94 réponses à ce sujet

[Icinix]

Chilcek wrote...(snipped)

Play it for the lore and the characters! (Also play it for the fact you can probably transfer your choices from 2->3).

But its the lack of depth to the lore that is my biggest gripe with DA2.

There should have been an amazing array of quests to interact, study and become involved with the lore in Kirkwall, Sundermount and deep beneath the surface.

There wasn't.

Sure, you could read a codex entry, but I'm talking about tangible - Not meaningless behind the scenes Lore *cough* - something that you find in the game and makes you go "Oh, Ahh." Quests, Characters that make the world feel deep. DAO had it in spades, The game DAO was a spirtual successor to had this in spades....DA2 used a spade to shovel them out and put them on the 'COD fanbois' won't care about this pile. << Maybe too harsh, but my point stands.

[Dangerfoot]

Icinix wrote...

But its the lack of depth to the lore that is my biggest gripe with DA2.

There should have been an amazing array of quests to interact, study and become involved with the lore in Kirkwall, Sundermount and deep beneath the surface.

There wasn't.

Not only that but it seemed to take the interesting lore of Origins and dumb it down so hard that it was offensively simple.

My main character in Origins was a healer, that supported the Chantry because of the good it did for those in need, but also supported mage rights, since she was a mage after all. And it was entirely possible and logical for my character to be that way. The game features a Knight-Commander and First Enchanter who are old friends. You see that the Templars are not just men hired to kill, enslave and labotomize mages, they serve a much more valiant, guardian role with regrettable duties they must sometimes perform.

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game. You never see the Chantry doing any good for the people. There is basically one genuinely pro-mage Templar, and he's basically a traitor to his country since law dictates that you hate all mages. It felt like a considerable step down in lore.

[RangerSG]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Alistairlover94 wrote...

How can my fiancee's Mahariel be back in Denerim, when he's off doing the nasty with Morri?

It's not a retcon until something explicitly says that he never went into the Eluvian with her at all.  If he did, and then left to go to Denerim, that's not a retcon.  It goes against the common interpretation of how that particular scenario might play out, but until it says something that happened didn't actually happen, it doesn't qualify.

Alistairlover94 wrote...

And in 50% of my playthroughs, that character is headless.

Not anymore!

You know there's a rogue skill called "Feign Death"? You also realize that that location is singularly charged with magical and/or spiritual energy? The argument about Nightingale's death not carrying over is utterly flimsy.

[RangerSG]

Dangerfoot wrote...

Icinix wrote...

But its the lack of depth to the lore that is my biggest gripe with DA2.

There should have been an amazing array of quests to interact, study and become involved with the lore in Kirkwall, Sundermount and deep beneath the surface.

There wasn't.

Not only that but it seemed to take the interesting lore of Origins and dumb it down so hard that it was offensively simple.

My main character in Origins was a healer, that supported the Chantry because of the good it did for those in need, but also supported mage rights, since she was a mage after all. And it was entirely possible and logical for my character to be that way. The game features a Knight-Commander and First Enchanter who are old friends. You see that the Templars are not just men hired to kill, enslave and labotomize mages, they serve a much more valiant, guardian role with regrettable duties they must sometimes perform.

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game. You never see the Chantry doing any good for the people. There is basically one genuinely pro-mage Templar, and he's basically a traitor to his country since law dictates that you hate all mages. It felt like a considerable step down in lore.

I have to agree on this one. The mage/Templar conflict was vastly oversimplified, on both sides. My goodness, when the most "kill 'em all" Templar in DA:O is the GOOD guy... 

[Skilled Seeker]

The situation in Kirkwall's circle is vastly different from that in Fereldan.

[IndigoWolfe]

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

Those are the Kirkwall Templars, who hardly reprisent the entire order.

[Persephone]

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

What about Cullen? Or Ser Thrask?

[KnightofPhoenix]

Persephone wrote...

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

What about Cullen?

An incompetent idiot.

[Lord_Valandil]

As Origins barely affected "II", I highly doubt there's going to be some change in "III".
And then they'll say, it's because it's "III", not "Origins III", lol.

Modifié par Lord_Valandil, 29 mai 2011 - 05:00 .

[Cutlass Jack]

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game. You never see the Chantry doing any good for the people. There is basically one genuinely pro-mage Templar, and he's basically a traitor to his country since law dictates that you hate all mages. It felt like a considerable step down in lore.

