650 réponses à ce sujet

[Tommy6860]

DuskWarden wrote...

I find that rather sad. Especially as the protaganist for Skyrim is going to be voiced. I can live with that, but if Fallout 4 has a voiced protaganist...

I know what you mean about waves, but lets try not to get onto that eh?

And yes, I do agree with you about Mass Effect being the point Bioware started to change the games they created. More specifically, I think something happened after the release of ME. Origins was pretty far ahead by this point, so it was pretty much undamaged, but from ME2 and DA:2, I think we can see the direction they were moving in. Hopefully the reaction to DA;2 has slowed them down a bit, but in general, I think that traditional crpgs are fairly dead. And the world in TW didn't exactly appeal to me, I found it a bit, meh.

The rpg series I still follow are basically DA, Fallout and TES. So I've only got this burst of NV dlc to look forward to

From what I understand from a development timeline, both ME and DA:O got underway about the same time. After KOTOR, this is when it started. If you look at KOTOR, that was (correct me if I am wrong anyone) the first game where Bioware used an SP, but showed the PC's face during convos.

I don't know, we will have to see wheere this goes in the future. Maybe they can improve the experience overall for everyone. But, I see many people here state how much they like the VO and seeing the expressions and how that works for them. No matter how much I may not like it, I havbe to keep in mind I am not the only gamer in the world and I repsect that they get the experiences that they do. Kind of like saying the "glass is half empty, or the glass is half full" thing.

[Brockololly]

In playing The Witcher 2, one thing I've noticed with the paraphrases there is that often times, you have the paraphrase and then the full line spoken by Geralt, but the nice thing is that often the paraphrase is actually word for word embedded in the full text.

Its a little thing and its not every line, but when its happened, I like it.

[Dave of Canada]

Brockololly wrote...

In playing The Witcher 2, one thing I've noticed with the paraphrases there is that often times, you have the paraphrase and then the full line spoken by Geralt, but the nice thing is that often the paraphrase is actually word for word embedded in the full text.

I didn't noticed this, I'd pick something simple and then Geralt would start cussing or yelling at somebody.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Brockololly wrote...

In playing The Witcher 2, one thing I've noticed with the paraphrases there is that often times, you have the paraphrase and then the full line spoken by Geralt, but the nice thing is that often the paraphrase is actually word for word embedded in the full text.

Its a little thing and its not every line, but when its happened, I like it.

Yea many paraphrases are actually sentences and Geralt only modifies a few words.

[Giggles_Manically]

At least its not as bad as ME2.

Experimenting on Humans is wrong = Crap like this makes Cerberus look RIGHT!

What the flying sideways fook!

[AngryFrozenWater]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

In playing The Witcher 2, one thing I've noticed with the paraphrases there is that often times, you have the paraphrase and then the full line spoken by Geralt, but the nice thing is that often the paraphrase is actually word for word embedded in the full text.

I didn't noticed this, I'd pick something simple and then Geralt would start cussing or yelling at somebody.

That's not surprising. BW didn't create that game. If they did you would have loved the cussing and yelling.

[Dave of Canada]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

That's not surprising. BW didn't create that game. If they did you would have loved the cussing and yelling.

Cute.

[In Exile]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
True, but that would be better than having the tone provided by the game as a sort of surprise for the player, so he never knows what tone he's going to get.

I think we agree on that.  We don't want the tone of the line to be a mystery to the player when he selects it.  We only disagree about when that happens.

Absolutely. For example, with the tone system in DA2 now in mind, ME2 becomes incredibly difficult to choose dialogue for because of the clunky paraphrase.

I maintain that the paraphrase should contain most of what the spoken line will, with the only difference being that the spoken should elaborate.

DuskWarden wrote...

I find that rather sad. Especially as
the protaganist for Skyrim is going to be voiced. I can live with that,
but if Fallout 4 has a voiced protaganist...

Wait, what?

That changes things a lot. It may make Skyrim go from unplayable to playable for me. Do you have a link?

[In Exile]

Brockololly wrote...

In playing The Witcher 2, one thing I've noticed with the paraphrases there is that often times, you have the paraphrase and then the full line spoken by Geralt, but the nice thing is that often the paraphrase is actually word for word embedded in the full text.

Its a little thing and its not every line, but when its happened, I like it.

Indeed. Bioware is explicitly against this, but I think they are very wrong. This system is superior.

[upsettingshorts]

I don't care what paraphrase system is being used or what company made the game, but if "Very Funny." leads to "**** you..." in the very first line of dialogue in any game I'm going to be among the first in line pointing it out as a failure to convey the substance of the following line.

That said, I don't really care as long as the same sentiment follows the paraphrase. And I do think that the BioWare house rules about not using the same words as in the following line ought to be abandoned. The "do the paraphrases in isolation from the context" idea - not sure if that was Sylvius or Exile's - is one I'd endorse, too.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 30 mai 2011 - 09:41 .

[John Epler]

Alistairlover94 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

That's not surprising. BW didn't create that game. If they did you would have loved the cussing and yelling.

