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[Calamity Abounds]

Is it also not safe to assume that regardless of what you think about Ashley's outlook on aliens, that see is merely accepting Spectre status as a way to abolish the stigma of embarrassment when her grand-father surrendered during The Skyllian Blitz? I believe Ash herself even states that its due to that stigma that she was passed over for promotions within the Alliance. I'm sure stopping Saren got her the Operations Chief nod but it still wasn't enough to redeem the Williams name in the galactic community. She may also be an Alliance loyalist which some also see as a reason for her not to be Spectre. I don't remember exactly but I think Anderson states in ME1 after Shep's induction that while he may now be a Spectre he is still technically Alliance so perhaps we can use that as justification for her accepting the role. I enjoy the fact that ME3 Ash can really shine, a "we've all come a long way" sort of thing.  I usually end us saving Ashley anyway since Kaiden's death (to me) has a huge emotional impact on the story. Plus Garrus has promptly rose to greater heights in the role  my Shepbro. Though I also look forward to Kaiden doing his Spectre thing in my other playthroughs as well!

Modifié par Calamity Abounds, 30 mai 2011 - 04:20 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Da Mecca wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Huzah wha?

Game lore never recognizes leveling up. It's the difference between game mechanics and game storytelling: after all, with the ME1 import feature, you can just as well start with a level 60 Shepard and crew.

Prior to ME1, Kaiden is already a highly decorated soldier, which is a large part of why Anderson head-hunted him to be on the Normandy in the first place. You can get this from Chakwas at the start. While Kaiden is a conservative person, that's a reflection of his temperment, not his abilities.

You obviously never had Garrus and Kaidan in the elevator together.

He specifically states that he's been holding back on living targets, but after Eden Prime he wasn't holding back on anyone anymore.

Uh, yes. I have had that, and it doesn't contradict my points. Kaiden is not growing in biotic power, nor is he only getting involved with being a significant soldier post-Shepard.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 30 mai 2011 - 06:01 .

[Northern Sun]

I agree that neither Ashley/Kaidan have the correct mentality to be a spectre, but they may not have been given a choice. Anderson made it clear in the ME1 prologue that Shepard didn't.
Shep: "I don't like people making decisions about my future."
Anderson: "This isn't about you, Shepard! Humanity needs this."

And Ashley isn't racist, just saying.

[TomY90]

Northern Sun wrote...

I agree that neither Ashley/Kaidan have the correct mentality to be a spectre, but they may not have been given a choice. Anderson made it clear in the ME1 prologue that Shepard didn't.
Shep: "I don't like people making decisions about my future."
Anderson: "This isn't about you, Shepard! Humanity needs this."

And Ashley isn't racist, just saying.

yeah your pretty much spot on i think either way they will be good spectres if they are spectres in ME3 which I imagine they will be.

but they will not have the same respect as shepherd does and i doubt they will be half the spectre shepherd is but will still help humanity out one way or another.

[Someone With Mass]

Ashley can stay on the ship. She's beyond annoying at this point. I might pick Kaidan with me on the Shepards where I saved him, though.

[jbblue05]

I really do't like the idea of the VS being a spectre..

Shepard's has N7 training. while the VS has none, Ash is blacklisted by the Alliance and has non-existent credetials outside of working with Shepard her bieng a spectre makes no sense unless Aderson gave it to her.

Kaidan I can understad a bit because he's one of the top biotics in the Alliance. but he has L2 biotics which is a big red flag

I rather their be a human spectre we've never met b$ preferrably a N7 marine

[Sylvianus]

Shepard became spectre because he was the best known, not necessarily the strongest. Shepard was forced to become spectre for the Alliance and Humanity. Shepard became a spectre, because of politics. He was chosen by the Alliance, it could'be the same for the VS, they are famous, politics, etc.

For Shepard I do not see what is special to be a survivor, which mean you're a spectre. In other origins, I do not mind, but otherwise ... War hero, it's the same thing it is cool, but other than that ? What Shepard have done ? There are other war heroes in the galaxy. When you listen to the story of Jack and Zaeed, we see that there must be a lot of cases that have exploits.

And there are lots of people who are as strong as the spectre in the galaxy.

Nilhus managed to escape Samara because he used civilians, but otherwise he would have been defeated. Garrus is as strong as a spectre, but he isn't.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 30 mai 2011 - 08:55 .

[Nathan Redgrave]

xIxDarkWolfxIx wrote...

I don't mind them becoming a Spectre, but lets be honest the only reason they became a Spectre was to monitor what Shepard was doing with Cerberus, well that's what I believe anyway. Plus how did Ashley become a Spectre? She's a xenophobe, kind of.

Not quite a xenophobe, just untrusting.

[Eshaye]

Dean_the_Young wrote...
]Uh, yes. I have had that, and it doesn't contradict my points. Kaiden is not growing in biotic power, nor is he only getting involved with being a significant soldier post-Shepard.

/sigh He doesn't grow he unleashes.. Difference.
 
Anyway peeps think whatever you want it doesn't change what the writers have done and are doing to the characters. BioWare says they are spectres then they are spectres. Bioware says they've both changed ranks, then that's how it is. It'll probably be up to player to fill in how it happened and why unless Ash/Kaidan tells Shepard about what happened to them in  ME3. 