This might have been true if there were only four templars in the game. The majority of templars in the game were not Ser Alrik. In fact, if you are very quick during the first Anders quest and loot the leaders body, you'll get a letter from him where it details his objections to Alrik's orders.

There were multiple Templars throughout the game who supported the mages being treated like human beings. Of course many were afflicted by the same chemical in the water as the mages and they stupidly kept doing things like attacking you instead of talking. Or kidnapping your sibling when you probably would have joined their side had they just asked.

[Persephone]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

What about Cullen?

An incompetent idiot.

Not my point. He is neither a murderer nor a sadist.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Persephone wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

What about Cullen?

An incompetent idiot.

Not my point. He is neither a murderer nor a sadist.

And if the only people who are neither murderers nor sadists are idiots, then I think you have a problem.

I know you were replying to a specific post. I am just throwing my 2 cents.

[Persephone]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Persephone wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

What about Cullen?

An incompetent idiot.

Not my point. He is neither a murderer nor a sadist.

And if the only people who are neither murderers nor sadists are idiots, then I think you have a problem.

I know you were replying to a specific post. I am just throwing my 2 cents.

Well, I know that. Though his "Knight Commander, STAND DOWN!" moment was epic IMO.

[xCirdanx]

Chilcek wrote...
So why bother telling people who liked Origins to NOT play 2?

Why do care? You don´t have to listen to these people nor is anyone hindering you or anyone else from buying it.

Besides that, your point of savegame import isn´t worth to consider at the moment, if DA3 would be similar to DA2 when it comes to the import, than it won´t have any meaningful impact.

[Dave of Canada]

Autolycus wrote...

If anything, it is easier make games now. 2dboy are testament to that.

I wouldn't compare casual games and their market to other bigger genres.

[Wulfram]

Persephone wrote...

Not my point. He is neither a murderer nor a sadist.

His role in the Annullment makes that at best debatable.

[Arrtis]

Chilcek wrote...

So why bother telling people who liked Origins to NOT play 2?

Some lore will be tying in to 3, at the very least. If you enjoy the Dragon Age universe, then play the games. It's not like they completely butchered the world Dragon Age is set in.

Honestly, I think the only problem is the repeated areas and tactical changes. The story is okay. The characters are pretty damned good. 

So yeah, you fairweather fans are pissed it didn't live up to origins. That really doesn't explain the reasoning behind telling people NOT to play a game in the series they enjoy.

If you didn't like the game, great, you're free to say so, but there are redeemable traits about the game that will be used in DA3, whether you want to admit them as "Redeemable" or not.

If anyone's wondering if I'm a fanboy, I'd give this game an 8/10. 7, if you don't have a computer to run it on max or a console port.

Play it for the lore and the characters! (Also play it for the fact you can probably transfer your choices from 2->3).

They will sum it all up in DA3.
Characters werent interesting to me...lore was easily forgettable.
Maybe I am just bored of the DA series.

[Dangerfoot]

Cutlass Jack wrote...
Or kidnapping your sibling when you probably would have joined their side had they just asked.

Good lord, that quest.

It really made no sense no matter what you did. My favorite though was when I was a blood mage and I killed a squad of Templars in order for Grace to escape, and then "NO, don't let her help us! Kill her brother! REEEEVENGE! EEEEEVIL!"

[IndigoWolfe]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

What about Cullen?

An incompetent idiot.

How exactly, might I ask?

[Zjarcal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...
And if the only people who are neither murderers nor sadists are idiots, then I think you have a problem.

I know you were replying to a specific post. I am just throwing my 2 cents.

On that I do agree. The only reason Cullen seemed fine (to me at least), was because he was fine in comparison to the other jerks. But judging him individually for his role in DA2, I don't think much of him. If anything I wanted to kill him at the end of act 1.

[KnightofPhoenix]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Persephone wrote...

Dangerfoot wrote...

DA2 basically throws all that out the window and makes 1/4th of them rapists, half of them murderers and sadists, and the last 4th don't appear in the game.

What about Cullen?

An incompetent idiot.

How exactly, might I ask?

[Zjarcal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Okaaayyyyy.......

That calls for....

[KnightofPhoenix]

Nvm, I've ranted on the story enough as it is.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 29 mai 2011 - 08:30 .

[Zjarcal]

Aww, but I would've appreciated a rant about that scene! I mean, it's epic fail on so many levels... x.x