239 réponses à ce sujet

[Skellimancer]

Writers are emo.

At least you lived after the ending.

Thanks for no real choices, Gaider.

Modifié par Skellimancer, 20 novembre 2009 - 02:17 .

[Vilegrim]

more goth imho, a more adult darkness with enough self awareness to laugh at itself

[_Infiltrator]

I think it's laziness still. Not necessarily the writers because it wouldn't be hard to come up with an alternate ending if you were romancing her.

[marshalleck]

Infiltrator wrote...

I think it's laziness still. Not necessarily the writers because it wouldn't be hard to come up with an alternate ending if you were romancing her.

Yes, and this ending would involve what, exactly? Hero changes the girl into the perfect woman, they settle down and spawn children? How would that not be a lazy ending?

Morrigan has her own plans, and they don't involve you beyond the ritual. Tough luck. During the course of the romance, you can make her fall in love with you, but she never loses sight of the goal she has had all along--restoring the soul of an Old God. She repeatedly tries to stop the relationship from developing because she knows it's something that can't last. It's your fault for improperly reading her character and recklessly pursuing the relationship. Heck, even Wynne sees it coming and warns you if I remember correctly.

IMO it's about time RPGs moved past puerile "get the girl, save the world" plots. If that's what you want, what's wrong with Leliana?

Modifié par marshalleck, 20 novembre 2009 - 03:21 .

[Vilegrim]

Infiltrator wrote...

I think it's laziness still. Not necessarily the writers because it wouldn't be hard to come up with an alternate ending if you were romancing her.

the ending is set, she has to do what she does, and sacrifices her happiness to do it.

[_Infiltrator]

marshalleck wrote...
Yes, and this ending would involve what, exactly? Hero changes the girl into the perfect woman, they settle down and spawn children? How would that not be a lazy ending?

Morrigan has her own plans, and they don't involve you beyond the ritual. Tough luck. During the course of the romance, you can make her fall in love with you, but she never loses sight of the goal she has had all along--restoring the soul of an Old God. She repeatedly tries to stop the relationship from developing because she knows it's something that can't last. It's your fault for improperly reading her character and recklessly pursuing the relationship. Heck, even Wynne sees it coming and warns you if I remember correctly.

IMO it's about time RPGs moved past puerile "get the girl, save the world" plots. If that's what you want, what's wrong with Leliana?

Wow, so much assumption and contradiction in your post.

First off, where do I say I want a happy from fairy tales? This is certainly NOT what I expected. It would have to come at a price if it did happen - either Morrigan somehow dying or the baby/kid getting sacrificed. Another ending could be morrigan getting possessed by flemeth.. there are so many options here I don't know where to start.

And about your "its about time RPGs moved past the "get the girl" plots, I guess you proved yourself wrong by mentioning Leliana in the same sentence.

[marshalleck]

Infiltrator wrote...

And about your "its about time RPGs moved past the "get the girl" plots, I guess you proved yourself wrong by mentioning Leliana in the same sentence.

Proved myself wrong? How does one prove an opinion wrong, pray tell? Leliana exists as the traditional male -> female romance option for people who can't handle a complex/conflicted character like Morrigan. Her ending in the game is perfect; it couldn't go any other way without contradicting who she is and what she's all about.

The only somewhat legit complaint I could understand would be dissatisfaction with the text box ending.

Modifié par marshalleck, 20 novembre 2009 - 04:41 .

[Taleroth]

Jacks-Up wrote...

Walina wrote...

mireigi wrote...

I agree that the ending could have been much better. Was kinda hoping for a revisit to the Veronica romance from Baldur's Gate 2 where you influence her enough to change her view on the world and how she responds to it.

I expected the to happen in DAO, I was dispointed

Viconia took off on you IN BG2 and Died in TOB.  

Train seems to be on the same tracks.

I keep hearing this, but I'm confused.

I only finished the entire thing once, but that time I romanced Viconia.  She never ran off on me, was with me at the final battle, and I swear the epilogue stated she became a priestess of my religion or some crap.

[screwoffreg]

In trying to create a compelling series, Bioware would do themselves a disservice by giving the player EVERYTHING they wanted in the first game.  I imagine they will pick up the romance/friendship somehow, but you are going to have to work for it a bit.  I have a feeling that in actuality Morrigan's romance may turn out the best while Leilana may be marked by tragedy, which would be a dramatic twist for how they were presented in the first game.  Either way, I look forward to chasing down the father of my PC's child through the mountains, even if only to serve her with papers for a court date (where's my visitation rights?!).

[screwoffreg]

Taleroth wrote...

I keep hearing this, but I'm confused.

I only finished the entire thing once, but that time I romanced Viconia.  She never ran off on me, was with me at the final battle, and I swear the epilogue stated she became a priestess of my religion or some crap.

That is because you chose to become a God.  If you stay in the mortal realm, Viconia settles down with you and has a child.  The Drow catch up with her and...well she doesn't make it.  Instead you and your child go to the Underdark and it is implied you basically massacre a significant number of the Spider Queen's people.

