137 réponses à ce sujet

[Elite Midget]

Yet earlier they said that there would be no LIs. Either there is new ones or they aren't.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Elite Midget wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...
I think your definitions of "sex object" and "retcon" are a little off.

Than prove me wrong.

Garrus has been cited in stats released by Bioware as one of the most popular squadmates to take on missions. Only about 20% of players play as Femshep, and not all of those players romance Garrus. Thus some of Garrus's popularity probably comes from straight males who see him as a "bro" rather than a love interest.

More people romance Miranda than Tali. So she would naturally be considered more of a "sex object" since she is literally a character designed to be as sexy as physically possible.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 12 mai 2011 - 07:13 .

[CroGamer002]

thatguy212 wrote...

Seboist wrote...
What's also bad about that is that the squad is confirmed to be smaller and there's no new LI. Talk about bull****

Casey Hudson made a tweet that implies that there will be new love interests

He did?

Source?

[thatguy212]

Seboist wrote...

thatguy212 wrote...

Seboist wrote...
What's also bad about that is that the squad is confirmed to be smaller and there's no new LI. Talk about bull****

Casey Hudson made a tweet that implies that there will be new love interests

Really? Not just "new" romancess with same old ones?

"#ME3 will have relationships with new characters and old friends, some of it romantic. Beyond that, spoiler territory!"
sounds like new ones to me
(this was in response to a question about new love interests)

Modifié par thatguy212, 12 mai 2011 - 07:13 .

[Seboist]

thatguy212 wrote...

Seboist wrote...

thatguy212 wrote...

Seboist wrote...
What's also bad about that is that the squad is confirmed to be smaller and there's no new LI. Talk about bull****

Casey Hudson made a tweet that implies that there will be new love interests

Really? Not just "new" romancess with same old ones?

"#ME3 will have relationships with new characters and old friends, some of it romantic. Beyond that, spoiler territory!"
sounds like new ones to me
(this was in response to a question about new love interests)

That's pretty vague. It doesn't help that "old friends" are counted with "some of it romantic".

[CulturalGeekGirl]

People are taking that quote as evidence of possible Jokermance, and maybe an "official," fully-developed Kellymance.

I'd say something like that is more likely than most alternatives. Though who knows?

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 12 mai 2011 - 07:16 .

[Someone With Mass]

Elite Midget wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...
I think your definitions of "sex object" and "retcon" are a little off.

Than prove me wrong.

Sex object is when you objectify someone sexually. I don't think either Tali or Garrus fit in that, because they have personalities beyond the sex.

As for the retcon, if there's nothing in the character that contradicts the rewritting, then I don't consider it retcon.

[Someone With Mass]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Garrus has been cited in stats released by Bioware as one of the most popular squadmates to take on missions. Only about 20% of players play as Femshep, and not all of those players romance Garrus. Thus some of Garrus's popularity probably comes from straight males who see him as a "bro" rather than a love interest.

More people romance Miranda than Tali. So she would naturally be considered more of a "sex object" since she is literally a character designed to be as sexy as physically possible.

Yep.

And even if Miranda was romanced more, BioWare can still see that Tali is quite popular. And there's really no harm in pleasing the fans as long as they do it properly, because if they don't appeal to the fans, they might lose them.

[Someone With Mass]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

People are taking that quote as evidence of possible Jokermance, and maybe an "official," fully-developed Kellymance.

I'd say something like that is more likely than most alternatives. Though who knows?

Jokermance? More like torturemance with his glass bones.

[Elite Midget]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
Garrus has been cited in stats released by Bioware as one of the most popular squadmates to take on missions. Only about 20% of players play as Femshep, and not all of those players romance Garrus. Thus some of Garrus's popularity probably comes from straight males who see him as a "bro" rather than a love interest.

More people romance Miranda than Tali. So she would naturally be considered more of a "sex object" since she is literally a character designed to be as sexy as physically possible.

So they shouldn't have made any of the ME2 Squaddies than? Or that they shouldn't have the option to be Femshep? Your bro option would work but look at it this way.

ME2 Garrus was very similiar to ME1 Kaiden with their dark past and lose of life. Kaiden was hated because he was just a 'human' while Garrus gets a pss because he's a Bird Man thus it makes him look more intreresting despite the similiarities. So that bro thing doesn't seem as more true than that "He's a Bird Man with a Gun that screws the rules even if it bites him in the ass multiple times!".

You may be true on that but at least she had key importance in ME2. I don't approve of her being madethat way but at least Bioware didn't change anything.

In ME1 Tali seems so much different than her fangurl version from ME2.

[Elite Midget]

Someone With Mass wrote...
Jokermance? More like torturemance with his glass bones.

Are you forgetting the Muscle and Bone upgrades that Shepard got throughout ME2? If Bioware really wanted they could fix Joker easily with those expensive upgrades that Shepard could get.

[Elite Midget]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Sex object is when you objectify someone sexually. I don't think either Tali or Garrus fit in that, because they have personalities beyond the sex.

As for the retcon, if there's nothing in the character that contradicts the rewritting, then I don't consider it retcon.

Which is what happened with ME1. Garrus an Tali weren't romanceable and it caused an outcy because many say them as objects that they wanted to have sex with.

There is when in the original working of ME1 they never intended to ever make Garrus or Tali as romances. Fan outcry and whinning caused them to rewrite that and change it to make them romanceable despite many ME1 lore that made is extremely toxic and deadly if they were to get initimate with a human.

[Seboist]

Elite Midget wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...
Jokermance? More like torturemance with his glass bones.

Are you forgetting the Muscle and Bone upgrades that Shepard got throughout ME2? If Bioware really wanted they could fix Joker easily with those expensive upgrades that Shepard could get.

