73 réponses à ce sujet

[Parah_Salin]

OK, unless they are doing a sidearm+however manny longarms your class can carry thing, the fact that all classes can use all weapons (which I think is good) kind of leaves pistols out in the cold. Now pistols aren't supposed to be GREAT, but I've liked the role they've had in ME where they don't TOTALLY suck, and can be used as a midrange primary weapon for classes w/o the assault rifle.

But where the pistol excels is mid/close range, right where the assault rifle excels. There won't really be any reasons for pistols in that case.

I think the solution would be to make it so you can enter aim mode without getting out of cover, and just making a one off snapshot when you hit fire. The real advantage of these weapons is that they're light and easy to handle, and I think this would be the best way to represent it. Also extra heavy weapon ammo/medgel capacity could be another option since you free up a good amount of space/weight switching from a longarm to a pistol.

[wizardryforever]

It's possible that there will be some badass pistol-only mods that can be gotten that make pistols viable and fun, ditto for SMGs.  But I think they'll just make the pistol a gimme weapon, and it doesn't count against the limit.  Remember that it is the only gun usable by all classes in the previous games.  It would be odd to throw that away now.

[marshalleck]

I've been wondering this myself. If anyone can take an assault rifle and shotgun along with them and be covered for close to medium-long range combat, why ever use a pistol or SMG? Perhaps they will retain their somewhat unique strengths against certain types of defenses? I dunno. Would be nice if we got to see a bit of this during E3.

[Harbinger of your Destiny]

It should be used like it is used in other games. As an emergency weapon for when the heat sinks in your assault rifle run out also as a headshot gun if the assault rifle you choose is like the revenant.

[aimlessgun]

Pistols are 'realistically' seen as a backup weapon, so I don't mind them being put in that role (despite loving the Better Than Every Other Weapon ME1 pistol).

SMG's in other games are balanced by giving them faster sight time, faster movement speed, better accuracy while moving. I don't know how many of these can be effectively translated to Mass Effect.

[Waltzingbear]

Firstly, it's very likely that pistol and SMGs will be transitioned into the same weapon category of 'Sidearms' in ME3.

Now, there could be several possibilities to handle this gap.

I've got to ask this first: is it confirmed that every class would be able to carry two 'full-size' weapons, so for example an Adept could carry both an Assault Rifle and a Shotgun? I think that the confirmation we got was about the weapons themselves not being class restricted.
I would be perfectly fine if my Adept could only carry one main weapon and one side-arm.

One option is to impair mobility if you do choose to carry two main guns or depending on what gun you're wielding (although I would hate if I would be slower when using a shotgun), which will mean that you'll perform acrobatic action slower as well as sprint.
Alternatively but on the same subject, using a side-arm could mean that your powers will be somewhat more efficient, and not necessarily by just a flat damage increase, which will be balanced around whether you prefer more fire power or more powerful abilities.

Another option is to simply buff sidearms from their current model, touching on whatever aspect that would make sense, be it more ammo, more damage (while being highly inaccurate) or whatever.
The buff doesn't have to, for example, put SMGs on a par with Assault Rifles, well at elast not entirely. What I mean by this is that SMG will be much stronger against shields than ARs but will be not quite as good in other functions, which will possibly make it favorable by Adepts. This is somewhat true in ME2 already, coupled with the fact that you can just spray it without ammo considerations (I like the Tempest a lot), but could be possibly taken even further in ME3, giving side arms a unique niche functionality.

Modifié par Waltzingbear, 26 mai 2011 - 04:55 .

[Kileyan]

Most common knowledge about guns goes out the window with mass effect fields/railgun type things we use in ME. Smaller guns are 'usually' less powerful, because they have smaller rounds and shorter barrels in which to achieve a fast moving bullet.

In ME, projectiles are reaching ludicrous speeds and the length of the barrels imho mean little past a certain point. Also I doubt the size of the rounds are hugely different, since each is only tiny grain of metal going really fast. That means the pistol and smg might pack just as much punch as a longer weapons. The larger sniper and assault rifles aren't really bigger to pack a bigger punch, they are just bigger because it is easier to accurately shoot a weapon that has a longer sight plane, shoulder stock and forearm.

So there is no reason that the pistol needs to be inferior with the projectile speeds these weapons use. They would only be inferior in long range accuracy due to the difficulty of holding that type of weapon steady as compared to longer guns.

Really this tech is so good, and the projectiles travel so fast, they should pretty much be instant hits out to extreme ranges. There is really nothing stopping a shotgun from hitting stuff out to what we consider sniper rifle ranges.

[Iakus]

I confess I'm curious about this too. A main weapon/sidearm deal does sound pretty reasonable.

[Captain_Obvious_au]

Well I've argued before that Pistols should have never been a primary weapon, they should have always been an 'emergency' weapon as in real life. I quite liked how Republic Commando did it actually - you have limited ammo for all weapons except the Pistol, but you'll never use it as your primary because it fires too slowly and isn't as powerful.

The SMG's though can easily be a primary weapon - just make them carry more ammo and have a greater impact at short range whilst the AR has a great impact at medium range, with the sniper rifle having greatest impact at long range. Simple.

[Fiery Phoenix]

I asked Christina on Twitter just yesterday and she said pistols do count as a primary weapon (i.e. one of the two or three carried weapons). I don't really like the idea and I think pistols should have been a default sidearm in addition to the primary weapons. I also hope to the heavens this doesn't mean Shepard and co. will pull pistols out of their bottoms in cutscenes when they really don't carry any.

Modifié par Fiery Phoenix, 26 mai 2011 - 05:28 .

[lazuli]

Waltzingbear wrote...

