108 réponses à ce sujet

[lolwut666]

I'm not.

But keep trying to drag everybody down to your level if that makes you feel more adequate.

[Volus Warlord]

This is just not going anywhere. What a shock.

[Blacklash93]

lolwut666 wrote...

I'm not.

But keep trying to drag everybody down to your level if that makes you feel more adequate.

If I'm dragging you down anywhere, it's back down to Earth.

Don't pretend your view on the issue is any better than mine or anyone else's. Unless you can prove yourself to be infallibly unbiased, don't discredit me for my stance with such a desperate allegation.

*sigh* This won't go anywhere. Let's just agree to disagree.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 26 mai 2011 - 10:55 .

[DxWill10]

I'm still having trouble understanding why some people are so against s/s romances. We have it confirmed for ME3, and evidence suggesting characters won't all be re-written to bisexual. So I guess I just don't understand the down side of it. If you don't want a s/s romance, don't pursue it; those who do will pursue it. problem solved? right? what am I missing? What is the negative of this situation? HELP ME SEE

[Destroy Raiden_]

SalsaDMA wrote...

The
way it seems now, we have a veritable mob of vocalists that are quick
to scream bloody murder if they don't get appeased every time. It's the
old 'give them a finger and they demand the whole arm' thing all over
again.

Bioware have with their kneefall for the vocalists just
shown that in the future they will be unable to create a game without
pandering to this very vocal minority. They had made several games that
should have been proof of the subject not being beyond them, but because
this single franchise didn't include it, the vocalists kept screaming
murder and claimed perceived insults. With the resignation, Bioware have
just shown them that their behaviour towards them as a company is
appearantly acceptable, and if they should happen to create a game in
the future that doesn't include pandering of these vocalists, then they
are free to rip them a new one verbally untill Bioware give in again.

After all, that's exactly what they showed with their move in regards to the ME franchise. [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/angry.png[/smilie]

This.

[Reapinger]

The whole homosexual romance thing was such a debacle in every way. If they wanted it in their game, it wouldn't have taken hundreds or thousands of people demanding it be it the game or they would all rage-quit BioWare products and such. Empty threats. Its one thing to suggest it, but another thing entirely to demand it and be offended that not everybody is accepting. Just my 2 cents.

[Blacklash93]

SalsaDMA wrote...

The
way it seems now, we have a veritable mob of vocalists that are quick
to scream bloody murder if they don't get appeased every time. It's the
old 'give them a finger and they demand the whole arm' thing all over
again.

Bioware have with their kneefall for the vocalists just
shown that in the future they will be unable to create a game without
pandering to this very vocal minority. They had made several games that
should have been proof of the subject not being beyond them, but because
this single franchise didn't include it, the vocalists kept screaming
murder and claimed perceived insults. With the resignation, Bioware have
just shown them that their behaviour towards them as a company is
appearantly acceptable, and if they should happen to create a game in
the future that doesn't include pandering of these vocalists, then they
are free to rip them a new one verbally untill Bioware give in again.

After all, that's exactly what they showed with their move in regards to the ME franchise. ../../../images/forum/emoticons/angry.png

Except Bioware could have easily ignored the gay community and have been none the worse for it. They're not including it because a vocal minority made them feel like they have to. They're doing it because they think enough people are demanding it.

Very few people in the FftL thread cried foul for Bioware not including s/s options in itself. It was the double standard with femShep and the "pre-defined" argument that set the fires of spite. Bioware set themselves up to be called out on that. Perhaps you weren't there, but when it was said there were no new LI's, the folks in the FftL thread were perfectly willing to accept they weren't going to get their way. All they were concerned with at that point was making amends with Bioware.

You're content with branding them all as a lot of whiny brats, but I'm not. They never demanded such content. In fact they all agreed there's is no such thing as entitlement to content once. It was a campaign of suggestions and criticism over perfectly valid points and nothing more. 

Currently, all most of them have done is defend an argument whenever they have to. Apparently people like to mistake that as being overly sensitive and arrogant.

Why you even care about content that has nothing to do with you is beyond me.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 27 mai 2011 - 03:01 .

[AngelicMachinery]

Does anyone else think it's Lulzworthy how a small minority of players of calling out those who wanted gay content for throwing a **** fit when they're doing the exact same thing?

[Reapinger]

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Does anyone else think it's Lulzworthy how a small minority of players of calling out those who wanted gay content for throwing a **** fit when they're doing the exact same thing?