It seemed like Cerberus fixed him up a bit in ME2. IIRC he talked about needing crutches in ME1.

[Someone With Mass]

That's because Tali was literally the only quarian in ME1, and had to be the living quarian encyclopedia.

ME2 gave her a chance to have some actual character traits. Much to everyone's joy and hate.

[Someone With Mass]

Elite Midget wrote...

Which is what happened with ME1. Garrus an Tali weren't romanceable and it caused an outcy because many say them as objects that they wanted to have sex with.

There is when in the original working of ME1 they never intended to ever make Garrus or Tali as romances. Fan outcry and whinning caused them to rewrite that and change it to make them romanceable despite many ME1 lore that made is extremely toxic and deadly if they were to get initimate with a human.

Yeah? So?
They still have personalities. Sex objects are there just for the sex.

Like Miranda.

[nelly21]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Yeah? So?
They still have personalities. Sex objects are there just for the sex.

Like Miranda.

Hold on a second!!!

Miranda isn't just a sex object. She is a very layered character if you give the whole romance the time.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Elite Midget wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
Garrus has been cited in stats released by Bioware as one of the most popular squadmates to take on missions. Only about 20% of players play as Femshep, and not all of those players romance Garrus. Thus some of Garrus's popularity probably comes from straight males who see him as a "bro" rather than a love interest.

More people romance Miranda than Tali. So she would naturally be considered more of a "sex object" since she is literally a character designed to be as sexy as physically possible.

So they shouldn't have made any of the ME2 Squaddies than? Or that they shouldn't have the option to be Femshep? Your bro option would work but look at it this way.

ME2 Garrus was very similiar to ME1 Kaiden with their dark past and lose of life. Kaiden was hated because he was just a 'human' while Garrus gets a pss because he's a Bird Man thus it makes him look more intreresting despite the similiarities. So that bro thing doesn't seem as more true than that "He's a Bird Man with a Gun that screws the rules even if it bites him in the ass multiple times!".

You may be true on that but at least she had key importance in ME2. I don't approve of her being madethat way but at least Bioware didn't change anything.

In ME1 Tali seems so much different than her fangurl version from ME2.

I was just trying to demonstrate that Garrus and Tali were not as popular as they are merely because of sexiness or LI-ness. Bioware has said that the majority of players don't even pursue any romance option at all. They are liked because they are liked.

While the fans on these boards may like them because they are love interests, in the "real world" most people probably just like those characters because they think they are cool, romance aside. Most (but not all) people I know who like Miranda romanced her, so I think her likability is more closely bound to her sexiness and the character attributes revealed during her romance. I like Tali even without her romance, and I like Garrus even without his.

In addition, most Garrusfans like Kaidan. It's a common theme in the Garrus fan thread. I've never seen a bad word said about the dude, except for the occasional "he broke my heart on horizon." 

I don't even know what you are saying about the ME2 squaddies. Of course there should have been new squadmates in ME2. And I would prefer 0-1 new characters, and a squad of 9 returning characters, made up of a mix of ME1 and ME2 squadmates. We're probably going to have to deal with 1-2 new characters, but I hope not too many more than that.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 12 mai 2011 - 07:35 .

[Someone With Mass]

nelly21 wrote...

Hold on a second!!!

Miranda isn't just a sex object. She is a very layered character if you give the whole romance the time.

If you say so...

[Phaedon]

Niddy' wrote...
Stop using that. LOTSB was a main story arc. It doesn't prove anything towards the argument in either direction. Stop.

Liara was a temporary squadmate in LotSB. It is true. In one of the missions of it, she's there. i didn't say ME2, I said LotSB. This is how temp squaddies will most likely work.

[Phaedon]

Elite Midget wrote...
Yes it was. Liara is part of an optional Mission Chain that you can miss. It changes nothing in ME2 and it took a DLC to retcon her Mission Chain after fans made it known they were angry at Bioware.

Retcon? What.

Liara is not a temporary squaddie in ME2, and her mission is not optional.
Liara is a temporary squaddie in LotSB, and her mission is mandatory.

a) You do nothing to dscourage it and your posts usually end up encourageing them to carry on. That makes you no better than them even if you don't outright say what you approve of them doing.

Hint: You assisted some of the trolls. 

Yes I do. Though why should I? My Variable Topic was there to give reasons why none could return, wihtout retcons or denying fans huge swaths of content, and that no Killable should ever get Special Treatment over the others. Than Lo and Behold Tali and Garrus get special treatment AGAIN.

And? Do you or do you not accept that variables can do that without retcons?

[darknoon5]

Someone With Mass wrote...

nelly21 wrote...

Hold on a second!!!

Miranda isn't just a sex object. She is a very layered character if you give the whole romance the time.

If you say so...

Hey, don't be a jerk. Stuff like this is why the old thread got locked.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

I agree that Bioware is more limited than they like, but this is also the first time anything remotely like this has been done. They're having to invent it all as they go along. If they ever do a chapter-wise story like this again, it'll be smoother.

That said, saying "if they were as free as they like to say I wouldn't have to fight Cerberus" is madness. That would be like me saying "if they were as free as they like to say I wouldn't have had to lose the first Normandy in ME2 and leave the alliance." or "If they were as free as they like to say, the reapers wouldn't be coming for another five years!" sometimes something just happens, and you have to react to it.

Also, it has been implied that you might get a chance later in ME3 to either solve whatever problem is making Cerberus attack you and reunite with them, or stay with the alliance.

[Someone With Mass]

darknoon5 wrote...
Hey, don't be a jerk. Stuff like this is why the old thread got locked.

I'm just saying.

No need to to be mad.