1373 réponses à ce sujet

[In Exile]

Luke Barrett wrote...

If it helps at all, I've got a long list of items that I made entirely from forum feedback that I check new content against when I'm working with it. Basically, I want to make sure everything we touch going forward meets and exceeds community expectations on all fronts. I'm sure the higher-ups have similar lists when they are dealing with the macro of it all (I deal primarily in micro)

Absolutely. Again, I feel it's important to add that for me, Bioware is top-line developer and one of the few I follow closely. The previous quality of work that Bioware can produce is staggering.  Most of all, I can appreciate how difficult it is to bring a concept to fruition in a final product.

I followed DA:O nearly from the start. I was (albeit as a lurker) there for when the qunari where still The MOR and Thedas was The DAS (for those curious, that is "the myserious other race" and "the dragon age setting"). I know that at one point, the origins would have had a personal nemesis that made up a significant part of gameplay, and that it was one time conceived of as a potential LAN client with each origin a starting point for a different Warden that converged at Ostagar.

Things change. Some things can be included. Other things have to be cut. Production schedules change.

Am I dissapointed that DAII was not the game that it was marketed as? Yes. But I take marketing with a grain of salt, especially after the marketing for DA:O. More than anything, I was dissapointed with DA2 because you could just see the opportunities that weren't realized and the state of the content when it was released. I won't lie - it felt like I was playin an Alpha Build, with much of the recycled areas placeholders to test the dialogues and pacing until the finished environments could be added in.

I remember your posts in the VO thread, as well as in the gameplay thread from ages ago. That you're listening makes a significant difference. What's left is to see what comes of the new content that Bioware will put forward. I'm certainly going to give it a fair shot.

[JakePT]

Luke Barrett wrote...

In Exile wrote...

I just want to echo this sentiment, with respect to the potential of DAII. It could have been brilliant. But it wasn't.

For me, this was the first Bioware misstep. I'll still be onboard for DLC and DAIII. But there needs to be a higher standard. This thread was a great first step. Now, there needs to be content that follows up on the promises here. A substantive show that DAIII and DAII DLC will be better.

If it helps at all, I've got a long list of items that I made entirely from forum feedback that I check new content against when I'm working with it. Basically, I want to make sure everything we touch going forward meets and exceeds community expectations on all fronts. I'm sure the higher-ups have similar lists when they are dealing with the macro of it all (I deal primarily in micro)

Just don't go overboard. I think some of the flaws of both DA2 and ME2 were because of an overreaction to feedback, not ignoring it.

"The inventory is kind of crappy, and the RPG elements are hard to understand."
"Ok, GONE!"

"Combat's a bit slow, why do they shuffle along in the middle of a fight?"
"Ok, how about you leap ENORMOUS distances and slide along the ground in an instant and people are sprinting all over the place and teleporting so fast you can't even see what's happening, and if you do hit them they EXPLODE!!"

The solution to shuffling in combat in DA2 seemed to be to change the entire physics of the universe in a way that didn't gel well with the story, which was even more realistic and grounded than DA:Os. The kind of world that Gaider et al. created and the stories they're telling in it require a more grounded approach to combat. That doesn't mean shuffling and unreponsiveness, but it certainly doesn't mean flying through the air and enemies exploding.

We obviously want you to take feedback into account, but don't compromise your artistic integrity to do so. Take feedback into account, but stay true to what Dragon Age is supposed to be.

Modifié par JakePT, 27 mai 2011 - 07:08 .

[Morroian]

Droma wrote...


For the companion costumization I personally would prefer a somewhat middle way between DAO and DA2, which leans more in the DA2 direction. For example give every companion 2-5 armors (should be unlocked throughout quests/romances =D) 

+1

[In Exile]

JakePT wrote...
Just don't go overboard. I think some of the flaws of both DA2 and ME2 were because of an overreaction to feedback, not ignoring it.

"The inventory is kind of crappy, and the RPG elements are hard to understand."
"Ok, GONE!"

"Combat's a bit slow, why do they shuffle along in the middle of a fight?"
"Ok, how about you leap ENORMOUS distances and slide along the ground in an instant and people are sprinting all over the place and teleporting so fast you can't even see what's happening, and if you do hit them they EXPLODE!!"

The solution to shuffling in combat in DA2 seemed to be to change the entire physics of the universe in a way that didn't gel well with the story, which was even more realistic and grounded than DA:Os. The kind of world that Gaider et al. and the stories they're telling it in require a more grounded approach to combat. That doesn't mean shuffling and unreponsiveness, but it certainly doesn't mean flying through the air and enemies exploding.

We obviously want you to take feedback into account, but don't compromise your artistic integrity to do so. Take feedback into account, but stay true to what Dragon Age is supposed to be.

I think offering playtesting modules isn't a bad idea. Just tweak some animations (for example) and mess with the inventory screen for companions, and release a demo to some of the forum (on a confidentiality basis) to see what the response is.

That way, you can see directly what the pulse is. As long as you do an SRS that's representative, you'll get meaningful data.

