the MMO subscription model is much more honest about it all.



I can say, based off Warden's Keep (which took all of 20 minutes on the first run through and ~10 on subsequent runthroughs when I skipped the dialogue), I will not be buying anymore DA DLC. That surpassed even my heavy Bioware fanboism in its naked greed. And while the money isn't necessarily the issue, the principle behind it all in enabling the accountants at these companies to turn the video game industry into a micro-transaction marketplace is troubling.



Instead, I await the much greater fare I have every confidence will come out of the community.

[nisallik]

LenaMarie wrote...

The 'masses' are brain dead sheep, without the ability to think for themselves. No one is arguing the base game was not great, it was. The problem is the DLCs are crappy obviously pumped out for extra cash. When they start making DLC thats up to the value and quality of the base game people would stop complaining. The brain dead fanboys arent helping this though, you keep supporting crap, you'll only ever end up with crap. I cant understand the mentality where less for more is good, can anyone truely be that stupid?

I would think everyone would want 3-4 hour DLCs for Dragon Age, more Content to play with. By the way, for blind ignorant fanboys, Bioware already confirmed this DLC is only 20-40 minutes, this isnt an hour of Content or more.

Maybe you fail to realize that people actually enjoyed Warden's Keep and were satisfied with their purchase? 

[the_one_54321]

nisallik wrote...

LenaMarie wrote...

The 'masses' are brain dead sheep, without the ability to think for themselves. No one is arguing the base game was not great, it was. The problem is the DLCs are crappy obviously pumped out for extra cash. When they start making DLC thats up to the value and quality of the base game people would stop complaining. The brain dead fanboys arent helping this though, you keep supporting crap, you'll only ever end up with crap. I cant understand the mentality where less for more is good, can anyone truely be that stupid?

I would think everyone would want 3-4 hour DLCs for Dragon Age, more Content to play with. By the way, for blind ignorant fanboys, Bioware already confirmed this DLC is only 20-40 minutes, this isnt an hour of Content or more.

Maybe you fail to realize that people actually enjoyed Warden's Keep and were satisfied with their purchase? 

no, i think that may be exactly what he's talking about.

have you ever heard of the saying "so good a salesman he could sell ice to an eskimo?"

[Dnarris]

nisallik wrote...

Maybe you fail to realize that people actually enjoyed Warden's Keep and were satisfied with their purchase? 

On the same note, I wasn't satisfied with it.

Though it was not a purchase I made. Would I have had to make the choice of paying $7 for it, I would not have in retrospect.

[kansadoom]

But still if someone enjoyed it and were satisified there is no reason to call them a brain dead sheep just because you dont share the same opinion as they do

[Hoganwulf]

36 pages of the same thing.

I love it, I'll buy it.
I hate it, I won't buy it.
BioWare rules!
Bioware sucks!

You don't want to buy it - great don't buy it. You don't like the way BioWare does business? Start your own and do better.  You want to buy it - download it.

This is a GAME. Take it as that. You made the choice to purchase DA:O. No one forced you. How does that give you the right to complain about a companies business model?

It is a game, not a matter of life or death. BioWare owes me nothing. I bought a GAME from them. Period. I have expectations when I buy a game, this game met those. I have had no game breaking problems. I have had hours of escapism.

I am not a "fanboy". I am a gamer. If a game fails to keep my attention, or fails to satisfy, I leave. I find something else.

Modifié par Hoganwulf, 20 novembre 2009 - 11:25 .

[nisallik]

the_one_54321 wrote...

no, i think that may be exactly what he's talking about.

have you ever heard of the saying "so good a salesman he could sell ice to an eskimo?"

But I will be getting what I want from Return to Ostagar.  New codex entries which will expand the lore and different reactions from companions going back to Ostagar.  To you, that maybe worthless, but to me it is far from it.

[Dnarris]

kjdhgfiliuhwe wrote...

Not sure what can be said that hasn't been said many times before. I can say the pricing is completely out of whack when viewed in relationship to the actual game itself.

