735 réponses à ce sujet

[Nathan Redgrave]

Y'know, Wreck, you could just go back a page or two. It's only a four-page thread so far.

EDIT: Er, make that five.

Modifié par Nathan Redgrave, 13 mai 2011 - 06:59 .

[NKKKK]

kylecouch wrote...

Ship.wreck wrote...

Can someone please post this picture. I still don't know what it looks like...

I'm more scared now than the reveal, consideirng I dind't notice the shoulder armor, which means IT IS armor. 

[Ship.wreck_]

Scrolling is for suckas.

No I went back.

But seriously, scrolling is for suckas.

[Nashiktal]

Come to think of it her new look is a little ironic considering she made fun of the old sci fi vids that involved skimpier clothing.

[Ship.wreck_]

Now that I've seen it, that does look bad :|

They did Marandize her, clothes almost identical, boobs identical (they WERE smaller before), hair identical, and what's up with the makeup.

Ash was actually cute, in ME. If she actually let her hair down and relaxed a little she would've been dead sexy (haven't romanced her, working on it). I'm all for her having a more sexy appearance in ME3 but I want her to still look like ASHLEY.

All they had to do was give her a slightly more sexy casuall outfit, and have her let her hair down when in "casual mode" on the ship. That would've been great. This just seems like it's changing her too much...

[AdmiralCheez]

aftohsix wrote...

Read the TOS please.

I did.

Okay.
 How about this.  I don't think Miranda was "overly sexualized."  Not
in the least compared to just about any other video game in recent
history.  In fact the last major female character who wasn't
"sexualized" that I can think of was Elena Fisher in the Uncharted
series and even she was designed to be a physically apealing woman.

Skintight
suit?  Stiletto heels?  Abundant asscrack?  Gratuitous camera angles?  A
waist that looked like I could snap it in half?  Sorry, bro: Space
Barbie.  Granted, she's no Ivy Valentine (that would be creepy), but
still, it was like every time I tried to talk to her, she was like LOOK AT MY BUTT, SHEPARD.

Samara's mega-cleavage and heels bugged me, too, but for some reason it wasn't quite as trashy.  Don't understand it, myself.

See? 
Elena Fischer is a good example of a girl that can be pretty without
being PLEASE ****** TO ME, LONELY MALE GAMER.  And what about Alyx from
Half Life 2?  Chell from Portal?  Ariel from Starcraft 2 (even though
she looked like Sarah Goddamn Palin, gag)?  Sheva from Res Evil 5 wasn't
too bad, either.  Oh, and Faith from Mirror's Edge.  And you know
what?  Even Jack, despite her shirtlessness, wasn't incredibly
sexualized either because of her unexaggerated frame, shaved head, tats,
and sour attitude.  And then there's Aveline, who was a nice counter to
Isabella, and then Leliana in DAO.  Liara was never oversexualized, nor
was Commander Shepard.  Not to mention Tali, whose suit, although snug,
is hardly skanky.

Sometimes all you need is a pretty face and a
memorable personality.  People can then fall in love with the character
on their own without them looking like an interactive pinup, hence the
legions of fans behind Tali (who has chicken legs and no face, for
f*ck's sake), Liara, and Ashley already.

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 13 mai 2011 - 07:06 .

[Ship.wreck_]

Nashiktal wrote...

Come to think of it her new look is a little ironic considering she made fun of the old sci fi vids that involved skimpier clothing.

Hahahaha! Which means Bioware was criticizing some sci-fi cliche's through her character!

I seem to recall that! And now bioware has become the very cliche they criticized haha!

That actually really sucks. I didn't even recognize her as Ashley when I saw that. Looks like her personality is going to change too.

[NKKKK]

Ship.wreck wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Come to think of it her new look is a little ironic considering she made fun of the old sci fi vids that involved skimpier clothing.

Hahahaha! Which means Bioware was criticizing some sci-fi cliche's through her character!

I seem to recall that! And now bioware has become the very cliche they criticized haha!

That actually really sucks. I didn't even recognize her as Ashley when I saw that. Looks like her personality is going to change too.

EA GAMES

Damage Everything...

[AdmiralCheez]

Nashiktal wrote...

