104 réponses à ce sujet

[Abispa]

Seems that the ME1 team was removed from ME2 so they would survive the suicide mission and they could be saved for ME3, to which I say, "Yay!" Now, as a fan of the VS, I won't stoop to the level of telling ME2 team fans to "feel my pain."

Actually, I would be shocked, SHOCKED, and disappointed if the surviving ME2 team isn't available for at least some of the game because several (not all) of them have grown on me. I want to see Mordin and Kirahee (the awesome "hold the line!" speech guy), I want to see Tali (but not as a LI), I want to see Garrus (femShep LI) and I REALLY want to see Jack keep her promise to "smear the walls" with Miranda.

[shep82]

DarkLord_PT wrote...

I definitely would like to have Legion, Mordin and Miranda back to my full-time squad. But I trust BioWare to do what's best for the story instead of bringing people back just to appease the fanbase.

edit: y u no liek to write rite?

Agreed. THere are many characters I want back but I have faith that they will do what is best for the story instead of bringing back people just to please the fanbase. Biowarehas always been about good storytelling that is what is most important. I have faith in who they pick to return as squaddies.

[Ieldra]

shep82 wrote...

DarkLord_PT wrote...

I definitely would like to have Legion, Mordin and Miranda back to my full-time squad. But I trust BioWare to do what's best for the story instead of bringing people back just to appease the fanbase.

edit: y u no liek to write rite?

Agreed. THere are many characters I want back but I have faith that they will do what is best for the story instead of bringing back people just to please the fanbase. Biowarehas always been about good storytelling that is what is most important. I have faith in who they pick to return as squaddies.

I'd rather have proof than faith. The problem is, story considerations are exactly not the most important factor that influences decisions about team members, and they did exactly bring Garrus and Tali back to please their fans, in spite of Garrus, at least, having had no story impact at all so far.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

classifying these decisions as favoring ME1 fans over ME2 fans is rather an oversimplification of the issue. In the recent super poll, where people were allowed to pick their top 5 returning squadmates, all the characters finished in the following order (after 300+ votes, as of this moment)

Garrus
Ash/Kaidan
Tali
Wrex
Liara
Legion
Mordin
Miranda
Jack
Thane
Kasumi
Grunt
Samara/Morinth
Jacob
Zaeed

This is a poll voted in by both ME1 fans and ME2 fans, and the results are clear: when everyone's opinions are taken into account, the ME1 characters are all more popular than the ME2 characters (though Legion comes damn close to reaching Liara, and Mordin is straight on his heels.) Now, I don't think that popularity should be the sole determinant of whether or not someone becomes a permanent squadmate, but it's interesting to look at. If we assume this survey bears any resemblance to the rest of the fanbase (numbers I'm sure Bioware has access to, at least in the form of loyalty missions completed/times chosen for missions), it shows not favoritism toward ME1 characters, but rather favoritism toward the most popular ones. I also think Miranda is probably significantly more popular than this poll suggests, among non-forumites, but I still don't think she likely surpasses the ME1 characters.

I also don't think the "Garrus and Tali fans get them for three games" argument is necessarily valid, either. They weren't love interests in ME1, and Garrus wasn't even in my top 3 characters at that point. Tali was essentially an elaborate codex entry, etc. Also, bear in mind that only about 50% of the people who played ME2 imported an ME1 save. That doesn't mean that only half of them ever PLAYED ME1, but I think a lot of people joined the series in ME2, so telling those people "if you want to continue your relationship, play the earlier game where it doesn't exist!" is pretty ridiculous, and if you count the total dialogue Garrus and Tali get in 1&2, I wonder if it's substantially more than Miranda got in 2 alone? She was pretty plotheavy, so got more attention... which is fine, but needs to be taken into account.

I know I may seem biased: I've clearly stated before that my ranking is Mordin, Wrex, Garrus, Tali, and Kasumi; three of them seem to have almost no chance of being permanent squadmates, and the other two might be. But I also think we haven't seen the last of the character announcements... they've just proceeded pretty clearly in the probably order of fan-favoriteness. If things continue that way, I expect Miranda to be along soon, followed by a few other people.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 13 mai 2011 - 11:24 .

[Silrian]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Silrian wrote...

Snowship wrote...

I see being the SB as a full-time job. So BIOware either shouldn't have made Liara the SB or have her as a squaddie for only a couple of missions (she can always contact you to give you intel).