I think it's Lulzworthy that you have a Jack pic and are acting just like a ****. I want BioWare to make a game the way that has served them perfectly so far. Cry about it. 

[AngelicMachinery]

Reapinger wrote...

AngelicMachinery wrote...

Does anyone else think it's Lulzworthy how a small minority of players of calling out those who wanted gay content for throwing a **** fit when they're doing the exact same thing?

I think it's Lulzworthy that you have a Jack pic and are acting just like a ****. I want BioWare to make a game the way that has served them perfectly so far. Cry about it. 

Well,  she is my favorite squad mate for a reason . 

Also,  you seem a tad disgruntle.

[lolwut666]

Blacklash93 wrote...

lolwut666 wrote...

I'm not.

But keep trying to drag everybody down to your level if that makes you feel more adequate.

If I'm dragging you down anywhere, it's back down to Earth.

Don't pretend your view on the issue is any better than mine or anyone else's. Unless you can prove yourself to be infallibly unbiased, don't discredit me for my stance with such a desperate allegation.

*sigh* This won't go anywhere. Let's just agree to disagree.

****...

Once you consider bias to be a reasonable stance, that means it's all over to you.

That's akin to being proud to be a fanboy.

That's, like, end of the line.

Rock bottom.

Game over, man! Game over!

If BioWare was to include homosexual content, that should be out of their own initiative.

I think devs should only accept fan feedback when it comes to gameplay mechanics.

They should never let the fans write their own characters for them.

That just means they are turning what was once a project of passion into a comercial fluff.

[ElitePinecone]

Your point is moot, lolwut.

Be disgruntled if you must, but don't get upset just because a development team listened to suggestions. Not demands.

It's in the game. Deal with it.

[Nathan Redgrave]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

They need to balance ability sets between squadmates so that each squadmate has their own strengths and weaknesses without being exponentially more useful all-around than anyone else--not something ME has always succeeded at to begin with.

This wasn't the case for either ME1 or ME2, so why now?

It was the case, actually. That they didn't do a perfect job of it doesn't change that.

[Wittand25]

lolwut666 wrote...
Once you consider bias to be a reasonable stance, that means it's all over to you.

That's akin to being proud to be a fanboy.

That's, like, end of the line.

Rock bottom.

Game over, man! Game over!

If BioWare was to include homosexual content, that should be out of their own initiative.

I think devs should only accept fan feedback when it comes to gameplay mechanics.

They should never let the fans write their own characters for them.

That just means they are turning what was once a project of passion into a comercial fluff.

Why the it is OK to react to feedback on game-play elements and not OK to react to feedback on story elements?
Don´t you believe that a developer could be as passionate say about the mako or planet scanning as they are about Vega´s sexuality ?

[Nathan Redgrave]

lolwut666 wrote...
Once you consider bias to be a reasonable stance, that means it's all over to you.

That's akin to being proud to be a fanboy.

That's, like, end of the line.

Rock bottom.

Game over, man! Game over!

If BioWare was to include homosexual content, that should be out of their own initiative.

I think devs should only accept fan feedback when it comes to gameplay mechanics.

They should never let the fans write their own characters for them.

Accepting feedback is not "letting the fans write the characters." The story is as much for the fanbase as the gameplay is. They have as much reason to accept feedback on the story as they do on the gameplay.

So with all due respect (and you can read that the same way Ashley Williams would, if you like), you're wrong.

[lolwut666]

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

Accepting feedback is not "letting the fans write the characters." The story is as much for the fanbase as the gameplay is. They have as much reason to accept feedback on the story as they do on the gameplay.

So with all due respect (and you can read that the same way Ashley Williams would, if you like), you're wrong.

No. You're wrong because you're an idiot who thinks the world revolves around your navel.

It's about what you want, not what is best for the franchise or what makes sense within the characterization.

That goes for all of those who think like you do.

[Nathan Redgrave]

lolwut666 wrote...

No. You're wrong because you're an idiot who thinks the world revolves around your navel.

classy.

It's about what you want, not what is best for the franchise or what makes sense within the characterization.

That goes for all of those who think like you do.

Because you know so much more about what's "best" for the franchise or what makes "sense" within the characterization, right?

[GuardianAngel470]

lolwut666 wrote...

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

Accepting feedback is not "letting the fans write the characters." The story is as much for the fanbase as the gameplay is. They have as much reason to accept feedback on the story as they do on the gameplay.