Come to think of it her new look is a little ironic considering she made fun of the old sci fi vids that involved skimpier clothing.

And that's my only beef with it, really.  It's not even THAT bad as far as jumpsuits go.

[1Minsc1]

Ship.wreck wrote...

Now that I've seen it, that does look bad :|

They did Marandize her, clothes almost identical, boobs identical (they WERE smaller before), hair identical, and what's up with the makeup.

Ash was actually cute, in ME. If she actually let her hair down and relaxed a little she would've been dead sexy (haven't romanced her, working on it). I'm all for her having a more sexy appearance in ME3 but I want her to still look like ASHLEY.

All they had to do was give her a slightly more sexy casuall outfit, and have her let her hair down when in "casual mode" on the ship. That would've been great. This just seems like it's changing her too much...

This

And, to me, more. The look expresses the character. And this look doen't fit her character. So i wonder if BW will change her not "only" on the surface. Her writer left BW...

[Ship.wreck_]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
...Elena Fischer is a good example of a girl that can be pretty without
being PLEASE ****** TO ME, LONELY MALE GAMER...

...Ariel from Starcraft 2 (even though
she looked like Sarah Goddamn Palin, gag)?...

...(who has chicken legs and no face, for f*ck's sake), Liara, and Ashley already.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

Both an excellent report on female sexuality in video games, and HILARIOUS!

[aftohsix]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Skintight
suit?  Stiletto heels?  Abundant asscrack?  Gratuitous camera angles?  A
waist that looked like I could snap it in half?  Sorry, bro: Space
Barbie.  Granted, she's no Ivy Valentine (that would be creepy), but
still, it was like every time I tried to talk to her, she was like LOOK AT MY BUTT, SHEPARD.

Samara's mega-cleavage and heels bugged me, too, but for some reason it wasn't quite as trashy.  Don't understand it, myself.

See? 
Elena Fischer is a good example of a girl that can be pretty without
being PLEASE ****** TO ME, LONELY MALE GAMER.  And what about Alyx from
Half Life 2?  Chell from Portal?  Ariel from Starcraft 2 (even though
she looked like Sarah Goddamn Palin, gag)?  Sheva from Res Evil 5 wasn't
too bad, either.  Oh, and Faith from Mirror's Edge.  And you know
what?  Even Jack, despite her shirtlessness, wasn't incredibly
sexualized either because of her unexaggerated frame, shaved head, tats,
and sour attitude.  And then there's Aveline, who was a nice counter to
Isabella, and then Leliana in DAO.  Liara was never oversexualized, nor
was Commander Shepard.  Not to mention Tali, whose suit, although snug,
is hardly skanky.

Sometimes all you need is a pretty face and a
memorable personality.  People can then fall in love with the character
on their own without them looking like an interactive pinup, hence the
legions of fans behind Tali (who has chicken legs and no face, for
f*ck's sake), Liara, and Ashley already.

I don't think I made my point very well.  In my opinion any time a game developer designs a female character to be considered more or less attractive it is pandering to a male demographic.  Miranda may be more blatantly in your face sexy but I don't think she is "oversexulized" as compared to Elena Fisher, who is designed to be a beautiful woman wearing only jeans and a button up shirt.

Every one of the characters you listed were designed to appeal to a male gamer.  Logically wouldn't this be considered "sexualizing" them as well?

Ship.wreck wrote...

Now that I've seen it, that does look bad :|

They did Marandize her, clothes almost identical, boobs identical (they WERE smaller before), hair identical, and what's up with the makeup.

Ash was actually cute, in ME. If she actually let her hair down and relaxed a little she would've been dead sexy (haven't romanced her, working on it). I'm all for her having a more sexy appearance in ME3 but I want her to still look like ASHLEY.

All they had to do was give her a slightly more sexy casuall outfit, and have her let her hair down when in "casual mode" on the ship. That would've been great. This just seems like it's changing her too much...

Again...  One picture.  Seriously you guys.  Lets wait to see a few in game screens?

Modifié par aftohsix, 13 mai 2011 - 07:16 .

