6696 réponses à ce sujet

[jlb524]

Do some people honestly have difficulty avoiding romances they don't have interest in? I surely don't. I happily avoided the 3 dude options in ME2. I personally don't like dudes romantically and neither does my Female Shepard...it was really no biggie. The idea that my Shepard could romance either Thane/Garrus/Jacob just never popped into my head, and I treated those guys as friends only.

Or, is it the fact that some other person playing the game down the street is doing these romances that is worrisome?

[Jademoon121]

The problem with a new LI though is that he's new. Shep, after two games will only be able to date said noob, instead of improving a relationship he already has.

[AdmiralCheez]

Mr.House wrote...

Yes let's introduce a new LI which will have little depth compared to the others, that's ****** poor.

You can't have a deep character in one game?

[ipgd]

Phaelducan wrote...

Whether it's 10 grand or 15 grand of added cost is irrelevant, and also not a straw man. If you want to cite a logical fallacy, do so correctly. I'm not using a different issue to deflect from the object of debate, I'm using the same issue. Unless you propose, as I suspect, that your minority actually IS the only minority of import in the world, in which case I stand by my previous statement.

Hypocrite.

I am a straight, white, middle-class American. I have no personal stake in this. I want it because there's no reason not to include it. If the examples you were giving were in any way realistic or economically feasible in the way gay options are, I would support them, but they aren't, so they are irrelevant to the discussion.

Modifié par ipgd, 16 mai 2011 - 07:43 .

[Ryzaki]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Restating this tweet...

CaseyDHudson (Casey Hudson):

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

Everybody chill!

Needs to be quoted. 

[Siansonea]

Wereparrot wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

ipgd wrote...

Wereparrot wrote...

So Shepherd could be racist or otherwise prejudiced because he's not forced to declare that he's not?

Yes. Hell, Shepard can be overtly racist/xenophobic in the text of the game already.

Fine. I hope, considering this, that Shepherd can be openly homophobic towards those of the same gender who come on to him/her.


That's not the case in DAII, and it won't be the case in ME3.

You hope your character can be homophobic in ME3. I don't even know what to do with this. This is really disgusting to me, but then so was working for Cerberus. At least your Homophobe Shepard idea would be optional, I guess. 

Well, one thing about it, Straight Shepard will be able to be straighter than ever before. After all, he will be able to pursue women even though there are men in the game he could pursue if he wanted to. Choosing a woman is even more meaningful when you're also not choosing a man.

I really hoped I wouldn't need to point out that I was being sarcastic.

Well, pardon me for not being a mind reader. You've said enough preposterous things with no seeming irony or sarcasm that it wasn't a stretch for me to think you were being perfectly serious. As Steve Martin would say "excuuuuuse meeeeee".

[Clonedzero]

Mr.House wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...

Matchy Pointy wrote...

I'm all for it, it's abput time, and I havent seen a single character in ME come out with their established preference.

that is such a ridiculous way to look at things.

people dont announce their sexual orientation to people unless the specific situation calls for it. i never flat out announced i was straight to any of my past girlfriends, why? becuase it was unnecessary.

shouldnt require everything to be flat out announced and specified for us to draw logical conclusions.

Well, what logical conclusion can you draw about a bisexual person if you've only witnessed them pursue one relationship?

Cleary if a man has sex with a woman that must bmean they are straight!

Ahhh ignorence is bliss.

ah yes, resorting to a condesending attitude really makes you seem mature and wise.

all that was said was if a guy has sex with a girl, its not unreasonable to assume he's straight. might not be 100% accurate, but most of the time sure.

now this is a STORY. where characters should be well defined by this point, changing them around is poor writing, especially using the excuse "well they were always bi, they just never mentioned it till now" can you really not see how someone might feel thats really forced and dumb?

again, its insulting you assume im bigoted in any way. i have no problem with the s/s romances in the game. more power to you, just dont shoehorn existing characters into being bi because "they never said they werent" because again, ill say it slowly this time

its      bad         writing        to           change            characters          so          late        in         a          story.

[JeffZero]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Yes let's introduce a new LI which will have little depth compared to the others, that's ****** poor.

You can't have a deep character in one game?

No. It's impossible.

*ignores pretty much all characters introduced in ME2 while humming sheepishly*

[Siansonea]

Jademoon121 wrote...

