115 réponses à ce sujet

[The_11thDoctor]

I find myself more and more worried about ME3 each day. Bioware has increasingly been getting more and more careless and cutting more and more corners in what I can only preceive as laziness. In ME2, the worlds seem to get smaller, there are glitches that shouldnt be there in large amounts, You cant custom the armor of party members, the Level up system is basically worthless, the refuse to remove the mining mini-hassle, they make up a speices and dont make the opposite sex...(Turrians, Krogans Female), We still have no clue what Tali looks like, They finally got male Quarians in ME2 so I appaud them on finally doing that much... It's taking till ME3 to finally have knives, something mentioned in all ME books and that is used by all Military...

My other worry is Bioware claiming that they are trying to hang with the big fish by improving there combat.. They finally have knives, customizable parts for the guns(Bout time), but they still refuse CO-OP or Multiplayer... This is a key feature to ALL shooters. If you want to be a shooter RPG, then act like it! THere are other shooter RPGs out there doing better and have more options and have CO-OP and Multiplayer! I cant figure out whats so hard about making a good one?! I'm sick of the stupid AI partners and there are a ton of missions that would be easier to deal with and kill (*% of my frustraition if I had a human partner that didnt get stuck in geometry, left behind, glitch out and stop fighting, fall thru the floor or covering wrong and instant dying at random!

What ever happened to the whole space exploration part of ME? You basically go to the same spots over and over again, you cant just travel a planet like in ME1 and look around. Granted ME 1 planets were sparce and had almost nothing to do, which I thought they would fix, but just got rid of in ME2...

DA2 was a nightmare... Sure it was fun for the first run if you ignore the fact that NONE of your decisions or opinions matter. If they want something to happen it happens. You can say you wont do a quest and they give it to you and force you to do it anyway, you can choose to help someone and they die no matter what choices you make, you cant save any of your family members, Mages cant all be healers, the Blizzard spell is gone, you cant custom party members armor, you cant custom body types on your hawke and the hair still hasnt improved in DA yet! The hands were horror to look at and the skin textures arent there yet. The armor looks better and the world looks better, but you reuse the same maps 1mill times, there are a #$(+ load of game breaking glitches and the load times are unacceptable for a game in 2000 much less 2011! I've seen PS2 games 4 times the size of DA2 and have less than 10 sec loads...

I know there is a ton neggative in this post as there should be. Im a paying customer and I love the ideas Bioware puts out there, but the execution as of late has been lame-sauce... I still like ME2 with it's flaws, but I'm bitter over DA2s glitches and lack of care in it and plot holes. I just hope ME3 since you were able to play it start to finish last Christmas and it still got delayed, that Bio does something big this time. ME3 decides if I stay with Bioware. They need to step up their game big time and TEST their game for bugs this time!!

No multiplayer in a shooter makes no sense and sounds like a lame excuse everytime they bring it up. Uncharted was a single player game that was a shooter, a Story driven game and they figured it out! ME would be perfect, but I just keep hearing excuses on why they wont try anything that takes effort... <_<
The whole RPG side of the excuse is holding less water when they take out all the RPG. Minus liking the space setting and the nice Conversation system, it doesnt hold up well to most JRPGs, but I like the fact that it was different.

Modifié par aang001, 16 mai 2011 - 12:35 .

[Shepard Lives]

By golly, I thought this was going to be one of the usual. disgustingly haughty RPG elitist rants and what do I get? A thread asking for multiplayer.

I take my hat off to you, good sir. You took me by surprise.

Also, keep your multiplayer the hell away from my ME.

Modifié par Shepard Lives, 16 mai 2011 - 12:32 .

[Nohvarr]

A lot of fans don't want multiplayer so no matter which way they go on that, someone's going to be ticked off.

As for DA 2, let me borrow an example from Ubisoft. One team made the recent Prince of Persia games, both of which flopped. Another team made the Assassins Creed games, all of which have been a success. So I wouldn't worry about the DA teams mistakes being repeated by the ME team.

[The_11thDoctor]

Multiplayer is an option that should exist. You dont have to use it. But most the rest of my complaints are mainly on the quality and lack of everything!

[Nohvarr]

They already said ME 3 will be more like ME 1 in terms of story so that means more traveling around from planet to planet. We've already confirmed a number of worlds like the Salarian homeworld, the moon of the Turian homeworld, etc.

As for Tali's face, somethings are better left to the imagination.

As for Multiplayer, many here feel that it takes time away from the creation of the single player game. Thus they'd rather that energy be focused on the story and not tacked on multiplayer.