Modifié par screwoffreg, 20 novembre 2009 - 04:56 .

[_Infiltrator]

marshalleck wrote...
Proved myself wrong? How does one prove an opinion wrong, pray tell? Leliana exists as the traditional male -> female romance option for people who can't handle a complex/conflicted character like Morrigan.

I thought it was obvious but since you're praying I'll give in. You said how RPGs have moved on from those traditional endings, right? Wouldn't the best scenario to present your case be the very game we're talking about? Oops, it appears the game holds onto those same values you seem to be relieved games have moved on from, well isn't that disappointing?

Of course anyone who even spends a small amount of time in the game will get a hint on which character between the two is going to be the traditional RPG romance and go with it, experiencing the very thing you are thankful to games have departed from. Was that clear enough of an explanation for you?

Also, I literally laughed out loud at the "people who can't handle a complex/conflicted character like Morrigan". Was that by any chance directed at me? I was complaining how the ending was uniform between the romance/non romance version, if you haven't figured it out by now. But don't worry, I'm not quite near a nerveous breakdown due to my "inability to handle complex characters" (still laughing out loud at this line, thanks!).

[Taleroth]

screwoffreg wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

I keep hearing this, but I'm confused.

I only finished the entire thing once, but that time I romanced Viconia.  She never ran off on me, was with me at the final battle, and I swear the epilogue stated she became a priestess of my religion or some crap.

That is because you chose to become a God.  If you stay in the mortal realm, Viconia settles down with you and has a child.  The Drow catch up with her and...well she doesn't make it.  Instead you and your child go to the Underdark and it is implied you basically massacre a significant number of the Spider Queen's people.

What kind of Silly Billy doesn't take up an offer to become a God?

[Darkben1]

/quote Her ending in the game is perfect; it couldn't go any other way without contradicting who she is and what she's all about.

I agree i only just completed the game recently i did the romance with morrigan, hell nothing better than a complex goth chick with mother issues ah

but it was a shokcer either agree and get the dark promise achi or disagree and she walks.. which was annoying cus i spent alot of time getting her skills up etc.. (lvl 20) 

but the ending pure genius cliffhanger opening.. if theres no expansion or dlc continuing the story it'll slap alot of ppl in the face hard..

but i live in hope.. i chose the "going after her" option cus any decent guy would plus it be nice to have a kid with the power of an old god..

[Darkben1]

one thing the ending made me question... if you choose not to inpregenant morrigan (or get another do do it) she walks.. why travel with your party all the way til the last hour only to strom off ??



if her end game was to capture the old god soul how does walking off help? ok a little off topic but hell couldnt resist

[marshalleck]

Infiltrator wrote...

I thought it was obvious but since you're praying I'll give in. You said how RPGs have moved on from those traditional endings, right? Wouldn't the best scenario to present your case be the very game we're talking about? Oops, it appears the game holds onto those same values you seem to be relieved games have moved on from, well isn't that disappointing?

Of course anyone who even spends a small amount of time in the game will get a hint on which character between the two is going to be the traditional RPG romance and go with it, experiencing the very thing you are thankful to games have departed from. Was that clear enough of an explanation for you?

Also, I literally laughed out loud at the "people who can't handle a complex/conflicted character like Morrigan". Was that by any chance directed at me? I was complaining how the ending was uniform between the romance/non romance version, if you haven't figured it out by now. But don't worry, I'm not quite near a nerveous breakdown due to my "inability to handle complex characters" (still laughing out loud at this line, thanks!).

The game...has values? Okay. This is quickly becoming a pointless semantic argument. I expressed an opinion that cliched happy ending romances are boring, and welcomed one with a more realistic twist. I then pointed out that if one is not happy with that, the developers kindly included the traditional romance option: Leliana.

And sadly, no, my posting here is not entirely directed at you. I see a lot of complaints about the Morrigan ending by people who simply appear to not have read any of her dialogue at all, rather prefering to shower her with gifts and saying all the 'mean' options so they could get the sex scene and the "congratulations, you saved Morrigan!" ending they apparently expected or felt entitled to. Then of course they come here and flame Bioware because they just got unceremoniously used and dumped by a video game character and their pride is bruised.

Modifié par marshalleck, 20 novembre 2009 - 05:14 .

[Exodus]

you guys suck. i've read david's books and it ends in a very similar way that really made me want to play this game and hopefully find out who the mystery person becomes and is. This really makes me look forward to the expansion or sequel to the game a LOT.

[marshalleck]

Exodus wrote...

you guys suck. 

aww dude, sucker punch

not fair

[marshalleck]

double post fail.

Modifié par marshalleck, 20 novembre 2009 - 05:18 .

[Driveninhifi]

marshalleck wrote...

Infiltrator wrote...

I think it's laziness still. Not necessarily the writers because it wouldn't be hard to come up with an alternate ending if you were romancing her.

Yes, and this ending would involve what, exactly? Hero changes the girl into the perfect woman, they settle down and spawn children? How would that not be a lazy ending?

