46 réponses à ce sujet

[Jensonagain]

PROBLEM: I'm struggling to find some challenge in Dragon Age. 

Nightmare Difficulty
- You are required to use each character to their full potential.  And even if you do, you will still fall short and absorb a massive amount of damage.  This results in spamming heal potions.  Unfortunately the game turns into a constant quest for healing potions.  Is that fun?  No.  So this difficulty mode is rather pointless.
- Magic use is almost a requirement and you are forced to make a party based on the devs vision instead of your own.  For example if you wanted leilana, two handed warrior (You), alistair and your dog this would not be viable and force you to consume a massive amount of healing potions.

Hard Difficulty
- Not too different from Nightmare and the same concept applies.  No matter how effective you use your characters you will still rely on heavy use from your healing potions.
- Magic use is still a requirement. 
- There are times when you will win a fight without using heal potions and the satisfaction level of the victory is extremely high! But then there will be times you find yourself burning through 20 heal potions.  It makes you wonder if the game takes skill or just a desire to spam heal potions.

Normal Difficulty
- If you use your characters to their full potential you will find that you do not have to rely on much magic healing or healing potions.  However there will still be certain fights that are so imbalanced you will be required to rely on healing potions no matter how good you are with the game.  Healing potions is a cop out. It's not skill.

Easy Difficulty
- An end to the use of healing and/or magic.  No more reliance on healing potions.
- The only problem is that this mode seems almost TOO easy for a majority of the fights.

Examples
- When an ogre goes for a charge, why not let us simply move out of the way? Instead you are forced to take the devastating hit which forces you to chug a heal potion.

Summary
- I would like to see games that require you to use your characters to their full potentials, using proper
skills, flanking properly, moving out of the way INSTEAD of having to rely on the healing potion.

I'm thinking about reinstalling the game and removing the 1.01a patch and playing on easy mode WITHOUT ever relying on a heal potion and instead relying purely on the characters skills and flanking techniques.  This results in a much more entertaining and rewarding experience when you win a fight.

/discuss

Modifié par Jensonagain, 19 novembre 2009 - 10:53 .

[soteria]

It sounds like your problem isn't trying to find a challenge, but trying to play without healing. Can't really help you there since they said before the game was released that they balanced it expecting you to have a mage in your party.

To a certain extent , you can dodge big attacks.  From the moment you see the yellow letters telling you what ability they're using, you have a second to run out of range, so you can dodge things like massive attack and double strike.

Modifié par soteria, 19 novembre 2009 - 10:57 .

[Lucasian]

Try min-max'ing your characters instead. Combined with proper tactical insight and hard mode will be the new easy mode.



Aside from that, there's people soloing on nightmare mode...

[Jensonagain]

Lucasian wrote...

Try min-max'ing your characters instead. Combined with proper tactical insight and hard mode will be the new easy mode.

Aside from that, there's people soloing on nightmare mode...

Hard and nightmare mode is easy if you use heal potions. THe game becomes too easy.

"Alistair health under 90 use lesser heal potion" = victory

[Jensonagain]

soteria wrote...

It sounds like your problem isn't trying to find a challenge, but trying to play without healing. Can't really help you there since they said before the game was released that they balanced it expecting you to have a mage in your party.

To a certain extent , you can dodge big attacks.  From the moment you see the yellow letters telling you what ability they're using, you have a second to run out of range, so you can dodge things like massive attack and double strike.

When the ogre goes for his mini charge you cannot dodge it. I've clearly moved out of the way and it still hits you lol.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

What the **** is the problem with using healing items?



Sure, I would prefer a healing system similar to The Witcher where it's a passive health regeneration buff rather than a instant gratification thing but regardless: The challenge of Nightmare and Hard mode is using your characters effectively. Yes, you have to use health potions but if you're playing effectively it isn't super mandatory.



As for Nightmare requiring a Mage: I don't think it does. It does require that you have party members capable of fulfilling specific roles: Tanking, Damage dealing and Crowd control: but how you go about assigning party members to those roles is up to you. For example, mid-late game leiliana has excellent crowd control with her Bard Songs and her archery talents like Pinning Shot and Scatter Shot and could quite easily replace a Mage in crowd control.

[mysticforce42]

Jensonagain wrote...

soteria wrote...

It sounds like your problem isn't trying to find a challenge, but trying to play without healing. Can't really help you there since they said before the game was released that they balanced it expecting you to have a mage in your party.

To a certain extent , you can dodge big attacks.  From the moment you see the yellow letters telling you what ability they're using, you have a second to run out of range, so you can dodge things like massive attack and double strike.

When the ogre goes for his mini charge you cannot dodge it. I've clearly moved out of the way and it still hits you lol.

While you can't doget it, or overwhelm-type attacks and certain stuns, you can stop/delay it with a freeze from either WG or CoC.

