6696 réponses à ce sujet

[TheMarshal]

Bible Doctor wrote...

Because believe it or not, everyone does not share your opinion or views on immersion in relation to a deep and meaningful video game experience. For some this obviously causes a distraction which not only takes their minds off of the narrative, but alters their perceptions on the characters involved. Thus damaging or ruining the experience to varying degrees.

Whether or not that is 'right', I can't say.

It's just difficult to reconcile "Game-ruining concept" with "Romances that you won't pursue being available".

[TheBlackBaron]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I'm really expecting one token bi/gay option of either gender.

Possibly just one bi guy to balance Liara.

Which is GREAT, by the way, but honestly? ENTIRE TEAM IS JACOB SHEPARDSEXUAL is a bit much.

I'm guessing Vega will be bi, and they'll also introduce a new female squadmate, who will likewise be bi. Liara has always been there as an option but isn't everybody's cup of tea. Hell, make him and theoretical new girl exclusively homosexual. 

Actually, Samara would make sense as a bisexual LI as well, if she's still around and up for full romance this time. 

Ryzaki wrote...

Just so I can see how quickly people start complaining about them only being available to same/sex Shepard. 

The sheer hypocrisy will be glorious to watch. 

Oh, this again. Great. 

Siansonea II wrote...

My strongest hope is for good writing, and good non-romance paths for ALL the characters. Believe it or not, it's not all about romance for me. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]

Seconded with the fury of a thousand suns. 

[CulturalGeekGirl]

jlb524 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...
Which is GREAT, by the way, but honestly? ENTIRE TEAM IS JACOB SHEPARDSEXUAL is a bit much.

I'm still not sure why this is such a big deal to people...considering we're talking about video game characters and I think it would be nicer if people had the choice to romance whoever they wanted amongst the LIs with whichever Shepard they wanted, instead of having to romance 'that one bisexual' with their gay/bi Shepard.

Now, expecting everyone in real life to bend to your animal magnetism and want to jump in bed with you regardless is absurd, of course.

Two words: Tenchi Muyo.

I'd rather have four characters (of any gender combination!) available to me than nine characters (of any gender combination). I'm already bummed that I have to turn Thane down in order to romance Garrus. Having to turn down four or five more characters who are obviously interested me would make me feel like a huge jerk. Also, impossibly harried.

Now, I've said before that I would be cool if there was a non-mod-related way to open up all romances for people who wouldn't be bothered by the "harem anime" vibe. I'm still in favor of some in-game, built-in way for people to get all the romances they want.

I just don't want nine people flirting with me at once. It doesn't matter if they're the nine hottest people in the entire world. It would be stressfull and awkward.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 16 mai 2011 - 05:38 .

[Eradyn]

We don't know yet if any of the new squadmates/LIs have or don't have history with Shepard, either. Not saying they will or won't be, but it's possible one or two will be familiar to Shepard and possibly be bi/gay options. If they are all strangers, well BW has written many stranger-to-lover romance arcs in many of their games to great success...and I am confident they can continue to do those justice if this is the case.

Modifié par Eradyn, 16 mai 2011 - 05:37 .

[Nexus Arcade]

I think you might probably have to turn them, maybe. Like male shep would have to get garrus loving instead of garrus ready to love.

[TheMarshal]

Lu the Prodigy wrote...

To this I say that in the ME games so far, romance has been initiated by shepard, so its unlikely that a male shepard would all of a sudden get hit on by garrus or kaiden. Remember that Garrus wasn't even interested in femshep until she tells him she is... then she had to spell it out for him. If characters only react to the PC's flirtatiousness then you dont have to fear a change in their personality unless you instigate that change

I think the ME1 LI's were a little more 'blunt' in their interest, not really waiting for Shepard to say "Hey, you're hot".  ME2's LI's gave Shepard the opportunity to say "Okay, let's give this relationship thing a go" or "Let's be friends, and by that I mean that I don't ever need to talk to you anymore".  Hopefully ME3 will be a little better in allowing a) Shepard to initiate the romance; and dialogue to continue if the romance path isn't taken.

[Ryzaki]

Lu the Prodigy wrote...

This announcement has provoked a lot of fears in the bioware community, but I don't really see them as warranted. I'll address them those that I have seen repeated:

1. Some are afraid that now if they don't pursue a SS relationship with one of their fav characters, then dialogue options will shut down.

This was already addressed by Casey Hudson when he said that they are adding more content to non romance relationships. So the team recognized that the fans didn't like this from ME2 and are addressing it.