The problem with a new LI though is that he's new. Shep, after two games will only be able to date said noob, instead of improving a relationship he already has.

I don't mind noobs, if they're hot noobs. Honestly, this James Vague-a sounds hot so far. I hope he's bi, so I can have Sheps of both genders get up on that.

[thatguy212]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Yes let's introduce a new LI which will have little depth compared to the others, that's ****** poor.

You can't have a deep character in one game?

I never get why people say that, i mean really what is a romance in the mass effect universe? 3 conversations then they declare their love for shepard

[hoorayforicecream]

Phaelducan wrote...

Whether it's 10 grand or 15 grand of added cost is irrelevant, and also not a straw man. If you want to cite a logical fallacy, do so correctly. I'm not using a different issue to deflect from the object of debate, I'm using the same issue. Unless you propose, as I suspect, that your minority actually IS the only minority of import in the world, in which case I stand by my previous statement.

Hypocrite.

If I happen to be proud of my heritage, language, culture contributions, suffering at the hands of oppressors (be it gay, Irish, native american, or whatever) then that is fine. What is NOT ok, is for me to demand that everyone else who isn't to be subjected to my own narrow view of the world so that my own entertainment is maximized.

Maybe the soundtrack for ME3 should be completely replaced with music from the Pogues, that way my minority would be properly represented and I would feel that I'm not being ignored/repressed by Bioware.

I agree with you in one sense. It isn't about rights, or who deserves what. That said, this is an artistic design choice that Bioware is making, because they feel that it will make for a better game. 

You can choose to say that it's a mistake to use resources on this, but that would be your opinion. Only the producers of the game really know the resources costs, and what ends up on the cutting room floor instead. However, this isn't really limited to same sex romances. One could apply the efficiency argument to every quest, NPC interaction, or dialogue in the game as well. Some of them are less valuable than others, and the time spent working on them could be used on other stuff. It's a design choice and artistic preference.

I mean... the writers could just straight-out kill certain former companions between the games, have them become enemies, or whatever, and it may or may not be consistent with their previously-written characters. It could even involve a retcon. Who knows?

The main point is this: I don't see what sexuality has to do with the efficiency problem you bring up. It's entirely based on what they decide to do and how they implement it.

Modifié par hoorayforicecream, 16 mai 2011 - 07:44 .

[Ryzaki]

You keep saying bad writing.

I don't think you really know what that is.

[Heather Cline]

Well I for one am glad that they are opening up to having a male/male romance for the gay/bi gamers of the male persuasion on here. I am also glad they are giving us female gamers another option for lesbian love interest other than Liara. I love Liara but I hated it when we got shafted that Jack and Tali were supposed to be bi but the content for those two were cut in ME2. So here's to hoping that we at least have one or two more s/s options than we had before.

[Mr.House]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Yes let's introduce a new LI which will have little depth compared to the others, that's ****** poor.

You can't have a deep character in one game?

Not if it's going to be like ME2. only a few characters in ME2 had depth.

[bleetman]

Clonedzero wrote...

most people arent concerned about shepard being gay/bi. they're concerned about established squadmates and characters being turned bi simply so gay/bi shepard has someone to shack up with.

thats whats going to come accross as forced and unrealistic.

I suppose, but I'm content to wait and see who the bi-sexual ones turn out to be and how it's handled. People are talking as if Garrus is going to burst out from his callibration-station and gay it up with man Shepard in the middle of the mess hall. Them turning out to have, say, been unsure how to approach the subject beforehand is something I'd be fine with.

Clonedzero wrote...

all that was said was if a guy has sex
with a girl, its not unreasonable to assume he's straight. might not be
100% accurate, but most of the time sure.

Right, but that doesn't utterly exclude the possibility of them not being straight, either.

Modifié par bleetman, 16 mai 2011 - 07:48 .

[jlb524]

Mr.House wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Restating this tweet...

CaseyDHudson (Casey Hudson):

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

Everybody chill!

Yes let's introduce a new LI which will have little depth compared to the others, that's ****** poor.

Speak for yourself...I don't want none dem old LIs (minus Liara of course ) but would prefer a new romance with Kasumi.  

[Jademoon121]

Siansonea II wrote...