Modifié par Nohvarr, 16 mai 2011 - 12:42 .

[Hathur]

The argument by many of us against multiplayer is not out of any desire to deprive people like you from having it, but simply from a practical perspective that we don't want resources diverted from our single player experience.

Developers are given a set budget by the publisher to make their game. That budget could either be assigned to hiring people who work on the single player aspect of the game.. including narrative, gameplay mechanics, level design, etc.... or divided between that and a second team who focuses on netcode, multiplayer gameplay mechanics, level design, etc.

By having a multiplayer team, you're automatically removing funds / personnel that would otherwise (or could otherwise) be assigned to a single player dev team that focuses on enriching the single player experience.

Also, regarding the reference to Uncharted.... a lovely single player game, but it takes about 6-7 hours to finish that... that's considerably less resources spent to develop than the 30-50 hrs of gameplay and dialogue we get from a Mass effect game... their game is a lot shorter, meaning they have more wiggle room with resource allocation.

I for one am not willing to see Mass Effect turned into a 6-8 hour typical FPS length game to have worthless (to me) multiplayer added.

Not all games need multiplayer.. this is a horribly gross mistake to want as a consumer... there are no shortages of good multiplayer shooters out there... why would you want a narrative / story driven game turned into one? Why can't it be its own thing and remain a single player narrative game?

Look at it this way... The overwhelming majority of people who buy Call of Duty games buy it for the multiplayer experience... not the 4-5 hour campaign ... the campaign is just sort of an apetizer to them.... but frankly, the game would be better off if they stripped it out entirely and focused that dev time & resources on what that game is actually good for / at... the multiplayer.

The overwhelming majority of people who buy Mass Effect don't buy it because they want a cutting edge top of the line shooter game... they want to play a fun sci-fi RPG with a cool story and great characters to interact with... so why laden the game's development with an unnecessary multiplayer component? It makes no sense.

[Autoclave]

You can have multiplayer in a special edition of Mass Effect. But ME3 should focus on single.

As for not removing planet scanning, I will just use again the gib editor for minerals.

[Bogsnot1]

aang001 wrote...

Multiplayer is an option that should exist. You dont have to use it. But most the rest of my complaints are mainly on the quality and lack of everything!

ME1 and ME2 were both succesful without any form of multiplayer included. Any argument you bring to the table as to why it should exist are null and void.
All your talk of "other shooter rpgs" are also void, as you only have to look at the quality of RP on those multiplayer servers to know that they are no longer RPG's, just shooters with immature players who swear and lack the ability to spell in the midst of their nerdrage.

[termokanden]

aang001 wrote...

Multiplayer is an option that should exist. You dont have to use it. But most the rest of my complaints are mainly on the quality and lack of everything!

Some of us just think they should focus on the singleplayer experience and leave multiplayer for other games. Once you're talking multiplayer, there are some things you can't do and in general the whole class balance needs to be different.

I realize some games give you some half-baked multiplayer just to say they have multiplayer. That's not what I want for Mass Effect 3. Either proper multiplayer or no multiplayer. And there are plenty of games that focus on multiplayer already. We need ME3 to have the best possible singleplayer experience.

[Deltateam Elcor]

Developing a game costs money, dividing the team and hiring new people (because bioware is focusing all their MP talent on their MMO currently) costs even more money, leaving less time for developing on both accounts.

Its simple management.

[Blarty]

I agree that Multiplayer in the Mass Effect universe should exist, but it should not be in ME3..... there are many existing examples of games that added multiplayer, that in the main detracted from the single player experience, rather than enhanced the package as a whole (Bioshock 2, looking at you).... there are of course a couple of exceptions, Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood is a notable exception to this in part due to it's more unique take on the multiplayer genre.

But in ME3.....no, no, no..... and in any case if they did add multiplayer, every person who whines about the outcome of ME3 will directly attribute it to the time devs set aside to write multiplayer irrespective of whether it was a completely separate team, or if the multiplayer is the best MP in any game up to date. Uncharted 2 managed to add it, but with a game with as many fans, outcomes, characters and plotlines (and dare I say it, 'variables!') as ME3, they wouldn't be able to pull it off adequately in the timeframe they've got AND still placate all the single player fans.

Adding multiplayer to Mass Effect 3 would be like throwing petrol in a room with 20 dissatisfied ME3 owners each of them ready with a hand grenade looking for any excuse to pull the pin

Modifié par Blarty, 16 mai 2011 - 01:15 .