2. Many have said they are afraid that their favorite characters will all of a sudden act like Anders and be very pushy about thei sexuality.

To this I say that in the ME games so far, romance has been initiated by shepard, so its unlikely that a male shepard would all of a sudden get hit on by garrus or kaiden. Remember that Garrus wasn't even interested in femshep until she tells him she is... then she had to spell it out for him. If characters only react to the PC's flirtatiousness then you dont have to fear a change in their personality unless you instigate that change

3. Some are afraid that this changes the characterzation of the party members

To this I say that of all the party members, only Jack has explicitly stated she isnt interested in "the girls club" While no other has hit on shepard, that may just be because we werent presented with the option to hit on them first. And if you like the ME series already, than its probably because of the great writing and characterization of the first two games. HAVE FAITH in the team that made those games. It's not the team that did the DA series.

4. Some are afraid that if they have gay crewmates, they might get their gay all over.

To these people, I can only shake my head and pity you

Excellent post and totally agreed.

Except ME1 I felt harassed. That should never happen again. o/s, s/s do not care. I don't want someone hovering over my shoulder every 5 second.

It's why I constantly Nuke Ash.

I shouldn't have to nuke a character to not romance them.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 16 mai 2011 - 05:39 .

[jlb524]

Bible Doctor wrote...

Because believe it or not, everyone does not share your opinion or views on immersion in relation to a deep and meaningful video game experience. For some this obviously causes a distraction which not only takes their minds off of the narrative, but alters their perceptions on the characters involved. Thus damaging or ruining the experience to varying degrees.

Whether or not that is 'right', I can't say.

No, I understand that.  I just want more explanation than "It sucks, I don't like it", which is all I ever hear.  Also, if these things are optional anyway, I'm not sure why simply avoiding the dialog option won't solve the problem.

There are also many things that can alter immersion or change the game...there are some things I like/don't like, but only when these things are forced on me.  Let's say, Garrus being interested in my FemShep ruins my immersion...oh wait, it doesn't b/c he never expresses interest in her as I never go that route.

[Siansonea]

jlb524 wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...
Which is GREAT, by the way, but honestly? ENTIRE TEAM IS JACOB SHEPARDSEXUAL is a bit much.

I'm still not sure why this is such a big deal to people...considering we're talking about video game characters and I think it would be nicer if people had the choice to romance whoever they wanted amongst the LIs with whichever Shepard they wanted, instead of having to romance 'that one bisexual' with their gay/bi Shepard.

Now, expecting everyone in real life to bend to your animal magnetism and want to jump in bed with you regardless is absurd, of course.

I actually see where the opposition is coming from on this—to an extent. I very sincerely value character above all else, and even though I know it's a game, I want the internal consistency of it to be as well-executed as possible. Now clearly that wasn't done perfectly between ME1 and ME2, if it was up to me, Shepard would never have been working with Cerberus (at least not ALL Shepards), and would never have been able to romance aliens other than asari. It just seems odd to me, and I would never have one of my canon Shepards romance Thane, Garrus, or Tali. But I can also see how those options gave a lot of people a much more enjoyable experience of the second game, so I don't begrudge their inclusion. I do try to pretend they don't exist though.

[PMC65]

onelifecrisis wrote...

naledgeborn wrote...

Raiders Fan 223 wrote...

Best option - James Vega and Liara bi. Everybody else stays the same

This! Keep everybody how they are now. No funny stuff like the Garrus and Tali romance. 

Thirded.

You know, this Vega guy might look like Zaeed's brother ... right?

[KawaiiKatie]

So... this is the new place to discuss same-sex in Mass Effect?

I'm sad that, Fight for the Love is closed. I guess that's fair, since they had several pages of "YAY, VICTORY!"

......though, after a year of waiting and silence from devs and flames from anti-gay, you could've given us more than a day to celebrate....

[Sunnie]

Why is there even an argument over s/s involving malians? For example, Garrus, who appears to be based off of an insect or Thane who appears to be based off of squamate? These two species are biologically and anatomically incompatible with human males or females. Neither of them could actually have any kind of intercourse with a human, as we humans know it, so why is this argument raging? because some some dude!shep wants to throw some kisses at Garrus or Thane? Whats the big deal anyway, it's not like either could actually cross breed, right?

[Ryzaki]

I guess I can see where people who say it will break the game are coming from. I just can't really sympathize because the Tali/Garrus mances already broke the game for me.

As did thermal clips and Shepard dying and being brought to life.

Working with Cerberus also broke the game for me but I got over it.

