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-Wider options for Romance in ME3, including Same-sex- *Update added*


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#1526
Jacody

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I personally think that there will be a squad of 6, and they'll all be LIs (not all bi, though)

Kaidan/Ashley would be bi.
Liara would be whatever she is(bi/pan?).
Garrus and Tali would be straight.
James Vega might be gay.
Another Female squaddie might be a lesbian.

2 ******, 2 hetero, and 2 bi.

Either way, I'm just happy about M/M :D

Modifié par Jacody, 17 mai 2011 - 05:10 .


#1527
CulturalGeekGirl

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CmmndrShepard wrote...

Raiders Fan 223 wrote...

This had turned into the new Fight for the Love thread Posted Image

In any event, I find it funny how some people are saying "but Kaiden was supposed to be bi in ME1!!!!!  He had romance linez but Bioware took them out!!!!111"

Yeah, they took it out.  There is no in-game, factual evidence that Shepard (male) is anything but a heterosexual male.  Has he had the opportunity to (and in many playthroughs for people, experience) a love affair/flirting with several different women: Ash, Liara, Shi'ira, Miranda, Jack, Kelly, Shiila, Parasini (could be missing some).  Does he ever even flirt with a guy?  I must have missed it in all of my playthroughs.  You would think, wouldn't you, that if Bioware had ever intended to truly make Shepard possibly bi/gay that they would have at least hinted at it in the first two games?

"But my Shepard didn't romance any girl in the first two games, so there's a chance he's gay/bi!"  How am I supposed to argue against this kind of testimony?


I know I will be barraged by about 25 posts in like 3 minutes, but I don't care.  Male shep shouldn't be gay. or bi, whatever.


i like what this guy said, but the fact he's a raider's fan might dampen his ethos...just kidding


I've posted this before, but there are clearly HUNDREDS of different Shepards. There is no one Shepard. One of my Shepards is straight, she romanced Kaidan in ME1. One of my Shepards is gay, she romanced Liara.

There was no indication that Shepard could biotic charge in ME1. The fact that she can suddenly biotic charge is so disconcerting. If they had meand for Shepard to be able to biotic charge, they would have hinted at it in the first game. There was no indication that Shepard would cooperate with Cerberus in ME1, but the option became available and some people took it. There was no indication that Shepard would suffer a Geth to live, but in ME2 he had the option and took it.

Just because an option hasn't been available previously doesn't mean that such a possibility opening up is out of character.

#1528
SennenScale

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Ryzaki wrote...

With the 4 new squaddies idea I'd be all for this. 

I won't have to drag around people I don't like hopefully. 


I'm going to start charging my squadmates rent if I get a ton I don't use.

Time to pay rent or go on missions! Either way, everybody better help fight the Reapers to get a ticket on this vessel!

:P

#1529
SilentNukee

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Siansonea II wrote...

SleepySasquatch wrote...

SilentNukee wrote...

Sigh...
I dislike when people say this "it'd be better to have the new characters be bi or homosexual to save from having to explain why the oldies have all suddenly and simultaneously had sexual epiphanies."
.......................... They never said they were straight to begin with, you all assume they are because they do not show signs of the stereotypical gay image you have in your head.
Jack is the only one who actually says anything of the sort, if you choose to have a paragon conversation with her after her loyalty mission as FemShep.

It's possible for Garrus to have sex with female Shepard (but not male Shepard) and Tali to have sex with male Shepard (but not female Shepard) despite the fact that it's possible to make your Shepard's basically identical in personality regardless of their sex. Hence, the implication is that they're romantically interested in the opposite sex but not the same sex.

Granted, you could argue that they could be bi, and that'd be a fair argument but it comes with the same issue. If they were bi previously why did they not think to flirt with you regardless of your sex? Your personality can be the same, and I can assure you they're not bothered by your physical looks (Seriously, my friends Shepard is just...just...Oh sweet Krogans of Croatia. He's just other-worldly ugly.) so logically it must be the fact that you're male/female.

Apologies if this comes across as aggressive as it's not my intention. Just offering an opinion ^_^


This is actually a pretty sound argument for excluding Garrus and Tali. The only problem is that the reason Garrus and Tali can't get anywhere with same-sex Shepard is because Shepard can't initiate the dialog. All that really says is that same-sex Shepard is reluctant to explore a relationship with Garrus or Tali at that point, much the way opposite-sex Shepard was reluctant to explore a relationship with them in the first game.

