6696 réponses à ce sujet

[Siansonea]

hex23 wrote...

ipgd wrote...

How is finding men attractive impossible in the first two games? There is nothing that suggests my Shepard can't blissfully ignore Miranda's shapely ass, lock himself in his cabin and beat off to the thought of Kaidan. Again, having sex is not a prerequisite of attraction. Reciprocation is not a prerequisite of attraction.

The problem is you're creating scenarios in your mind where your Shep was gay, but these don't exist in 1 or 2. That's all I'm saying. Your Shep could've been gay in your mind but Bioware didn't give you the option, and there was no indication that Shep was into that sort of thing, so it comes off as really heavy handed and honestly kinda lame.

So what? I don't care that they didn't "intend" for my Shepard to be gay. They didn't do anything to prevent it, even if they didn't help it along. So I have a gay Shepard.

[Erani]

jakal66 wrote...

There's a big difference between tolerance and acceptance, I can tolerate and respect your ways but accept them as the right ones.I believe in free will and freedom of choice in all matters.So in conclusion I can respects it and tolerate it but still think it's not right for me, and I emphasize on the me part.I am not the beholder of the truth but then again none of us are.

Thank you. This means that you respect and tolerate someone else's choice to romance a a male LI with their MShep even if that content is not right for you and your Shep remains straight. I don't understand, if the content is optional, why some people have a problem with other people's Shepards.<3

[jlb524]

Sylvianus wrote...
Okay, However, Do not forget the power of Asari. They can appeal to everyone, anyone, anything. An animal, a stone, a different race, any gender. They transcend affiliations.

I will use that the next time some straight gal gamer complains about asari characters hitting on their FemShep.

"Come on, you know your Shepard wants it!  No one can resist the power of the asari!" 

[CulturalGeekGirl]

SennenScale wrote...

Phaelducan wrote...

TIme constraints my left fore-tentacle. If it was recorded, they would have put it in the game if they wanted it there. Hence why it took modders so little time to get those scenes in the game.

It was recorded and some of it was in the game. You can go listen to them, if you wish.

I don't actually believe it's the reason it was taken out, but that is what was said. However, them saying that would mean they are saying didn't have any intention of Shepard being exclusively straight.

As I explain above, a bit angrily, I do believe that's part of the reason why it was taken out. This is how things work near launch of a major title.

There is a list of features up on a white board. They have completion percentages near them. As launch time approaches, stuff gets crossed off. Additional Quarian Armor? We don't have enough time, cross it off. More Mako physics tweaking? Mako's good enough as it is, cross it off. And one of the things on the list at some point was "same sex human romance implementation." 

Now why that got crossed off rather than something else... that might have been politics, or marketing. It might also have been that they couldn't figure out how to get the settings exactly right - they didn't really get the romance to work correctly in ME1 at all, since many girls report having a single conversation with Kaidan and then having him show up in their cabin. The fact that Meer's lines did get recorded indicate that it was almost definitely planned at some stage in the game.

But at this point, why it ended up on the chopping block isn't important. The point is that the devs actually have time this time. Enough time to do what they intended from the very start.

[Sylvianus]

Lenimph wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...


Okay, However, Do not forget the power of Asari. They can appeal to everyone, anyone, anything. An animal, a stone, a different race, any gender. They transcend affiliations.

With the power of T&A 

EDIT: I mean "Funny bumps" 

[Temper_Graniteskul]

Phaelducan wrote...

Sigh, it's not a double standard for one version of the protagonist to be gay and the other straight. It's just the way the developers saw the character at the time. It's also incorrect I think for you to think Liara was thrown in for titilation for immature males. Why is it so hard to accept the possibilty that male shep was straight (emphasis on was) and fem shep was bi-sexual? For some astoundingly absurd reason, the fight for the love corner can't seem to accept that possibility yet immediately glom on the the "fact" that male shep was always bi, but for some reason the programmers simply didn't include that option in the final commercial version of the game?

