791 réponses à ce sujet

[Phaedon]

 A really short thread guys, but I felt the need to do this.

Christina Norman tweeted this, a few hours ago:
"We are continuing to use thermal clips in me3, there will be other changes to weapons but no me1-style regenerating ammo"

So...yeah. No regenerating ammo, at least not the kind that ME1 had.

I have to say that the concept in ME1 was interesting, since it introduced a new burst-fired centered and ammo management approach, but the execution was not that good.

Saying that the ME2 system is terrible is a bit silly if you ask me. 95% of all shooters use that system, so I suppose that you find them all terrible. Sorry, I can't help but frown at such extreme arguments.

Anyway, I suppose it sounds a bit hypocritical to say that I respect this decision, while I often supported innovation in the past (and present). But hear me out;

Bioware has promised for a lot more diversity when it comes to weapons. There even appears to be a laser rifle as well as a pulse rifle. Now, if they go with the traditional approach, as they hint, the player's focus will naturally shift, in my opinion, from ammo management to other properties of the weapon. Such as, rate of fire, unique properties (particle beam etc.), the special effect that it has on types of enemies, etc.

I think that that is a very interesting approach, and while I will not support it until I learn more about it, I certainly respect it.

Just my 0.02 €

[Obro]

I wish they just called them ammo because they ARE ammo.

[95Headhunter]

While I have no problem with them sticking with thermal clips, I am a little disappointed that they're not at least tweaking the system (at least, that comment doesn't suggest they are).

The current system is still broken. This has been discussed endless times, so I'm just going to say I'm mostly fine with the clip system as a combat mechanic. BUT...

Either these clips are universal or they're not. Either each pick up should contribute to a total ammo pool - which all weapons draw from, or each weapon should have clearly defined separate ammo. The system as is doesn't make any sense.

[Starman01]

Hm, I don't mind the use of the clips. In a battle, I found it more convinient than having my weapon overheating in the stupiest moments. Not sure I understand the idea behind the clip ( i don't bother), I just see them as ammo. At least, it add something to the gameplay because I have to take care that my weapons are ready to shoot, and I'm sometimes forced to switch to a new weapon. Only thing that pained me a bit, was the limited ammo storage at all. Some more ways to enhance the ammo that can be carried would be nice (either due to research or armor addons)

[Banzboy]

95Headhunter wrote...

While I have no problem with them sticking with thermal clips, I am a little disappointed that they're not at least tweaking the system (at least, that comment doesn't suggest they are).

The current system is still broken. This has been discussed endless times, so I'm just going to say I'm mostly fine with the clip system as a combat mechanic. BUT...

Either these clips are universal or they're not. Either each pick up should contribute to a total ammo pool - which all weapons draw from, or each weapon should have clearly defined separate ammo. The system as is doesn't make any sense.

This. Sometimes i want to use my shotgun but i have no idea when i'll get ammo for it. It seems completely random.

[Phaedon]

95Headhunter wrote...

While I have no problem with them sticking with thermal clips, I am a little disappointed that they're not at least tweaking the system (at least, that comment doesn't suggest they are).

The current system is still broken. This has been discussed endless times, so I'm just going to say I'm mostly fine with the clip system as a combat mechanic. BUT...

Either these clips are universal or they're not. Either each pick up should contribute to a total ammo pool - which all weapons draw from, or each weapon should have clearly defined separate ammo. The system as is doesn't make any sense.

How exactly is it broken?

95% of the shooters right there have it, and in my 4 playthroughs I have only been completely out of ammo twice.

[Vengeful Nature]

Hmmm... I'm OK with this. I'd much rather have this system than ME1's.

However, why not a hybid system? You still build up heat, which cools off, but you can use a thermal clip when you don't want to wait? Weapon mods can affect the the heat buildup/dissipation or damage, so you can strike a balance between rounds going downrange or the punch of those rounds, or just go full damage/low heat tolerance or ME1-style lower damage/heat dissipation. That way, the people who like the ME1 system can have their way as well as people who like the ME2 system.

Regardless, this is alright in my book. I don't mind this.

[lolwut666]

Infinite ammo was a bad idea from the start, IMO.

I'm glad they're sticking to ME2's ammo system.

[ME_Fan]

I agree with op. Hated the cooldown system ME1 had. Playing insanity on Mass Effect 2 was made more challenging by the need to find ammo, rather than only needing to wait a few seconds for cooldown. I liked the challenge.

[Someone With Mass]

ME2's system is good.

Never saw the appeal of unlimited ammo, anyway. It's boring. I mean, what's so fun with shooting a guy with Sledgehammer rounds, and then stand over his body and just fire until he's dead with little to no resistance?

[GnusmasTHX]

Phaedon wrote...

95Headhunter wrote...

While I have no problem with them sticking with thermal clips, I am a little disappointed that they're not at least tweaking the system (at least, that comment doesn't suggest they are).

The current system is still broken. This has been discussed endless times, so I'm just going to say I'm mostly fine with the clip system as a combat mechanic. BUT...

Either these clips are universal or they're not. Either each pick up should contribute to a total ammo pool - which all weapons draw from, or each weapon should have clearly defined separate ammo. The system as is doesn't make any sense.

How exactly is it broken?

95% of the shooters right there have it, and in my 4 playthroughs I have only been completely out of ammo twice.