Permanent choice Squad members:
VS (Kaiden/Ashley)
Garrus
James Vega
Grunt
Jack

Temporary Companions
Legion (from start until he has to return to the Geth)
Tali (from start, again until she has to return to the Migrant fleet)
Miranda/Jacob (for Cerberus related missions only)
Samara (Asari related missions only)
Liara (I'm putting her here cause she Shouldn't be a full-time companion)


Non usable companions
Mordin
Thane
Morinth
Wrex
DLC (Zaeed/Kasumi)

Okay... 1) what is your reasoning behind Liara not beeing a permanent squadmate, and do you by 'not permanent' mean like almost all companions in ME2 were in different measures not permanent? 2) I don't agree concerning Miranda and Jacob. I think at least Miranda should have the possibility of being a permanent squadmate, because she's out of a job after the suicide run (at least if you take her to the larva). Jacob I don't know. I don't dislike him but MAN is he an uninteresting character.3) I think Grunt should be optionably permanent, because he'd have reasons to return to (Wrex and) clan Urdnot. The choice to let him go could be present at the beginning of the game. 4) I think point 3 should apply to Tali as well and both should have an impact on the unfolding story. 5) All your  other choices are, now that I ponder it, surprisingly logical storywise, as long as ME2 deaths are considered final.

    



Grunt will be back because Shepard is Battle Master and plus he is the only Krogan that can be on the squad . Miranda will be back she is a LI and has no place else to go 

Yeah I guess it's almost a given. They can't not give you a potential Krogan squad mate, Wrex doesn't seem to be an option (though technically it could be) and introducing a third Krogan character would be stretching it. Grunt and Ashley as squad mates would be so friggin brutal, especially if you play as a soldier yourself. Would love to combo Kaiden and Miranda as well as a great biotic team.

[Abispa]

@ CulturalGeekGirl -- Even as a fan of the VS, I have to admit that the poll is a bit unfair since ME1 biased fans have fewer characters to divide their loyalties than ME2 biased fans.

[shep82]

Ieldra2 wrote...

shep82 wrote...

DarkLord_PT wrote...

I definitely would like to have Legion, Mordin and Miranda back to my full-time squad. But I trust BioWare to do what's best for the story instead of bringing people back just to appease the fanbase.

edit: y u no liek to write rite?

Agreed. THere are many characters I want back but I have faith that they will do what is best for the story instead of bringing back people just to please the fanbase. Biowarehas always been about good storytelling that is what is most important. I have faith in who they pick to return as squaddies.

I'd rather have proof than faith. The problem is, story considerations are exactly not the most important factor that influences decisions about team members, and they did exactly bring Garrus and Tali back to please their fans, in spite of Garrus, at least, having had no story impact at all so far.

I disagree about Garrus not having an impact on the story and your right they likely brought them back to please fans and while I am thrilled to have them and while I'd love everyone from both games on my squad that isn't very likely. They will have to pick and choose based on what makes the story flow the best. Miranda likely won't be a squaddie because of the story. Am I a tad disapointed? Yes. Does that ruin the game for me? Not in the least.

[Silrian]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

classifying these decisions as favoring ME1 fans over ME2 fans is rather an oversimplification of the issue. In the recent super poll, where people were allowed to pick their top 5 returning squadmates, all the characters finished in the following order (after 300+ votes, as of this moment)

Garrus
Ash/Kaidan
Tali
Wrex
Liara
Legion
Mordin
Miranda
Jack
Thane
Kasumi
Grunt
Samara/Morinth
Jacob
Zaeed

Mordin 5 places higher then Grunt? Mordin OVER MIRANDA?!?! No way. I don't buy that at all. Is Mordin really that popular? Or is it that Grunt ends up low because most favor Wrex as 'the krogan team mate'? And I think nostalgia plays a big role. People want to use ME1 characters in the ME2 style. I personally heavily favor making a mix of possibilities so varied, after ME3 the 'Who was from what game?' question is left completely forgotten. Mordin more popular then Thane, come on that has to be a joke. 

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Abispa wrote...

@ CulturalGeekGirl -- Even as a fan of the VS, I have to admit that the poll is a bit unfair since ME1 biased fans have fewer characters to divide their loyalties than ME2 biased fans.

True, but to some extent that's the problem (also, the VS get added together, which is both fair and unfair, simultaneously). Also, Garrus and Tali can get votes from fans of both games, etc. Still, I don't think that fans of ME1 and fans of ME2 are as clearly divided as people seem to think. Hmm, interesting topic for a poll...