[Sloth Of Doom]

My solo nightare rogue is starting to run into some issues now. To be honest, though I don't use THAT many healing potions at all. In genera I have two types of status: 1) Traps out, poisons up, backstabbing and vanishing all over OR 2) Grabbed/overwhelmed and raped to death in 3 seconds.



But enough about soloing, on hard and nightmare magic is NOT required. Properly building your party means you will have decent stuns and damage as well as special abilities. You just aren't using all of you characters abilities right. Magic makes it much easier but is not 'required' in any way.



This has been covered in dozens and dozens of posts already.

[vhatever]

Potion spam isn't going to help you in many of the tougher fights. You need to get control of the siuation first. I'm not sure it's not possible to take whatever party you want. Since I solo'd the entire game on nightmare as a rogue, you could literally drag your party member along with you for the ride. You have to think about it, though. How your group is going to be effective versus bosses, versus large groups, versus medium sized groups with mages in the back, etc.

[Jensonagain]

Sloth Of Doom wrote...

My solo nightare rogue is starting to run into some issues now. To be honest, though I don't use THAT many healing potions at all. In genera I have two types of status: 1) Traps out, poisons up, backstabbing and vanishing all over OR 2) Grabbed/overwhelmed and raped to death in 3 seconds.

But enough about soloing, on hard and nightmare magic is NOT required. Properly building your party means you will have decent stuns and damage as well as special abilities. You just aren't using all of you characters abilities right. Magic makes it much easier but is not 'required' in any way.

This has been covered in dozens and dozens of posts already.

I beat the game on nightmare mode, I attribute my victory to healing potions.

Grey wardens attribute their victory to the heal potion and nothing else. LOL. They should show a picture of a heal potion at the end of the game haha.

[soteria]

Jensonagain wrote...

soteria wrote...

It sounds like your problem isn't trying to find a challenge, but trying to play without healing. Can't really help you there since they said before the game was released that they balanced it expecting you to have a mage in your party.

To a certain extent , you can dodge big attacks.  From the moment you see the yellow letters telling you what ability they're using, you have a second to run out of range, so you can dodge things like massive attack and double strike.

When the ogre goes for his mini charge you cannot dodge it. I've clearly moved out of the way and it still hits you lol.

Try using any of the half-dozen stuns your party has available on the ogre whenever he brings his head down to ram you.  You said you wanted to be able to use your abilities strategically to avoid taking damage, and there you go.

[Jensonagain]

soteria wrote...

Jensonagain wrote...

soteria wrote...

It sounds like your problem isn't trying to find a challenge, but trying to play without healing. Can't really help you there since they said before the game was released that they balanced it expecting you to have a mage in your party.

To a certain extent , you can dodge big attacks.  From the moment you see the yellow letters telling you what ability they're using, you have a second to run out of range, so you can dodge things like massive attack and double strike.

When the ogre goes for his mini charge you cannot dodge it. I've clearly moved out of the way and it still hits you lol.

Try using any of the half-dozen stuns your party has available on the ogre whenever he brings his head down to ram you.  You said you wanted to be able to use your abilities strategically to avoid taking damage, and there you go.

Ogre on nightmare requires you save a lot of your stuns and slams in case he picks someone up.   If paralyze fails then shield bash, if that fails then stun etc.  The whole time you are spamming heal potions.

Ogre on nightmare
-

Modifié par Jensonagain, 19 novembre 2009 - 11:22 .

[daem3an]

Jensonagain wrote...

Hard Difficulty
- Not too different from Nightmare and the same concept applies.  No matter how effective you use your characters you will still rely on heavy use from your healing potions.
- Magic use is still a requirement.
- There are times when you will win a fight without using heal potions and the satisfaction level of the victory is extremely high! But then there will be times you find yourself burning through 20 heal potions.  It makes you wonder if the game takes skill or just a desire to spam heal potions.

I think you answered your own question. The challenge comes from playing the character/party, not the build, if you get what I mean. If your party doesn't have magic or healing potions, what would you do instead? These things are there for those who need or want them, but not the only way to win. I think I'd have a pretty hard time at first without using magic as well, but traps and grenades could probably be used pretty effectively, for starters.

My only experience thus far is playing on hard and I'm not using very many potions. I never really liked using healing potions in rpgs. If I end up using more than a couple, and win, I restart the fight. It just feels way better to win without them as you said. So yes, the game takes skill, but you can also get by using potions if you want.

[dienon11]

Meh. I'm running nightmare on the PC and I haven't had to chug too many health pots. Put a decent chunk of points into CON even for mages, keep your armor up-to-date on everyone, manage hate, use traps, bombs and poisons, and CC - most fights really aren't even threatening - even on nightmare.