Jademoon121 wrote...

The problem with a new LI though is that he's new. Shep, after two games will only be able to date said noob, instead of improving a relationship he already has.

I don't mind noobs, if they're hot noobs. Honestly, this James Vague-a sounds hot so far. I hope he's bi, so I can have Sheps of both genders get up on that.

If the guy's a boss and he's not a clone of any other past stereotypical male s/s LI *cough*ZEVRANFENRIS*cough* I'll be happy.
This guy needs his testosterone, not good hair.

[Mr.House]

Clonedzero wrote...
its      bad         writing        to           change            characters          so          late        in         a          story.

You keep saying it's bad writing but it's not.

[Mad Pig]

call me homophob but im not supporting this, it started with Dragon Age 2 that everyone should be bi, and now it comes to Mass Effect...shame

[ipgd]

Clonedzero wrote...

its      bad         writing        to           change            characters          so          late        in         a          story.

Characters get changed in the late stages of well written stories all of the time. The only difference here is whether or not we know it was planned all along.

They Changed It Now It Sucks is such an irritating sentiment and I just wish it would die.

[GreenSoda]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Yes let's introduce a new LI which will have little depth compared to the others, that's ****** poor.

You can't have a deep character in one game?

Man, BW can't catch a break.

[BrandNewMan]

Clonedzero wrote...

bleetman wrote...

Phaelducan wrote...

What is unfortunate is that it wasn't included in 1 OR 2, and now to put it in ME3 is forced, unrealistic, and is going to require resources allocated that shouldn't be.

It's not forced, and I grow weary of repeating that. If your Shepard is straight to you, it'll continue being that. If your Shepard was bi/******-sexual from the point of view of the player - which several people have already said was the case for them - they'll have the option to go somewhere with it.

I'm assuming you mean 'forced' not in the sense of the player being made to engage in s/s romances, more in a 'round peg, square hole' kind of sense of trying to fit it into a backstory that doesn't make sense with it. The point is, it makes sense to the people who wanted it, because chances are they've already written out their characters that way.

most people arent concerned about shepard being gay/bi. they're concerned about established squadmates and characters being turned bi simply so gay/bi shepard has someone to shack up with.

thats whats going to come accross as forced and unrealistic.

But they never said they were doing that...

[CroGamer002]

Mr.House wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...
its      bad         writing        to           change            characters          so          late        in         a          story.

You keep saying it's bad writing but it's not.

If you ask smudboy it is.

[Siansonea]

Clonedzero wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...

Matchy Pointy wrote...

I'm all for it, it's abput time, and I havent seen a single character in ME come out with their established preference.

that is such a ridiculous way to look at things.

people dont announce their sexual orientation to people unless the specific situation calls for it. i never flat out announced i was straight to any of my past girlfriends, why? becuase it was unnecessary.

shouldnt require everything to be flat out announced and specified for us to draw logical conclusions.

Well, what logical conclusion can you draw about a bisexual person if you've only witnessed them pursue one relationship?

Cleary if a man has sex with a woman that must bmean they are straight!

Ahhh ignorence is bliss.

ah yes, resorting to a condesending attitude really makes you seem mature and wise.

all that was said was if a guy has sex with a girl, its not unreasonable to assume he's straight. might not be 100% accurate, but most of the time sure.

now this is a STORY. where characters should be well defined by this point, changing them around is poor writing, especially using the excuse "well they were always bi, they just never mentioned it till now" can you really not see how someone might feel thats really forced and dumb?

again, its insulting you assume im bigoted in any way. i have no problem with the s/s romances in the game. more power to you, just dont shoehorn existing characters into being bi because "they never said they werent" because again, ill say it slowly this time

its      bad         writing        to           change            characters          so          late        in         a          story.

Well, you know you can always avoid that 'bad writing', by, you know, not sleeping with dudes in the game. But saying that no one should have that option because you think it's bad writing (without actually having seen the writing, I might add) is as silly as me saying that no one should have alien LI options because I personally think they're beyond ridiculous . I can still have my game the way I want it, with Devon Shepard, Martín Shepard and Ethan Shepard saying "how about no" to Tali when she gets all flustery, and Simone Shepard, Leah Shepard and Ashley Shepard never going there with Garrus, because, ew.