[Siansonea]

I don't mind Ash's new hair and makeup at all. I mean, some eyeliner and lip gloss is pretty minor, it's not like she's wearing Jack-level makeup. And her hair is a basic long shag cut with sideswept bangs, no frills. Her bust size is a bit more of a concern, though it's possible that she developed a bit more of a chest over the last few years, this much more breast volume would have to be a cosmetic enhancement procedure of some kind. I would prefer that they 'split the difference' between Ash's ME1 bustline and the promo pic, Ash was never about being the Sexy Hot Mama, that's why we have Miranda.

[Ship.wreck_]

1Minsc1 wrote...
This

And, to me, more. The look expresses the character. And this look doen't fit her character. So i wonder if BW will change her not "only" on the surface. Her writer left BW...

That's what I meant at the end there, I just can't picture Ashley's personality in this look.  I mean Ashley would conscously CHOOSE to not look like this. But like I said, it would be nice if she let her hair down occasionally, both literally and figuratively...

[TheRevanchist]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

aftohsix wrote...

Read the TOS please.

I did.

Okay.
 How about this.  I don't think Miranda was "overly sexualized."  Not
in the least compared to just about any other video game in recent
history.  In fact the last major female character who wasn't
"sexualized" that I can think of was Elena Fisher in the Uncharted
series and even she was designed to be a physically apealing woman.

Skintight
suit?  Stiletto heels?  Abundant asscrack?  Gratuitous camera angles?  A
waist that looked like I could snap it in half?  Sorry, bro: Space
Barbie.  Granted, she's no Ivy Valentine (that would be creepy), but
still, it was like every time I tried to talk to her, she was like LOOK AT MY BUTT, SHEPARD.

Samara's mega-cleavage and heels bugged me, too, but for some reason it wasn't quite as trashy.  Don't understand it, myself.

See? 
Elena Fischer is a good example of a girl that can be pretty without
being PLEASE ****** TO ME, LONELY MALE GAMER.  And what about Alyx from
Half Life 2?  Chell from Portal?  Ariel from Starcraft 2 (even though
she looked like Sarah Goddamn Palin, gag)?  Sheva from Res Evil 5 wasn't
too bad, either.  Oh, and Faith from Mirror's Edge.  And you know
what?  Even Jack, despite her shirtlessness, wasn't incredibly
sexualized either because of her unexaggerated frame, shaved head, tats,
and sour attitude.  And then there's Aveline, who was a nice counter to
Isabella, and then Leliana in DAO.  Liara was never oversexualized, nor
was Commander Shepard.  Not to mention Tali, whose suit, although snug,
is hardly skanky.

Sometimes all you need is a pretty face and a
memorable personality.  People can then fall in love with the character
on their own without them looking like an interactive pinup, hence the
legions of fans behind Tali (who has chicken legs and no face, for
f*ck's sake), Liara, and Ashley already.

QFT

Honestly...idk why either...but Samara does not bother me NEARLY as much...it still does to some degree however...and Aveline? I'm gonna be honest...I was honest to god in love with Aveline before the game launched. Until Bioware basiclly went "ha ha suckers! shes totaly into random guard # 55!" (as far as I'm concerned.) it was more than a little devastateing...was just one of MANY reasons why I hate DA2. And now my first and last love...Operations Chief Ashely Williams is being changed from what made me like her to begin with.

[Halo Quea]

Poor Ash, she went from being a Warrior-Poet to a dancer at After Life.

[Bluko]

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

Bluko wrote...

Thing is we all know why he isn't: it's cause he doesn't have boobs to show off.

The male equivalent of sexiness isn't the same as the female equivalent. The heavy armor makes his body appear even broader than it is, and that spells "manly." In this case it provides the side-effect of making him look cooler. Mostly it's only on the female side of things where people get touchy about people looking sexy, probably because sexuality and practicality don't line up as often as they do on the male side of the fence.

Well sort of. I don't think bulky armor is all that appealing. To guys, probably yeah since it looks "tuff". But I can't ever recall an instance where a girl thought the guys in Gears of War looked "hot". They could quite easily give Kaidan a very masculine armor to show off his actual physique. Think Greek/Roman.



The thing is Kaidan's armor actually conceals his actual features, which probably makes him less hot. You're right though for most guys  wearing big armor tends to look more impressive (since most of don't have chiseled abs) and leaves more to the imagination that we could be quite fit.