/facepalm

Facepalm indeed. How is it not a double standard? There aren't two protagonists - there's only one. Commander Shepard. Shep might be a woman, or a man. Might be renegade, paragon, or somewhere in between. Might be a soldier, or a biotic, etc. etc. Having the female version of Shep able to identify as gay or bisexual - but denying that opportunity to the male version - made about as much sense to me as if they'd decided that Renedouche Shep could only identify as straight, but Paragod Shep could identify as straight, gay, or bisexual. Which is to say, it made no sense at all to me.

Modifié par Temper_Graniteskul, 18 mai 2011 - 10:01 .

[hex23]

Russalka wrote...

Nitpicking because you can, hm?

They were designed to be discount lesbians. Shepard's attraction and viewpoint is the only thing that matters, she sees them as a woman, ergo it is a lesbian relationship.

False. As I previously stated Mordin points out that Asari are attractively to virtually everyone because they most likely release neuro-chemicals making them desirable to a wide variety of races, sexes, and species. This is further illustrated in the "bachelor party scene" in "ME2", where different species comment on how similar the Asari stripper is to their specific race, even though that's obviously impossible.

So yeah, not lesbianism. Neuro-chemicals.

[Abispa]

Why is Shepard having a relationship with someone of the same gender so controversial? I mean, depending how you played ME2, Shepard has already made passionate love with a plucked chicken?

[Centauri2002]

Phaelducan wrote...

Sigh, it's not a double standard for one version of the protagonist to be gay and the other straight. It's just the way the developers saw the character at the time. It's also incorrect I think for you to think Liara was thrown in for titilation for immature males. Why is it so hard to accept the possibilty that male shep was straight (emphasis on was) and fem shep was bi-sexual? For some astoundingly absurd reason, the fight for the love corner can't seem to accept that possibility yet immediately glom on the the "fact" that male shep was always bi, but for some reason the programmers simply didn't include that option in the final commercial version of the game?

/facepalm

No, I was saying asari were put into the game for titilation. This was pretty much admitted when they stated that they were Mass Effect's version of the "green alien babe". The discount lesbian thing is included in a lot of media so it's not a big jump to conclude that was another feature for titilation. Especially considering there wasn't an equivalent for MaleShep. I'm not saying Liara was created for the purpose of titilation, however. She's clearly an important and developed character within the story.

They're supposed to be the same character, that's why. Their gender is almost incidental because a MaleShep can make the same decisions and dialogue choices as a FemShep. The only changes are aesthetic and in romance choices. Why allow that degree of similarity and then differ their sexualities so much?

I'm not saying MaleShep was bi. I'm not even saying FemShep is bi. MY FemShep is a lesbian. But other players can label their Shepard however they want.

[Ryzaki]

Abispa wrote...

Why is Shepard having a relationship with someone of the same gender so controversial? I mean, depending how you played ME2, Shepard has already made passionate love with a plucked chicken?

LOL or a dinosaur.

[hex23]

Siansonea II wrote...

So what? I don't care that they didn't "intend" for my Shepard to be gay. They didn't do anything to prevent it, even if they didn't help it along. So I have a gay Shepard.

Uh....they programmed 2 full games where it obviously wasn't possible, or even hinted at. I'd say that's preventing it.

[Servo to the bitter end]

hex23 wrote...

False. As I previously stated Mordin points out that Asari are attractively to virtually everyone because they most likely release neuro-chemicals making them desirable to a wide variety of races, sexes, and species. This is further illustrated in the "bachelor party scene" in "ME2", where different species comment on how similar the Asari stripper is to their specific race, even though that's obviously impossible.

So yeah, not lesbianism. Neuro-chemicals.

It still comes back to Kelly, though.

[ReallyRue]

Abispa wrote...

Why is Shepard having a relationship with someone of the same gender so controversial? I mean, depending how you played ME2, Shepard has already made passionate love with a plucked chicken?

 

Because people like to complain.

[Abispa]

Ryzaki wrote...

Abispa wrote...

Why is Shepard having a relationship with someone of the same gender so controversial? I mean, depending how you played ME2, Shepard has already made passionate love with a plucked chicken?