Modifié par Eshaye, 30 mai 2011 - 11:12 .

[naledgeborn]

In my canon Shepard is an anti-Cerberus, reinstated SpecTRe Paragade. Miranda is Shepard's love interest and the Executive Officer of Normandy SR-2. SpecTRe Kaidan starts getting any bright ideas I'll give him a reason for his head to hurt.

[Randy1012]

Eshaye wrote...

Randy1083 wrote...

Or maybe Kaidan just isn't very ambitious. Maybe he doesn't have the drive that Ashley has to prove herself.

Before meeting Shepard he's portrayed as very cautious and conservative  with his abilities, his migraines never helped either. After the events of Eden Prime and a relationship with Shepard (friendly or romantic) he decides to let loose more and his biotic power increases. 

After ME1 it's quite possible he just went ahead full steam due to his experiences.

Yeah, I remember that. I believe it was during an elevator conversation with Wrex. Wrex asked him about his biotics, and Kaidan said something like "After what happened at Eden Prime, I'm not holding back anymore." I loved hearing him say that. I'm one of those who actually liked both Ashley and Kaidan, and I hated having to let one of them die.

You're right, it's very possible that after his experiences in ME1 and then losing his friend (or lover, in some cases), Kaidan decided to be a little less cautious and put more effort into his career. Jumping two ranks (from Staff Lieutenant to Staff Commander) in two years would support such an idea.

[LOLandStuff]

If they made Kaidan and Ashley Spectre then I say Conrad Verner should be one too.
He travels the galaxy solo, barging into people's business and looting. Clearly those are the qualities of a Spectre.

[thatdude90210]

VS becoming a Spectre sounds like fan appeasement. The other ME1 LI got a dlc, plus an important position in the ME world. All the VS got was an unpleasant cameo.

[Sylvianus]

For now, everything you say, is simply a subjective point of view. Move on and wait to see.

[knightnblu]

The fact that BioWare kind of messed over the Ashley and Kaidan LI in ME2, kind of means that they owe you a surprise in ME3. Nobody said that it would be a pleasant surprise though. Some of the most powerful moments of the game come from shock, anger, and a sense of betrayal. That is what RPGs do, they evoke emotion and by so doing they draw you into the game.

As for these two being Specters, I think that it is a great idea. In RL, people often ride on the coat tails of others and they being a part of the team that took down Saren and the galaxy's need for a boost after the death of Cmdr. Shepard, it makes good sense to do so. I often wondered why Ash was on Horizon and why Anderson was giving her oversight. Now it makes sense. As a Specter she would answer to the Council and could also maintain her Alliance membership as Shepard did.

Bringing back your ME LI as a rival and competitor in ME3 sounds like BioWare and after the hostility on Horizon and tepid apology, it promises to bear some bittersweet fruit.

[Oblivious]

I admit knightnblu, if they actually make VS into their own character rather than an active member of the Shepard fan club the Spectre thing would be genius. If the VS can choose to disobey orders (At least initially), act their own way without consulting you, and act like Shepard's equal then that would present a whole new playing field. Maybe have Ash lean toward the Paragade stance and Kaidan Paragon?

[LordEurope]

Oblivious wrote...

I admit knightnblu, if they actually make VS into their own character rather than an active member of the Shepard fan club the Spectre thing would be genius. If the VS can choose to disobey orders (At least initially), act their own way without consulting you, and act like Shepard's equal then that would present a whole new playing field. Maybe have Ash lean toward the Paragade stance and Kaidan Paragon?

If she does that I'll dump her ass on the nearest planet.

[eye basher]

I don't know how ashley could make specter everytime something big happened you had to save her useless ass eden prime,virmire,horizon shes the worst soldier ever.

[Antivenger]

LordEurope wrote...

If she does that I'll dump her ass on the nearest planet.

And that's why you're a sociopath.

Since you bumped this thread anyways, we already have confirmation on Kaidan being a SpecTRe. Now for Ash:

eye basher wrote...

I don't know how ashley could make specter everytime something big happened you had to save her useless ass eden prime,virmire,horizon shes the worst soldier ever.

[Made Nightwing]

Suck it Haters

[skcih-deraj]

Seems like the haters have a bit of a personal problem.

[Labrev]

The only thing I don't like about this is that it basically makes your decision on Virmire nothing more than a popularity contest, since they both end up becoming the same thing. I thought they were planning to have actual consequences for our actions in ME3? Because I had thought-out reasons for choosing Kaidan over Ashley, and I really think this is one of those decisions that should have its own pros/cons.

[Antivenger]

Hah Yes Reapers wrote...

The only thing I don't like about this is that it basically makes your decision on Virmire nothing more than a popularity contest, since they both end up becoming the same thing. I thought they were planning to have actual consequences for our actions in ME3? Because I had thought-out reasons for choosing Kaidan over Ashley, and I really think this is one of those decisions that should have its own pros/cons.

The consequences already happened, losing a team mate (though some might see this as a blessing). For ME3 I speculate that you'll get some form of extra content based on who you choose. Gagarin station for Kaidan and Amaterasu for Ashley?