They're not broken gameplay-wise, they just don't make sense. I prefer gameplay over trivial things such as ammo, so I don't mind. And goddamn in-general, ME1's combat was a snoozefest where you just ran around with a paperweight duct taped to your Mouse 1. The "reloading" was a welcome change, even if it is an appropriately old shooter convention.

[Mykel54]

This is the worst possible news i´ve heard, i hope ME3 is at least as moddable as ME2:crying:

[Someone With Mass]

Phaedon wrote...
How exactly is it broken?

95% of the shooters right there have it, and in my 4 playthroughs I have only been completely out of ammo twice.

I guess people have never heard of the concept of conserving ammunition.

If you're a class like Sentinel, Adept, Vanguard, Infiltrator or Engineer, It doesn't really matter if you run out of ammo, because you have powers to fall back on in case that happens.

And if you run completely out of ammo as a Soldier, you're doing something wrong.

[Reever]

This whole weapon system problem really isn´t an issue for me! I fared pretty well in both games, although I haven´t tried it out on in an ME2 insanity playthrough.

As long as it doesn´t get worse than it is now, I´m good =)

[Geth_Prime]

I guess it's OK (still prefer ME1's system though). I don't like the idea of ammo magically disappearing when you walk over it. Plus, clip scavenging isn't fun, and there was a lot of it in ME2. I hope they'll tweak the system in ME3 so that it makes more sense.

[Nikkeli]

Doesn't matter I'll just mod it like I did with ME2, unless you can't... that'd be a shame.

[mopotter]

Since the story is what I'm playing for more than anything else, how I get the ammo to kill the bad guys isn't that big of a deal for me.
Overheating didn't bother me I just switched weapons. I do feel silly running around in circles picking up the bright and shinny ammo laying around, but I can live with it and it's easier then having to find ammo boxes or actually buying the ammo from shops, like I do in Fall Out.

[Murmillos]

0) It's not that it's a problem in modern day shooters, because we all know modern day shooters operate just like modern weapons. We know todays weapons shoots bullets that you can only fire from "ammo".

1) But in ME1, they got rid of then need for bullets/ammo - so when they said, here you go, you now need bullets to fire your weapons - then that was the problem.

2) Yes, ME1 system was broken were they allowed you to create the no heat generation weapon (which was stupid as you are doing minimal damage to be able to do so... you must like playing ME2 with ONLY the starting weapons too)

3) THE FIX would have to tie together upgrades and cooling, so that non would over take the other, each "cooling" upgrade thus increase the damage equally so that heat/cooling is a constant value the entire game.
3a) [MY 'idea'], 99% heat to 0% heat = 2.5 seconds wait. "Over heat" is 4 seconds wait to 0% OR you may use a limited cooling sink that completes to 0% cooling in 1 second on activation.


(of course.. I would like to know if they ever thought of this method, implemented a test build and tested it as such.)

Modifié par Murmillos, 21 mai 2011 - 01:21 .

[Dave666]

Well thats crap. Why don't they just call it Generic Shooter Ammo and just be done with it? Would it really be that hard to create a single mod for guns that gives ME:1 style regenerative ammo? Some of us preferred that. Oh well I guess that just means that I'll end up replaying ME:1 way more than I do ME:2 so no change there really.

[Kandid001]

Meh, I was really looking forward to a hybrid system with clips and long cooldowns, but it's okay.

[SNascimento]

This is for gameplay purpose. You need to balance the weapons and make they work correctly, it is just obvious that this couldn't be done with ME cooling system. This is a decision based on gameplay, and then they look for a explanation on the ME universe to further justify it.
.
And that is totally ok, because, after all, ME1 and 2 are games. I feel that complaning about this is the same as complaning why in a movie the bad guys always miss their shots. (Stormtrooper Effect)

[Wulfram]

SNascimento wrote...

This is for gameplay purpose. You need to balance the weapons and make they work correctly, it is just obvious that this couldn't be done with ME cooling system.

Why is that obvious? 

It's not like the current system has a significant effect on the balance - ammo is only a concern if you're playing pretty poorly anyway.

[dreman9999]

Murmillos wrote...

0) It's not that it's a problem in modern day shooters, because we all know modern day shooters operate just like modern weapons. We know todays weapons shoots bullets that you can only fire from "ammo".

1) But in ME1, they got rid of then need for bullets/ammo - so when they said, here you go, you now need bullets to fire your weapons - then that was the problem.

2) Yes, ME1 system was broken were they allowed you to create the no heat generation weapon (which was stupid as you are doing minimal damage to be able to do so... you must like playing ME2 with ONLY the starting weapons too)

3) THE FIX would have to tie together upgrades and cooling, so that non would over take the other, each "cooling" upgrade thus increase the damage equally so that heat/cooling is a constant value the entire game.
3a) [MY 'idea'], 99% heat to 0% heat = 2.5 seconds wait. "Over heat" is 4 seconds wait to 0% OR you may use a limited cooling sink that completes to 0% cooling in 1 second on activation.


(of course.. I would like to know if they ever thought of this method, implemented a test build and tested it as such.)

If you want a plot reson for the change, think of it this way. ME2 weopons have more damage than ME1, this means that the concosion force.....Meaning more heat is generated when firing ME2 weopons. With the weopon they had a limit on this because the gun would be useless if it's too hot to fire bullets due to not being able to ejecting the heat sink.....
The only thing that dosen't make sense is the whole power cell being used for regular gun ammo.

[Someone With Mass]

As long as my gun can fire when I want it to, I don't give a crap about what it has to do in order to do it.