Cute.

This is gonna be good. *gets some popcorn and soda*

Let me put the kibosh on this right now before it goes any further.

Respect and civility. This includes avoiding the temptation to take potshots at other posters because you happen to disagree with them.

[Brockololly]

In Exile wrote...

DuskWarden wrote...

I find that rather sad. Especially as  the protaganist for Skyrim is going to be voiced. I can live with that,  but if Fallout 4 has a voiced protaganist...

Wait, what?

That changes things a lot. It may make Skyrim go from unplayable to playable for me. Do you have a link?

I haven't heard that....I know there is the Dragon shout system, but I haven't heard anything of the actual full dialogue for the PC being voiced.

[Xewaka]

In Exile wrote...

Brockololly wrote...
In playing The Witcher 2, one thing I've noticed with the paraphrases there is that often times, you have the paraphrase and then the full line spoken by Geralt, but the nice thing is that often the paraphrase is actually word for word embedded in the full text.
Its a little thing and its not every line, but when its happened, I like it.

Indeed. Bioware is explicitly against this, but I think they are very wrong. This system is superior.

It is still inferior to actually showing the line, however.

[Dave of Canada]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I don't care what paraphrase system is being used or what company made the game, but if "Very Funny." leads to "**** you..." in the very first line of dialogue in any game I'm going to be among the first in line pointing it out as a failure to convey the substance of the following line.

That's one of the examples where I sat there going "wut", there's quite a few others I've experienced which were equally jarring.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I don't care what paraphrase system is being used or what company made the game, but if "Very Funny." leads to "**** you..." in the very first line of dialogue in any game I'm going to be among the first in line pointing it out as a failure to convey the substance of the following line.

I don't know if that's the scene you're talking about, but in what I have in mind, Geralt was clearly joking with Dandelion and was mocking him, which they do to each other often. It was not an insulting FU but a friendly one.

[TEWR]

Jumping in here because I'm bored. Not sure how TW2 acts in regards to paraphrasing (game lags horribly on my PC so I haven't even begun a playthrough. may need to wait for a console version), but it should be something like this. Bear in mind this is my personal opinion.


You pick "I'm a mage too"

PC says "I'm a mage too you know, and so are some of my friends."


It shouldn't be a paraphrase. It should be a snippet of text that is in the sentence, be it in the beginning, middle, or end.

[In Exile]

Xewaka wrote...
It is still inferior to actually showing the line, however.

Like I said: you can not buy into the idea that there is a trade-off between repetition and clarity, making the whole attempt moot. But if you take that issue seriously, then the full line is greatly inferior, to the poin that it actively harms enjoyment.

Upsettingshorts wrote...
That said, I don't really care
as long as the same sentiment follows the paraphrase. And I do
think that the BioWare house rules about not using the same words as in
the following line ought to be abandoned. The "do the paraphrases in
isolation from the context" idea - not sure if that was Sylvius or
Exile's - is one I'd endorse, too.

I think that was Sylvius or Waka.

[In Exile]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I don't know if that's the scene you're talking about, but in what I have in mind, Geralt was clearly joking with Dandelion and was mocking him, which they do to each other often. It was not an insulting FU but a friendly one.

It's with Roche at the start of the game, and it didn't look like Geralt was kidding.

[Dave of Canada]

Alistairlover94 wrote...

I pick "Hey! I'm a mage!" She goes "I have friends who are mages". I sat there going wut?

At least you didn't pick a line which resulted in Geralt dying in a cutscene giving me a game over forcing me to pick the other option because trying to be intimidating resulted in Geralt trying to attack people.

"wut" was how I'd describe it.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 30 mai 2011 - 10:03 .

[upsettingshorts]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I don't know if that's the scene you're talking about, but in what I have in mind, Geralt was clearly joking with Dandelion and was mocking him, which they do to each other often. It was not an insulting FU but a friendly one.

It was Roche, and it was the very first line Gerald speaks during the interrogation in the prologue.  As a player at that point, I had zero knowledge of any relationship between him and Geralt.  He was "dude who broght me to interrogation then offered protagonist a handshake while he was cuffed."

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 30 mai 2011 - 10:02 .

[tmp7704]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I don't care what paraphrase system is being used or what company made the game, but if "Very Funny." leads to "**** you..." in the very first line of dialogue in any game I'm going to be among the first in line pointing it out as a failure to convey the substance of the following line.

That sounds like translation issue. In the native version of TW2 the "paraphrase" for that choice is literally "**** you"* and that's exactly what Geralt says if you choose it.

*) well, technically it's "go **** yourself" but, well.

Modifié par tmp7704, 30 mai 2011 - 10:06 .

[In Exile]

tmp7704 wrote...
That sounds like translation issue. In the native version of TW2 the "paraphrase" for that choice is literally "**** you" and that's exactly what Geralt says if you choose it.

I can appreciate that something is lost in translation when you go from one language to another. But how does insulting someone change to "Very funny?"