Exactly. For Tali and FemShep, you go as far as she telling you that it would be a "honor to link suits with you.", or that the blushing is the fever. The dossier logs in LotSB place, actually have the same logs as male Shep. (Where she is seen downloading and uninstalling the "nerve-sti" program multiple times and downloading the human anatomy vid.)
As for Garrus, I'm not too sure how far maleShep takes the conversation. But I imagine it's not too far, like Tali.
That always leaves doors open.

#1530
PMC65

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SennenScale wrote...

PMC65 wrote...


The US ... California


Hey, me too! But my area is super-hostile to gays for whatever reason. And androgynous faces, oddly enough.


Move out of Bakersfield! Posted Image

[EDI: That is a joke]

#1531
SennenScale

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CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
There was no indication that Shepard would suffer a Geth to live, but in ME2 he had the option and took it.


Indeed! I love Legion and even jokingly suggested Legionmance earlier, but one has to admit, bringing a geth aboard and even trusting him is waaaaaay stranger a circumstance than a gay Shepard.

#1532
CulturalGeekGirl

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SennenScale wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

With the 4 new squaddies idea I'd be all for this. 

I won't have to drag around people I don't like hopefully. 


I'm going to start charging my squadmates rent if I get a ton I don't use.

Time to pay rent or go on missions! Either way, everybody better help fight the Reapers to get a ticket on this vessel!

:P


The only problem with this idea is that a lot of interviews and articles have implied that there will be fewer squadmates who are able to be permanent, with more of a focus on deep, well-developed character interaction for a few characters, with the rest probably being temporary squadmates tied to personal stories like LotSB Liara. Adding in four brand new squadmates and making existing characters have less development would cause more rage than the bisexualization option, I think. I could be wrong, though. Adding a bunch of squadmates who may or may not be permanent would further spread out the writing burden and development resources, which doesn't seem to be something Bioware is keen to do right now. Of course, I could be misreading things.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 17 mai 2011 - 05:04 .


#1533
PMC65

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Ryzaki wrote...

I actually want a non-filledtothebrim with issues s/s LI. Someone well mentally adjusted and just wants to stop the reapers. 

I've had enough of daddy issues.
I don't want this person to be cheerful mc cheerful though. 

That'll make me wanna strangle them. 



If you find that person ... can you share with my Shepard? Posted Image

#1534
SleepySasquatch

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CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

SleepySasquatch wrote...

SilentNukee wrote...

Sigh...
I dislike when people say this "it'd be better to have the new characters be bi or homosexual to save from having to explain why the oldies have all suddenly and simultaneously had sexual epiphanies."
.......................... They never said they were straight to begin with, you all assume they are because they do not show signs of the stereotypical gay image you have in your head.
Jack is the only one who actually says anything of the sort, if you choose to have a paragon conversation with her after her loyalty mission as FemShep.

It's possible for Garrus to have sex with female Shepard (but not male Shepard) and Tali to have sex with male Shepard (but not female Shepard) despite the fact that it's possible to make your Shepard's basically identical in personality regardless of their sex. Hence, the implication is that they're romantically interested in the opposite sex but not the same sex.

Granted, you could argue that they could be bi, and that'd be a fair argument but it comes with the same issue. If they were bi previously why did they not think to flirt with you regardless of your sex? Your personality can be the same, and I can assure you they're not bothered by your physical looks (Seriously, my friends Shepard is just...just...Oh sweet Krogans of Croatia. He's just other-worldly ugly.) so logically it must be the fact that you're male/female.

Apologies if this comes across as aggressive as it's not my intention. Just offering an opinion ^_^


Maybe they didn't flirt with you before because they did some extranet research on human sexuality and saw that homosexuals and bisexuals were a minority, and also found references to nasty human history in relation to homosexuality? That would make me think twice about hitting on someone, and it would make sense in that case that Shepard has to hit on them first.

As for Garrus, you have to initiate the flirt with him anyway, and he already makes it pretty clear that femshep isn't really his type, but he'll give it a whirl.

I think the background reading issue is grasping a bit. Often when realising that aliens have a knowledge of human history or cultural traits Shepard seems taken aback (as with when Samara makes mention of the samurai) indicating that it's not common for other species to read around such matters. In addition to this, if a character was actually interested in you surely they'd respond seductively on atleast a couple of occasions. I mean even Tali got there eventually? :P

Concerning the human former crew members, my argument remains valid.