[Darth Death]

As far as gamplay goes I'm not worried, everything else I'm slightly curious. I'm finding it rather hard to believe every question that hasn't been addressed thus far will be answered in ME3. Worries? Irrelevant. The game will proceed in accordance.

[TOBY FLENDERSON]

My biggest fear is the retconing of past facts to better suit EA's advertising machine, oh woops it already been done:

http://xbox360.ign.c.../1168458p1.html

Seriously Bioware your pulling the same corner cutting cop out as DA2? Haven't we had 2 games already that say Sheppard is straight? (Last one is retorical and is a yes). You delay the game to make it better but only make it more of a cliche. Make me wonder who the romances woudl be with given there is only one bisexual squadmate, jack, and the Asari who are mono gendered.

[DeadLetterBox]

To address the OP argument:

I don’t think laziness is the issue. Problems can creep in for all kinds of reasons, and often what one person sees as a problem another does not. I don’t think ME2 cut a lot of corners, though I do see an argument that their style choices for the game weren’t perfect.

I agree that I would like to see turian women, but there are good reasons not to see krogan women. In a race that is dying through lack of reproduction it makes sense that you wouldn’t see any. Of course, Inamorda could have been a woman. We don’t know how different krogan women are from krogan men.

As far as co-op or multiplayer… I would love to see a Mass Effect co-op, but not in one of the Shepard games. It doesn’t make any sense at this point. We’ve spent all this time developing Shepard, and suddenly Joe Smith comes in and is our best bud? No, that needs to be in from the start. I never play multiplayer, so this isn’t all that important to me.

While you can’t just travel to a planet and look around, you can go to other planets and find stuff to do. It frequently does involve planet scanning, but I am sure you can find a list somewhere of the planets that have missions on them. Some of those missions are very entertaining.

I have major issues with DA2 myself, but that’s a different dev team so I’m not stressing it.

There are a lot fewer glitches and bugs in ME2 than I saw in ME1.

No multiplayer in a shooter makes perfect sense when you want that game to focus on one character. I don’t think all the RPG has been taken out of the game. I’m glad to hear some stuff is going back in, but my biggest thing with RPG is story, and this story needs a lot of dialog. Comparing Mass Effect to JRPGs is apples and oranges. They’re different sorts of games. I’ve never played a JRPG where the story changed based on my decisions.

You can take exception to what BioWare does, and to the decisions they’ve made, but saying they are lazy and don’t want to do anything that takes effort is ignorant. Mass Effect 2 was a game that had obvious care and energy put into it.

[lazuli]

TOBY FLENDERSON wrote...

My biggest fear is the retconing of past facts to better suit EA's advertising machine, oh woops it already been done:

http://xbox360.ign.c.../1168458p1.html

Seriously Bioware your pulling the same corner cutting cop out as DA2? Haven't we had 2 games already that say Sheppard is straight? (Last one is retorical and is a yes). You delay the game to make it better but only make it more of a cliche. Make me wonder who the romances woudl be with given there is only one bisexual squadmate, jack, and the Asari who are mono gendered.

Same-sex romances were not what ruined DA2.  Also, there have been same-sex romances in both ME1 and ME2.  They're finally expanding that beyond female same-sex relationships, doing their part to chip away at the double standard that "lesbians = hot" while "gay men = gross."  Additionally, Asari are an all female species.  Let's not go down that road right now.  And if you reject that, then there's still Kelly to consider.

I don't think anyone's asking for sloppy, handwaving retcons to fit returning squadmates into the new romances.  With careful writing, some of these "retcons" could be believable.

[Blarty]

Half of the issues with DA2 stem from it being called '2' which in terms of defining a 'sequel', carried a lot of expectations that weren't delivered on. Though I have some issues with DA2 I've played far, far worse games, and overall I don't dislike the game

[mineralica]

Glitches what glitches? Compared with ME1 (stuck!) or anything Bethesda made, ME2 (at least PC version) is almost ideal.
Tali's face - either surprise for ME3 (not every fan gets everything at his first wish) or just another field for imagination - haven't you even felt disappointed by visualisation of favourite character from a book?
Balance - yes, abilities got rebalanced everythere. I was also shocked to see some changes but get used to it rather soon.
Female turians/salarians/krogan - I'd gladly trade all of them for extra lines for Garrus/Mordin/Wrex etc.
For now I like news about ME3. But again, everything may change

[DeadLetterBox]

TOBY FLENDERSON wrote...