[Ship.wreck_]

aftohsix wrote...
Again...  One picture.  Seriously you guys.  Lets wait to see a few in game screens?

Yeah but... this one picture is so wildly different from the Ashley we all know and love!

Someone just posted something about not minding the make up: I don't mind a girl in makeup either,
The problem is Ashley isn't the kind of girl who would BE in makeup. Maybe on leave, or off duty. But we've never seen her on leave or off duty, and I doubt we're going to in ME3 when the galaxy is being destroyed... you know... not the time to take the day off.

Even if Ashley does use makeup in her pesonal time, which I'm sure she would occassionally, she wouldn't do it in uniform. She's a soldier! A combatant! Makeup is not conducive to combat :|

I want a sexy Ashely too, but I want her to still be Ashley, and she seems to be slowly morphing into a different character... Oh yeah, it's Miranda...

[Shadowrun1177]

Ship.wreck wrote...

1Minsc1 wrote...
This

And, to me, more. The look expresses the character. And this look doen't fit her character. So i wonder if BW will change her not "only" on the surface. Her writer left BW...

That's what I meant at the end there, I just can't picture Ashley's personality in this look.  I mean Ashley would conscously CHOOSE to not look like this. But like I said, it would be nice if she let her hair down occasionally, both literally and figuratively...

Here's another issue people who say it doesn't fit her character. How do you know it doesn't fit her character, did you create Ashley, did you spend years developing the ME Universe or its residents. The answer is no none of us did so you can't say it doesn't fit her character, cause we only know what Bioware has allowed us to see and know of the characters.

Modifié par Shadowrun1177, 13 mai 2011 - 07:27 .

[Ship.wreck_]

kylecouch wrote...
QFT

Honestly...idk why either...but Samara does not bother me NEARLY as much...it still does to some degree however...and Aveline? I'm gonna be honest...I was honest to god in love with Aveline before the game launched. Until Bioware basiclly went "ha ha suckers! shes totaly into random guard # 55!" (as far as I'm concerned.) it was more than a little devastateing...was just one of MANY reasons why I hate DA2. And now my first and last love...Operations Chief Ashely Williams is being changed from what made me like her to begin with.

I think Samara didn't bother anyone as much because her personality was so painfully non sexual.

Her boobs hanging out doesnt' bother me at all, and wouldn't. Hell she's an alien, is it so far fetched to think that they don't obsese as much as we do about what's showing or not?

What does bother me is that she, and none of the other characters wear armor, when they're on a military mission and they KNOW they're going to be shot at! Seriously wtf???

Also Samara's PERSONALITY annoyed the hell out of me IMO that chick takes herself way too damn seriously. I don't care if she is a Justicar.

Also what's QFT?

[AdmiralCheez]

aftohsix wrote...

I don't think I made my point very well.  In my opinion any time a game developer designs a female character to be considered more or less attractive it is pandering to a male demographic.  Miranda may be more blatantly in your face sexy but I don't think she is "oversexulized" as compared to Elena Fisher, who is designed to be a beautiful woman wearing only jeans and a button up shirt.

Yes, but Elena was realistic.  She was pretty without being trashy, proving that you don't have to resort to skankdom to make an appealing female character.

Every one of the characters you listed were designed to appeal to a male gamer.  Logically wouldn't this be considered "sexualizing" them as well?

None of them wore lolspandex and Space Heels.  It was a realistic and practical sort of sexy, the kind that isn't obvious and yet still enjoyable.  I'm not against tig ol' bitties and tight pants, but when that sort of thing becomes the norm, I can't help but feel like the devs think I'm some brainless horny teenager or something.

When you have an Isabella, you need an Aveline.  The old Ashley provided a nice counterbalance to Miranda--the tank to her skank, if you will--but when they're both big-boobied bimbos?  The individuality is lost.  Yeah, it's not as important as personality, but unlike a few users here, I don't want a whole squad of Catwoman clones.

Also, going into combat in heels and a catsuit doesn't make you sexy; it makes you a moron.  Alternate Appearance Pack 2 for the win.

[AdmiralCheez]

Ship.wreck wrote...