#1535
SennenScale

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CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

The only problem with this idea is that a lot of interviews and articles have implied that there will be fewer squadmates who are able to be permanent, with more of a focus on deep, well-developed character interaction for a few characters, with the rest probably being temporary squadmates tied to personal stories like LotSB Liara. Adding in four brand new squadmates and making existing characters have less development would cause more rage than the bisexualization option, I think. I could be wrong, though. Adding a bunch of squadmates who may or may not be permanent would further spread out the writing burden and development resources, which doesn't seem to be something Bioware is keen to do right now. Of course, I could be misreading things.


I was just joking around. I want there to be fewer squaddies to manage and Bioware will be able to focus on them more. What I meant was... If there IS a buttload of unused squaddies, I be chargin 'em rent!

#1536
PMC65

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Smilietime wrote...

Casey Hudson (from twitter):

"Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both
m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in ME3"

This sounds great. Someone should attatch this to the Origional Post.

It's annoying, reading some news articles going all jubilant about how they think they will finally have a gay relationship with their favorite character. I'm sure that they will all stay in character, regardless, rather than replacing a character we know with a similar character (who has a different orientation) all the sudden.


And if you notice he says "not necessarily true." The game is still in development so there will be many changes in the next few months. He has left the possibility open ... I want gay romances but I want it to be done in such a way that it does not make the "straight" Shepards uncomfortable. I am sure that Bioware will look at the best way to execute these romances. I hope .... Posted Image

#1537
SleepySasquatch

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For the record, I am still firmly in favour of a Wrexmance in ME3 regardless of how everything else works out.

#1538
PMC65

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SilentNukee wrote...

If they add in a gay LI, do you honestly think a straight male playing the game as Shepard, would ever think of ever bringing him into their squad? They would probably try to avoid them as much as possible, or kill them off if they have the chance. But they wouldn't get the "know" the character indepth...and that's not cool. While having a "bi" Garrus, let's say, you'll still want to "bromance" him because of the way his personality is. We love him. And you could totally continue that without affecting anything, if you wish.


That is not true of all straight men or even the majority .... Posted Image

#1539
Ryzaki

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SennenScale wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

With the 4 new squaddies idea I'd be all for this. 

I won't have to drag around people I don't like hopefully. 


I'm going to start charging my squadmates rent if I get a ton I don't use.

Time to pay rent or go on missions! Either way, everybody better help fight the Reapers to get a ticket on this vessel!

:P


Agreed so hard. 

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
The only problem with this idea is that a lot of interviews and articles have implied that there will be fewer squadmates who are able to be permanent, with more of a focus on deep, well-developed character interaction for a few characters, with the rest probably being temporary squadmates tied to personal stories like LotSB Liara. Adding in four brand new squadmates and making existing characters have less development would cause more rage than the bisexualization option, I think. I could be wrong, though. Adding a bunch of squadmates who may or may not be permanent would further spread out the writing burden and development resources, which doesn't seem to be something Bioware is keen to do right now. Of course, I could be misreading things.


Hm...in that case I would be more pro my 4 s/s LIs as squaddies. The ME1 and ME2 teams have already gotten plenty of development. It's time for others to get in the spotlight. All of them have already got their time in the limelight and we know them pretty well already. I'd rather have them pushed to the side than risk the new LIs not being properly developed. 

I don't mind them being side characters with temporary stories (because LotSB was awesome.) 

And I doubt it would cause more rage. They still have their LIs consistent after all. Isn't that more important than forcing them into the spotlight? 

PMC65 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

I actually want a non-filledtothebrim with issues s/s LI. Someone well mentally adjusted and just wants to stop the reapers. 

I've had enough of daddy issues.
I don't want this person to be cheerful mc cheerful though. 

That'll make me wanna strangle them. 



If you find that person ... can you share with my Shepard? Posted Image


Hey I don't mind sharing. <3 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 17 mai 2011 - 05:15 .


#1540
CulturalGeekGirl

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Ryzaki wrote...


Agreed so hard. 

CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
The only problem with this idea is that a lot of interviews and articles have implied that there will be fewer squadmates who are able to be permanent, with more of a focus on deep, well-developed character interaction for a few characters, with the rest probably being temporary squadmates tied to personal stories like LotSB Liara. Adding in four brand new squadmates and making existing characters have less development would cause more rage than the bisexualization option, I think. I could be wrong, though. Adding a bunch of squadmates who may or may not be permanent would further spread out the writing burden and development resources, which doesn't seem to be something Bioware is keen to do right now. Of course, I could be misreading things.


Hm...in that case I would be more pro my 4 s/s LIs as squaddies. The ME1 and ME2 teams have already gotten plenty of development. It's time for others to get in the spotlight. 

I don't mind them being side characters with temporary stories (because LotSB was awesome.) 