Plenty of things in ME2 made no sense to me but I went along with it because it was a game. An these things weren't easily ignorable like romance options.

The whole "game would be ruined." thing is a giant YMMV and for the most part people are just saying it to be dramatic. They like most people will play probably cringe, realize they can ignore it and move on.

There'll be a few who will go on the forums and rage about it but as time goes on they too will eventually get over it or move on to something else once they realize it's not changing or being patched out.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 16 mai 2011 - 05:43 .

[PMC65]

TheMarshal wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

I'd be happy with James Vega and Joker.

If only one I'd take Joker.

Frankly any human male other than Jacob will do.

No, you take Jacob and you LIKE IT!  : P

Yees ... let the male shep's feel the sudden need to "hoochie mama" around Jacob!!!!

[CheeseEnchilada]

I want a s/s only LI. Not everyone is heterosexual or bisexual.

While I'm dreaming, I'd like an aseuxal LI please. One that isn't Sebastian.

[In all seriousness though, it'll probably be James Vega and a new female interest/Kelly as s/s LIs. Then again, I'm not convinced Vega isn't another Nihlus]

[Nexus Arcade]

Example to my last post.

Garrus: I don't know shephard I never been with another man.

Shephard: Come on garrus don't knock till you try it.


Or something like that.

[Ryzaki]

PMC65 wrote...
Yees ... let the male shep's feel the sudden need to "hoochie mama" around Jacob!!!!

I swear if any of my Shepards act like that around anyone. I will nerdrage with the fury of a thousand suns.

[Mr.House]

I personally think Ash and Kai Kai will be made bi. For starters they where meant to be bi and in both games Hale and Meer have done voiced work for both romances. Two they are easy to implant and since one of them will always be alive and has known Shepard for awhile.

Also do it like Fen/Merrill who only come on too you AFTER you flirt so people who don't want the content don't whine that the same sex is flirting with them.

That is a fair compromise, I would prefer everyone is bi my self but as long as some are bi and done well then I don't care, just let maleshep get some male loving.

[TheMarshal]

PMC65 wrote...

TheMarshal wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

I'd be happy with James Vega and Joker.

If only one I'd take Joker.

Frankly any human male other than Jacob will do.

No, you take Jacob and you LIKE IT!  : P

Yees ... let the male shep's feel the sudden need to "hoochie mama" around Jacob!!!!

God, I could IMAGINE the outrage if ManShep was forcibly turned into a "cougar" around one of the male LI's. 

[Leonia]

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Two words: Tenchi Muyo.

I'd rather have four characters (of any gender combination!) available to me than nine characters (of any gender combination). I'm already bummed that I have to turn Thane down in order to romance Garrus. Having to turn down four or five more characters who are obviously interested me would make me feel like a huge jerk. Also, impossibly harried.

Now, I've said before that I would be cool if there was a non-mod-related way to open up all romances for people who wouldn't be bothered by the "harem anime" vibe. I'm still in favor of some in-game, built-in way for people to get all the romances they want.

I just don't want nine people flirting with me at once. It doesn't matter if they're the nine hottest people in the entire world. It would be stressfull and awkward.

This deserves mentioning, it feels like this portion of the debate gets neglected the most. I don't want to have juggle relationships and saving the universe, I don't want to be Tenchi Muyo (or whatever his last name was). I know Shepard has control over who she/he wishes to pursue, ultimately, but if it feels like I having to juggle my entire crew's feelings (regardless of their sexual orientations) the whole time... then that's going to get boring.

Again, I want to add hope that more dialogue will not be tied down to romance/flirt options. Casey sort of assured us that this is possible so hopefully it's not a worry.

But I do think people have ignored the potential problems of having everyone making a play for Shepard at once could cause.

[Siansonea]

TheMarshal wrote...

Lu the Prodigy wrote...

To this I say that in the ME games so far, romance has been initiated by shepard, so its unlikely that a male shepard would all of a sudden get hit on by garrus or kaiden. Remember that Garrus wasn't even interested in femshep until she tells him she is... then she had to spell it out for him. If characters only react to the PC's flirtatiousness then you dont have to fear a change in their personality unless you instigate that change

I think the ME1 LI's were a little more 'blunt' in their interest, not really waiting for Shepard to say "Hey, you're hot".  ME2's LI's gave Shepard the opportunity to say "Okay, let's give this relationship thing a go" or "Let's be friends, and by that I mean that I don't ever need to talk to you anymore".  Hopefully ME3 will be a little better in allowing a) Shepard to initiate the romance; and dialogue to continue if the romance path isn't taken.