Morrigan has her own plans, and they don't involve you beyond the ritual. Tough luck. During the course of the romance, you can make her fall in love with you, but she never loses sight of the goal she has had all along--restoring the soul of an Old God. She repeatedly tries to stop the relationship from developing because she knows it's something that can't last. It's your fault for improperly reading her character and recklessly pursuing the relationship. Heck, even Wynne sees it coming and warns you if I remember correctly.

IMO it's about time RPGs moved past puerile "get the girl, save the world" plots. If that's what you want, what's wrong with Leliana?

You can make that argument, but I don't think it really rings true. There could easily be endings that are not totally sappy and keep Morrigan and the PC united. Why wouldn't she take him with her, for example. Since the game gives you absolutely nothing toward answering that, the player can't help but feel a bit cheated.

The ending isn't bad, it's just not handled well. I think the ending would have been fine for a book, but it's not a good ending for a game. It should be ONE of the endings, but not all of them.

I've got two issues with it:
One is that it completely stops her character development, which was progressing very nicely until it suddenly ends. She was morphing into a very interesting, conflicted character. She is most compelling when her humanity is cracking through and the ending kind of undoes all that. Not to say she should settle down with the character, but since there was no indication of what she might plan it doesn't make sense that she would forbid the PC from coming. It would totally be in character for her to convince herself she needs a defender while pregnant and is purely being pragmatic by bringing him along.
Two is that it is inconsistent with the rest of the game. You can impact every major event except this one - and that's because the plot hook is needed (or the writers wanted a bittersweet ending). This feels very artificial to me - it's the one time you don't get a choice. The player's destiny is taken out of their hands, and that feels forced since it doesn't happen elsewhere. You can't even ask her why you can't come - which is probably the most natural thing for someone to ask their lover after she tells them she is leaving.

[aaniadyen]

Darkben1 wrote...

one thing the ending made me question... if you choose not to inpregenant morrigan (or get another do do it) she walks.. why travel with your party all the way til the last hour only to strom off ??

if her end game was to capture the old god soul how does walking off help? ok a little off topic but hell couldnt resist

This is the only complaint I have with it. Evidently she wanted this enough to stay with the party for the better part of two years. Then when she finally gets to the point of getting what she wanted the entire time she seems so nonchalant about it. If you say no she's just like "Meh, alright...no big deal", then leaves. You assume she'd make a bigger deal out of it (Like Vico when she's trying to convince you to not romance her). I was honestly kinda confused of her real intentions all along when I refused. I was like "Wait...wtf just happened?" I seriously didn't see that comming at all. Other than that, I thought it was great.

[marshalleck]

Is the campaign really supposed to take place over two years? I had assumed it was several months. Would be nice if Ferelden had seasons.

[fr4gged]

@Marshalleck, when you play through the human noble campaign, you meet up with someone at the end and the game itself is over a span of weeks.



I could be wrong though, and I don't really feel like replaying the ending atm.

[Darkben1]

aaniadyen wrote...

Darkben1 wrote...

one thing the ending made me question... if you choose not to inpregenant morrigan (or get another do do it) she walks.. why travel with your party all the way til the last hour only to strom off ??

if her end game was to capture the old god soul how does walking off help? ok a little off topic but hell couldnt resist

This is the only complaint I have with it. Evidently she wanted this enough to stay with the party for the better part of two years. Then when she finally gets to the point of getting what she wanted the entire time she seems so nonchalant about it. If you say no she's just like "Meh, alright...no big deal", then leaves. You assume she'd make a bigger deal out of it (Like Vico when she's trying to convince you to not romance her). I was honestly kinda confused of her real intentions all along when I refused. I was like "Wait...wtf just happened?" I seriously didn't see that comming at all. Other than that, I thought it was great.

Yeah i was like huh.. she tells you she has plans and i assume her plan was to capture the old god but it's a BIG if to preggys from a grey warden 1 day before the main event.. i mean how could anyone plan that adhead of time?

i mean through the story morrigan was useless with social skills and never tryed to start a relationship so whats the chance of convincing anyone to do the ritual    i would think very small

i think in a logical sense the ending has alot of holes.. but i think this is what id call a random or an ending to make people confused so much that we talk about it on forums which for me is a win... bioware must have some kick ass writiers that know what triggers people

or simple put the ending is to leave it open to the next expansion.. but i hate HATE unanswered questions

worse what if there isnt a follow on from this jesus thats a question that can never be answered..

[Driveninhifi]

Well, she is very into self-preservation. She's not exactly what you'd call "good with people," so maybe she just assumes you would be up for saving yourself because that's the logical thing to do in her mind?



But since we aren't given much information about the outside world or her plans, the ending definitely appears to have a lot of holes in it. Which is why I was saying it feels kind of forced and inconsistent with the ability to influence the world via your choices.

[screwoffreg]

Spoiler alert:  I read a preview of the end of the Dragon Age series and it says that it ends up you can marry Morrigan and you and her take turns droppings the kids off at soccer and karate practice.