The real problem is that DLC creep is a very real and probable future where we'll start seeing games created 'incomplete' while using DLC as an underhand method of increasing the game price. Obviously a business' #1 concern is to make a profit, but there is something distasteful in the current DLC trend. I almost feel as if the MMO subscription model is much more honest about it all.

I can say, based off Warden's Keep (which took all of 20 minutes on the first run through and ~10 on subsequent runthroughs when I skipped the dialogue), I will not be buying anymore DA DLC. That surpassed even my heavy Bioware fanboism in its naked greed. And while the money isn't necessarily the issue, the principle behind it all in enabling the accountants at these companies to turn the video game industry into a micro-transaction marketplace is troubling.

Instead, I await the much greater fare I have every confidence will come out of the community.

That is the biggest underlying issue with DLC. The more successful DLC is the more you're going to see other games turning to it. Unfortunately, it isn't something that can be stopped without major consumer support in the effort.

I've already accepted that microtransactions are an inevitable permanency. So, rather than focus effort on deriding microtransactions in general, I find it best to at least vocalize on acceptable methods of implementation.

Such as opposing games that have obviously been "slimed" down and content removed to be sold as DLC. Or overpriced DLC that do not so appreciation or at least equivalency for the value of our currency.

The DA:O  retail box is great and I can't say I see any slimming down for DLC (Though I am currently contemplating this with RTO, which I'm sure will be more evident upon its release), but I do see their pricing model is off-scale with the equivalency with the purchasing power of our currency. If they want to keep prices where they are they simply have to add more content to the DLC for it to maintain the value of our currency. Which is a concern for consumers as the less they give you for your currency the more they stand to profit.

[Dnarris]

Hoganwulf wrote...

36 pages of the same thing.

I love it, I'll buy it.
I hate it, I won't buy it.
BioWare rules!
Bioware sucks!

You don't want to buy it - great don't buy it. You don't like the way BioWare does business? Start your own and do better.  You want to buy it - download it.

This is a GAME. Take it as that. You made the choice to purchase DA:O. No one forced you. How does that give you the right to complain about a companies business model?

It is a game, not a matter of life or death. BioWare owes me nothing. I bought a GAME from them. Period. I have expectations when I buy a game, this game met those. I have had no game breaking problems. I have had hours of escapism.

I am not a "fanboy". I am a gamer. If a game fails to keep my attention, or fails to satisfy, I leave. I find something else.

And if you read through the thread you'd find many post just like yours attempting to be the "Be all, end all" post for the thread.

[the_one_54321]

Hoganwulf wrote...
This is a GAME. Take it as that. You made the choice to purchase DA:O. No one forced you. How does that give you the right to complain about a companies business model?

it's a game, but the sale and purchase thereof are ecconomics. i have the right to complain because their business model directly effects me as the consumer, and everyone elses choice to purchase it effects me by validating that business model.

[Blood Bathrrom]

meh good game but not to much replay value to be honest, game could have been alot better. pretty linear. but still good game, now on the subject of these dlc's..... i wouldnt waste the money.

[Atertract]

I paid for two PC games in the last ~year: Fallout 3 and Dragon Age.  As much as I loved FO3, I was completely turned off by the DLC model.  I bided my time, waiting for a proper expansion pack containing all the DLCs.  It never came.  Instead we were offered two add-on packs at $20 each, or a game of the year edition for $45, neither of which were palatable to me. 

What happened to the $20 expansion pack?  Obviously it's disappeared in favor of delivering not very expansive content piecemeal for greater profit.  Good for developers and publishers, bad for gamers, despite what half of them seem to think. If an add-on or DLC adds 2% gameplay hours to a $50 game, then it's actual worth is a dollar, right?  As far as I can see, a huge portion of the cost and effort that goes into developing a game is NOT found in the missions themselves, so why is a DLC that adds maybe 5% to a game often priced at more than 20% of the game's original cost? 

