213 réponses à ce sujet

[Ryzaki]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

What I *didn't* enjoy was my dude Hawke grinning like an idiot when Shiala flirted with him

This wasn't a gender thing. I was quite annoyed when my FemShep did this, since I reeeeally dislike the asari. I guess not even Shepard is immune to the 'everyone loves the asari' clause. Bleh.

 

I dislike the Asari too.  It burns. 

I guess it's less of a gender thing then.  

iakus wrote...
Well, truth be told, that's something that can affect both genders.  I hardly think it would go over any better if femShep were to meet Samesh Bhatia and have him give her a kiss.  Or if Eddie Lang hit on her, even if it was just a little flirting.  The problem there is lack of a player's ability to respond to it, not the actions themselves.

 

That is very true. 

[PsyrenY]

I love the gender-specific touches. The one that comes to mind immediately for me was in ME1 when Harkin hit on my femshep - it made me extremely happy I had chosen to go Renegade with her, so she could emasculate him in the middle of the bar in front of everyone.

[100k]

Ryzaki wrote...

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

What I *didn't* enjoy was my dude Hawke grinning like an idiot when Shiala flirted with him

This wasn't a gender thing. I was quite annoyed when my FemShep did this, since I reeeeally dislike the asari. I guess not even Shepard is immune to the 'everyone loves the asari' clause. Bleh.

 

I dislike the Asari too.  It burns. 

I guess it's less of a gender thing then.  

iakus wrote...
Well, truth be told, that's something that can affect both genders.  I hardly think it would go over any better if femShep were to meet Samesh Bhatia and have him give her a kiss.  Or if Eddie Lang hit on her, even if it was just a little flirting.  The problem there is lack of a player's ability to respond to it, not the actions themselves.

 

That is very true. 

How can you dislike the asari!?

[Ryzaki]

100k wrote...

How can you dislike the asari!?

 

Very easily. 

And none of them seem to understand the concept of personal space. <_<

[ThatDancingTurian]

100k wrote...

How can you dislike the asari!?

Because they're perfect at everything and every single one of them is a stereotypical gorgeous swimsuit model-esque clone that gives amazing, mind-blowing sex and everyone everywhere wants them, period. They're at the forefront of fashion, art, entertainment and politics. They all go through a 'wild' phase to become strippers, then eventually want to settle down and make babies. The physical signifier for old age in asari is not wrinkles or saggy skin, but an increase in cup size and a deeper, sultrier voice. In a universe with races that are all good at one thing, the asari are good at everything; they have scientists that rival the salarians, merchants that rival the volus, commandos that rival the krogan, and spaceships like the Destiny Ascension that rival those of the turians. On top of these things, they also live the longest and have the strongest biotics.

I dislike them because they're not people. People have flaws.

Modifié par Aris Ravenstar, 01 juin 2011 - 05:44 .

[Shimmer_Gloom]

LOL the Assari are the Elves of the ME universe. Sure they don't have many flaws but that's okay. They to serve an ideal like Superman. Sure its a tad unrealistic. But, its fantasy my man.

I dig the Asarri. Why should you dislike something because they are awesome? There is no such thing as 'too awesome.' It would be like disliking Americans because we are all rich.

[D.Kain]

Shimmer_Gloom wrote...

LOL the Assari are the Elves of the ME universe. Sure they don't have many flaws but that's okay. They to serve an ideal like Superman. Sure its a tad unrealistic. But, its fantasy my man.

I dig the Asarri. Why should you dislike something because they are awesome? There is no such thing as 'too awesome.' It would be like disliking Americans because we are all rich.

Do you have any idea how  many people dislike americans? 

[Ryzaki]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

100k wrote...

How can you dislike the asari!?

Because they're perfect at everything and every single one of them is a stereotypical gorgeous swimsuit model-esque clone that gives amazing, mind-blowing sex and everyone everywhere wants them, period. They're at the forefront of fashion, art, entertainment and politics. They all go through a 'wild' phase to become strippers, then eventually want to settle down and make babies. The physical signifier for old age in asari is not wrinkles or saggy skin, but an increase in cup size and a deeper, sultrier voice. In a universe with races that are all good at one thing, the asari are good at everything; they have scientists that rival the salarians, merchants that rival the volus, commandos that rival the krogan, and spaceships like the Destiny Ascension that rival those of the turians. On top of these things, they also live the longest and have the strongest biotics.

I dislike them because they're not people. People have flaws.

 

QFT. 

[Whale]

Fhaileas wrote...

Personally I don't think this affects the male Shephard as much as it does the female Shephard, considering that the role is contextually perceived as male oriented anyway. Ironically though this actually makes FemShep a more worthwhile and "strong" atypical female character since she is not seen as catering to the standard sexually titillating kick-ass male wet dream trope that exists in popular culture. In fact I would go as far as to say that of either Shephard gender, the female is by far portrayed as being more gender neutral.

QFT. I hate how the message "women can kick ass too!" always gets the unspoken clause "as long as they're hot".
In a way, I even like the shared animations (well, ok, except the hunchback run). I sit like that. I walk like John Wayne. It may be selfish, but I love this to be reflected in an awesome character like Shepard. Please, Bioware, you own my soul alredy, keep me happy: just keep doing what you've been doing.

And I find it disheartening that so many people believe that we could have space travel, magical powers and aliens, but never a gender-blind society.

[PsyrenY]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

100k wrote...

How can you dislike the asari!?