[Fraevar]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...
Now, back to dipping that unicycle in kerosene. Epler: get those matches ready, buddy. We're going to the moon.

Before you do that, can I just say thanks for stopping by to answer questions, Mike? I've had my share of gripes with DA2, as Epler well knows, but I really appreciate you taking the time to brave the flames and re-engage in discussions with those of us who do have criticisms but don't want to just spew vitriol

[PaulSX]

Nice to hear more informations about DA2, I personally want to have some real consequences in future DA games, hope you guys are considering an expansion for DA2 where we can explore more on Hawke's later life based on the decisions made by the end of the game (I mean different routes, quest lines, and solutions when siding with Templars or Mages)

[Luke Barrett]

JakePT wrote...
We obviously want you to take feedback into account, but don't compromise your artistic integrity to do so. Take feedback into account, but stay true to what Dragon Age is supposed to be.

Yes, there is obviously a fine line between pandering and improving based on feedback. Everything is always carefully assessed, I was merely trying to imply that we're doing the best we can to improve on a daily basis and ensure what is best for the franchise as well as what the community wants to see. Obviously when those two things conflict we have to make a judgment call and live with the consequences, one way or the other.

Modifié par Luke Barrett, 27 mai 2011 - 07:17 .

[Maria Caliban]

v_ware wrote...

WHY DIDN'T YOU MAKE DA2 TO BE ALL THAT YOU STATED. It could have been everything we wanted. It wasn't.

It's not possible for a game to be 'everything we wanted' because different people want different things. Heck, just building one person's dream RPG would probably bankrupt any game developer that tried.

[Serpieri Nei]

As long as the unique armors are statless (and have some method of adding specific bonuses – other than just runes) so they don't pigeon hole the companion into a preset build. If not then several armor sets useable for archers, blood mages, dual wielding warriors/rogues, sword/shield. 2 handed warriors and more would be far more preferable. And we should have several different variations on robes and leather/metal armors.

Modifié par Serpieri Nei, 27 mai 2011 - 07:22 .

[v_ware]

Maria Caliban wrote...

v_ware wrote...

WHY DIDN'T YOU MAKE DA2 TO BE ALL THAT YOU STATED. It could have been everything we wanted. It wasn't.

It's not possible for a game to be 'everything we wanted' because different people want different things. Heck, just building one person's dream RPG would probably bankrupt any game developer that tried.

Every game from Bioware was pretty close until DA2. It just wasn't very good.

[In Exile]

Serpieri Nei wrote...

As long as the unique armors are statless (and have some method of adding specific bonuses – other than just runes) so they don't pigeon hole the companion into a preset build. If not then several armor sets useable for archers, blood mages, dual wielding warriors/rogues, sword/shield. 2 handed warriors and more would be far more preferable. And we should have several different variations on robes and leather/metal armors.

Or they could have a few reskins of the unique model and have it work exactly like DA:O armour while keeping iconic apperance. That's the model I favour now.

[Maria Caliban]

v_ware wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

v_ware wrote...

WHY DIDN'T YOU MAKE DA2 TO BE ALL THAT YOU STATED. It could have been everything we wanted. It wasn't.

It's not possible for a game to be 'everything we wanted' because different people want different things. Heck, just building one person's dream RPG would probably bankrupt any game developer that tried.

Every game from Bioware was pretty close until DA2. It just wasn't very good.

Dragon Age 2 is my favorite BioWare RPG, and I say this despite the fact that I believe it has some serious flaws.

Remember when I said different people want different things? A game that is everything you want won't be a game that is everything I want.

Why should BioWare cater to your wants over mine?

I'm prettier.

[In Exile]

Maria Caliban wrote...
Dragon Age 2 is my favorite BioWare RPG, and I say this despite the fact that I believe it has some serious flaws.

Remember when I said different people want different things? A game that is everything you want won't be a game that is everything I want.

Why should BioWare cater to your wants over mine?

I'm prettier.

I'm a huge fan of PC VO. When I played DA2 for the first time, the dialogue system was such a plus for me, the game was rated very highly. Comparable to ME.

Then I replayed it, and I realized DA2 just happened to work with the character concepted I started. Had I used any other character, the game just would not have worked as well, and it was mere chance I picked a sarcastic, selfish and disinterested mage.

[v_ware]

Maria Caliban wrote...

v_ware wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

v_ware wrote...

WHY DIDN'T YOU MAKE DA2 TO BE ALL THAT YOU STATED. It could have been everything we wanted. It wasn't.

It's not possible for a game to be 'everything we wanted' because different people want different things. Heck, just building one person's dream RPG would probably bankrupt any game developer that tried.

Every game from Bioware was pretty close until DA2. It just wasn't very good.

Dragon Age 2 is my favorite BioWare RPG, and I say this despite the fact that I believe it has some serious flaws.

Remember when I said different people want different things? A game that is everything you want won't be a game that is everything I want.

Why should BioWare cater to your wants over mine?

I'm prettier.

Dragon Age 2 is the lowest rated Bioware game in a very long time. Just stating the facts honey.

[upsettingshorts]

In Exile wrote...