My biggest fear is the retconing of past facts to better suit EA's advertising machine, oh woops it already been done:

http://xbox360.ign.c.../1168458p1.html

Seriously Bioware your pulling the same corner cutting cop out as DA2? Haven't we had 2 games already that say Sheppard is straight? (Last one is retorical and is a yes). You delay the game to make it better but only make it more of a cliche. Make me wonder who the romances woudl be with given there is only one bisexual squadmate, jack, and the Asari who are mono gendered.

The game never said that Shepard was straight.  The writers bandied that notion about, but it was never clarified in the game one way or the other.  The game never specifically said anyone was straight.  Just because you've talked to someone a couple of times doesn't mean they'll have shared their preferences with you.

[nicethugbert]

Just because it costs money to make a game MP does not mean it is not worth it. Investments are not free. So, stop the bull**** already.

I just bought Dead Space 2 this week because it's similar to ME2 plus it has MP. I can only play ME2 so many times while waiting for ME3 to come out. A lot of these games are similar but I'm not going to buy all of them. I'll buy the one that I consider the best investment. For me, that entails MP because it has more replay value than SP.

Also, I bought ME last night and at least ME2 has AI.  Stupid ME1 squad needs me to tell them to take cover.  I'm baby sitting corpses.

Modifié par nicethugbert, 16 mai 2011 - 02:02 .

[Nohvarr]

nicethugbert wrote...

I just bought Dead Space 2 this week because it's similar to ME2 plus it has MP.

I've played Dead Space 2, and I like the game but...

a 10-12 hour linear adventure game has the same requirements as a 30 hour rpg with mutiple choices and interactive dialogue?

Next you'll be telling me that Fable 3 is as good as the Witcher 2....

[nicethugbert]

Nohvarr wrote...

nicethugbert wrote...

I just bought Dead Space 2 this week because it's similar to ME2 plus it has MP.

I've played Dead Space 2, and I like the game but...

a 10-12 hour linear adventure game has the same requirements as a 30 hour rpg with mutiple choices and interactive dialogue?

Next you'll be telling me that Fable 3 is as good as the Witcher 2....

I don't know what you mean by requirements here.  MP extends replayability for me and I doubt it takes as much time to develope as it does to develope that extra 15 hours of SP content.  And, considering that SPers think 30 hours of content is a rip off, the cost of MP is negligible.

[Nohvarr]

nicethugbert wrote...

I don't know what you mean by requirements here. 

Voice Actors: Which ME 2 has a lot of

Level design: More varied places to go in ME 2 than Deadspace 2

Plot: Which ME 2 has more of than Deadspace 2, plus character, and the players ability to affect the plot.

Character design: Take all the character you see in Dead Space 2, now compare that to the variety of aliens (hostile and non-hostie), humans (hostile and Non-hostile) and squad members. available in ME 2

The implementation of new gameplay: Dead Space 2 just tweaked the first games combat, ME 2 gave it a significant overhaul. Weapons were changed, given varying firing charateristics, the old rpg systems was replaced and  the graphics were upgraded.

MP extends replayability for me and I doubt it takes as much time to develope as it does to develope that extra 15 hours of SP content. 

That's time taken away from the single player expierence, if it's done right. Let's compare Neverwinter nights (another bioware game) to Knights of the Old Republic. NWN wasn't bad, but it focused a lot more on MP from the beginning and it shows when you compare the games plot, characters and storyline to KOTOR.

 And, considering that SPers think 30 hours of content is a rip off, the cost of MP is negligible.

So SPers would be happy with an even worse single player expierence as long as the multiplayer is fun? Please enlighten me.

[Bearcut]

All I have to say to the OP and others like him is this...

Seriously? I've your getting an ulcer over ME3 maybe you should join the entertainment industry, because you obviously have more than a vested interest in gaming.

Relax guy! Jeez, we haven't even been shown the game yet. If E3 comes out and it looks horrible horrible, then start to worry. Even then, itll be several months before completion. They will be working until at least November if they plan to release it in the first quarter of next year.

[Obro]

TOBY FLENDERSON wrote...


http://xbox360.ign.c.../1168458p1.html

Oh boy Garus should watch his back. Someone in the writers departement (I am looking at you hamburger) could make Shepard hungry.

[Someone With Mass]

I stopped reading at "multiplayer"

And for the love of God, stop comparing DA2 to ME3. The only thing they have in common is that they're developed by BioWare.

They don't have the same development team, they don't have the same development time, they have different in-game systems, they don't have the same settings, etc etc.