LOL or a dinosaur.

No, I'm pretty sure it was a plucked chicken.

[Inquisitor Recon]

jakal66 wrote...
My way or the highway is just NOT the way to go people.

Oh but my or the highway is ALWAYS the way to go when you can play the "homophobe" card and somehow link it with race. The hypocrisy astounds me, though I suppose it shouldn't. People always cloak their intentions.

Apparently being tolerant doesn't count these days, you have to be "accepting" in the sense that you let them get whatever they want.

It isn't "optional" when characters are being rewritten if that indeed occurs. (I don't consider "oh, they happened to just be bisexual the whole time" to be a real argument.) If this James Vega fellow is merely token gay guy fan service, that doesn't seem optional either. I for one would rather see "boring old Jacob" have more personality.

[Russalka]

hex23 wrote...

False. As I previously stated Mordin points out that Asari are attractively to virtually everyone because they most likely release neuro-chemicals making them desirable to a wide variety of races, sexes, and species. This is further illustrated in the "bachelor party scene" in "ME2", where different species comment on how similar the Asari stripper is to their specific race, even though that's obviously impossible.

So yeah, not lesbianism. Neuro-chemicals.

So, if a woman is drugged in real life to have sex with a woman, she does not have a lesbian sexual encounter?

[Phaelducan]

Russalka wrote...

Phaelducan wrote...

In this case we are talking about a 2 minute cinematic with one character.... which was already animated for the other gender. The lines were recorded... and the animations were complete..... if you honestly say they cut s/s romances because they didn't have time, you are rocking the ganj.

It was what Bioware said. Or do you only believe that which you agree with? 

I believe what I believe, which in this case is both the more likely truth (deride Occam's Razor all you want) and easily explained with several different paths of logic. I couldn't care less if you agree. Bioware saying they didn't have time is absurd. They did, and you know they did.

[ReallyRue]

hex23 wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

So what? I don't care that they didn't "intend" for my Shepard to be gay. They didn't do anything to prevent it, even if they didn't help it along. So I have a gay Shepard.

Uh....they programmed 2 full games where it obviously wasn't possible, or even hinted at. I'd say that's preventing it.

Forcing maleShep to romance women and femShep to romance men would have been preventing Shepard's homosexuality. Not including s/s is just ignoring it.

[Centauri2002]

hex23 wrote...

False. As I previously stated Mordin points out that Asari are attractively to virtually everyone because they most likely release neuro-chemicals making them desirable to a wide variety of races, sexes, and species. This is further illustrated in the "bachelor party scene" in "ME2", where different species comment on how similar the Asari stripper is to their specific race, even though that's obviously impossible.

So yeah, not lesbianism. Neuro-chemicals.

Because you seemed to miss what I wrote in reply to this last time, I'll just copy and paste it here:

That's fine but that doesn't mean it overrides inherent sexual preference. If they're seeing the asari in their own way, then they're viewing the asari as what they find sexually appealing. My FemShep still views Liara as a female so she must find females appealing. Another FemShep can turn Liara down and say she's not interested in females so it can't all be about pheromones.

[Raanz]

jakal66 wrote...

All I read here is "my opinion is right yours is wrong" "what I want is right what you want is wrong"

May I point that if you were able to complain and ask for a change in the game you should also tolerate other people's opinions and suggestions even if you consider them wrong,as long as they are done or put politely.

I feel that people which want SS romance are less tolerant thatn what they'd like to imagine...becasue it sounds like they just one thing done in the only way they want it and they're not open to suggestions or oppositions...

My way or the highway is just NOT the way to go people.

Best post in a while.

In my humblest of opinions, patching SS relationships into ME3 after two installments of a trilogy, feels contrived and forced.
It sounds like that is what Bioware wants to do to appease some fans....so I guess you can call it a fan-service yes?  Much like cleavage, a visible thong for Isabela, a mono-gender race of aliens that just so happen to resemble female humans with nice racks and arses that have tentacles for hair,  and all of that other stuff that some folks like to pitch a fit over when it happens.