And I doubt it would cause more rage. They still have their LIs consistent after all. Isn't that more important than forcing them into the spotlight? 


I would prefer to have Garrus as a permanent squadmate and not a continuing LI than to have him as an LI who was only a temporary squadmate. My friendship with Garrus is more important than his love interest status for me, and for a lot of guys who didn't romance him. His status as a friend is probably the greatest component in his character's popularity. So no. Not more important!

I don't know about other people and their LIs, and I do not represent the majority of Garrus Fangirls. Heh.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 17 mai 2011 - 05:17 .


#1541
SleepySasquatch

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Siansonea II wrote...

SleepySasquatch wrote...

SilentNukee wrote...

Sigh...
I dislike when people say this "it'd be better to have the new characters be bi or homosexual to save from having to explain why the oldies have all suddenly and simultaneously had sexual epiphanies."
.......................... They never said they were straight to begin with, you all assume they are because they do not show signs of the stereotypical gay image you have in your head.
Jack is the only one who actually says anything of the sort, if you choose to have a paragon conversation with her after her loyalty mission as FemShep.

It's possible for Garrus to have sex with female Shepard (but not male Shepard) and Tali to have sex with male Shepard (but not female Shepard) despite the fact that it's possible to make your Shepard's basically identical in personality regardless of their sex. Hence, the implication is that they're romantically interested in the opposite sex but not the same sex.

Granted, you could argue that they could be bi, and that'd be a fair argument but it comes with the same issue. If they were bi previously why did they not think to flirt with you regardless of your sex? Your personality can be the same, and I can assure you they're not bothered by your physical looks (Seriously, my friends Shepard is just...just...Oh sweet Krogans of Croatia. He's just other-worldly ugly.) so logically it must be the fact that you're male/female.

Apologies if this comes across as aggressive as it's not my intention. Just offering an opinion ^_^


This is actually a pretty sound argument for excluding Garrus and Tali. The only problem is that the reason Garrus and Tali can't get anywhere with same-sex Shepard is because Shepard can't initiate the dialog. All that really says is that same-sex Shepard is reluctant to explore a relationship with Garrus or Tali at that point, much the way opposite-sex Shepard was reluctant to explore a relationship with them in the first game.

-
That's a good point actually. Shepard is never given the option to initiate anything. But if we now know that gay romance options are offered in the third game (meaning Shepard may have been bi/gay all along) I wonder why Shepard didn't have the option. One could say that he simply wasn't interested but you'd think that'd be the players choice to make. Though perhaps I'm being too pedantic now.

#1542
KainrycKarr

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Cool. I'm totally okay with it - as long as Garrus doesn't grab my manshep's ass or something wildly inappropriate or something, which I doubt will happen.

Congrats to those who've been fighting for this.

#1543
Ryzaki

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CulturalGeekGirl wrote...
I would prefer to have Garrus as a permanent squadmate and not a continuing LI than to have him as an LI who was only a temporary squadmate. My friendship with Garrus is more important than his love interest status for me, and for a lot of guys who didn't romance him. So no. Not more important!

I don't know about other people and their LIs, and I do not represent the majority of Garrus Fangirls. Heh.


Heh. You're lucky. Garrus is one of the sure returning people isn't he? Him and everyone else from ME1 pretty much. And yes his bromance was pretty epic and is probably the reason he's a returning squaddie.  

I doubt it would be bad for them not to be in the spotlight. It's not like their characterization will degress.And they've already had a game's worth (if not more) of development. To me it's far more important that the new characters don't end up falling flat. But of course it is a personal opinion. I just think they should treat the new characters with the same TLC that they do the ME1 characters. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 17 mai 2011 - 05:22 .


#1544
AngryFrozenWater

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I would prefer a non-artificial solution. I mean... A game option which activates or deactivates non-hetero romances is something I don't like, because in real life you can't always detect someone's sexual orientation. It's not about realism, it is about creating a believable experience. No matter what orientation, in-game it would be nice if there was a clear dialogue option which started a romance and in case the companion had the initiative it would be nice to have a clear option to gracefully reject. That still allows the writers to dream up a great story around it. I'll trust the writers' skills on that.

#1545
Sayfodias

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I do not understand why spoil the space saga about the salvation of mankind? You're a good command. This is one of those things because of which mankind is not worth saving. All this is depressing and disappointing. With respect and thanks.

#1546
PMC65

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[quote]James2912 wrote...