Modifié par dienon11, 19 novembre 2009 - 11:26 .

[spool32]

mysticforce42 wrote...

Jensonagain wrote...

soteria wrote...

It sounds like your problem isn't trying to find a challenge, but trying to play without healing. Can't really help you there since they said before the game was released that they balanced it expecting you to have a mage in your party.

To a certain extent , you can dodge big attacks.  From the moment you see the yellow letters telling you what ability they're using, you have a second to run out of range, so you can dodge things like massive attack and double strike.

When the ogre goes for his mini charge you cannot dodge it. I've clearly moved out of the way and it still hits you lol.

While you can't doget it, or overwhelm-type attacks and certain stuns, you can stop/delay it with a freeze from either WG or CoC.

Shield Wall / Indomitible + Threaten = who cares about charges

[Kahryl]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...

What the **** is the problem with using healing items?

Sure, I would prefer a healing system similar to The Witcher where it's a passive health regeneration buff rather than a instant gratification thing but regardless: The challenge of Nightmare and Hard mode is using your characters effectively.

The point of the OP's post is that this isn't true.

Hard and Nightmare difficulty don't require you to use your characters more effectively.

They require you to bring more mages and click on your little potion icon more times per fight.

The game lacks balance or strategy.

[daem3an]

If you're suggesting the game isn't playable without spamming potions, I disagree. You may not enjoy the increased challenge, but that's exactly what it is, a challenge. Playing without potions or a healer requires a different strategy.

[Kahryl]

daem3an wrote...

If you're suggesting the game isn't playable without spamming potions, I disagree. You may not enjoy the increased challenge, but that's exactly what it is, a challenge. Playing without potions or a healer requires a different strategy.

The point is that you should be able to get a challenge by clicking "nightmare mode".  Not by artificially restricting yourslef.

[Aesira]

Err, this review is kinda fail.

If you dont bring a proper tank and proper healer, what the heck are you trying to archieve at extreme difficulties?



If you want to have a fun party with Leliana/whatever, by all means, set your game difficulty to Easy and embark into romance with Alistair/Leliana/blah blah, smell flowers, 2-shot dragons.



If you want to beat the game at exreme difficulty, yes, get ready to get your face melted alot, so, of course, lol, set up proper party, burn all your consumables, potions, balms, mages with healing, etc



Seriously, the one and only thing I love about this game (actual difficulty level), get so much whine its hilarious. So many consoletards fail to comprehend simple things, like, yes, you need a healer in your party for Nightmare, omg big news.

[daem3an]

Kahryl wrote...

daem3an wrote...
If you're suggesting the game isn't playable without spamming potions, I disagree. You may not enjoy the increased challenge, but that's exactly what it is, a challenge. Playing without potions or a healer requires a different strategy.

The point is that you should be able to get a challenge by clicking "nightmare mode".  Not by artificially restricting yourslef.

Fair enough. I find potions aren't that common that I'm tempted to overuse them in my game, but as I said, that's my play style. I'm curious now that I'm this far on hard, what the difference is between this and nightmare. But I find hard is the right level of challenge for me. It's tough enough that I have to think and can't let my guard down for a moment, but no fight feels impossible (so far).

Modifié par daem3an, 20 novembre 2009 - 12:02 .

[daem3an]

So would Nightmare make more sense if less potions were available, or if they were less effective? There's a mod that does that I believe.

[dienon11]

daem3an wrote...
Fair enough. I find potions aren't that common that I'm tempted to overuse them in my game, but as I said, that's my play style. I'm curious now that I'm this far on hard, what the difference is between this and nightmare.

It doesn't really feel that different for most fights.  The ones where I tend to notice are boss fights (they last much longer it seems) and battles with mages (they have a greater arsenal of spells, nasty ones, and aren't afraid to use them with impunity). 

[Kahryl]

dienon11 wrote...

daem3an wrote...
Fair enough. I find potions aren't that common that I'm tempted to overuse them in my game, but as I said, that's my play style. I'm curious now that I'm this far on hard, what the difference is between this and nightmare.

It doesn't really feel that different for most fights.  The ones where I tend to notice are boss fights (they last much longer it seems) and battles with mages (they have a greater arsenal of spells, nasty ones, and aren't afraid to use them with impunity). 

Potions themselves are in a limited enough quantity to be balanced.   The problem is that ingredients for making potions are both very cheap and unlimited in quantity, so any need for tactics goes right out the window when you have 495 poltices and lyrium pots.

[BluesMan1956]

Troll troll troll troll. Keep Trolling. Maybe you'll catch something....

[JHorwath]

I should point out that when knocked down, grabbed, stunned, ect... you can not use healing potions or mana potions.  Is that something that people forget?  If your not paying attention and your character gets this affliction in the wrong situation they are history.