So with all due respect (and you can read that the same way Ashley Williams would, if you like), you're wrong.

No. You're wrong because you're an idiot who thinks the world revolves around your navel.

It's about what you want, not what is best for the franchise or what makes sense within the characterization.

That goes for all of those who think like you do.

Wow. That is an impressively irrefutable argument lolwut. I have no logical way to counter such a strong argument. I congratulate you on your impressive display of communication skills and persuasive tactics.

For the record, I'm against prexisting characters being changed to fit a fan demand. However, I am witholding judgement on this topic until the game comes out and I've beaten it. They might totally butcher it or they might do really well, there's no way to tell at this point because the DA team is different than the ME team.

That said, Liara's romance does foreshadow a little bit but still, that's one writer among many, many writers.

[lolwut666]

Nathan Redgrave wrote...

Because you know so much more about what's "best" for the franchise or what makes "sense" within the characterization, right?

I know what's not: catering to a bunch of perverted yuri/yaoi fanboys. That's cheap and tasteless, and harms the series' credibility.

ME is BioWare's story. They should tell it like they want to. Great works of art throughout the ages were not created by the authors listening to the complains of the ignorante masses. That would make their work not theirs.

If they are to include gay content, that should be their decision, and in a way that complements the plot rather than gratuitous fanservice.

However, that's impossible now, because the demand is so heavy that I can only imagine the crap that is going to be the result.

Modifié par lolwut666, 27 mai 2011 - 09:00 .

[ElitePinecone]

" I can only imagine"

Perhaps when the reality is different to your imagination, you'll think differently. Have a bit of confidence in Bioware's ability.

By the way, we tend to not like being called 'perverted' . I'm sure you'll understand why. But then again, you aren't biased. Nope. Not at all.

[lolwut666]

ElitePinecone wrote...

By the way, we tend to not like being called 'perverted' . I'm sure you'll understand why. But then again, you aren't biased. Nope. Not at all.

You must have mistaken me for someone who gives a ****.

I'm not trying to be polite to the likes of you.

I don't like you. You're one the reasons I think lowly of the ME fandom.

[Ryzaki]

...The fail in this thread is strong.

[Nightwriter]

Homosexual players have gotten one serious same sex love interest throughout the course of the series. Heterosexual players have gotten four. Male homosexual players have gotten no love interests at all. If you ask me, they are not appeasing one group over another. They are simply making things equal, finally.

I think it's a relatively fair request, but I'm not really sure why it's necessary to attach a "you appeased them, now appease me" to it. Also, what is the use of a character being with you on a combat level if you can't talk to them and they never have anything to say? Not sure I'd enjoy that. Also also, I know the OP specifically says that logistics concerns are being totally disregarded here, but I think the reasonableness of a request depends entirely upon how difficult it is to implement. And I don't know how difficult it would be to give us the freedom to select any combination we like from a pool of -- what -- seventeen characters?

[Someone With Mass]

lolwut666 wrote...
If BioWare was to include homosexual content, that should be out of their own initiative.

I think devs should only accept fan feedback when it comes to gameplay mechanics.

They should never let the fans write their own characters for them.

That just means they are turning what was once a project of passion into a comercial fluff.

I agree with this.

It's ridiculous how many demands BioWare's getting.

"Do this, do that, that character should be like this."

It's their game. They can do whatever they want.

[ElitePinecone]

Someone With Mass wrote...
It's their game. They can do whatever they want.

Do you seriously think that Bioware bowed to the 'demands' of a few hundred forum posters? 

After saying virtually nothing about the topic for two games? After ignoring similar threads for the last four years? 

Nonsense. 

Bioware are an independent company with a tonne of money to worry about. They would not intentionally set out to put content in their games unless they had a very good reason. Certainly not because some people asked them to.

They're smart people. The PR and marketing departments know their numbers. They wouldn't be doing this unless they could see a commercial advantage in it. Developers - David Gaider in particular - have said often enough that they would never do same-sex romances just because it was "the right thing to do". It has to sell copies. 

Show me the proof that this was brought about by one forum topic and a few hundred posters - rather than the market opportunities of putting in S/S content, and the increased development time afforded by the delay in ME3's launch - and I'll agree with you entirely that this is appeasement. Until then, your point is moot. 

Yes, it is their game. Yes, they can do whatever they want. Yes. they've chosen to implement s/s romances in some respect. End of story. 

Edit: weird formatting fixed.

Modifié par ElitePinecone, 27 mai 2011 - 12:07 .