What's happening?  Maybe people are confusing virtual worlds for real.  Invisible armor, storage chests, increased level caps, King Cailan's armor and weapons--yes, these things are cool.  But their cost should be determined by the cost it took to produce them, not their worth inside a virtual world.  I'd appreciate the hell out of a storage chest for my loot, but will I be paying for a handful of DLC packs whose combined cost is comparable to the original game when they probably add no more than 15% gameplay to the entire experience?  No.  Obviously, the free market decides the future of DLC vs. expansion packs; unfortunately, it seems we've got a bunch of gamers who have no idea what they're saying goodbye to by saying yes to $7/2% DLCs.

How did I solve my FO3 problem?  I bet you can figure it out.

[djfayt]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

jynthor wrote...

The negative responses really make me sad.
This dlc looks alot better than wardens keep, bioware works hard so we can play this and all you suckers can do is whine.

seriously

The problem is it sounds very similar to a Warden's Keep type DLC, and lets face it, WC was a giant gimmick.  Are you really surprised that not everyone is peeing themselves with excitement?

I loved Warden's Keep.  It gives you all sorts of cool things if you complete it. Very handy early game in my first(and continued first run).
Keep the DLC coming! In the end you will have a tremendous game.  I'm not sure on this but I think the assets used in DLC can also be used by the toolset.  That allows for better mods. The game IS NOT AN MMO. A lot of people here are whining for an expansion pack.  Really? Go back to WoW for that stuff.

[Atertract]

djfayt wrote...
The game IS NOT AN MMO. A lot of people here are whining for an expansion pack.  Really? Go back to WoW for that stuff.

Wrong.  Expansion packs existed years before MMORPGs were developed.  The general model was $20 for a significant, expansive addition to the base game.

[Dnarris]

Atertract wrote...

I paid for two PC games in the last ~year: Fallout 3 and Dragon Age.  As much as I loved FO3, I was completely turned off by the DLC model.  I bided my time, waiting for a proper expansion pack containing all the DLCs.  It never came.  Instead we were offered two add-on packs at $20 each, or a game of the year edition for $45, neither of which were palatable to me. 

What happened to the $20 expansion pack?  Obviously it's disappeared in favor of delivering not very expansive content piecemeal for greater profit.  Good for developers and publishers, bad for gamers, despite what half of them seem to think. If an add-on or DLC adds 2% gameplay hours to a $50 game, then it's actual worth is a dollar, right?  As far as I can see, a huge portion of the cost and effort that goes into developing a game is NOT found in the missions themselves, so why is a DLC that adds maybe 5% to a game often priced at more than 20% of the game's original cost? 

What's happening?  Maybe people are confusing virtual worlds for real.  Invisible armor, storage chests, increased level caps, King Cailan's armor and weapons--yes, these things are cool.  But their cost should be determined by the cost it took to produce them, not their worth inside a virtual world.  I'd appreciate the hell out of a storage chest for my loot, but will I be paying for a handful of DLC packs whose combined cost is comparable to the original game when they probably add no more than 15% gameplay to the entire experience?  No.  Obviously, the free market decides the future of DLC vs. expansion packs; unfortunately, it seems we've got a bunch of gamers who have no idea what they're saying goodbye to by saying yes to $7/2% DLCs.

How did I solve my FO3 problem?  I bet you can figure it out.

A very well thought out and constructed post.

This is exactly my feelings on DLC currently.

It is almost similar to my standings on the Consitution of the United States. Everytime the U.S. allows a change to the Consitution or allows some civil freedom to be removed, without serious consideration and debate, for larger government regulation they are giving something that is unlikely that they will ever get back.

I have no desire to discuss politics in light of economics, but it was an example to support my reasoning. If you allow the the charging of exorbant prices for little in the way of goods/services you open the way for a continuation of such an exaggerated standard. Even $1 can be exorbant if what you received in return didn't warrant the cost and in terms of value per currency spent on the retail box and value per currency spent on DLC the DLC is not adding up to sound purchases.

You have to be able to remove the personal value from the picture to really appreciate the economical value of the purchases. With that said I am in no way deriding the personal views on why the purchases are or aren't sound, I'm simply not addressing the cost from a personal aspect.