A while ago when the "whole squad back" threads were common, there was a comment I'd see all the time: "I don't care about getting the whole squad back, as long as I get X, Y, and Z back." The problem was that X, Y, and Z were often completely different. Offering more characters in ME2 split the vote, and also gave each individual character less time for development. There is a reason that Mordin, Legion, and Miranda top that list... Mordin probably had the most chat dialogue (with his randomized "busy" responses. ), Miranda had the biggest role in cutscenes, and Legion had some of the strongest plot importance. They got the kind of focused development they're trying to do in 3, and even then they had "votes" split between them and the less-than-ten-percenters.

So while it isn't really "fair" that ME2 characters split the vote in more ways, it's what happened, and as a result characters who appeared in both games are the most popular, and characters who appeared in ME1 only are slightly more popular.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Silrian wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

classifying these decisions as favoring ME1 fans over ME2 fans is rather an oversimplification of the issue. In the recent super poll, where people were allowed to pick their top 5 returning squadmates, all the characters finished in the following order (after 300+ votes, as of this moment)

Garrus
Ash/Kaidan
Tali
Wrex
Liara
Legion
Mordin
Miranda
Jack
Thane
Kasumi
Grunt
Samara/Morinth
Jacob
Zaeed

Mordin 5 places higher then Grunt? Mordin OVER MIRANDA?!?! No way. I don't buy that at all. Is Mordin really that popular? Or is it that Grunt ends up low because most favor Wrex as 'the krogan team mate'? And I think nostalgia plays a big role. People want to use ME1 characters in the ME2 style. I personally heavily favor making a mix of possibilities so varied, after ME3 the 'Who was from what game?' question is left completely forgotten. Mordin more popular then Thane, come on that has to be a joke. 

These are how the votes come out when you allow people to select more characters than just their single favorite. Mordin comes in number 3 or 4 on a lot of people's top 5 lists. He's very popular, he's just fewer people's #1 favorite character. Poll and methodology here.

[darthbuert]

I have no problem having my favorite ME1 squaddies back, I missed them all terribly anyway. But I did like many of the newer additions from ME2 (most of which have been mentioned in one way or another).

Considering Kasumi, she had a really interesting sub-plot for her DLC, and it's implied to have significant importance within the story (though I can't say more due to no spoilers being in this thread), I hope that they will get a chance to finish that story within the third game. Kasumi is one of my favorites. She had lots of personality. I thoroughly enjoyed her lighthearted sense of humor (and her one-hit-kills in many cases). But with all I've seen so far it seems that she is on the bottom of the priority list for some reason. I tweeted Casey yesterday and (so far) got no reply...which doesn't bode well for my favorite thief. He mentioned "major" characters getting a return in various capacities...but in regard to Kasumi, does he consider her to be a "major" character? If not, I'm S.O.L.

[TheConfidenceMan]

The less there is in the game to remind me of Mass Effect 2 the better.

[Silrian]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Silrian wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

classifying these decisions as favoring ME1 fans over ME2 fans is rather an oversimplification of the issue. In the recent super poll, where people were allowed to pick their top 5 returning squadmates, all the characters finished in the following order (after 300+ votes, as of this moment)

Garrus
Ash/Kaidan
Tali
Wrex
Liara
Legion
Mordin
Miranda
Jack
Thane
Kasumi
Grunt
Samara/Morinth
Jacob
Zaeed

Mordin 5 places higher then Grunt? Mordin OVER MIRANDA?!?! No way. I don't buy that at all. Is Mordin really that popular? Or is it that Grunt ends up low because most favor Wrex as 'the krogan team mate'? And I think nostalgia plays a big role. People want to use ME1 characters in the ME2 style. I personally heavily favor making a mix of possibilities so varied, after ME3 the 'Who was from what game?' question is left completely forgotten. Mordin more popular then Thane, come on that has to be a joke. 

These are how the votes come out when you allow people to select more characters than just their single favorite. Mordin comes in number 3 or 4 on a lot of people's top 5 lists. He's very popular, he's just fewer people's #1 favorite character. Poll and methodology here.

Yeah I understand. The whole 'consistent point grossing' idea (thanks for the link). I still, still am surprised though, but that probably says more about me. There are so many characters I would choose over Mordin. I thought he was a great NPC character (cutscenes and the like), but squad mate? Never used him (used pretty much all other characters except Jack because I hate her enormously, don't ask me why). They should've let you place all of them in a certain order, then any character would garner points to some degree. I wonder how that would change the list.