[Polliot]

Siansonea II wrote...

hex23 wrote...

ipgd wrote...

How is finding men attractive impossible in the first two games? There is nothing that suggests my Shepard can't blissfully ignore Miranda's shapely ass, lock himself in his cabin and beat off to the thought of Kaidan. Again, having sex is not a prerequisite of attraction. Reciprocation is not a prerequisite of attraction.

The problem is you're creating scenarios in your mind where your Shep was gay, but these don't exist in 1 or 2. That's all I'm saying. Your Shep could've been gay in your mind but Bioware didn't give you the option, and there was no indication that Shep was into that sort of thing, so it comes off as really heavy handed and honestly kinda lame.

So what? I don't care that they didn't "intend" for my Shepard to be gay. They didn't do anything to prevent it, even if they didn't help it along. So I have a gay Shepard.

I agree with hex23. And Siansonea,try with better answers than I don't care,it just pisses people off and further makes them sure they are right. You are actually hurting your own case.

[ipgd]

hex23 wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

So what? I don't care that they didn't "intend" for my Shepard to be gay. They didn't do anything to prevent it, even if they didn't help it along. So I have a gay Shepard.

Uh....they programmed 2 full games where it obviously wasn't possible, or even hinted at. I'd say that's preventing it.

The only thing that was "prevented" is gay sex. Yes, a sexually active gay male Shepard is impossible. [Involuntarily] celibate gay male Shepard is well within the realm of roleplaying possibilities.

[Polliot]

Raanz wrote...

jakal66 wrote...

All I read here is "my opinion is right yours is wrong" "what I want is right what you want is wrong"

May I point that if you were able to complain and ask for a change in the game you should also tolerate other people's opinions and suggestions even if you consider them wrong,as long as they are done or put politely.

I feel that people which want SS romance are less tolerant thatn what they'd like to imagine...becasue it sounds like they just one thing done in the only way they want it and they're not open to suggestions or oppositions...

My way or the highway is just NOT the way to go people.

Best post in a while.

In my humblest of opinions, patching SS relationships into ME3 after two installments of a trilogy, feels contrived and forced.
It sounds like that is what Bioware wants to do to appease some fans....so I guess you can call it a fan-service yes?  Much like cleavage, a visible thong for Isabela, a mono-gender race of aliens that just so happen to resemble female humans with nice racks and arses that have tentacles for hair,  and all of that other stuff that some folks like to pitch a fit over when it happens.

Yes

[Temper_Graniteskul]

hex23 wrote...

Russalka wrote...

Nitpicking because you can, hm?

They were designed to be discount lesbians. Shepard's attraction and viewpoint is the only thing that matters, she sees them as a woman, ergo it is a lesbian relationship.

False. As I previously stated Mordin points out that Asari are attractively to virtually everyone because they most likely release neuro-chemicals making them desirable to a wide variety of races, sexes, and species. This is further illustrated in the "bachelor party scene" in "ME2", where different species comment on how similar the Asari stripper is to their specific race, even though that's obviously impossible.

So yeah, not lesbianism. Neuro-chemicals.

Except that the actual dialogue from the bachelor party has each guy remarking on the physical attribute of the Asari they find most similar to their own species. Hence the Turian remarking on the head fringe, and the Salarian commenting on the (I think) skin colouring. Guess which physical bit of the Asari is most attractive to humans? (Psst. My own bet is that from the neck down they look like a curvy human lady with nice boobs.)

While the in-game explanation might include neuro-chemicals that attract, I will point out that there are plenty of people who resist the apparently alluring call of the Asari; at a guess, I'd postulate that the chemicals can't bridge the whole gap. Something else there has to appeal.

[rapscallioness]

The more options the better. Just more fun. I've seen a few posts hitting on the idea of Also making the actual friendships deeper. Being able to have a few drinks, or something. I think that's one of the most awesome ideas. I'd love to see that.

I did get drunk with Dr. Chakwass. Fun stuff. Fun option. It ended up w/ her passed out in the med bay and me stumbling out...........Ah, yes...good times.