One option is to impair mobility if you do choose to carry two main guns or depending on what gun you're wielding (although I would hate if I would be slower when using a shotgun), which will mean that you'll perform acrobatic action slower as well as sprint.

No offense, but I hate everything about this idea.  I envision it working as Adepts and other casters getting 1 sidearm and one main weapon.  Other classes will have access to more, with Soldier getting the most.

[KainrycKarr]

Well seeing as we know the weapons carry over, my vanguard will still be rocking the Claymore and Phalanx.
Phalanx can basically be a sniper rifle if you're good with it.

Modifié par KainrycKarr, 26 mai 2011 - 05:50 .

[Waltzingbear]

lazuli wrote...

No offense, but I hate everything about this idea.  I envision it working as Adepts and other casters getting 1 sidearm and one main weapon.  Other classes will have access to more, with Soldier getting the most.

None taken, for I hate it too.

I only gave it as an example off the top of my head of what other games have done.

[Geth_Prime]

I must be the only player on the forum who doesn't just use pistols for backup. The Phalanx and Carnifex pistols are really good against mechs and husks.

[clerkenwell]

I've been thinking about this as well. In most modern shooters the differences between an SMG and an Assault Rifle are:

- SMGs are smaller and lighter, allowing you to run faster and aim-down-the-sight faster.
- SMGs tend to have larger clips.
- SMGs tend have a higher rate-of-fire.
- SMGs tend to do less damage per bullet.
- SMGs tend to be less accurate.
- SMGs tend to have less recoil.

As a result, SMGs are usually better suited for close-range encounters where they can spray a lot of bullets very quickly without having to worry too much about precision. In Mass Effect, I think this should make SMG's more suitable weapons for Vanguards (almost definitely), and potentially for other classes depending on playstyle (Infiltrator or Sentinel). Adepts and Engineers are probably always going to prefer a longer range solution, and Adrenaline Rush makes a lot of the SMG's advantages over the Assault Rifle a moot point.

Obviously, they're going to have to tweak the weapons to make them actually behave this way, and not create weapons that are so crazy awesome that they are often the best option even in situations they were never designed for *cough*Mattock*cough*. One thing that is slightly concerning is that ME2 only really had one true SMG, and that was the Locust. The Locust hit many of the key points of what makes a good SMG, and in truth it's one of the most effective weapons in the game. The other SMGs are more like what other shooters would classify as machine pistols, usually a sidearm and an alternative to the hand-cannon style sidearms that the Phalanx and Carnifex would fall under. Almost never useful as a primary weapon.

Personally, I agree with the sentiment that all Shepards should carry one sidearm (a Heavy Pistol or a Machine Pistol) and then 1-3 other weapons of choice depending on class.

[Dexi]

 I love doing the Last Stand with only a pistol ( on insanity) so badass! 
I actually play a lot of my Shep only with the pistol. It just makes me feel the ultimate bad ass. 
And my first ME1 character, an Infiltrator, I rarely played with anything else but the pistol ( sniper occasionally, when I really had to shot at long ranges). 

[Antivenger]

Different abilities? Shotgun + Concussive Shot + Cryo Ammo would have an area effect instead of freezing only one enemy. Also, SMGs are badass.

[Captain_Obvious_au]

Fiery Phoenix wrote...

I asked Christina on Twitter just yesterday and she said pistols do count as a primary weapon (i.e. one of the two or three carried weapons). I don't really like the idea and I think pistols should have been a default sidearm in addition to the primary weapons. I also hope to the heavens this doesn't mean Shepard and co. will pull pistols out of their bottoms in cutscenes when they really don't carry any.

Why not, they already do that in ME2 - I was just playing Garrus' loyalty mission and he pulls out a pistol twice even though he doesn't carry one.

I can't say that the weapons thing for ME3 bothers me though - I'll be quite happy with my Shotgun/Assault Rifle/Sniper Rifle Vanguard

[brokit808]

pistol does count as one of your slots in me3. christina notman tweeted it

[Nashiktal]

Didn't SMG's have a higher DPS than rifles?

[lolwut666]

The Carnifex is one of my favorite weapons in ME2.

"I know what you're thinking. 'Did he fire six shots or only five?' Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I kind of lost track myself. But being as this is a M-6 Carnifex, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?"

[Fredvdp]

If I play a class that can carry only two weapons I will pick an assault rifle and a pistol. I prefer sniper rifles over pistols but they run out of ammo fast.

[TobyHasEyes]

Geth_Prime wrote...

I must be the only player on the forum who doesn't just use pistols for backup. The Phalanx and Carnifex pistols are really good against mechs and husks.

 As an Adept in Mass Effect, I chose only to use pistol (no bonus weapons) and in Mass Effect 2 I kinda resented getting another weapon foisted on my character model cause I like just using the pistols (and SMG's if the divide is still needed)

 So I do hope there will be a chance to carry less weapons maybe with the benefit of more ammo for the less spaces used, so say if the adept can carry two weapons, they could have an assault rifle and a shotgun with 'full ammo', or an assault rifle alone with double capacity for 'full ammo'. Basically so I could just use my pistol

[Terror_K]

To be honest, I prefer pistols to the other weapons. I find them the most universally versatile. The others all have their places where they're best, but I personally find the pistols still pack a decent punch and are just overall better at all situations as a whole. There's also just something more cinematically cool about using a pistol over the other weapons. Maybe it's that whole "James Bond" feel or something, I don't know. A pistol just seems classier and more dignified than the other weapons somehow... the weapon of choice for the smart, savvy Shepard rather than the All-Guns-Blazing meathead Shepard, y'know?