[Kileyan]

I don't care too much, I sort of liked all the squad members except for Jacob. I didn't even hate him, just found him a bit boring story and power set wise. I am more attached to the ME2 team, just because I played it more recently but would be fine losing some of them ME2 team to make room for old squaddies.

I have one likely unpopular wish, I want Mordin to be a very prevalent character in the story, but I'd prefer he just be our ship board lab guy, with lots of dialog, rather than part of the combat squad load out. In ME2 I enjoyed his character immensely but never really did use him on any missions unless required to.

Grunt vs Wrex, I prefer Wrex. He can have a much more interesting story since he has several human lifetimes of stories and experiences. I liked Grunt, but in the end he is still just a 1 year old. I'd be thrilled if they brought back the Patriarch a bit. That little side quest really made me like to old fellow a lot, and I'd take him in a heartbeat on a mission or 3.

Mostly, I 'think' I will be happy with most any mix of characters they choose to be our full time squaddies, as long as they don't try to introduce too many newbies to the mix.

Modifié par Kileyan, 14 mai 2011 - 12:05 .

[shep82]

Kileyan wrote...

I don't care too much, I sort of liked all the squad members except for Jacob. I didn't even hate him, just found him a bit boring story and power set wise. I am more attached to the ME2 team, just because I played it more recently but would be fine losing some of them ME2 team to make room for old squaddies.

I have one likely unpopular wish, I want Mordin to be a very prevalent character in the story, but I'd prefer he just be our ship board lab guy, with lots of dialog, rather than part of the combat squad load out. In ME2 I enjoyed his character immensely but never really did use him on any missions unless required to.

Grunt vs Wrex, I prefer Wrex. He can have a much more interesting story since he has several human lifetimes of stories and experiences. I liked Grunt, but in the end he is still just a 1 year old.

Mostly, I 'think' I will be happy with most any mix of characters they choose to be our full time squaddies, as long as they don't try to introduce too many newbies to the mix.

I agree mostly except about Jacob I liked him. As long as there are only a few newbies that add to the story I have no objections.

[nickkcin11]

Ieldra2 wrote...

So far, all confirmed ME3 team members were also part of the ME1 team. I can't express th level of my disappointment in that. I am a great fan of specifically those team members of the ME2 team who were not in ME1. Where are they? I would very much dislike to play ME3 mostly with the ME1 team, and I would be *extremely* disappointed if all members of ME3's permanent "core squad" were those of ME1.

So, where are they? "Somewhere in ME3", yeah, but what about being a team member again? Also some of my Shepards sympathize with the goals if not the methods of Cerberus. I want those team members back who might support me in that. Where are they?

BW did the smart thing and severely cut down on the amount of squaddies so that it feels like a team, not a small ground army where 90% don't see any action. That being said, Miranda, Jack, and Mordin will probably return in a large capacity due to there popularity (Jack and Miranda probably are going to be squaddies). I hope they are at least.

I can see Legion, Wrex, and Grunt taking on a Liara in LOTSB role. Which even though I would prefer squaddies, I would rather have more banter.

Modifié par nickkcin11, 14 mai 2011 - 12:39 .

[Seroxi]

I see this very topic popping up quite a lot so I would like to pose a question: Why do you think ME2 characters deserve a comeback as a full-ledged squadmembers over ME1 characters? It is just beyond me why someone would ever complain about seeing the same characters 3 games in a row considering all the benefits it brings(mainly character development) and how unique it is.

I rarely see people having problems with Liara/virmire survivor being confirmed for ME3 because they are being "negleted" in ME2 but the amount of butt-hurt due to Garrus and Tali also being confirmed never ceases to amaze me. Is it because you are afraid of your own favorite character being left out of the squad because they got the spots? Or is it maybe because you simply hate the characters and can't skip using them so you have to start some sort of personal vendetta?

Team size will be cut down and there is no reason to blame Bioware for doing it, for obvious reasons I might add. Most of the ME2 characters were recruited to end the Collector threat and have been more or less written "out" off ME3 squad status so it's not ME1 characters fault if someone specific gets left out. Picking up characters might be a very simple process from your point of view but it certainly isn't so for Bioware - there are a lot of different variables, and some disappointed fans.