[/quote]

"Frankly, when the conversation has reached the point where peope are sterotyping the crap out of straight males (god, I love being an Acceptable Target) and discussing the need to stealth an NPC open to homosexual relationships on the team, I think it's far beyond any sort of reasonable discussion and more into "you don't agree with me, you must be a homophobe/fruity fairy" territory. 
[/quote]"

Haha towards the acceptable target point try being a straight white male, you become the epidomy of evil. Once one of my teachers in middle school was giving a talk on the n a z i s and to illustrate how evil they were he pointed out the people in the class that the ****s would kill and those they would like. There was one other white guy in the class and we both had to stand up because we would supposedly be the only survivors, because we were the only people the ****s would like! (i live in an area thatt is majority minority) lol my teacher had no idea i was Jewish! I didn't want to leave the other guy standing a lone so I just stayed quiet!;)

[/quote]

That is what we call character. Posted Image

#1547
colossus50000

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This game has become about LI more than the core gameplay, it makes me sick they are allowing this to happen. Bioware you have lost my respect.

#1548
CulturalGeekGirl

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SleepySasquatch wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

This is actually a pretty sound argument for excluding Garrus and Tali. The only problem is that the reason Garrus and Tali can't get anywhere with same-sex Shepard is because Shepard can't initiate the dialog. All that really says is that same-sex Shepard is reluctant to explore a relationship with Garrus or Tali at that point, much the way opposite-sex Shepard was reluctant to explore a relationship with them in the first game.

-
That's a good point actually. Shepard is never given the option to initiate anything. But if we now know that gay romance options are offered in the third game (meaning Shepard may have been bi/gay all along) I wonder why Shepard didn't have the option. One could say that he simply wasn't interested but you'd think that'd be the players choice to make. Though perhaps I'm being too pedantic now.


Well, you can't romance Garrus in ME2 as a Femshep if you didn't recruit him in ME1. And you can't romance any of them in ME1. So there are a lot of 'hidden variables' that some people don't like and don't want to have to think about. It's not like you can bring up the possibility of romance in ME1 and get shot down, you just don't happen to think of it in ME1. An ME2 Shepard who didn't get to know Garrus in ME1 is incapable of even concieving of the option of flirting with him.

This confuses and angers a lot of people, who consider the fact that one day you decided to flirt with Garrus when it had never previously occurred to you a bizarre and crazy idea. I don't. Sometimes something just strikes you right, you get into one wierd conversation and you're like "you know what, maybe this is an option." Maybe the files you saw on the Shadow Broker base that imply that Gavorn may have a human male lover made you think about Garrus differently, if you were gay. Maybe you watched fleet and flotilla and there's a f/f Quarian and Turian relationship on it, which made you think differently about Tali. Sometimes something happens that makes you see someone in a different way.

It happens all the time in real life, why can't it happen in games?

#1549
mgs00

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Male Shepard needs to have hot monkey sex with Garrus

#1550
PMC65

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CulturalGeekGirl wrote...

SleepySasquatch wrote...

SilentNukee wrote...

Sigh...
I dislike when people say this "it'd be better to have the new characters be bi or homosexual to save from having to explain why the oldies have all suddenly and simultaneously had sexual epiphanies."
.......................... They never said they were straight to begin with, you all assume they are because they do not show signs of the stereotypical gay image you have in your head.
Jack is the only one who actually says anything of the sort, if you choose to have a paragon conversation with her after her loyalty mission as FemShep.

It's possible for Garrus to have sex with female Shepard (but not male Shepard) and Tali to have sex with male Shepard (but not female Shepard) despite the fact that it's possible to make your Shepard's basically identical in personality regardless of their sex. Hence, the implication is that they're romantically interested in the opposite sex but not the same sex.

Granted, you could argue that they could be bi, and that'd be a fair argument but it comes with the same issue. If they were bi previously why did they not think to flirt with you regardless of your sex? Your personality can be the same, and I can assure you they're not bothered by your physical looks (Seriously, my friends Shepard is just...just...Oh sweet Krogans of Croatia. He's just other-worldly ugly.) so logically it must be the fact that you're male/female.

Apologies if this comes across as aggressive as it's not my intention. Just offering an opinion ^_^


Maybe they didn't flirt with you before because they did some extranet research on human sexuality and saw that homosexuals and bisexuals were a minority, and also found references to nasty human history in relation to homosexuality? That would make me think twice about hitting on someone, and it would make sense in that case that Shepard has to hit on them first.

As for Garrus, you have to initiate the flirt with him anyway, and he already makes it pretty clear that femshep isn't really his type, but he'll give it a whirl.


Tali also hints at it (sharing the suit) with the femshep and gets embarrassed. It caught my femshep off guard. Posted Image