[Dnarris]

Bio-Boy 3000 wrote...

So if I buy 10 DLCs at 5 dollars a piece that only offer an hour worth of gameplay, it would be a devaluation for me if they released a single expansion for 50 dollars that offered 30 hours of gameplay.

I'm not certain to what post this replies to, but I'd like to address your statement.

If you spent $5 for 1 hour of gameplay and you did so 10 times, your $50 would be spent on 10 hours of gameplay total.

In comparison to the retail box which costs $50 and offered 60+ hours of gameplay, would you not say that your dollar did not command the same value that it did when you purchased the retail box?

However, if you were to buy an expansion at the same cost and it offered half the gameplay time then your dollar has still depreciated, but by an amount of 50% compared to the amount of 83%. Which economically would have been the better purchase than the 10 DLCs at $5 each.

It wasn't the optimal purchase since you're attempting to reach an equivalency per dollar spent. But it was a much better deal.

As I've stated before personal value comes into play when a consumer is making a decision and personal value can be quite signifcant, but from an economical view you see the difference. 

[kalerab]

Too much of a fuss here, I think. What about to wait till it comes out and check some review to see if it is worth buying or not, if not screw it and if yes buy it. Jesus, one would think that this is more than obvious. One way or another, this DLC will come out and next DLCs as well, some of them are going to be good, some of them will suck - not a big deal there, nobody is forcing you to buy or download anything at all.

[Atertract]

Lowlander wrote...

djfayt wrote...
I loved Warden's Keep.  It gives you all sorts of cool things if you complete it. Very handy early game in my first(and continued first run).

That is even worse. You are essentially just buying in game gold with real money.

Exactly.  Paying real money for virtual items actually *is* a post-MMORPG concept, unlike the expansion pack.  It's highly unsettling that this could be the reason for in-game gold scarcity, and certainly isn't outside the realm of possibility considering the in-game DLC sales pitch.

[Mozi]

Just a few comments -



- I appreciate the quality of content in Warden's Keep (voiceovers etc.) but it was simply too short for what I paid for it.



-Please, no overpowered items in DLC - it's not a substitute for quality gameplay and it kind of ruins the rest of the game to have these great items fall into your lap in DLC and then go through the rest of the game, fighting challenging battles, and not finding anything better.



- BGII - ToB cost what, 30 bucks? I think I got more than 20 times the gameplay out of that then Warden's Keep. I fear that DLC will add up to be more money for less gameplay than a simple, old-fashioned expansion pack.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

LenaMarie wrote...

If you k
The 'masses' are brain dead sheep, without the ability to think for themselves. No one is arguing the base game was not great, it was. The problem is the DLCs are crappy obviously pumped out for extra cash. When they start making DLC thats up to the value and quality of the base game people would stop complaining. The brain dead fanboys arent helping this though, you keep supporting crap, you'll only ever end up with crap. I cant understand the mentality where less for more is good, can anyone truely be that stupid?

If no one buys the DLC at all, they don't go "Hey, let's spend more money and more resources to make a bigger DLC".  Their pricing model is structured for $5, $7 and $15 DLC's, being that this is their first DLC it's $5 but what the **** makes you think they don't have bigger stuff in the works?  Bigger stuff takes time, this small stuff they can put out every month or so and put out the big stuff every 6 months.  If you don't care for the small stuff, then don't buy it.  Personally, I'm intent on getting the full Dragon Age experience. I  bought the Digital Deluxe Edition for that very reason, and I'll buy any DLC they throw my way (unless it's absolutely revolting) because I love the game and I want to support it.

The base game was such great value for the money, to **** about the cheap as **** DLC is mind-numbingly stupid.

DLC is pure profit for the devs, by buying it you are supporting the developers directly.  That is how expansion packs and sequels get made, DLC is not designed a replacement for expansion packs. (Unless you're bethesda, the only other RPG to use a DLC model extensively)

Modifié par ITSSEXYTIME, 21 novembre 2009 - 12:35 .