ME and ME2 might be two different games but it's still the one and same franchise, sadly some people just seem to have forgotten it.

[Chala]

Warlock Adam wrote...

Speculative configuration, let me know if this would be acceptable:

Permanent Squadmates
-VS (Ashley/Kaidan)
-James Vega (assume killed off at some point)
-Liara (Feron takes over SB)
-Garrus (ME1 and 2)
-Tali (ME1 and 2)
-Grunt (ME2, replaces Vega as team tank)
-Jack or Miranda (ME2, based on player choice)
-Thane (ME2)
-1 new squadmate
-Legion (ME2)

Temporary Squadmates (i.e. story arcs)
-Anderson (for opening levels)
-Wrex (krogan arc)
-Jacob (ME2, Cerberus arc)
-Samara/Morinth (ME2, Asari arc)
-Zaeed (ME2, gathering mercs)
-Kasumi (ME2, stealing Prothean tech)

Mordin, Chakwas, and Joker as non-squaddies that help and accompany you throughout the game. All are on the Normandy.

How's this?

It's a pretty interesting idea and a very good one.

[eternalnightmare13]

Warlock Adam wrote...

Speculative configuration, let me know if this would be acceptable:

Permanent Squadmates
-VS (Ashley/Kaidan)
-James Vega (assume killed off at some point)
-Liara (Feron takes over SB)
-Garrus (ME1 and 2)
-Tali (ME1 and 2)
-Grunt (ME2, replaces Vega as team tank)
-Jack or Miranda (ME2, based on player choice)
-Thane (ME2)
-1 new squadmate
-Legion (ME2)

Temporary Squadmates (i.e. story arcs)
-Anderson (for opening levels)
-Wrex (krogan arc)
-Jacob (ME2, Cerberus arc)
-Samara/Morinth (ME2, Asari arc)
-Zaeed (ME2, gathering mercs)
-Kasumi (ME2, stealing Prothean tech)

Mordin, Chakwas, and Joker as non-squaddies that help and accompany you throughout the game. All are on the Normandy.

How's this?

Sounds plausible, but I have my doubts about Zaeed coming back.  ****, Aria could organize mercs/thugs, too. IMO Zaeed is disposable.

I don't agree about another new squad mate, either.  We'll be getting this Vegas dude who's probably gonna be a mole for Cerebus or the Reapers.

Modifié par eternalnightmare13, 14 mai 2011 - 01:43 .

[ExtremeOne]

Seroxi wrote...

I see this very topic popping up quite a lot so I would like to pose a question: Why do you think ME2 characters deserve a comeback as a full-ledged squadmembers over ME1 characters? It is just beyond me why someone would ever complain about seeing the same characters 3 games in a row considering all the benefits it brings(mainly character development) and how unique it is.

I rarely see people having problems with Liara/virmire survivor being confirmed for ME3 because they are being "negleted" in ME2 but the amount of butt-hurt due to Garrus and Tali also being confirmed never ceases to amaze me. Is it because you are afraid of your own favorite character being left out of the squad because they got the spots? Or is it maybe because you simply hate the characters and can't skip using them so you have to start some sort of personal vendetta?

Team size will be cut down and there is no reason to blame Bioware for doing it, for obvious reasons I might add. Most of the ME2 characters were recruited to end the Collector threat and have been more or less written "out" off ME3 squad status so it's not ME1 characters fault if someone specific gets left out. Picking up characters might be a very simple process from your point of view but it certainly isn't so for Bioware - there are a lot of different variables, and some disappointed fans.

ME and ME2 might be two different games but it's still the one and same franchise, sadly some people just seem to have forgotten it.

    




Hold on you mean to tell me that the ME 1 squad has a almighty right to be squad mates but none of the ME 2 squad has that right . Oh please you ME 1 fans  have been crying and pissing  about the VS in 2 and now you get little wish in 3 . Oh and even more Liara is back on the squad oh yeah where is the logic in that and she is the new Shadow Broker . The ME 2 squad deserves to be on the squad in 3 .  Bioware has clearly been on the ME 1 fans side when it comes to the squad for 3 and its bull sh*t and unfair to us ME 2 fans .  Bioware better do us ME 2 fans right when it comes to the squad . I am not talking about no stupid LOTSB  type bull sh*t justice neither .   

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

I want Miri back. "That's all I have to say about that"

[ExtremeOne]

Miri needs to be on the squad simple as that Bioware

[MASSEFFECTfanforlife101]

Yeah