Then I replayed it, and I realized DA2 just happened to work with the character concepted I started. Had I used any other character, the game just would not have worked as well, and it was mere chance I picked a sarcastic, selfish and disinterested mage.

Weirdly I had similar thoughts but was playing a peacekeeping hated-all-zealots warrior.  I think he picked the middle dialogue option <6 times.  The fact he failed to stop anything despite his attempts was something I actually loved. 

v_ware wrote...

Dragon Age 2 is the lowest rated Bioware game in a very long time. Just stating the facts honey.

How is that relevant when it comes to a single person's opinion?

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 27 mai 2011 - 07:40 .

[In Exile]

Upsettingshorts wrote...
Weirdly I had similar thoughts but was playing a peacekeeping hated-all-zealots warrior.  I think he picked the middle dialogue option <6 times. 

I think that as long as you have a Hawke that doesn't want to commit to either side of the mage/templar issue, DA2 doesn't feel as disconnected between acts (because Hawke's just living his life, not aggravated by all the BS unless he has to be).

But I really thought the plot would be reactive, and really looked foward to seeing how it could have played out differently. And it didn't.

And then the design decisions began to pile up for me. All of which led to a feeling that I had played the alpha build.

Modifié par In Exile, 27 mai 2011 - 07:41 .

[upsettingshorts]

Yeah I can understand that. Whereas others who weren't hooked by the story or their own character would have been focusing on those flaws from the get-go.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 27 mai 2011 - 07:43 .

[v_ware]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

v_ware wrote...
Dragon Age 2 is the lowest rated Bioware game in a very long time. Just stating the facts honey.

How is that relevant when it comes to a single person's opinion?

They should cater to the overall opinion. And the fact that DA2 is the lowest rated Biogame in a long time means most changes weren't for the better. 

[lobi]

Maria Caliban wrote...
I'm prettier.

I love the internet

Modifié par lobi, 27 mai 2011 - 07:46 .

[AngryFrozenWater]

It is of no use to have a discussion here about whether the game is great or not. This thread was started because a lot of users felt that it wasn't that good and Mr Laidlaw felt that it was time to address them after he got over some emotional problems related to that. It's nice to show your support for BW, but it is of no use. The issues involved are now well know. Mr Laidlaw even said that he will address those issues in the next game. He named some of them and said that others will be investigated. If you believe him is another question. But what are you guys fighting about then?

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 27 mai 2011 - 07:49 .

[MDarwin]

Tommy6860 wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

I read your post and had to think hard how to respond. There is only one way for me and you probably don't like it. Here it goes anyway...

Mr Laidlaw, I still cannot get over the fact that I feel that the promises to add decisions that would impact the story plot were simply not implemented. That feature was not just my interpretation of the first pod cast or the marketing material, it was out there for everyone to see. Politely put, you were not telling the truth. I won't go into details. I've written about that until my fingers got numb. That didn't make me feel good about the company. So, despite that I like your post, I have my reservations about any promised changes. I am not eager to pre-order anymore or just buy a product because BW meant quality in the past. It just isn't true anymore.

In short... Your post didn't change anything for me.

This^ so totally, and I agree! I remember those marketing promos so well.

Same here. Plus the mess with the Pre-Bonus Items. And the DRM confusion. Still, thanks for posting here Mike Laidlaw. Quick question: Do we still get the updated TS?  Those personal attacks were way over the Top!

[General Malor]

v_ware wrote...

Dragon Age 2 is the lowest rated Bioware game in a very long time. Just stating the facts honey.

I think a key fact you're forgetting is that your opinion only matters to you, should people choose to fell such.

Another fact: People who like something aren't going to change their mind because someone else didn't.

... I know, shocking right. 

[v_ware]

General Malor wrote...

v_ware wrote...
Dragon Age 2 is the lowest rated Bioware game in a very long time. Just stating the facts honey.

I think a key fact you're forgetting is that your opinion only matters to you, should people choose to fell such.

Another fact: People who like something aren't going to change their mind because someone else didn't.

... I know, shocking right. 

Again. Bioware should cater to the overall opinion. And the fact that DA2 is the lowest rated Biogame in a long time means most changes weren't for the better. 

[lobi]

General Malor wrote...

v_ware wrote...

Dragon Age 2 is the lowest rated Bioware game in a very long time. Just stating the facts honey.

I think a key fact you're forgetting is that your opinion only matters to you, should people choose to fell such.

Another fact: People who like something aren't going to change their mind because someone else didn't.

... I know, shocking right. 

King Mob disagrees

Modifié par lobi, 27 mai 2011 - 07:48 .

[In Exile]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

It is of no use to have a discussion here about whether the game is great or not. This thread was started because a lot of users felt that it wasn't that good and Mr Laidlaw felt that it was time to address them after he got over some emotional problems related to that. It's nice to show your support for BW, but it is of no use. The issues involved are now well know. Mr Laidlaw even said that he will address those issues in the next game. He named some of them and said that others will be investigated. If you believe him is another question. But what are you guys fighting about then?

Like I said. I would like to see what changes are made for DLC and announced for DAIII, down the line.