Because they're perfect at everything and every single one of them is a stereotypical gorgeous swimsuit model-esque clone that gives amazing, mind-blowing sex and everyone everywhere wants them, period. They're at the forefront of fashion, art, entertainment and politics. They all go through a 'wild' phase to become strippers, then eventually want to settle down and make babies. The physical signifier for old age in asari is not wrinkles or saggy skin, but an increase in cup size and a deeper, sultrier voice. In a universe with races that are all good at one thing, the asari are good at everything; they have scientists that rival the salarians, merchants that rival the volus, commandos that rival the krogan, and spaceships like the Destiny Ascension that rival those of the turians. On top of these things, they also live the longest and have the strongest biotics.

I dislike them because they're not people. People have flaws.

Well the cup size thing can actually be a drawback, it means more "funny bumps" the Turians have to live with

More seriously though - they do not have many, and perhaps it can be argued not enough flaws, but they certainly have some:

1) They are too moderate/compromising - they don't make a principled stand on any issue, preferring to vacillate, avoid confrontation and please all parties. On the original council in ME1, the asari councillor is the one that came closest to agreeing with you after each report, yet she never did anything to actually speak up against her compatriots. Similarly, Sha'ira prefers to involve strangers in her relationship with the Turian general rather than confront him herself. And on Ilium, they go so far as to condone slavery and drugs to better integrate with the Terminus rather than uphold their own homeworld's standards.

2) They are intolerant. The object of their racism is inverted (they hate purebloods and welcome hybrids) but that doesn't make them any less discriminatory.

3) They do not welcome change. Aethyta's very sensible recommendations caused Thessia to "laugh the blue off her ass." Similarly, Liara's studies were dismissed out of hand simply due to her age rather than any critical examination of her findings.

In short, they are space elves. Mass Effect, despite being sci-fi, does employ a fantasy trope or two.

I agree with you on the generic beauty thing but lets be honest, this is not a perfect world and so a little T&A boosted ME1's sales and helped it perform well enough for Bioware to greenlight the whole trilogy. I can't find much to complain about in that outcome.

[ThatDancingTurian]

I can't really give this the response it deserves since a debate would further derail, but I'll simply say that I disagree with almost all of your listed 'flaws', since two can also be considered strengths instead of weaknesses and the third is practically an informed flaw, considering how it's only presented itself so that the most prominent asari in the game can be viewed as victims. At the very least, they do little to balance out how super amazing they are at every other thing in the history of the universe.

I will say it's funny the one you chose as your first example, though. Mary Sues (which is what the asari are) almost always seem to go for the flaw 'they're just too nice'.

But anyway, I'm going to stop here, I really shouldn't have even responded with that original rant since it's so off-topic.

Modifié par Aris Ravenstar, 01 juin 2011 - 09:43 .

[1136342t54_]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

100k wrote...

How can you dislike the asari!?

Because they're perfect at everything and every single one of them is a stereotypical gorgeous swimsuit model-esque clone that gives amazing, mind-blowing sex and everyone everywhere wants them, period. They're at the forefront of fashion, art, entertainment and politics. They all go through a 'wild' phase to become strippers, then eventually want to settle down and make babies. The physical signifier for old age in asari is not wrinkles or saggy skin, but an increase in cup size and a deeper, sultrier voice. In a universe with races that are all good at one thing, the asari are good at everything; they have scientists that rival the salarians, merchants that rival the volus, commandos that rival the krogan, and spaceships like the Destiny Ascension that rival those of the turians. On top of these things, they also live the longest and have the strongest biotics.

I dislike them because they're not people. People have flaws.

Sorry but I have to comment on this and then I will actually make a post regarding gender blindness. This really isn't a attack against you.

The Asari are not a Mary Sue race. They are more advanced simply because they had FTL drive longer and was the first FTL civilization. When it comes to Diplomacy and economy they are superior because they have played the game of politics longer then the other races and actually agreed on a joint civil government sooner than the others races. Their Economy would be larger simply because they started the galactic economy sooner and had more access to territory because they expanded sooner. The only advantage Asari have is being the first race to use FTL which allowed them to gain more experience in a few areas but not all.

The Salarians are smarter then Asari period. They even are possibly better when it comes to intelligence gathering. Volus are better merchants than the Asari period. Have you been to Ilium in ME2? You can hear a volus and a Asari bidding over colony rights I think. Eventually the Volus won out because he was a more agressive and intelligent economist and merchant. Why do think the Turians have them as a client race?

Also regarding the Destiny Ascension thats the Asari's only real defense agaisnt another strong power is their small fleet and big **** off Dreadnought. Without it in ME2 the Asari ceded their defense share of the Citadel fleet to the Turians.

The only Mary Sue race is Humanity hands down.


Now to continue on the topic with Gender blindness. I happen to agree that neutrality is better when it comes to Shepard as long as Bioware sprinkle in some parts recognizsing shep as female or male. Shepard really isn't different female nor male. The only difference would be how people react to him or her thats really it.

[PsyrenY]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

I will say it's funny the one you chose as your first example, though. Mary Sues (which is what the asari are) almost always seem to go for the flaw 'they're just too nice'.

I didn't say "too nice" though. I was more going for "wishy-washy" or "indecisive" - which is a genuine flaw from a race expected to lead others.

EDIT: I also agree with the above that Humanity are more of a Sue Race (we're magically more genetically diverse than all the others? Come on) with the only major drawback being that we are as "short-lived" as all but three of the others.

Modifié par Optimystic_X, 02 juin 2011 - 01:51 .

[sevalaricgirl]

Absolutely agree with what was written by the writer, but that video was freaking outstanding. I love seeing all the femSheps and the renegade and paragon reactions. Hale does both so well that I can't think of a better voice actor for femShep. Even my hubby who is not into rpgs thought it was very well done. Now I'm off to play femShep Sentinel.