Actually, only Liara was really pushy in the first game. Ashley was mildly flirtatious, and Kaidan actually seemed to be taken by surprise that Shepard was interested, and 'needed time to process it'.

I do think BioWare got the memo that No Sex=No More Talkie is a big no-no, so I'm optimistic that friendmances will be better in ME3.

[Lu the Prodigy]

TheMarshal wrote...

Lu the Prodigy wrote...

To this I say that in the ME games so far, romance has been initiated by shepard, so its unlikely that a male shepard would all of a sudden get hit on by garrus or kaiden. Remember that Garrus wasn't even interested in femshep until she tells him she is... then she had to spell it out for him. If characters only react to the PC's flirtatiousness then you dont have to fear a change in their personality unless you instigate that change

I think the ME1 LI's were a little more 'blunt' in their interest, not really waiting for Shepard to say "Hey, you're hot".  ME2's LI's gave Shepard the opportunity to say "Okay, let's give this relationship thing a go" or "Let's be friends, and by that I mean that I don't ever need to talk to you anymore".  Hopefully ME3 will be a little better in allowing a) Shepard to initiate the romance; and dialogue to continue if the romance path isn't taken.

Ah yes... ME1.  You are correct.  I suppose I have been playing far too much of the sequel and that the original is no longer as fresh in my memory... I should really remedy that with another playthrough.  But yes, it was much better in ME2, and if you read Casey Hudson's tweets, it is very reassuring that they know what the community was not pleased with, and that the romanced will not be implimented the same was as in DA or ME1

[TaHol100]

I'm going to have interesting times when importing my Sheps. Thing is, most of them are modded in ME1 to have romance with Kaidan, and all my Sheps are males. Worked well when importing to ME2, Kaidan hugs and his picture is in cabin. Now, if Kaidan would have come out of the closet in ME3, maybe my imports are not totally lost. Otherwise...I'm anxious to see! All this importing-thing is not so important to me and I don't mind doing new Sheps from scratch if needed.

But it would feel little funny if Kaidan of Ashley are suddenly bisexual when they were not in ME1. I don't mind if they are, I would romance Kaidan all the way, but still. New members on the other hand, we don't know anything about them yet, and they can be written to be whatever.

Modifié par TaHol100, 16 mai 2011 - 05:47 .

[Ryzaki]

Lu the Prodigy wrote...

Ah yes... ME1.  You are correct.  I suppose I have been playing far too much of the sequel and that the original is no longer as fresh in my memory... I should really remedy that with another playthrough.  But yes, it was much better in ME2, and if you read Casey Hudson's tweets, it is very reassuring that they know what the community was not pleased with, and that the romanced will not be implimented the same was as in DA or ME1

???

DAO's implication was fine. You could end it easily, you could start it easily and most of the options were obvious.

Only ninja'mance was Leliana and Alistair and since Alistair was a m/f romance only there wasn't much complaining and Leliana was a massive bug.

[Ryzaki]

leonia42 wrote...

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

Two words: Tenchi Muyo.

I'd rather have four characters (of any gender combination!) available to me than nine characters (of any gender combination). I'm already bummed that I have to turn Thane down in order to romance Garrus. Having to turn down four or five more characters who are obviously interested me would make me feel like a huge jerk. Also, impossibly harried.

Now, I've said before that I would be cool if there was a non-mod-related way to open up all romances for people who wouldn't be bothered by the "harem anime" vibe. I'm still in favor of some in-game, built-in way for people to get all the romances they want.

I just don't want nine people flirting with me at once. It doesn't matter if they're the nine hottest people in the entire world. It would be stressfull and awkward.

This deserves mentioning, it feels like this portion of the debate gets neglected the most. I don't want to have juggle relationships and saving the universe, I don't want to be Tenchi Muyo (or whatever his last name was). I know Shepard has control over who she/he wishes to pursue, ultimately, but if it feels like I having to juggle my entire crew's feelings (regardless of their sexual orientations) the whole time... then that's going to get boring.

Again, I want to add hope that more dialogue will not be tied down to romance/flirt options. Casey sort of assured us that this is possible so hopefully it's not a worry.

But I do think people have ignored the potential problems of having everyone making a play for Shepard at once could cause.

That won't be an issue if Shepard (like every s/s romance ever) initates the romance first. I can't remember a romance in a BW game where I didn't have to pick the obvious YOU ARE STARTING A GAY ROMANCE dialogue choice.