Also what's QFT?

Quoted For Truth/Quite F*ckin' True

[Siansonea]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
Skintight suit?  Stiletto heels?  Abundant asscrack?  Gratuitous camera angles?  A waist that looked like I could snap it in half?  Sorry, bro: Space Barbie. Granted, she's no Ivy Valentine (that would be creepy), but still, it was like every time I tried to talk to her, she was like LOOK AT MY BUTT, SHEPARD.

I never minded Miranda's overt sexuality, because it always seemed to me that Miranda had consciously cultivated it herself, rather than simply being an unwittingly Barbie-esque figure. Miranda has crafted her look, her body language, her demeanor, etc. to give herself an edge. Maybe it's not the most feminist version of an empowered woman, but I don't think Miranda's goal is to take a stand on that issue. She simply wants to put people off balance whether by intimidating other women, or distracting lustful men.

Samara's mega-cleavage and heels bugged me, too, but for some reason it wasn't quite as trashy.  Don't understand it, myself.

I think Samara's demeanor and posture go a long way toward negating her overtly sexualized costume. It also helps that she's an alien, and that her species doesn't have males that would drool over her bodacious bosom. Her cleavage has less meaning to a species who all have breasts themselves. We don't even know to what extent other asari sexualize their own bodies. Sure there are asari strippers galore, but I'm sure they would wear baggy coveralls if they thought it would turn on their clientele. I see that more as a response to the desires of other species than an intrinsic asari celebration of their own bodies. And I get the impression that Samara's costume design is very old-fashioned for the asari, and probably predates first contact with humans, who would be among the first to remark on the sexual aspect of asari breasts. I can't imagine that turians and salarians would care about breasts one way or the other, much less volus, elcor, and hanar. That would be like a human being turned on my a camel's hump.

See? 
Elena Fischer is a good example of a girl that can be pretty without being PLEASE ****** TO ME, LONELY MALE GAMER.  And what about Alyx from Half Life 2?  Chell from Portal?  Ariel from Starcraft 2 (even though she looked like Sarah Goddamn Palin, gag)?  Sheva from Res Evil 5 wasn't too bad, either.  Oh, and Faith from Mirror's Edge.  And you know what?  Even Jack, despite her shirtlessness, wasn't incredibly sexualized either because of her unexaggerated frame, shaved head, tats, and sour attitude.  And then there's Aveline, who was a nice counter to Isabella, and then Leliana in DAO.  Liara was never oversexualized, nor was Commander Shepard.  Not to mention Tali, whose suit, although snug, is hardly skanky.


Sometimes all you need is a pretty face and a memorable personality.  People can then fall in love with the character on their own without them looking like an interactive pinup, hence the legions of fans behind Tali (who has chicken legs and no face, for f*ck's sake), Liara, and Ashley already.

I loved Sheva, Aveline and a few of the others mentioned, but I will say that I also love Isabela. I don't mind an overtly sexualized character every now and then, especially if they OWN it, and especially if not EVERY character is overtly sexualized.

[LiquidGrape]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Samara's mega-cleavage and heels bugged me, too, but for some reason it wasn't quite as trashy.  Don't understand it, myself.

I think the reasons Samara's outfit actually works are twofold.
A) She carries it with as much class as is humanly possible. She didn't wear it for the benefit of anyone else.
 She's Asari. There's a lot we don't understand.

[Ship.wreck_]

Shadowrun1177 wrote...
Here's another issue people who say it doesn't fit her character. How do you know it doesn't fit her character, did you create Ashley, did you spend years developing the ME Universe or its residents. The answer is no none of us did so you can't say it doesn't fit her character, cause we only know what Bioware has allowed us to see and know of the characters.

Ugh. Of course we can.

Granted, I didn't create the ME universe or Ashley's character, but I'm not God either: I didn't CREATE my co-workers. But from working with them I know their personalities and I know what would fit them, or not. And likewise from playing ME we know Ashley's personality even though we didn't create it, and we know this look doesn't fit it.

If CREATION was a pre-requisite of knowing someone NO ONE would know ANYONE.

Also see my previous post regarding the ridiculous impracticalities of trying to wear makeup in an active military operation.